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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7494795 - 10/07/07 03:05 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

i wasn't really talking about 2012...

but why objective?


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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7494835 - 10/07/07 03:13 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
Again... Mysticism exists... it is wrapped up within the definition of another, more important word, "Spirituality". Both have been proven to exist but ONLY WITHIN the human mind.

The thing is; Mysticism AND Spirituality are both INTANGIBLE by definition.

If they WERE proven to EXIST outside the human mind, they'd CEASE to be mystical or spiritual... because if they WERE proven to exist, they'd become TANGIBLE. They'd become REAL. Therefore they'd no longer fit their own definitions.

Do you follow me?




yes, that is why i try do not practice "mysticism"... rather experience :lol:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: onlynow]
    #7494870 - 10/07/07 03:25 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Yes... which is why I mentioned EXPERIENCE being INTANGIBLE.

Can you hold experience?

Experience is a thought. Once experienced... your brain will continue to CHANGE your perception of that thought.

Experience is intangible... and the experience will be perceived differently by everyone who experiences it.

Even a tangible event, can be experienced differently by all its participants.


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Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (10/07/07 04:27 PM)


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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7494902 - 10/07/07 03:33 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

why hold anything that is impermanent?


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: onlynow]
    #7494909 - 10/07/07 03:34 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Guy's got to pee... once in a while... :wink:


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Fiddlesticks.



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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7495013 - 10/07/07 03:59 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)



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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: onlynow]
    #7495122 - 10/07/07 04:23 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

A picture of a guy dressed as Gandalf... at Burning Man!?

I'm confused. Is that you in the pic?


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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7495153 - 10/07/07 04:33 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

no way, I am not that old. :crazy:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: onlynow]
    #7495173 - 10/07/07 04:37 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Then, I am even more confused than before.

Surely you know by now: Linking to things without explanation, can be quite troublesome.

Were you trying to make a point, or change the subject?


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Fiddlesticks.



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Offlineonlynow
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7495193 - 10/07/07 04:42 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

must I solve your confusion?


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Invisiblethedudenj
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7497340 - 10/08/07 12:17 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

yippie !


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"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours


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OfflineSCFratter
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #7499695 - 10/08/07 10:04 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Check out the book Eat the Document. Can't remember who wrote it but it is about the Brotherhood of Eternal Love and all that stuff from the 60's. Its fiction but a good read.


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OfflineBard
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: 2FiNiTe]
    #7500680 - 10/09/07 07:16 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Cervantes, you should write more about hippie history, and stuff... I'm interested...


--------------------
So dreaming let's you know reality exists.



I don't belive. I fear.


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Invisiblethedudenj
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Bard]
    #7501406 - 10/09/07 11:54 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

yippies are more fun


--------------------

"You all are just  puppets... You have no heart...and cannot feel any pain...""
you may think thats pain you feel but you must have a heart to feel true pain and that pain wont be yours


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Bard]
    #7501669 - 10/09/07 01:53 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Bard said:
Cervantes, you should write more about hippie history, and stuff... I'm interested...




I'd love to.

To generalize... and, I'm sure the old farts around here will correct me if I'm wrong (I didn't look at a timeline before I wrote this, so there could be several mistakes). The hippie way of life came from a number of ingredients... and it happened in a pretty specific order. Allow me to OVER simplify the American hippie movement.

Hippiedom came from:

The creation of psychology.

The invention of LSD.

New isms... like Nihilism, Anarchism and Realism.

A Western exploration of Eastern Philosophy/Spirituality/Arts

The combination of psychological LSD use with Eastern Spirituality/ Arts

Psychological LSD testing on Ivy League students and artists.

Then:

JFK is assassinated

The British Invasion kicks into full swing.

Publication of findings from the psychological LSD studies.

LSD is passed around freely and legally among East Coast college towns.

American coffee shop folk singers (mostly in NYC) begin to use psychedelic imagery in their songs.

Artists like Bob Dylan and the pre-fab Peter, Paul & Mary become VERY popular. Protest songs (Eve of Destruction) and drug songs (Puff) start to reach the airways.

The idea spreads across the country, mostly through music (also, authors and artists like Andy Warhol).

Pop-culture jumps on board the hippie train. Marijuana and LSD use spreads across the country.

East Coast musicians and groups begin a mass-exodus to San Francisco and L.A.; probably because the mild winters appeal to them... and everybody else was doing it. Only a few established and popular bands remain in the East... The Lovin' Spoonful comes to mind...

Hippies are REALLY mass-marketed.

The Beatles jump onto the hippie train.

Tim and Ralph's book, The Psychedelic Experience, is published.

The Vietnam War kicks into full gear.

LSD is outlawed.

Protest songs inundate the airways.

Bobby and Martin are assassinated.

Moon Landing

Woodstock

Altamont (the NEXT Woodstock, if you will) is a debacle. The press uses this to kill the popular hippie dream.

70's happen.

The, "Me" generation introduces itself to pop-culture.

