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Offlinejet li
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #7536560 - 10/19/07 05:46 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Well, I'm leaning more toward Stropharia aeruginosa, but a spore print would be a deciding factor. I just don't quite like the look of those, although they are pretty harmless (Stropharia aeruginosa) they're still not recommended for eating.


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Offlineepilobium
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: jet li]
    #7538548 - 10/20/07 08:40 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for all the excellent replies guys. I also have some more info on the find:
1) The habitat contained no bark chippings etc Its an open filed, no woodland nearby either. However, the could be growing on grass/juncus thatch?
2) Spore prints just in! See photos below. The color = purplely/chocolaty brown.
I was leaning towards Stropharia aeruginosa BUT there is no frilly cap margin and the gills don't have a lighter/white margin either.The youngest species was quite blue however.
Also, AKB was right in that there is bluing where debris has obscured the cap. This is evident in the picture where a blade of grass has created a line of bluing.
Personally, I don't think its either species as the cap seems to be too light/blue for be cyanescens.

Two further things that confuse me:
1) The gills. They are free. Is this the case in cyanescens or aeruginosa? (I keep reading conflicting reports).
2) The smell. They have a distinct smell, slightly aniseedish (?)

So what the hell is it?!???

Any more ideas/thoughts guys? :smile:





Edited by epilobium (10/20/07 08:42 AM)


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Offlineakb112211
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: Dr. uarewotueat]
    #7538622 - 10/20/07 09:15 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think they are cyans at all.
The poster did not indicate whether they were blue when picked or began white and bruised after handling. they appear to have a uniform blueness throughout the stem. Wrong color gills as well.
If you notice in the first picture, the mushrooms lose their blue color as they gain age. Ending with a almost completely pale brown upturned wavy cap. Here are some pics of mine exhibiting the same characteristics. They are a bit scalier. But also have a removable pellicle.


Also, the poster mentioned finding these in grass. I didn't think cyans grew in grass. They could be on rotten wood beneath the grass, but because cyans are reported to have been brought into the UK on woodchips, this should be ruled out. Unless there are woodchips in the middle of a field.(not likely)
Look at this pic from mushroomexpert.com

Even though they were found in the UK, they could resemble "Stropharia pseudocyanea (= Stropharia albocyanea), of the Pacific Northwest, is similar in appearance but is typically paler, and grows in grass. Its gills and spore print are brownish, rather than purplish brown."(mushroomexpert.com)
This entry in rogersmushrooms.com should confirm. It also mentions a habitat that resembles that of the mushrooms in question.(the third photo.)
http://www.rogersmushrooms.com/gallery/DisplayBlock~bid~6787.asp
Either way, he/she has not been back to refute or confirm any of the claims we are making. Could just be a one-time poster.

I guess arguing my point does not make me a popular poster. Sorry, it just seems obvious even though the pics are not that great. tell me what you think of the links.


--------------------
"There never was and never will be,
Nor is there now,
The wholly criticized
Or the wholly approved"


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Offlineakb112211
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: epilobium]
    #7538627 - 10/20/07 09:17 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

oh, you must have posted while I was writing mine up...cool


--------------------
"There never was and never will be,
Nor is there now,
The wholly criticized
Or the wholly approved"


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OfflineFahkface
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: akb112211]
    #7538768 - 10/20/07 10:14 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Since this is a forum that's based on free speech, everyone can tell what ever they think (as long as it isn't completely fucked up). And when you think it's another type of mushrooms than I do (or some others) this shouldn't make you unpopular (at least it doesn't for me).

Anyway, I'm ABSOLUTELY convinced that these are Ps. Cyanescens and believe me, when I say, that I've seen enough Cyans to know what I'm talking about.

When Cyans get old and a little dry (often comes with cold and dry weather), they start tunring blue all over (especially the stem) and sometimes even the caps. The mushrooms on the right side of the first picture look a little different to the ones on the left, though they appear to be still Cyans, since their appearance varies quiet much from young to old. I've seen tons of Cyans looking like that, that where as blue as them (or even WAY more blue).
Spore print colour also leads me to believe that these are Cyans.

Stropharia aeruginosa and all the other blue Stropharia species have a much thicker stem and become more white when they get old, almost loosing their magnificent coloration.

As you can see in these pics, the stems can turn very blue without even being touched and the coloration gets brighter, more yellow like, when they get old and dry:

Blue stem:




And older and dry ones...



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Offlinejet li
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: epilobium]
    #7539036 - 10/20/07 11:51 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

epilobium said:
Thanks for all the excellent replies guys. I also have some more info on the find:
1) The habitat contained no bark chippings etc Its an open filed, no woodland nearby either. However, the could be growing on grass/juncus thatch?
2) Spore prints just in! See photos below. The color = purplely/chocolaty brown.
I was leaning towards Stropharia aeruginosa BUT there is no frilly cap margin and the gills don't have a lighter/white margin either.The youngest species was quite blue however.
Also, AKB was right in that there is bluing where debris has obscured the cap. This is evident in the picture where a blade of grass has created a line of bluing.
Personally, I don't think its either species as the cap seems to be too light/blue for be cyanescens.

