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OfflineCaribou_Lou
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Registered: 10/17/07
Posts: 2,510
Loc: Never Land
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Quick Question
    #7528885 - 10/17/07 06:46 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Okay so this is my first attempt at growing mushrooms. I have 12 1/2 pint jars and I filled them with the vermiculite, water, and brown rice flour. Instead of drilling holes in the lids of the jars I just used the ring thing with threads and screwed it on over foil, then I poked four holes in the foil. I put foil over the top of the jars in the pressure cooker, but only loosly. After I cooked them for an hour I took them out and it is very soggy looking inside the jars, what should I do? I put them in the oven for a little bit, so hopefully that helps.


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Registered: 07/29/07
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Re: Quick Question [Re: Caribou_Lou]
    #7528946 - 10/17/07 07:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I suggest starting over and do everything exactly like the tek says!!!!

Sounds like water managed to get into the jars. U will want the holes in the jar lids anyway not just for inoculating, but for gas exchange.

Put the holes in the lids, screw on loosely and cover with tinfoil to stop moisture getting in the jars while PC

You will want to keep ur jars raised out of the water in the pressure cooker, also make sure u have your water content right.


--------------------

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OfflineCaribou_Lou
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Registered: 10/17/07
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Re: Quick Question [Re: veda_sticks]
    #7528998 - 10/17/07 07:21 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think you understand what I said. Condensation got into the holes, and it doesn't matter if I used a foil lid or the canning lid. Holes are holes lol.. I covered the holes with foil, but only loosly. I don't have any more brown rice flour so starting over isn't an option at this point. How do I know if there is too much water inside the jars or not?


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Invisibleblood4blood
Calmer Than You Are


Registered: 04/25/07
Posts: 6,029
Loc: The Valley
Re: Quick Question [Re: veda_sticks]
    #7529001 - 10/17/07 07:22 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

you want to leave the weight on the pc leave the jars in the pc as LEAST overight. this used to happen to me all the time because i would take the weight off right away after they were done pc'n without letting the pressure drop by itself. it causes water to condensate inside of your jars.


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Invisibleblood4blood
Calmer Than You Are


Registered: 04/25/07
Posts: 6,029
Loc: The Valley
Re: Quick Question [Re: blood4blood]
    #7529013 - 10/17/07 07:24 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

di dyou put a dry verm layer on top of your jars


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OfflineCaribou_Lou
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Registered: 10/17/07
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Re: Quick Question [Re: blood4blood]
    #7529093 - 10/17/07 07:48 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

yeah i have vermiculite on top, and the first five all look really mushy and stuck to the walls of the jars. the second group of 5 I covered a lot better and they look much more like they did before they went into the PC so I hope at least those one's are okay. You aren't supposed to let the pressure out either? I did the second time but they look a lot better than the first group.


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OfflineHappyHardcore
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Re: Quick Question [Re: Caribou_Lou]
    #7529121 - 10/17/07 07:58 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

The problem is most likely your procedures. The lids will help much more than foil at keeping the inside of the jars "stable", so it's best to use the jar lids. Whenever I PC my jars, I always use a double layer of foil wrapped TIGHTLY as possible around the jars to prevent water and water vapor seeping in. In one instance, I had 6qt jars PCing and 4/6 of the jars were soaked to the sog full of water. I had no idea how that had happened. I used lids, foil underneath, and wrapped foil around the tops of the jars as tightly as possible. They were quart jars as well, much taller than pint jars, with 1 inch of water and somehow they all managed to get water logged. Due to that, I now always use a double layer of foil over the tops of my jars. You don't need gas exchange or anything like in the jars until you innoc. and they begin to colonize so leaving them as protected as you can while sterilizing is the best thing to do.


--------------------
:bouncysmoke::juggle:


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OfflineCaribou_Lou
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Re: Quick Question [Re: HappyHardcore]
    #7529146 - 10/17/07 08:07 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Damn I wish I knew this before I started haha. So is it best to use the metal jars, or two layers of foil I'm kind of confused. If they look pretty normal should I inoculate them? what problems does having too much water inside the jars cause? I opened some of the bad ones and they felt like rubber and they were very compact, but the other ones look like they should.

I had to order my flour online and I only bought one pound I ended up using it all, and it took like three weeks to come.. I wish I could just start over but I don't know where to buy the flour. Would a place like trader joe's have brown rice flour? that's the only place I can think of


Edited by Caribou_Lou (10/17/07 08:12 PM)


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Offlinebtronson
first timegrower
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Registered: 05/01/07
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Re: Quick Question [Re: Caribou_Lou]
    #7529207 - 10/17/07 08:29 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

dude you gotta use the lid, then filter, then the ring. you have no viable gas exchange filter with the verm alone. especially if the jars shift while pressure cooking which they will with boiling water. the foil is only to protect the filter from getting wet and, therefore adding more moisture to the substrate you just worked so hard to make perfect. drill the 1/4" hole in the lid, then, if youre low on the cash flow, go buy some heater vent filters at wal-mart for $2 and cut them slightly larger than the lid.

make it look roughly like this:

foil (no holes)
jar ring
filter
jar lid (3/16" to 1/4" hole in top)
jar (filled with your substrate and dry verm layer)


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Offlinebtronson
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Registered: 05/01/07
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Last seen: 15 years, 10 hours
Re: Quick Question [Re: btronson]
    #7529214 - 10/17/07 08:32 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

if the jars get too wet youre inviting contams at worst, and slow or no colonization at best. at any rate, its all bad. see if you can buy organic brown rice and make your own flour with a coffee grinder (props to RR!)


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OfflineCaribou_Lou
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Registered: 10/17/07
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Re: Quick Question [Re: btronson]
    #7529228 - 10/17/07 08:35 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

that is very confusing haha, why can't I just use two layers of foil or the lid and foil over it? I actually found a place that has it so I'm going to pick up some tomorrow and I guess I will just start over completely. I don't have a drill though so I can't drill holes in the lids, can I just use two layers of foil?


Edited by Caribou_Lou (10/17/07 08:48 PM)


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OfflineMepher
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Re: Quick Question [Re: Caribou_Lou]
    #7529835 - 10/18/07 01:18 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Wait, foil under the band in place of the lid? There is no way you can tighten the band without tearing the crap out of the foil.

The classic tek is to use a dry verm layer, put the flat lids on seal-side up, put the band on tightly, and cover the whole top tightly with foil. Very simple. To improve upon this, use a tyvek filter layer under or over the lids (still under the screw-on bands). Look for a writeup with pics if none of thuis makes sense, cause it is actually VERY easy to do.

Caribou_Lou, I punch holes with an awl (an ice pick or small pointy screwdriver works) rather than drilling. Really, these methods are designed to be very simple, so follow the instructions and be happy rather than trying to cut corners or innovate. And if buying another $7 worth of BRF to do it right is too expensive after you soak your first effort, you may have chosen the wrong hobby. Surely you have a health food store or whole foods or organic foods store nearby? They're almost guaranteed to stock BRF. Even the big chain supermarkets around here carry BRF.

I'm not sure what you mean by using "metal jars," as I've never heard of such a thing.


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