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InvisibleKnifey Mcstab
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I'm no republican but...
    #7518392 - 10/15/07 05:03 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Hard core liberals really seem to irritate the hell out of me. Especially with their whole anti-gun stance. They seem to ***** and moan so much about the government and yet they want more government involvement in our daily lives.

The day I'm not allowed to own a gun is the day I pack my bags and move somewhere else.


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Knifey Mcstab]
    #7518401 - 10/15/07 05:16 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

> Hard core liberals really seem to irritate the hell out of me

Extremist on both sides "irritate the hell out of me", not just hard core liberals. I've got one side installing cameras in my home and drafting me for the modern day crusades and the other side taking away my guns and spending tax money to tuck me in to bed at night.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleKnifey Mcstab
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Seuss]
    #7518403 - 10/15/07 05:18 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Ya, your right extremists on both sides do irritate me it's just that recently it's been the liberals.

I just hate people I think.


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OfflineTaco Chef
I found dead John Cheever
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Knifey Mcstab]
    #7519018 - 10/15/07 11:25 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

i used to be in favor of gun-control, but after this administration's trashing of the constitution, i came to understand the need for the 2nd amendment.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
jiggy
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Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 7,469
Loc: Heart of Laughter
Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Taco Chef]
    #7519089 - 10/15/07 11:42 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

novumorganum said:
i used to be in favor of gun-control, but after this administration's trashing of the constitution, i came to understand the need for the 2nd amendment.




Me Too!

Have you noticed the MSM doing hour specials revisting the DC sniper case? I swear they are doing it, to get people all worked up for gun control candidates.

Thomas Jefferson said, " The irony of the second ammendment is that, when you will need your guns the most is when they have been taken from you."


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Knifey Mcstab]
    #7519101 - 10/15/07 11:47 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Mandrake said:
I just hate people I think.




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All I know is The Growery is a place where losers who get banned here go.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7519508 - 10/15/07 01:34 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
Quote:

novumorganum said:
i used to be in favor of gun-control, but after this administration's trashing of the constitution, i came to understand the need for the 2nd amendment.




Me Too!

Have you noticed the MSM doing hour specials revisting the DC sniper case? I swear they are doing it, to get people all worked up for gun control candidates.

Thomas Jefferson said, " The irony of the second ammendment is that, when you will need your guns the most is when they have been taken from you."





For realz.

The gun thing is a pandora's box that, once open, can't be closed. You could shut down every gun shop in America and the bad guys are just going to get their shit from dealers that get their shit from overseas. Then we'll be in a world of mess because no one can defend themselves.

It's like all crime. Cops barely put a DENT in the crime going on out there, but imagine how much worse it would be if there weren't any cops and there was NO FEAR of ever having to get arrested.

THe thought that MAYBE the guy inside this house has a gun is probably what keeps thousands of phychos from busting in your door.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: BrAiN]
    #7519724 - 10/15/07 02:31 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Ummm not for nothing but if any of you think any gun you could ever buy would be worth more than a suicide note against government troops you are so utterly deluded that you might as well go Koscinski right now.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7519743 - 10/15/07 02:36 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I think most people that are anti gun control are just talking about defending their own home and family against intruders.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: BrAiN]
    #7519777 - 10/15/07 02:43 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Which I can understand, but the bombastic posturing by some of the people espousing a defense against an unreasonable government is utterly absurd. They would be history. Then they would be geography.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: BrAiN]
    #7519805 - 10/15/07 02:49 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

BrAiN said:
I think most people that are anti gun control are just talking about defending their own home and family against intruders.




Yup! I live in a gated community with 24 hr security and yet, when a 13 year old boy waa taken at gun point from a bus stop not far from me, a bunch of moms in my subdivision went out and bought guns and have been practicing at the shooting range.

I agree with you Zap. My sister and I were talking about it the other night and it was discussed that when the Constitution was written, it was a time armed citizens could rise up against government tyranny and defeat it. Now, it would be a short lived isolated mess with the government diffusing any armed uprising quickly. If our own military turned on the government, that would be another story :lol: That will never happen either.


