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mr.coolass
Super RocketMr.MagicMushroom Man

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 77
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case patching substrate.
#7493195 - 10/07/07 12:21 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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just wondering if their are different alternatives to this method.
maybe adding something to the patching substrate without adding to the whole casing?
maybe patching with different materials than the base of which is in the casing.
what you keep your patching substrates in, and if you keep it damp always? (ziplock bags/bowls? etc) what do you do?
thanks
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mr.coolass
Super RocketMr.MagicMushroom Man

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 77
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: mr.coolass]
#7493818 - 10/07/07 09:27 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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?
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 42,214
Loc: Seattle
Last seen: 11 months, 3 days
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: mr.coolass]
#7493847 - 10/07/07 09:42 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I have no idea what you're asking. You seem to have your terms messed up.
Spawn: Noun form: Grains, brf, etc., fully colonized with mushroom mycelium.
Spawn: Verb form: To mix the above defined colonized grains into a substrate.
Substrate: Manure, compost, coir, coffee grinds, etc. Substrate is the food the mushroom mycelium eats. In the case of brf cakes, the brf is both the spawn and the substrate.
Casing: The non-nutritious, moisture-holding layer we place on top of a substrate as a water reservoir to supply the substrate with the extra moisture it needs to support the developing flush of mushrooms.
Patching: Applying a small amount of casing material over the mycelium that is poking through the casing layer. This allows that mycelium to continue growing, while waiting for more mycelium to reach the surface of the non-patched areas. This results in a more even pinset.
With the above definitions in mind, perhaps you could re-phrase your question? RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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mr.coolass
Super RocketMr.MagicMushroom Man

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 77
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: RogerRabbit]
#7493900 - 10/07/07 10:18 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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for my first question, i was wondering that if i weren't to add "vermiculite" (as an example)to my casing "substrate", would it benefit me to add it to my patching material/substrate? has their been any experience doing something like this?
and basically, what do you keep your patching material in to keep it moist/sterile...ziplock bags/tubberwear?
i didn't think i was being misleading, sorry/.
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skattman1982
Stranger


Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 259
Last seen: 7 years, 11 months
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: mr.coolass]
#7493920 - 10/07/07 10:32 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr.coolass said: for my first question, i was wondering that if i weren't to add "vermiculite" (as an example)to my casing "substrate", would it benefit me to add it to my patching material/substrate? has their been any experience doing something like this?
and basically, what do you keep your patching material in to keep it moist/sterile...ziplock bags/tubberwear?
i didn't think i was being misleading, sorry/.
as for a casing layer one usually uses a 50/50 mix of peat moss and verm. one may use the same ratio of coir and verm as your casing should be airy enough to allow the mycelium to grow through and be able to retain water. i would just patch with straight verm, lightly of course. i have a tub cases with straight verm that is doing decent. mycelium is poking through in many places as looks to be knotting. the main point is to have a non-nutritive casing so the mycelium do not colonize it. as for sterility... well mix your casing 50/50 verm/coir or verm/peat in a microwave container, cover and nuke for 5 minutes. keep covered until cool then add to your crumbled cakes... i would read hyphae's casing tek. learn it, live it, love it... though there are other proven methods here if one but looks.
peace.
-------------------- They lie about marijuana. Tell you pot-smoking makes you unmotivated. Lie! When you're high, you can do everything you normally do, just as well. You just realize that it's not worth the fucking effort. There is a difference.-Bill Hicks- by the way, everything i write is for entertainment purposes and is purely fictional. do not construe these written words with the author having any knowledge of actual persons, places, events, or actions.
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soulsizzle
nobody f**kswith The Jesus


Registered: 05/17/05
Posts: 632
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: mr.coolass]
#7494250 - 10/07/07 12:28 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr.coolass said: for my first question, i was wondering that if i weren't to add "vermiculite" (as an example)to my casing "substrate", would it benefit me to add it to my patching material/substrate? has their been any experience doing something like this?
and basically, what do you keep your patching material in to keep it moist/sterile...ziplock bags/tubberwear?
i didn't think i was being misleading, sorry/.
Man ... I am getting a headache just trying to decipher what you are saying here . I think you still have your terminology mixed up here. There is no such thing as "patching substrate". And "casing substrate" is a bit ambiguous. I think it would be very beneficial if you were to briefly go over your procedure and the materials you used at each step.
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mr.coolass
Super RocketMr.MagicMushroom Man

