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InvisibleMrKite1
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Registered: 03/02/04
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Loc: AK
Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Walter1496211]
    #7525144 - 10/16/07 08:04 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Read his comment again, I think he was pointing out how horribly wrong a psychedelic trip can go for an unprepared youth.


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When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.


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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: MrKite1]
    #7525167 - 10/16/07 08:08 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

leary was so enthusiastic about the effects of acid he disregarded the threats. like hst said it wasn't instant enlightenment 5$ a pop, it was more complicated than that.


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OfflineWalter1496211
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Walter1496211]
    #7525185 - 10/16/07 08:12 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Walter1496211 said:
I think it means that people who didn't have an opinion to begin with tryed to find one using drugs. This cannot work. But if you have and opinion and a solid foundation of who you are and what you want then and only then can it help open your mind to the path you have already chosen.




I made that statement here.


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you see the world through the window of your experience


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InvisibleaDoS
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Clean]
    #7525241 - 10/16/07 08:22 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Clean said:
i think if we never had anyone who acted like timothy leary we would all be under fascism more horrific than any of us can imagine.




leary didn't do any more than inspire college kids to drop out and ruin their lives.


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"If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution - then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise." - Aldous Huxley
:drooling:GIVE ME OPIATES OR GIVE ME DEATH:drooling:


Edited by aDoS (10/16/07 08:32 PM)


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InvisibleaDoS
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: clemens]
    #7525250 - 10/16/07 08:23 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think fear and loathing is anti drug, but might be sending a message about the importance of moderation. Moderation is key to many things, especially with drugs.


--------------------
"If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution - then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise." - Aldous Huxley
:drooling:GIVE ME OPIATES OR GIVE ME DEATH:drooling:


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OfflineNoviseer
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: aDoS]
    #7525298 - 10/16/07 08:32 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I think the movie demystifies drugs.

Fear and Loathing was written by Hunter Thompson in the early seventies. He was watching the idealism and mysticism of the sixties crumble away into nonsense. He was looking at the thing realistically... laughing at the fact that at the end of the day, you take a lot of drugs and get all fucked up, and that's why we do it, mostly. It doesn't always have to be about seeing god and what not.

HST took an honest look at the world, then cringed, laughed, and shrugged, mumbled to himself, and kept on going.


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_______________________________________________________________
namaste said:
no flamz in da ODD, if you got nothing to contribute then keep yo lips zipped
_________________________________________________________________


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OfflineWalter1496211
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Noviseer]
    #7525317 - 10/16/07 08:36 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Noviseer said:
I think the movie demystifies drugs.

Fear and Loathing was written by Hunter Thompson in the early seventies. He was watching the idealism and mysticism of the sixties crumble away into nonsense. He was looking at the thing realistically... laughing at the fact that at the end of the day, you take a lot of drugs and get all fucked up, and that's why we do it, mostly. It doesn't always have to be about seeing god and what not.

HST took an honest look at the world, then cringed, laughed, and shrugged, mumbled to himself, and kept on going.




Very well said.


--------------------
you see the world through the window of your experience


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Offlinecamelsmoker
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Walter1496211]
    #7525372 - 10/16/07 08:45 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Walter1496211 said:
Quote:

Noviseer said:
I think the movie demystifies drugs.

Fear and Loathing was written by Hunter Thompson in the early seventies. He was watching the idealism and mysticism of the sixties crumble away into nonsense. He was looking at the thing realistically... laughing at the fact that at the end of the day, you take a lot of drugs and get all fucked up, and that's why we do it, mostly. It doesn't always have to be about seeing god and what not.

HST took an honest look at the world, then cringed, laughed, and shrugged, mumbled to himself, and kept on going.




Very well said.



I second that motion!


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THE LUNATIC IS IN MY HEAD
<----(o)---->
Check out www.alexgrey.com! He does tools artwork from lateralus.
No harm can come from questioning. "Best" case scenerio: You prove it right without relying on the fact that it is widely accepted. Argument strengthened. "Worst" case scenerio: You realize you might have been wrong. The new answer might or might not be what you want to hear, but it beats defending yourself with bullshit.
Qoted from (Koala Koolio)


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Offlineclemens
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: JunkFood]
    #7527931 - 10/17/07 02:06 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

JunkFood said:
Quote:

b0red5tiff said:
leary gave out acid like crackers. even to kids that were underage.




Link?



would also like to see this. Leary was against the miss use of acid. I don't think he would have kids tripping on acid. It is just acid became to big, it was the new thing. To many people were using it and when you such a large number of people using a powerful drug that is when it becomes dangerous. He thought he was going to change the world and didn't think people were going to be stupid. Fact remains that acid is a drug and is sold to people so they can get "high" and that is not what Leary really intended.


--------------------

Take it easy dude, but take it!


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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: clemens]
    #7527958 - 10/17/07 02:16 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

leary was all for acid. there's a documentary "the beyond within" or something. little kids are talking about how acid is better than becoming the pope or reading the bible 6 times over or whatever. the merry pranksters weren't that crazy but leary's side was. he wanted the kids not to participate in the corporate world or the american life like their parents. he wanted utopia to happen, one way for that (for him) to give young people LSD.


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OfflineCepheus
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #7528038 - 10/17/07 02:41 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Dr. Timothy Leary is often chastised by uninformed individuals, I too used to chastise him based on what I had heard.

He was most definitely an important character; he essentially started the whole counter culture movement; if it wasn't for him LSD probably would of stayed amongst the closed circles of psychiatrists and pharmacologists.

He was an individual that saw hope for the world; after 2 horrific wars, he found optimism, hope and promise in a miraculous drug. The reason so many people 'dropped out' is because they saw the light; they were part of the dehumanizing machine that is society. He encouraged individuality and  thought for freedom.

