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mushbaby
woodswalker




Registered: 09/30/06
Posts: 2,645
Loc: in my own lil world
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Thor]
#7528997 - 10/17/07 07:21 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Thanks Thor.
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Pooter
Shroom Mongler




Registered: 02/12/07
Posts: 146
Loc: With waldo.
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: mushbaby]
#7529213 - 10/17/07 08:32 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
mushbaby said: Maybe the results will help lead the way for a study involving cluster headaches.
I'm sorry, but I think that prescribing shrooms are a bit of an overkill for a cluster headache. Think about it, either the dose will be insanely low, or it will be insanely expensive. It might become legal for a little while, and OH-DMT would be moved to schedule II, but either of the following would happen, and -OH-DMT would back in schedule 1. 1.) Everybody suddenly starts to get cluster headaches. Doctors believe them, and prescribe them to people. Three days later, people try to refill, pharmacists are like lol wut, and it's schedule 1 again. 2.) Pharmaceutical competitors find a new, dare I say "safer" different medication, and govt bans -OH-DMT.
Back on the topic of giving OH-DMT to cancer patients, if this had been 15years ago, you'd damn well bet my grandpa would be on the next plan to LA.
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MushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs



Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Pooter]
#7529273 - 10/17/07 08:52 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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The research does not limit itself only to what it officially is about, but it also proves latent effects. Through which more people will become aware that there are low psychical and mental health risks when it comes to consuming mushrooms. As opposed to the propaganda that's taking place right now.
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   All this time I've loved you And never known your face All this time I've missed you And searched this human race Here is true peace Here my heart knows calm Safe in your soul Bathed in your sighs
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FurrowedBrow
Free yourself from yourself



Registered: 10/26/06
Posts: 2,439
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Thor]
#7529408 - 10/17/07 09:55 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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This is good news. I dont think maps has anything to do with this one so it's good to see that there is research being conducted outside of their organizational sponsorship. I can't say enough in support of the research. There are soo many natural cures we overlook or just don't know about.
-------------------- Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery. ~ Thomas Jefferson
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Roadkill
Retired Shroomery Mod



Registered: 12/11/01
Posts: 22,674
Loc: Montana
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: FurrowedBrow]
#7529594 - 10/17/07 11:09 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
FurrowedBrow said:
There are soo many natural cures we overlook or just don't know about.
I know someday they will find a cure for Cancer from some mushroom or some plant.
It's too late for my Mother...
but maybe it won't be too late for some of yours!~
much 
-------------------- Laterz, Road Who the hell you callin crazy? You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch! Brainiac said: PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.
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ThePyschonaut52
Stranger


Registered: 04/24/07
Posts: 982
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Roadkill]
#7530218 - 10/18/07 06:24 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I agree with you roadkill. About 25% of our medicines come from plants, most of which are found in the rainforest...I think
Sorry to hear about your mother btw
-------------------- "In god we trust..." -I guess we're screwed.
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dysphoria
lost soul


Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 1,651
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: ThePyschonaut52]
#7530956 - 10/18/07 11:39 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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i think its more like 75% or more of our medicines come from plants. and even the truly synthetic drugs have their origins, at least in theory, from plants.
but who knows...
(kinda a pun, since W.H.O. is the one that proposed the above estimate.)
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dysphoria
lost soul


Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 1,651
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: dysphoria]
#7530970 - 10/18/07 11:45 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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actually, i misread the statistic =)
25-40% of drugs are derived from plants. 75-85% of the population uses plants as medicine.
so yea, you're right psychonaut.
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sunshine
Sin18DwireWuTang

Registered: 04/03/04
Posts: 43,592
Loc: higher plane of sex
Last seen: 5 years, 25 minutes
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: FurrowedBrow]
#7531447 - 10/18/07 02:25 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I read in High Times about a study w/ Psilocybin, and all of the participants ranked their trip as one of the most important experiences of their life.
-------------------- One Love True Indeed. Have Good Trips. Mike/sunshine's mom.
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scout24
Hallelujah!