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 77
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: soulsizzle]
#7494388 - 10/07/07 01:12 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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how is that so hard for you to follow? say my casing is streight coir, and i don't add vermiculite to it... and coir is also my patching material, but i do add vermiculite to it..how would this benefit my casing, rather than just patching with streight coir...i'm just using those to for examples, but i was asking in general if anybody had made any patching material with different or similar ingredients as the casing (ie. coir casing, with oyster shells and verm for patching material) very simple...
this is the Most basic way anyone could explain anything, ever. do you comprehend?
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xhooliganx
Munky


Registered: 03/09/06
Posts: 900
Loc: reno, nevada
Last seen: 2 years, 8 months
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: soulsizzle]
#7494479 - 10/07/07 01:39 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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add your casing layer at approximately .5" then wait for that to colonize. when the mycelium is poking through the casing layer then you lightly cover that with more casing(just enough to cover it). then you're ready to put it into the fc.
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soulsizzle
nobody f**kswith The Jesus


Registered: 05/17/05
Posts: 632
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: xhooliganx]
#7495961 - 10/08/07 12:19 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I obviously wasn't the only one who was a little confused by your use of terminology. The confusion lies in the such statements as "...i weren't to add 'vermiculite' (as an example)to my casing 'substrate'..." The material that you use as a casing layer is not casing "substrate." Substrate is the nutritive bottom layer that you start out with. Casing material is what you add to create a microclimate for the the mycelium, which has 100% colonized the substrate.
I am sure you are well aware of all of this, but it seems you are a just little bit confused on the terminology (as I'm sure RR would agree).
However, assuming I am understanding what you are asking now, I do not see any benefit in adding additional elements into the casing material that intend to use to patch. The amount of new casing material you are going to use to do this is relatively small and shouldn't have much of an effect. If anything, it will create an uneven microclimate that will make getting an even pinset difficult.
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eleven34



Registered: 08/26/07
Posts: 307
Loc: Missouri
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: soulsizzle]
#7496028 - 10/08/07 12:55 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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I get your ? and the only benefit there would be is that the patching material that your using (that you added the vermiculite to) is just going to be able to hold more moisture.
I see that your ? is simple. Your asking if there is a benefit to adding a patching substrate such as coir/verm to your original substrate of just coir that you spawned to? That's what I got out of it.
If that's your ? the answer is above. No nutritional value just moisture value. If that makes any sense?
-------------------- "Get your damn hands off me sesame cake"
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monstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work



Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 3,911
Loc: Arizona Bay
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Re: case patching substrate. [Re: mr.coolass]
#7496098 - 10/08/07 01:28 AM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr.coolass said: how is that so hard for you to follow? say my casing is streight coir, and i don't add vermiculite to it... and coir is also my patching material, but i do add vermiculite to it..how would this benefit my casing, rather than just patching with streight coir...i'm just using those to for examples, but i was asking in general if anybody had made any patching material with different or similar ingredients as the casing (ie. coir casing, with oyster shells and verm for patching material) very simple...
this is the Most basic way anyone could explain anything, ever. do you comprehend?
Sorry, but no it is not. You DO have a terminology problem. You are NOT explaining yourself correctly so we can understand you. There is nothing wrong with us.
You need to think about it a bit... think like this:
If coir is your substrate it is not a casing. It is a Substrate! Read RR's definitions above he nicely typed for you. Casing does NOT have nutrient value usually, i.e. peat moss/vermiculite. If your mycelium has colonized coir, then you have a colonized Substrate of coir.
If then you add more coir to it, you're simply adding more substrate. At this point there is NO casing or patching happening. Just substrate. Promise.
Once that layer of coir you added colonizes, you're left with a colonized substrate. Again, no patching or casing has occurred yet.
You may then choose to add a casing layer of peat/vermiculite/gypsum/hydrated lime (or oyster shell flour or whatever) This would be Casing. See??
Now the mycelium would grow up from your Substrate of coir to colonize into your Casing of peat/verm. If this happened in an uneven manner, you could add a bit more Casing material to those early growth spots of mycelium. That would be called Patching.
Get it?
So, to sum things up: If you add straight coir to any substrate, you're only adding more substrate material for your mycelium to consume. You are NOT casing. If you add straight vermiculite to a substrate, you are adding a Casing material to provide the substrate with a micro- climate to trap humidity, co2, and to hold extra water for the flush. Plain vermiculite though is not a good casing material. It's much better to mix it with pH adjusted and buffered peat moss.
I think you term of "patching material" is one of your own that does not exist here in the OMC.
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