Listen to his LSD and Mind control lecture :laugh:

http://deoxy.org/leary.htm


--------------------
"I only ever hope to reach equilibrium, in Nature's matrix, in line with the meridian" ~ Jehst

:sun: "...and I know that I have to keep breathing, as tomorrow the sun will rise, who knows what the tide will bring?" :sun:

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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Cepheus]
    #7528048 - 10/17/07 02:43 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, listen to a lecture about mind control so he can remove all doubts... :shiftyeyes:

i'm not saying he is a "bad man", i say he had good intentions but was going at it like a small kid.


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OfflineCepheus
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #7528101 - 10/17/07 02:59 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

He was approaching it from an idealists perspective. What more can you expect from a Buddhist/ explorer of the psyche / esoteric teacher.

He wasn't a little kid about it at all; he did _LOADS_ of research on the topic (and its all floating around the web). LSD is not dangerous, people are dangerous.

People chastise him for societies mistakes; the reason theres such a thing as an acid casualty is because of social conditioning; people are bred to fear; Listen to the song working class hero by John Lennon.

"The only abuse of drugs, is the control of drugs by other people; the only control is self control" - Tim Leary.

"People use the word "natural"... What is natural to me is these botanical species which interact directly with the nervous system. What I consider artificial is 4 years at Harvard, and the Bible, and Saint Patrick's cathedral, and the sunday school teachings." - Tim Leary.


--------------------
"I only ever hope to reach equilibrium, in Nature's matrix, in line with the meridian" ~ Jehst

:sun: "...and I know that I have to keep breathing, as tomorrow the sun will rise, who knows what the tide will bring?" :sun:

Free Spore Ring Europe
Send any spare spore prints you might have and help the distribution :grin:

Open Source. Freedom.  GNU/Linux

Addicting is not a word.


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OfflineJunkFood
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Cepheus]
    #7528113 - 10/17/07 03:01 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Cepheus said:
"People use the word "natural"... What is natural to me is these botanical species which interact directly with the nervous system. What I consider artificial is 4 years at Harvard, and the Bible, and Saint Patrick's cathedral, and the sunday school teachings." - Tim Leary.




That one's good.


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InvisibleClean
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: JunkFood]
    #7528138 - 10/17/07 03:09 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Leary's two psychedelic suggestions (i call them suggestions rather than commandments)

Quote:


Thou shalt not force thy neighbor to alter her consciousness

Thou shalt not prevent thy neighbor from altering her consciousness




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Invisiblewps
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: clemens]
    #7528192 - 10/17/07 03:25 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I think the movie is less about the pitfalls of drug abuse and more about the failure of the hippy movement, of which drug use played a significant part.

Basically Thompson is saying that the hippy movement had all this potential to change the world for the better but failed to do so because it was unorganized, impractical, and too based in ideals that didn't pan out in reality.


--------------------
"America touts itself as the land of the free, but the number one freedom that you and I have is the freedom to enter into a subservient role in the workplace. Once you exercise this freedom you've lost all control over what you do, what is produced, and how it is produced. And in the end, the product doesn't belong to you. The only way you can avoid bosses and jobs is if you don't care about making a living. Which leads to the second freedom: the freedom to starve."

- Tom Morello


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InvisibleBridgeburner
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: wps]
    #7528201 - 10/17/07 03:28 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

wps said:
I think the movie is less about the pitfalls of drug abuse and more about the failure of the hippy movement, of which drug use played a significant part.

Basically Thompson is saying that the hippy movement had all this potential to change the world for the better but failed to do so because it was unorganized, impractical, and too based in ideals that didn't pan out in reality.




nicely put.


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Invisiblewps
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #7528259 - 10/17/07 03:41 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

still true today as well. 

the only reason liberals still get fucked by conservatives on a regular basis is simply because we are too unorganized to effectively fight back, or we are too nonmaterial and idealistic to realize or care that we are being fucked. 

Neoconservatives are actively using their monetary and political clout to oppress liberals any way they can, while all the liberals argue with eachother, don't participate in the political process, or pursue avenues of change that are ineffective pipe-dreams. 

The sad thing is we outnumber them, but can't match their solidarity, determination, guile, and self-confidence.  The very tolerance and open-mindedness that defines us is our undoing.  Maybe evil does triumph over good after all.  :shrug:


--------------------
"America touts itself as the land of the free, but the number one freedom that you and I have is the freedom to enter into a subservient role in the workplace. Once you exercise this freedom you've lost all control over what you do, what is produced, and how it is produced. And in the end, the product doesn't belong to you. The only way you can avoid bosses and jobs is if you don't care about making a living. Which leads to the second freedom: the freedom to starve."

- Tom Morello


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OfflineTheCow
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Cepheus]
    #7528293 - 10/17/07 03:47 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Cepheus said:
he essentially started the whole counter culture movement



What the hell are you talking about? That is utter bullshit


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OfflineLion
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Re: what fear and loathing was saying about drugs [Re: Noviseer]
    #7528339 - 10/17/07 03:56 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

HST took an honest look at the world, then cringed, laughed, and shrugged, mumbled to himself, and kept on going.


He also blew his own brains out. :shrug:

F&LILV doesn't de-mystify drugs.  Scenes like Duke watching blook-soaked dinosaurs mauling each other (good metaphor!), and watching Dr. Gonzo morph into a hairy Satanic mule thingy, do nothing if not creating a mystique around drug use.

It's a movie about one man's (often substance-induced) observations of the darker side of the 'American Dream'.  Hunter S. Thompson's views on the use of drugs was far more complex than anything conveyed in the film, as anyone who's read a lot of his essays can attest.


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”


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