Registered: 02/12/07
Posts: 2,769
Loc: Disappear Here
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: sunshine]
#7532395 - 10/18/07 05:59 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Sorry for the long post, but I can't link this. Here's a description of a psilocybin study and 'mystical' experiences from Johns Hopkins:
"Using unusually rigorous scientific conditions and measures, Johns Hopkins researchers have shown that the active agent in "sacred mushrooms" can induce mystical/spiritual experiences descriptively identical to spontaneous ones people have reported for centuries and can apparently prompt positive changes in behavior and attitude that last a minimum of several months.
.
Cited as "landmark" in the commentary by former National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA) director, Charles Schuster, the research marks a new systematic approach to studying certain hallucinogenic compounds that, in the 1950s, showed signs of therapeutic potential or value in research into the nature of consciousness and sensory perception. "Human consciousness...is a function of the ebb and flow of neural impulses in various regions of the brain-the very substrate that drugs such as psilocybin act upon," Schuster said. "Understanding what mediates these effects is clearly within the realm of neuroscience and deserves investigation."
"A vast gap exists between what we know of these drugs-mostly from descriptive anthropology-and what we believe we can understand using modern clinical pharmacology techniques," said study leader Roland Griffiths, PhD, a professor with Hopkins' departments of Neuroscience and Psychiatry and Behavioral Biology. "That gap is large because, as a reaction to the excesses of the 1960s, human research with hallucinogens has been basically frozen in time these last forty years."
All of the study's authors caution about substantial risks of taking psilocybin under conditions not appropriately supervised.
"Even in this study, where we greatly controlled conditions to minimize adverse effects, about a third of subjects reported significant fear, with some also reporting transient feelings of paranoia," said Griffiths. "Under unmonitored conditions, it's not hard to imagine those emotions escalating to panic and dangerous behavior."
The researchers' message isn't just that psilocybin can produce mystical experiences. "I had a healthy skepticism going into this," said Griffiths, "and that finding alone was a surprise." But, as important, he said, "is that, under very defined conditions, with careful preparation, you can safely and fairly reliably occasion what's called a primary mystical experience that may lead to positive changes in a person. It's an early step in what we hope will be a large body of scientific work that will ultimately help people."
The authors acknowledge the unusual nature of the work, treading, as it does, a fine line between neuroscience and areas most would consider outside science's realm. "But establishing the basic science here is necessary," said Griffiths, "to take advantage of the possible benefits psilocybin can bring to our understanding of how thought, emotion, and ultimately behavior are grounded in biology."
In the study, more than 60% of subjects described the effects of psilocybin in ways that met criteria for a "full mystical experience" as measured by established psychological scales. One third said the experience was the single most spiritually significant of their lifetimes; and more than two-thirds rated it among their five most meaningful and spiritually significant. Griffiths said subjects liken it to the importance of the birth of their first child or the death of a parent.
Two months later, 79% of subjects reported moderately or greatly increased well-being or life satisfaction compared with those given a placebo at the same test session. A majority said their mood, attitudes and behaviors had changed for the better. Structured interviews with family members, friends and co-workers generally confirmed the subjects' remarks. Results of a year-long followup are being readied for publication.
Psychological tests and subjects' own reports showed no harm to study participants, though some admitted extreme anxiety or other unpleasant effects in the hours following the psilocybin capsule. The drug has not been observed to be addictive or physically toxic in animal studies or human populations. "In this regard," said Griffiths, a psychopharmacologist, "it contrasts with MDMA (ecstasy), amphetamines or alcohol."
The study isn't the first with psilocybin, the researchers say, though some of the earlier ones, done elsewhere, had notably less rigorous design, were less thorough in measuring outcomes or lacked longer-term follow-up.
In the present work, 36 healthy, well-educated volunteers - most of them middle-aged-with no family history of psychosis or bipolar disorder - were selected. All had active spiritual practices. "We thought a familiarity with spiritual practice would give them a framework for interpreting their experiences and that they'd be less likely to be confused or troubled by them," Griffiths said. All gave informed consent to the study approved by Hopkins' institutional review board.
Each of thirty of the subjects attended two separate 8-hour drug sessions, at two month intervals. On one they received psilocybin, on another, methylphenidate (Ritalin), the active placebo.
Each subject met several times, before drug sessions began, with a reassuring "monitor," a medical professional experienced in observing drug study participants. Monitors stayed with them during the capsule-taking sessions.
The researchers countered "expectancy" by having both monitors and subjects "blinded" to what substance would be given. For ethical reasons, subjects were told about hallucinogens' possible effects, but also learned they could, instead, get other substances-weak or strong-that might change perception or consciousness.
Most important, a third "red herring" group of six subjects had two blinded placebo sessions, then were told they'd receive psilocybin at a third. This tactic-questionnaires later verified-kept participants and monitors in the dark at the first two sessions about each capsule's contents.
As for where the work could lead, the team is planning a trial of patients suffering from advanced cancer-related depression or anxiety, following up suggestive research several decades ago. They're also designing studies to test a role for psilocybin in treating drug dependence.
This article was prepared by Science Letter editors from staff and other reports. Copyright 2007, Science Letter via NewsRx.com."
-------------------- Always Be Closing
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Shroomtalk
Journalist


