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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75546 - 05/13/00 05:11 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

do subbalteatus grow on the sub tropics? found these near some copelandia in an area full of old hay and turds. I just chucked them thinking they were baddies. I still always take photos. Are they subbalteatus? I am fine with copes and cubensis but your photos got me thinking of these.


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OfflineLizard King
King Lizard

Registered: 10/04/99
Posts: 1,998
Loc: GA
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75548 - 05/13/00 05:21 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

I'm no expert, and I've only seen pics of this species before, but I'd say those are Pan. subbs.


--------------------


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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75549 - 05/13/00 05:23 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Nope,

Those are panaeolina foenisecii, A non-psychoactive species which macroscopically resembles Paneolus subbalteatus. This species has a cosmopolitan distribution.

You can read about his in my article on this species at:
http://mjshroomer.yage.net/panaeolina.html

Mjshroomer



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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75550 - 05/13/00 05:41 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Good on ya mate! That was quick. You must be great with all mushies. If I post another will you have a go at it as well? I will try to be quick. I like taking pics of all mushies but have trouble identifying the non psycoactives. Thanks again and I will post the other real soon.


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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75551 - 05/13/00 06:04 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)


This look like some type of agaric. I have read about them and would never eat one. For ID purposes, is this one? It is pretty.

Good night from down under.



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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75552 - 05/13/00 06:12 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

. sorry to intrude on the pann sub thread. I will post this as a new topic. thanks for the other ID


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Offlinesurrealthoughts
member
Registered: 04/15/00
Posts: 46
Last seen: 20 years, 5 months
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75553 - 05/13/00 06:15 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

does Panaeolus subbalteatus stain blue?


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OfflinePsychonaut
seeker

Registered: 12/18/98
Posts: 407
Loc: Vancouver Island, Canada
Last seen: 9 years, 1 month
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75554 - 05/13/00 09:28 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Nice Pics, everyone.

------------------
"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." J.M.

Northern Touch Spores



--------------------
FungusFun.com


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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75555 - 05/13/00 10:37 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Interestingly, No. Mr. Surrealthoughts,

However, On Maui at the 3000 meter elevation on Kula Highway about thirty yards before Poli-Poli road is a field on the right side of the highway withy Koulao Ranch Homes and the Panaeolus subbalteatus in this field not only exhibit extreme bluing but they get as large as some P. cubensis.

When I picked themn in oregon and washingon in manue I noticed no bluing due to the red coloration of the stems. Which probably hide the bluing. In haystacks in the Willamette Valley near Corvalis, Oregon, when you part the hay where the mushrooms are coming out of, the fine matted pads of mycellium are already tinged a light azure blue.

Ehy they blue in Hawaii is a mystery to be studied someday by someone other than me who might get grrants to do so.

mjshroomer



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InvisiblePsylosymon
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 10/12/99
Posts: 1,818
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75556 - 05/14/00 06:44 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

i want to find some pan subbs!!i am so fuckin busy lately tho.

cool pics mj. :biggrin:

------------------
Father Psylosymon:PRAISE OOLAR!!!!!!!!!!!
Listen to brother oDin,show us your tits!
*************************

"you worked at a sperm bank and got fired drinkin on the job"
Dilated Peoples



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OfflineKrupa
veteran
Registered: 01/09/00
Posts: 443
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75557 - 05/18/00 11:27 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Thanks for the Spring Mushrooms series, mj. Quite interesting.

-Good Day, All!



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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75558 - 05/19/00 04:54 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Hi again,

went out today with my friend Marco from Sequim and we went down to Tumwater, Washingtons to check the hay compost heaps. We only found about 6 little one to two inch high Panaeolus subbalteatus and about 1,000 Panaeolus sphinctrinus. It was very dry in one half of the area and the other had thousands of non-hallucinogenic mushrooms in little dried rosettes and when we picked a clump of them they crumbled to dust.

We also found a puffball as large as a softball.

But it was strange weather conditions. The Pn. sphinctrinus had all gone black and gooey there. We also some some Conocybe tenera, not psychoactive and some gymnopilus there, also not psychoactive. I almost caught a red and black garden snake in the brush but he alluded me.