None the less, I posted the Jefferson quote as reminder, about a  government looking to take away your right to bare arms, being a government you would want to use them against.

The government has far to much power over us now. It was never meant to be that way though. :sad:


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7519876 - 10/15/07 03:08 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:


I agree with you Zap.






I just fainted for a moment, but I'm OK now. A little bump on the head, nothing major.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7520095 - 10/15/07 04:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Which I can understand, but the bombastic posturing by some of the people espousing a defense against an unreasonable government is utterly absurd. They would be history. Then they would be geography.




I disagree. The gov't has satellites but they can't cover every inch of the earth at all times and know exactly every person to target who might be a dissident. They can tap our phones. but you don't neccessarily need a phone to communicate. 300,000,000 people is a lot to tame. Not to mention any civil war going on would probably lead to other countries trying to get a piece of the action and starting to fund uprisings.

besides... I don't know if you're aware.. but assault rifles such as the m16 and AK47 are now LEGAL to own in the states as of about two years ago.

I don't think America will ever (in the near future anyways) get to a point where it needs to rebel against the gov't. I think whatever gov't we have will be smart enough to keep us at least no farther than the edge of what we'll accept.

No matter how opressed we become, we still have a pretty posh lifestyle. We're too comfortable. I don't think anything would ever happen until the average income per person drops DRAMATICALLY. It would probably take another all out world war to happen, or something else drastic, before this ever happens.

Once the middle class loses it's big screen TV's, hummers, and sex and the city.. then maybe they'll get off their asses and take action.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: BrAiN]
    #7523273 - 10/16/07 01:46 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

BrAiN said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
300,000,000 people is a lot to tame.




Except that about 299,900,000 are already tame.


Quote:

besides... I don't know if you're aware.. but assault rifles such as the m16 and AK47 are now LEGAL to own in the states as of about two years ago.



They have been for years.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #7523370 - 10/16/07 02:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe back in the day. There was a long-time ban on them that expired only a couple of years ago.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #7523938 - 10/16/07 03:51 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

BrAiN said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
300,000,000 people is a lot to tame.




Except that about 299,900,000 are already tame.












I just did a search under my name and BrAiN and I couldn't find this exchange. Where did it come from


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Knifey Mcstab]
    #7524588 - 10/16/07 06:07 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

The day I'm not allowed to own a gun is the day I pack my bags and move somewhere else.


This is the only decent reason for passing gun control laws I have heard to date.;)


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinerobbyberto
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7524982 - 10/16/07 07:39 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Ummm not for nothing but if any of you think any gun you could ever buy would be worth more than a suicide note against government troops you are so utterly deluded that you might as well go Koscinski right now.



Sure, but would the guys in the armed forces really shoot their own people and obey orders no matter what? In regard to the topic, while I'm not an extremist, or particularly left winged, at least the super left want to help the people with social programs even if what they're doing is misguided. I'd rather have that than a very right winged country dictating my social conduct at all times.


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“People say having kids is life changing, well that doesn’t necessarily mean a good thing, does it? I could take one of my legs off. That would change my life.” -Karl Pilkington



Edited by robbyberto (10/16/07 08:11 PM)


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Offlinecasgoodie
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: robbyberto]
    #7525182 - 10/16/07 08:11 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

abolish all governement, its never going to work


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TRAPPED IN LINGUISTIC CONCEPTS


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InvisibleaDoS
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Knifey Mcstab]
    #7525292 - 10/16/07 08:31 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

liberals tend to contradict themselves. They want the government to butt out and let them live freely, but then they fight for socialist ideas. They don't want the government but they do want the government.


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"If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution - then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise." - Aldous Huxley
:drooling:GIVE ME OPIATES OR GIVE ME DEATH:drooling:


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: robbyberto]
    #7525353 - 10/16/07 08:42 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:45 PM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: aDoS]
    #7525411 - 10/16/07 08:50 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:45 PM)


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InvisibleaDoS
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7525432 - 10/16/07 08:55 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I have huge problems with both sides...so I am neither.