Pop culture jumps onto the, "Me" generation train.

The End

Musicology contains a LOT of hippie history. I mention music a LOT when I talk about hippie history... but this is because the EARLY hippie bands actually were quite close to the EARLY LSD studies. To follow the movement, follow the music. Their stories overlap A LOT more than you'd think... and most of the story can be found WITHIN the music of the era. Much like the way martial arts have contained Eastern philosophies, for hundreds of years.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (10/10/07 12:01 AM)


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OfflineBard
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7504301 - 10/10/07 06:08 AM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks Cervantes!

I will google some of the things you wrote... But I have some questions...

"American coffee shop folk singers" - Who are they?

What is "Me" generation?

"the EARLY hippie bands actually were quite close to the EARLY LSD studies" - And then again, I want names, citizen, and connections... :smirk: That last paragraph is quite interesting, the music and the lsd studies connection you speak about.

Thanks again! :thumbup:


--------------------
So dreaming let's you know reality exists.



I don't belive. I fear.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Bard]
    #7506901 - 10/10/07 08:21 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

I get the feeling I'm helping you with a school paper, or something.

Quote:

Bard said:
"American coffee shop folk singers" - Who are they?




This simple question has a slightly complicated answer.

It begins with popular American music during the first half of the 20th century. Yes, there were records... but they couldn't hold much sound. Also, VERY early records had to be re-recorded to be reproduced. If you wanted 10 records, you had to record the song 10 times. By the 1920's and '30's, there were better recording techniques... but records still, only held one song per side.

In the mid-late 50's the LP (Long Playing Record) was introduced. No longer did records have only 2 songs (Side A and Side B). Albums could now be produced... but more important to this story... Greatest hits albums, and Anthologies could now be made, and sold.

One Anthology in particular, Harry Smith's "American Anthology of Folk" was released around 1957. Harry Smith was an eccentric character... but he had THOUSANDS of RARE and several  ONE OF A KIND VINTAGE RECORDS from the Earliest days of record recording. This collection of music captures the sound of America before the radio gave America common songs and performers to follow. It is as close as you could come to hearing American music before there was POP Music.

Yeah, The American Anthology of Folk is scratchy (Old records recorded onto NEW reciords... then played on a record player.) but to THIS DAY it is one of the greatest American Musical Releases EVER.

Bob Dylan, in particular, was profoundly influenced by this Anthology (Actually it was a 6 LP collection) To this day, he still makes references to the songs in The Anthology. Bob routinely borrows imagery, tunes, vocal style... even song titles.

Well, back in 1957, several of the Artists heard on Smith's Anthology were still alive, and the popularity of this compilation gave them a newfound following. Several of these, "Lost" American folk artists re-emerged and began playing their songs, once again. I'm not just talking about The Carter Family, Pete Seeger and Woodie Guthrie... I'm talking about people FAR less well known than that. They didn't exactly play the big venues... they played Bohemian coffee shops.

With the birth of the LP, we Americans were able to discover our folk-music tradition. America is a relatively young country... it took a while to develop folk music... and it took even longer for Americans to look back and discover their new folk traditions... but, American Folk music was finally being recognized... and (GASP!) the American YOUTH was listening.

To see video of these coffee shop folk artists, in NYC... watch Bob Dylan's "No Direction Home"... goofy, weird, cool stuff. Seeing them is better than hearing them, or reading about them.

Quote:


"the EARLY hippie bands actually were quite close to the EARLY LSD studies" - And then again, I want names, citizen, and connections... :smirk: That last paragraph is quite interesting, the music and the lsd studies connection you speak about.





I wrote enough discussing coffee shops... so I'll make this one short... even though I know you're DYING for more info on this topic.

Music for Ken Kesey's Merry Prankster Kool-Aid Acid Tests were provided by a band known as The Warlocks (and later as The Grateful Dead). They were a San Francisco Band. Soon after... many MANY Popular bands FLOCKED to San Francisco.

That should be enough info to aid your searching.

Quote:


What is "Me" generation?




The generation of the 70's and 80's. It is how the generation was marketed. They were called, "Generation Me" or, "The ME Generation". Supposedly, people born into this generation had a larger sense of entitlement than the generations which preceded them.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



Edited by Rose (10/10/07 08:28 PM)


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7506954 - 10/10/07 08:33 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

many MANY Popular bands FLOCKED to San Francisco.





Despite the auspicious lead-in, A Flock of Seagulls never migrated to San Francisco, but stayed predominantly in England where they were formed and played '80s New Wave.

The End.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7506972 - 10/10/07 08:36 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

And I ra-a-an I ran so far away-ay-ay.

Why DID the musicians go West in the mid-60's, Org?


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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: New / Recent Psychonaut Authors? [Re: Rose]
    #7506991 - 10/10/07 08:41 PM (16 years, 3 months ago)

For the same reason that miners FLOCKED to the Sierra Nevada foothills in the mid/late 1800s.


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