I'll keep in touch if any thing interesting comes up. Also have a new picture of the Treasure Coast of three shrooms and soon I'll start on the Cambodians again and on the Psilocybe hispanica from Spain.

everyone have a shroomy day.

mjshroomer



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Offlineazurescen
meanderinemushie muncher
Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 261
Loc: bellingham wa
Last seen: 16 years, 8 months
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75559 - 05/20/00 09:00 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

going lib cap and pan subb hunting tomorrow in yelm on a friends property, hope I find some good ones. he said he was finding lbm's w/purple-brown gills and nipples on the caps;0 will keep you posted


--------------------
if the sign says dont pick the mushrooms, you should probably pick them


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Offlineazurescen
meanderinemushie muncher
Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 261
Loc: bellingham wa
Last seen: 16 years, 8 months
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75560 - 05/22/00 04:06 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

well, found a shit load of p. papilionaceous today, as well as some amanitas and a few other unidentified shrooms. oh well, scoped out the property well as well as some other spots out there, so I cant complain


--------------------
if the sign says dont pick the mushrooms, you should probably pick them


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75561 - 05/24/00 01:31 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

mj could you explain those two pics of yours please

Is that small one your holding in your hand the same one as the one on the right with the white backround??

and whats that shiney thing on the left???

heh

what is that thing?



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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75562 - 05/24/00 06:27 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Yes GGreatOne234,

Both shrooms are Panaeoluls subbalteatus.

The shiny cap on the left is also subbalteautus which is also hygrophanous and turns to an off-white shiny cap which may also become somewhat pitted and craclkked with age similar to the Copelandia mushrooms. It apparently awas mimicking the Panaeolus sphinctrinus which were also growing all around it. I have more new pictures from last weeks pickings but have not developed them since i have a lot of photographs to take still in the camera.

mj



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InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75563 - 05/27/00 08:33 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

mj, in your last reply you stated:
"It apparently awas mimicking the Panaeolus sphinctrinus which were also growing all around it."

---Is this known to happen???
---Could you please try to expand on that idea.



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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75564 - 05/27/00 10:42 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Sometimes when hundreds of mushrooms grow side by side, the caps may resemble each other macroscopically. For example, Copelanida cyanescens and paneolus antillarum has been known to grow from the same cow dung together and thus get accidently picked together. ALso Copelandia cyanescens and panaeolus sphinctrinus will be growing side by side, the caps will appear similar. the difference is in the coloration of the stems. Yet they will often appear in collections by people picking them and not realizing they have two varieties, although all three of those species have disctinct characteristics separate of each other.

I have pictures posted in my field guide at my website:
http://mjshroomer.yage.net

Have a shroomy day. Niice field guide G GreatOne234 who's name is hard to type.

mj



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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75565 - 05/28/00 04:21 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Hey MJ
if I make sure every specimen of copelandia turns blue before eating it would prevent picking paneolus antillarum and sphinctrinus right? That is what I stick to. No blue no go. Are the other varieties poisonous or toxic? Do they exhibit any type of bruising?
Thanks mate


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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75566 - 05/28/00 04:19 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

High Beesley,

The Panaeolus sphinctrinus has teeth on the edge of the cap and the stem is usually a reddish-brown color so you can distinguish it from the Copelandia.

The Panaeolus antillarum cap gets very large and thich. The edges of the gills are often white and the gills brqack and the spae of the capo from underneath is sorto f distorted. Also they tent to get rather large and silvery looking with age.

Check my site for soem Antillarums.(Shroom Guide and also the Thailand papers show Panaeoulus antillarum

mjshroomer



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InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75567 - 05/28/00 06:31 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Hello Beesly,

mj had once said that Copelandia cyanscens, copelandia chlorocystis and one other copelandia variety (forget which one), all are microscopically the same. So with that said, all three of these varieties are known as the "Blue Meanies".

You had said once that the copes in your country show positive blue on the stems....

The copelandias that I have found here in florida, most do not show a "positive" bluing on the stems. Their stems are rather fragile, they damage and dry up very quick, to a dark blackish green with a slight tint of blue on most of them (just a tint behind the black).

After only one day of drying in the open air the stems are like dental floss. The caps take a couple days to completely dry in the open air and shrivel up to the size of raisins...so I have to work quick with them.