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"If we could sniff or swallow something that would, for five or six hours each day, abolish our solitude as individuals, atone us with our fellows in a glowing exaltation of affection and make life in all its aspects seem not only worth living, but divinely beautiful and significant, and if this heavenly, world-transfiguring drug were of such a kind that we could wake up next morning with a clear head and an undamaged constitution - then, it seems to me, all our problems (and not merely the one small problem of discovering a novel pleasure) would be wholly solved and earth would become paradise." - Aldous Huxley
:drooling:GIVE ME OPIATES OR GIVE ME DEATH:drooling:


Edited by aDoS (10/16/07 08:57 PM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: aDoS]
    #7525457 - 10/16/07 09:00 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:46 PM)


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: BrAiN]
    #7526632 - 10/17/07 04:18 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

BrAiN said:
Maybe back in the day. There was a long-time ban on them that expired only a couple of years ago.



Wrong. If you are talking about full auto weapons, you have needed a special permit.

Wrong. If you are talking semi-auto there were several models that had certain features that were banned. An example would be folding stocks. Manufacturers merely switched to non-folding stocks.

All that has lapsed is the ban on those particular features.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7526649 - 10/17/07 04:36 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

> & throw you in jail for growing and possessing plants they don't like.

Please look at the number of convictions for cannabis over the last thirty years and note what president was in office during the vast majority of them. I'll give you a hint... it was Clinton... by a HUGE massive margin... more than twice the number during the Clinton years than all the other presidents (Regan, Bush and Bush) combined. You may want to rethink your claim a bit.


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Just another spore in the wind.


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Offlinegluke bastid
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: aDoS]
    #7527173 - 10/17/07 10:37 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

aDoS said:
liberals tend to contradict themselves. They want the government to butt out and let them live freely, but then they fight for socialist ideas. They don't want the government but they do want the government.




It's not that I disagree with you, its that I think neo-conservatives contradict themselves just as much. They say "no government," but then want to ban gay marriage, abortion, extend military campaigns all over the middle east. Its the same thing. Both sides do everything they do in the name of liberty.


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:hst:
Society in every form is a blessing,
but government at its best is but a necessary evil
 
- Thomas Paine


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Seuss]
    #7527269 - 10/17/07 11:10 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Seuss said:

Please look at the number of convictions for cannabis over the last thirty years and note what president was in office during the vast majority of them. I'll give you a hint... it was Clinton... by a HUGE massive margin... more than twice the number during the Clinton years than all the other presidents (Regan, Bush and Bush) combined. You may want to rethink your claim a bit.




We've had this discussion before. That simply isn't true.

If you really want me to, I can prove it to you with the FBI's Uniform Crime Reporting Program statistics, but they aren't user friendly and it would take me awhile to find the tables I need and throw something together.


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After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


Edited by Madtowntripper (10/17/07 11:19 AM)


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Offlinerobbyberto
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: gluke bastid]
    #7527637 - 10/17/07 12:53 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Thats not more government in the sense that they actually want to increase the size of bureaucracy but it is increased as a result of their policies. I guess that always applies.


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“People say having kids is life changing, well that doesn’t necessarily mean a good thing, does it? I could take one of my legs off. That would change my life.” -Karl Pilkington



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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: gluke bastid]
    #7528407 - 10/17/07 04:14 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

gluke bastid said:
Quote:

aDoS said:
liberals tend to contradict themselves. They want the government to butt out and let them live freely, but then they fight for socialist ideas. They don't want the government but they do want the government.




It's not that I disagree with you, its that I think neo-conservatives contradict themselves just as much. They say "no government," but then want to ban gay marriage, abortion, extend military campaigns all over the middle east. Its the same thing. Both sides do everything they do in the name of liberty.




I don't think there is a neo-con position on abortion or homo marriage. They also don't say "no government" and they don't advocate intervention all over the Mid-East. You are lying.

This conservative (I consider Libertarian to be more conservative than Republican) loves abortion and wants homos to just shut the fuck up, they are boring me. As to intervention it becomes far less necessary when the enemy knows that you aren't afraid to use it. THAT is something the libtards will never ever figure out.

