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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, 10cc Syringe, Brown Rice Flour, Peat, Perlite, Pressure Cooker, Vermiculite

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OfflineJGraham9382
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Registered: 07/13/02
Posts: 5
Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
Check a newbie please? :)
    #755533 - 07/18/02 08:36 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Hey guys,

First of all...a MAJOR thank you to the shroomery and also everyone who posts on this board. I have learned so much from you all, and it is greatly appreciated. I finally decided dive in and grow my own shrooms. I was wondering if you all would double check me to make sure that everything seems alright before I do it. First of all I will be following most of the the MMGG (http://www.shroomery.org/findorgrowthem/MMGG.HTM) with adaptations 6, 20, 22, and 23. (http://www.shroomery.org/MMGG.HTM#adaptation_index) However, I was thinking about using the casing technique that I found here: http://www.shamanshop.net/casing.htm. Now a couple of questions that I had are vermiculite or perlite? I've seen these being used in both cases, and everyone that I talked to at the garden supply places that I visted said that perlite pretty much the same thing. Would it make that big of a difference if I used perlite to colonize my cakes instead of vermiculite? I also found what was called a "grower's mix" which says "...is a lightweight soil mix for starting seeds and cuttings indoors. It's a blend of sphagnuum peat moss, professional grower's grade vermiculite, horticultural grade perlite and other ingredients." From the looks of it it doesn't seem to have a whole lot of vermiculite in the mix. Would this be suitable (or maybe better?) then using straight vermiculite or perlite? Other than that I have all of my ingredients, and I have my spores all lined up and ready to go. I just wanted to see if anyone had any other suggestions or advice before I started on my way. Thanks again!


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Offlinebluefoot
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Registered: 03/29/02
Posts: 94
Loc: Mother Earth
Last seen: 13 years, 9 months
Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: JGraham9382]
    #755563 - 07/18/02 08:51 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

From my experience, verm works better for colonizing of your substrate, especially if you're using brown rice for your nutrients in that substrate. It just seems to keep a better consistency in the substrate for the colonizing mycelium. As far as your casing mix goes, it sounds okay. The 50/50+ seems to always be a good place to start for beginners. Check and see if your premix has any liming agent as this will help a whole lot in the department of contamination of your casings. Go ahead and get those first jars cooked up and innoculated because the first ones never seem to colonize fast enough when you're excited. Keep us posted with any q's and GOOD LUCK!

peace
bluefoot


--------------------
peace
bluefoot

"There is more in us than we know. If we can be made to see it, perhaps, for the rest of our lives, we will be unwilling to settle for less." - Kurt Hahn


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Offlinebladerunnerss
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Registered: 07/16/02
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: JGraham9382]
    #755583 - 07/18/02 09:01 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

whats your first step? colonizing in 8oz glass jars?
Ive done this twice now. Heres the one mistake i would like for you to avoid. when you are loading your 8oz jars DO NOT pack them tight. my first time i would load a spoon full and then use the spoon and pack it down tight. then i would load the jar and keep packing it down tight. This caused incubation time to strech out over about 2 months+ maybe even longer. temperatures were always in the low70's as well. incubate at high 80'sF.
so load your jars to the top and LIGHTLY TAMP, not slam, the loaded jar onto the table. I mean very light. just enough that it packs and levels off. This will creat a generous amount air pockets for mycelium (sp?) to access.

I am experincing noticable diffrence in the speed of colonization. i would have to say maybe 10X faster. also a note about how much spore solution to inject into each inoculation site. do you have more syringes than you need? if you want to even see your bad boys grow at explosive speeds than use a rediculous amount of solution per inoculation site. Im thinking about less than 1cc per site or a little more. whatever the amount is in cc's i forget. basically I used 2x the amount suggested. pour it on. I would like to think that that is going to add even a little more water to the cakes for the mycelium to use. I used one 10cc [had about 9cc in it] of spore soution evenly between 5 jars. wow! huge massive germination sites. go that route unless one of the veterans here advises against it for some reason.

and a note about water. Do you have a backyard goldfish pond? PF mentions that the best water to use is water high in organics. stream lake river pond water. water coming out of a compost pipe.