Registered: 03/04/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Shroomville, Canada
Last seen: 15 years, 6 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: ThePyschonaut52]
#7532436 - 10/18/07 06:12 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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This is impressive work.
I would love to write about this and possibly get an interview for the magazine.
Please contact me if your interested. info@shroomtalk.com
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: ThePyschonaut52]
#7532774 - 10/18/07 07:33 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
ThePyschonaut52 said: You people joking abou cancer have no fucking clue how bad, terrible, and painful cancer is.
I would know considering I had lung cancer when I was 6 to 7 years old, and was in pain pretty much every day. So please, grow up, as I infeel it is inappropriate to joke about this horrible disease...
Nothing is too horrible to joke about. Joking is what relieves anxiety about difficult things for many people. If you don't like the jokes then you have the ability to ignore them. However what I think is inappropriate is someone telling others how they should behave as far as expressing themselves goes. I'm sorry you suffered, I really am, but someone joking about it does not make the physical suffering worse and emotionally we all have free will as to how we feel about things others may say.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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SneezingPenis
ACHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!111!

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 15,427
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Icelander]
#7532808 - 10/18/07 07:44 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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hey, are there any more details we can get about this?
like, will they really be ingesting mushrooms? or will it be an IM or IV sort of thing? what is the setting going to be? what are the safety measures if someone trips out too hard? what are the dosages going to be? are you able to disclose rough facts about the group? like age? are they terminal? sex?
from my limited knowledge from reading The Spirit Molecule, i was under the assumption that in order to do research/testing on human patients, the drug had to be of a certain quality or grade.... how would they go about that with psilocybin? is there going to be a placebo group? if so, is it going to be double-blind?
I are wanting more details.... gimme.
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CaptainLinger
A Fungus Amongus


Registered: 05/25/07
Posts: 1,756
Last seen: 3 years, 7 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: SneezingPenis]
#7533502 - 10/18/07 10:34 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I would have to presume the psilocybin will be synthesized, orally ingested. That's generally the procedure used; it would be of effectively 100% purity.
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Thor
Anti-Theist OVERLORD