What I do to find the blue, is take spore prints of each of them and match up each cap with its corrosponding stem (just to be sure). They take a good half hour for them to fully blue, I see their bluing under the cap where the stem was fully removed from. Under the cap. That is the only way I can positively identify them (positively).

Red brown stems - - - throw that shit out

oh and I'll email you the link so you can see my new freeinternet mushroom hunting booklet!

G1



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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75568 - 05/29/00 03:24 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

ya mj, I usually se those big silver ones when the copes are out. the little ones look similar. The silvery ones here drop nasty black goop spores soon after picking. yuck. I will take a look at your site
thanks mate.

GGreat
ya it is good to check at the stem/cap junction for posi-blue. The aussie ones will blue on the stem a deep blue then they go black soon after. I have seen them blue on the caps as well. They are very fragile. I am certain the ones I have had are cope cyans due to the potency and major blueing. thus the name cyanescen. Maybe the florida strains are not as potent. does less blue mean less psilocin? Who knows? I cannot disqualify a cope cyan because it blues too much. Pan sphintrinus will not blue, will it? That should disqualify that. Cause I do see ones that look like cope/cyan but they never blue at all. I chuck them out. gotta go
later mate
bb



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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75569 - 05/29/00 05:53 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Bluing in an indication that the mushrooms in question ae high in psilocine, not in psilocybine.

You can go to Spiritplants and go to thwe mushroom hunting forum and go back to the whole one year and look up the posts I made on Copelandia. I show several fresh specimens of Copelandia's to show their natural colors and their bluing reactions.

Usually, the Copelandia's will already have bluing in them from natural elements such as falling leaves, slug damage, wind and/or from cows kicking the shrooms as they trudge through the fields.

Also the cow pies can have anywhere from one or two shrooms up to as many as two hundred mushrooms depending oin the weather and their growing conditions. And sometimes, every cow pie will have massive shrooms growing abunbdantly from their manure heaps.

Other times only one or two specimens in the manu.

When only a few shrooms are visable, then that means that the flush has already run its course. See the seven images taken below of Panaeolus tropicalis.

I photographed this shroom every three days. for A total of twenty-one days of fruitings.

The manure, as you can see is dark and black and fresh. It fell during the night. So I photographed it and then did a few close-ups. Then came back every three days until no more shrooms appeared. And every three days I kept removing the leaves from the manure.

This was growing on Kualoa Ranch in Kahuku, Oahu, Hawaii. Along side a trail in a shaded tree area.



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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/22/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75570 - 05/29/00 07:52 AM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Hey GGreatOne234 and Beesly,

Here are the Copelandia tropicalis images of a 21 day growth of shrooms.

Here we have day 1.


And here is a close-up of day i.


And yet one more close up for day 1.


And now for the tird day of picking. I again returned to the spot and found these had come up during the last three days.

After picking them I cleaned away all of the leaves.


and then Day six.


And for a close-up of day 6.


Here iw the 14th day of growth on this lonely cow-pie.





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OfflineSirShroomalot
journeyman
Registered: 05/22/00
Posts: 47
Last seen: 21 years, 3 months
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75571 - 05/29/00 08:45 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

GGreatOne234,

Do you think you could send me the link to your hunting booklet site? I am trying to find out all of the different species that grow in central Georgia. I would really appreciate it. I am trying to get my hands on a good book, but I don't have a credit card for ordering off the net. my email address: wakefakie@aol

Thanks alot...

I've enjoyed your spring mushrooms series mj.
It's been inspirational...

Thanks guys...



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Anonymous

Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75572 - 05/30/00 02:03 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Hey Mj you are the master. Great sequence. If you look again you will notice I did say that less blue might be less psilocine not psilocybin. I once say a big blue stain in the grass that had remnants of copes that a cow smashed.
Hope to see ya if you come to OZ again.I did not see a picture of mj with a kangaroo or cockatoo in the archives. Ha ha
BB


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InvisibleGGreatOne234
Stranger
Registered: 12/24/99
Posts: 8,946
Re: Spring Mushrooms Part Three: Panaeolus subbalteatus
    #75573 - 05/30/00 09:30 PM (22 years, 4 months ago)

Huh, thats a lot of mushrooms.

I think Ive found some of those tropicalis' here in florida, early-october '99..

..yeah,.. but certainly not That many

Those stems and caps stain Blue right?



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