PF says " Water quality is indeed important. I have found out that "natural" water is the water to use. It makes for better cultivation of this mushroom on this simple substrate. for growing, they seem to like the "natural" water such as: swamp, lake, stream, pond,river, ground or any water that is rich in organics.I suppose that water seeping from an organic compost pile would be about the best."

I used water from our filtered and well maintained gold fish pond in the back yard on half of my jars and regular bottled water on the other half to compare. both work well but i believe that it would be benificial for the mycelium to have access to still more minerals and nutrients for consumption.

hoped that helped

bladeruNNer




--------------------
bladeruNNer



Edited by bladerunnerss (07/18/02 09:06 AM)


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OfflineJGraham9382
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Registered: 07/13/02
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: bluefoot]
    #755600 - 07/18/02 09:09 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Right on. Thanks for the heads up. I'll also double check to see if there are any liming agents as well. Thanks again for the help.


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OfflineJGraham9382
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Registered: 07/13/02
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: bladerunnerss]
    #755609 - 07/18/02 09:13 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Yes, 1/2 pint jars are what I am using. I'll make sure I go light on the packing. I also will be setting the jars in water that I am going to heat to right around 80 degrees with a fish tank heater while they colonize. Now when you are talking about the water do you mean the water that I use when I make the substrate, or do you mean the water that I use when I am casing them? Both? At any rate, thanks so much for the input. I'll definately keep everyone posted.


Edited by JGraham9382 (07/18/02 09:13 AM)


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Offlinebladerunnerss
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Registered: 07/16/02
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: JGraham9382]
    #755731 - 07/18/02 09:59 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Im a n00b too and know nothing of casing. but am fairly knowlegable in jars. ive done this a few times already and thought about it even more.
yes im talking about when you are in your kitchen with measuring cup and mixing bowls. you know mix your S!@# up and use some natural water.

I used perrie mineral water on one jar... No Go. dont use that it sucks. Note that the pond water i used was from my own backyard gold fish pond. its small has lillys and 10 goldfish. it is near crystal clear and is well maintained. there obviously is a pump/filter so i know where the water is coming from and how clean it is.
so if you have access to something like that where you know the water is natural but not contaminated give it a try.

I still recomend using this type of water, like i said you can always use natural water in X amont of jars and bottled water on the majority to be safe, just in case. but last batch i used pond water on 100% of my jars and they are doing very very well.

Note about getting set up in your kitchen. this is just a TEK i came up with for myself. I only have one measuring cup and by following instructions, i mix one jars worth of substrate at a time. this means fill measuring cup with rice, put in mixing bowl, fill measuring cup with verm, put in mixing bowl, mixing and load jar. then repeating this Xamount of times.

heres what i do with the water. before i start mixing anything I take the #of jars im going to do and get the same #of paper cups. measure out 50cc's or 50ml's of water, one at a time in the measuring cup and pour it into the paper cup. do this unti you have 12 or 24 individual paper cups full with 50cc;s or however much your going to put into the substrate each.
you can also do 10jars with 40cc's and 10jars with 50cc's or how ever much or little to compare results. 50 cc's is generally good. too much water is not a good thing. you already know this.
this is beneficial when it comes to mixing individually. had you not done this each time you measuer the three items, water verm and brice your measuring cup will be wet from the water and the next jar you whip up, your measuring cup will have rice and verm sticking all over the inside walls of the measuring cup because you measured water then rice then mica (i call vermiculite mica) and then doing that X amount of times. so i think that works well. without that junk sticking to the measuring cup because its wet... you will get true accurate amounts of rice and mica into your mixing bowl each time you prepare substrate for the jar. brice and mica inside a dry measuring cup will slide out clean against the glass measuring cup. as long as your measuring cup is dry and not wet.... you measure 1/2 cup of mica.... 1/2 mica comes out of the cup and into the mixing bowl. had there been water remaining in the measuring cup it will adhear to the walls. you get what im saying, youll be good to go.