Registered: 08/12/98
Posts: 10,017
Loc: Iceland
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: Pooter]
#7533734 - 10/19/07 12:24 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
I'm sorry, but I think that prescribing shrooms are a bit of an overkill for a cluster headache. Think about it, either the dose will be insanely low, or it will be insanely expensive
Considering that cluster headache suffers are getting great results from psilocybin where other treatments fail, I think its the furthest from overkill imaginable. Considering the high suicide rate of people suffering from cluster headaches which are often described as excruciating pain; I would think considering the pain these people have to endure the hope psilocybin gives them is hugely important.
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: ThePyschonaut52]
#7533797 - 10/19/07 12:58 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
ThePyschonaut52 said: You people joking abou cancer have no fucking clue how bad, terrible, and painful cancer is.
I would know considering I had lung cancer when I was 6 to 7 years old, and was in pain pretty much every day. So please, grow up, as I feel it is inappropriate to joke about this horrible disease...
I commiserate, but to rule cancer off the funny list is patently unfair. People die, and it is most frequently an excruciating and prolonged affair. If you hold true to your professed virtues, the Darwin Awards are now off limits, along with every other "it's funny because it's terrible" comment that involves someone's death. Cancer does not have a monopoly on pain. Besides, "tumor" is a very funny word describing a very deadly thing; isn't it contrast--such as between terrible and silly, or expected and unexpected--that defines humor, anyway?
To the point, though, I am surprised and a little bit disappointed that the subject post is contacting obviously-partisan groups for subjects. That's bad science, and compromising the study is going to compromise its impact. My personal experiences tell me that this sort of research--not just with terminal illness, but with many forms of anxiety--has great potential. Hallucinogens can, with guidance, help an individual to reorganize their entire world-view in an almost uniformly positive way (2012 prophecies notwithstanding). However, we don't have that kind of guidance yet. If hallucinogens are going to be implemented as a treatment for any psychiatric condition, there are going to need to be psychiatrists specially trained in their use.
In other words, popping an eighth of shrooms twice a month isn't going to work like an SSRI, or any other mood-altering substance. Some people will find a way to improve their state through the use of hallucinogens without help, surely, but for this to be a widely-applicable treatment we would really require a more balanced approach to pharmacology. Maybe one day.
-------------------- FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
Edited by figgusfiddus (10/19/07 12:59 AM)
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: CaptainLinger]
#7533804 - 10/19/07 01:03 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
CaptainLinger said: I would have to presume the psilocybin will be synthesized, orally ingested. That's generally the procedure used; it would be of effectively 100% purity.
I'm not sure if that's true, especially with frontier pharmaceuticals. I don't personally know whether they've actually spliced yeast DNA together to pump out psilocybin, or however they do these things. I would make an uneducated guess that the federal government probably cultivates cubensis on some limited scale. Oh, and I do remember that it was orally ingested in that one episode of House. I'm not sure that counts as a veritable source, though.
Say, if that yeast synthesis method is how they do it, what do you think a sample of that yeast would do to ruin/reinvent our hobby?
-------------------- FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
Edited by figgusfiddus (10/19/07 01:06 AM)
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 15 years, 4 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: scout24]
#7533815 - 10/19/07 01:12 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
scout24 said: Sorry for the long post, but I can't link this. Here's a description of a psilocybin study and 'mystical' experiences from Johns Hopkins:....
I've read this, and I really just want to know what doses they used in the study. I guess the source report is probably available through Hopkins itself, could probably get it via an online journal uh, thingy through any given university.
As far as I can tell, by the way, the original article here is from Science Letter (newsrx.com), a $2295.00/yr weekly publication. Aye aye aye.
-------------------- FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS FGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDSFGSFDS
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johnm214



Registered: 05/31/07
Posts: 17,582
Loc: Americas
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7534332 - 10/19/07 07:09 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Johns Hopkins researchers have shown that the active agent in "sacred mushrooms" can induce mystical/spiritual experiences descriptively identical to spontaneous ones people have reported for centuries and can apparently prompt positive changes in behavior and attitude that last a minimum of several months.
Reached for comment, the Shroomery replied: "No shit"
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opensaysme
Be Here Now



Registered: 07/15/07
Posts: 1,649
Loc: NJ-NY area
Last seen: 12 years, 4 months
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Re: Clinical Trial with Psilocybin in Los Angeles [Re: johnm214]
#7534587 - 10/19/07 09:17 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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For a test like this you would not be eating actual mushrooms, im positive of that. Theres too much variation in dosages, you would be consuming psilocybin capsules like Leary used at harvard.
As for cluster headaches, psychedelics have been proven to brake cycles and prevent the headaches. Here is a video of what a cluster headache is like for those who think its silly to treat them with lsd or psilocybin:Cluster Headache
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