And finally, if you don't think the libtard nanny state comes without much more than fiscal strings you are seriously deluded. They WILL be telling you how to act what to eat where to go far more than real conservatives. Do not make the mistake of conflating the morality police morons with all conservatives. There is just as much morality police overlap with libs as with conservatives. At least the conservative moralists will leave you with enough money in your pocket to misbehave. Liberal moralists? Not a fucking nickel of your own.


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: Seuss]
    #7528432 - 10/17/07 04:22 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:46 PM)


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Offlinewilshire
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528456 - 10/17/07 04:30 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Ummm not for nothing but if any of you think any gun you could ever buy would be worth more than a suicide note against government troops you are so utterly deluded that you might as well go Koscinski right now.

if you were fighting openly against a unified, popular u.s. government and you had no support other than a few other civilians with guns, yeah, you'd be dead pretty fast.

there are other scenarios where civilians might fight againt government troops and have a much better chance though.

civil war, massive unrest accompanied by defections of regular military forces, etc.

then there's the deterrent factor. even if you are a dictator, you make decisions based on risk vs. reward like everyone else. a populace that is well armed and not too keen on what you might be thinking about doing may tip the scale in your scheming.


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528460 - 10/17/07 04:31 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:47 PM)


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Offlinelonestar2004
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7528484 - 10/17/07 04:39 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

"clinton was a center to center-right president."

and bush was a center to center-left president? :smirk:

Bush gave us huge new prescription drug entitlement program, centralizing education, bigger government and Immigration Amnesty etc..............


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7528508 - 10/17/07 04:49 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:47 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7528519 - 10/17/07 04:51 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

It would be a lot more effective if it weren't for the incessant bleatings of the useful idiots (their term, not mine). And in fact the two cases you cite are not failures by any means, no matter what your unrealistic expectations may have been.


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7528532 - 10/17/07 04:54 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:47 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7528545 - 10/17/07 04:57 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

EntheogenicPeace said:
Quote:

Immigration Amnesty




The driving force behind amnesty for "illegal aliens"... in Washington anyway... is employers & corporations; not sympathy for the impoverished.




Bullshit
Quote:



Quote:

huge new prescription drug entitlement program




wanted by big pharma companies




And libtards everywhere
Quote:



Quote:

centralizing education




can't really dispute this one




A Kennedy program
Quote:



Quote:

bigger government




fascists want big government every bit as much as Communists do.




Same thing. Scratch a lib, find a fascist.


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528575 - 10/17/07 05:04 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:48 PM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528580 - 10/17/07 05:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:48 PM)


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7528735 - 10/17/07 05:52 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:48 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #7528743 - 10/17/07 05:53 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Vote pandering. Are you fucking kidding me?

"Mission Accomplished" is where you hang your hat? The fucking mission was accomplished, the mission being the destruction of the Iraqi Army and the removal of Saddam Hussein from power. You can move the goalposts all you want but it doesn't make you correct or the statement wrong. What makes you think that YOU get to define what the mission being referred to was? Bulletin to you, "you don't."


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528779 - 10/17/07 06:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/30/21 05:49 PM)


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Invisiblewps
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Re: I'm no republican but... [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7528787 - 10/17/07 06:08 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Which I can understand, but the bombastic posturing by some of the people espousing a defense against an unreasonable government is utterly absurd. They would be history. Then they would be geography.




could an armed populace overthrow or prevent an oppressive government? Probably not.

But I think having an armed populace does discourage government from going too far. Its all about cost-benefit analysis. The government knows if they go too far, people will fight back, and since they are armed it would definitely cause casualties and losses for the government that they might not be prepared to accept.


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"America touts itself as the land of the free, but the number one freedom that you and I have is the freedom to enter into a subservient role in the workplace. Once you exercise this freedom you've lost all control over what you do, what is produced, and how it is produced. And in the end, the product doesn't belong to you. The only way you can avoid bosses and jobs is if you don't care about making a living. Which leads to the second freedom: the freedom to starve."

- Tom Morello


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