--------------------
bladeruNNer



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Offlinebladerunnerss
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: bladerunnerss]
    #755750 - 07/18/02 10:04 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

oh and you do know you can use a blender to turn the rice into rice powder?
use the kind of blender you use to make chocolate mild shakes in. the one with four blades two bending down and two bending up. get it nice and powder like.

mica (verm) should be fine but NOT powdery. if you feel yours is way to bulky you can put that in the blender for a few seconds.

PF says "The coarser type will hold less water than the finer type which will alter the water holding capacity.The finer type of vermiculite is recommended over the coarser type because it holds more water. To ascertain the size of the vermiculite particles, observe them under a photo magnifier next to a millimeter ruler. The finer type of vermiculite has particles averaging around 1 millimeter across (some larger and some smaller). The coarser type has particles averaging around 4 or 5 millimeters across and up to 8 millimeters."


--------------------
bladeruNNer



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OfflineJGraham9382
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Registered: 07/13/02
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Last seen: 14 years, 6 months
Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: bladerunnerss]
    #756841 - 07/18/02 06:22 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks again buddy...I'll check it all out. I'm going to start everything first thing tomorrow morning...I'll let you know how it turns out.


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Offlinebladerunnerss
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Registered: 07/16/02
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Last seen: 2 years, 11 months
Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: JGraham9382]
    #756950 - 07/18/02 07:01 PM (14 years, 6 months ago)

excellent. hope that little bladeruNNer TEK i mentioned will help you do your job quickly and effeciently.
At the risk of pointing out the obvious and common sense things heres how i find it easy to work. again Im sure you will have your own TEK for setting up your kitchen table or where ever it is your going to be working.
This is how i do it.
set up 12, or however many jars you want to inoculate, set up 12 paper cups each with 50cc's/ml of water.
One mixing bowl of mica
One mixing bowl of powder brice
One mixing bowl where you mix the three together.
Now you have a mini assembling line.

Puncture your jar lids first. And tape them before mixing.
Remeber, the only time that the lids are not taped is for the few seconds you inoculate that jar. when that is done retape with fresh masking tape.

Pour in Rice. Pour in mica. as it is dry mix with spoon and creat a cavity in the midle. Pour some water in. Mix. then pour the rest in and mix good.

really hope you are using a pressure cooker. I made the mistake of NOT leaving the jar lids LOSE. The steam will faster and effectively penetrate the substrate. or something like that. and i lost a few jars to contamination. Im sure that was one of the reasons.
you mentioned you are using the TEK that is here in the shroomery right? I love that instruction. pretty damn good detailed job whoever wrote that.

well im very excited about your first go around at this. I want to hear all about it when you are done and have the time to tell us how it went.
just follow the instructions advice youve got and use common sense and be neat and sanitary.


--------------------
bladeruNNer



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OfflineJGraham9382
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Registered: 07/13/02
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: bladerunnerss]
    #758542 - 07/19/02 09:11 AM (14 years, 6 months ago)

Ok so the first part is done. I'm not sure if this is/was a no-no but I used perlite instead of vermiculite for my substrate. Will that have a major impact? (IE: no growth?!) I hope not...but I checked every major garden supply place around my area with no luck finding any vermiculite. Other than that I think things went pretty well. The one thing that I noticed (I boiled the jars) was that near the end of the hour that I was boiling the water was almost gone. Do you think my substrate might have gotten too dried out? It seemed alright to me. Lastly, I am putting my jars in a rubbermaid container (not clear) and putting a blanket over it. Do I have worry about any type of humidity, etc? I know I need to keep them at around the mid 80s... but if there is anything else you think I missed please let me know. Thanks again in advance!


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Anonymous

Post deleted by Anno [Re: JGraham9382]
    #1025713 - 11/05/02 10:21 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)



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Invisiblegeorge castanzaM
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Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 7,290
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Re: Check a newbie please? :) [Re: ]
    #1025772 - 11/05/02 10:37 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

don't toss the jars givem at least 2 weeks then toss them and get some verm :crazy: 


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Quote:

pftek said:Impossible to clean everything right now. Maybe in a week.





ROTHBURY

:pm:


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, 10cc Syringe, Brown Rice Flour, Peat, Perlite, Pressure Cooker, Vermiculite

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