Two further things that confuse me:
1) The gills. They are free. Is this the case in cyanescens or aeruginosa? (I keep reading conflicting reports).
2) The smell. They have a distinct smell, slightly aniseedish (?)

So what the hell is it?!???

Any more ideas/thoughts guys? :smile:








The spore print looks Brown to me, but it might just be the picture.  I'm still sure they are Stropharia aeruginosa.


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Offlineelflord420
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: jet li]
    #7539321 - 10/20/07 01:30 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

it looks alot like cyan... but the spore print of cyans are alot more purple

i dunno could be your camera...

but it looks more brown then purple which is a bad sign that its not cyan


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OfflineFahkface
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: elflord420]
    #7539434 - 10/20/07 02:08 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Well, most of the prints I take from Cyans look dark brown (most of them don't look purple at all).
Older and wet specimens given almost orange looking prints...


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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: Fahkface]
    #7539515 - 10/20/07 02:34 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Those don't look like stropharia aeruginosa to me. The ones I find have a shaggier stem. I really think those are cyanescens.


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Offlineelflord420
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: landsnorkler]
    #7539527 - 10/20/07 02:40 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

i dunno fhakface... when me and my friend were pickin a extremely ungodly big patch of cyans our hands became covered in deep purple spores... and you can see as the cyans grow.. smaller mushrooms under bigger ones get drenched in deep purple spores on their caps... plus the spore prints that ive taken from cyans are deep purple!

something strange about thoes pics of mushrooms make me think differently i duno.. they look alot like cyans with blueing but something about the cap structure just kinda throws me off of thinking they are cyans plus the brown spore-print

but on the other hand they look alot like actives and the more i look at the spore print i think they are cyans...

its up to you if you wanna consume them or not!!


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Dont ever eat mushrooms and watch Total Recall


Edited by elflord420 (10/20/07 02:41 PM)


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OfflineFahkface
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: elflord420]
    #7540610 - 10/20/07 07:58 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

its up to you if you wanna consume them or not!!




In the end it's always up to the poster to consume them and I'd always say: "Don't eat them!" if there is more than one opinion about it.
Anyway, St. aeruginosa ain't poison (after removing the cap skin (and that's gonna be hard with Cyans)).
I'd say: Eat them and see what's gonna happen! You won't get sick or anything. The only thinkg that might happen is, that you#re not gonna trip (very unlikely :wink: )


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Invisiblecactu
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: Fahkface]
    #7540690 - 10/20/07 08:18 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

i like to see more, pictures, if you can and more specimens


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Offlinecasgoodie
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: cactu]
    #7540740 - 10/20/07 08:35 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

most likely a rare strain of p cyanescens, maybe a new species in the woodlover complex


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Offlinecasgoodie
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: casgoodie]
    #7540746 - 10/20/07 08:36 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

have they been under freezing conditions?


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Offlinenotapillow
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: casgoodie]
    #7540753 - 10/20/07 08:39 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

woodlovers are so coplex :grin:


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OfflineSubbedhunter420
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: notapillow]
    #7541424 - 10/21/07 02:22 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I still firmly believe them to be cyans too. after a further look at the pictures die by side, i believe the way they bruise, the thickness of the stems, and the purple/brown spore print would indicate Psilocybe Cyanescens.


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Offlineundergrounder
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: Subbedhunter420]
    #7541545 - 10/21/07 03:28 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

That print looks really brown, way too brown. I equalised the colour, it looks a little better:



Although they don't look like typical cyans and they're growing in a field, i'd say they're just cyans that are cold. Where i pick woodlovers the temps get regularly to and below freezing and the woodlovers grow smaller, the caps don't open up fully and there's often a lot of blueing already evident.

That said, they still look strange, the blueing still doesn't look right and the colours are off.


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Offlineepilobium
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: undergrounder]
    #7541597 - 10/21/07 04:35 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks again guys... I wish I had discovered this place a few years ago :smile:

They were picked after a few days of frosts so they had undergone cooling. I think, among other things,  they are not 'meaty' enough for  St. aeruginosa. However, they could be a rarer variety of either Psilocybe or strophs. Now that they are drying they are really bluing-up and the gills are completly detached from the stem.

Think I might try one and see what happens. Maybe half of one to be safe? What do you guys think?


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Offlineepilobium
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: epilobium]
    #7541599 - 10/21/07 04:36 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Also, they still have that slight aniseed smell which is very confusing :S


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OfflineFahkface
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Re: Unusual UK active! Please help to identify.... [Re: epilobium]
    #7541636 - 10/21/07 05:12 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Half of one specimen wouldn't do it, I guess. Just eat a gram and see what happens. Three of my mushroom books say that St. aeruginosa is more or less safe to eat (as I said before: after removing the cap skin and that is impossible with Cyans).

I'm definitely no one who suggests eating mushrooms he's not 10000% sure of what they are, so IF you get sick after eating those, the claim is upon me! It might be a fucked up situation to eat mushrooms you're not convinced of what they are but keep sayin' to yourself that St. Aeruginosa isn't poisonous. The only thing that could happen is that you get diarrhea for a few hours but it's more likely that you trip a little :wink:

Have fun!


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