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mr.shankly
A Charming Man



Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 18
Loc: texas, the evil empire
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT
#7477915 - 10/02/07 03:52 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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i came across an older post in the forum talking about mixing DPT into mycelium to increase psilocybin/psilocin content as well as producing an unnatural component in the fruit body, 4-HO-DPT. while this is an interesting theory, it is a tedious and cumbersome process just to produce the DPT. Most mushroom cultivators do not have immediate access to the glassware, reagents and precursors one would need to produce it. While researching this project, originated out of germany, i remembered the similarities in the chemical structures of serotonin and psilocybin . Psilocybin, upon becoming psilocin in the body, acts a partial agonist upon the serotonin receptors where it then mimics the effects of serotonin, preventing the release of serotonin to certain receptors, resulting in hallucinations. My hypothesis is this, if you were to introduce 5-HTP into the mycelium, via substrate or casing, would it absorb in the same way proposed in the german experiment, thusly creating a new compound, or would it act as a catalyst for psilocybin/psilocin upon ingestion of the fruit bodies, or just nothing at all?
-------------------- ''It is wrong to expect a reward for your struggles. The reward is the act of struggle itself, not what you win. Even though you can't expect to defeat the absurdity of the world, you must make that attempt. That's morality, that's religion. That's art. That's life.'' - Phil Ochs ideas are the real things; what we see in the world of experience are only their shadows.
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HugaDeadHead
yogi


Registered: 11/09/06
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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: mr.shankly]
#7477929 - 10/02/07 03:58 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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5-htp this is mycelium, mycelium meet 5-htp. now go play along.
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mr.shankly
A Charming Man



Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 18
Loc: texas, the evil empire
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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another interesting tidbit i'd like to mention; 5-HTP, while not a direct precursor for DMT, is the most effective precursor for serotonin. By providing the brain with the raw material to make serotonin, it spares tryptophan for production of other important tryptamines, such as DMT.
-------------------- ''It is wrong to expect a reward for your struggles. The reward is the act of struggle itself, not what you win. Even though you can't expect to defeat the absurdity of the world, you must make that attempt. That's morality, that's religion. That's art. That's life.'' - Phil Ochs ideas are the real things; what we see in the world of experience are only their shadows.
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HugaDeadHead
yogi


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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: mr.shankly]
#7477984 - 10/02/07 04:13 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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if you say so.
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mr.shankly
A Charming Man



Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 18
Loc: texas, the evil empire
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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-------------------- ''It is wrong to expect a reward for your struggles. The reward is the act of struggle itself, not what you win. Even though you can't expect to defeat the absurdity of the world, you must make that attempt. That's morality, that's religion. That's art. That's life.'' - Phil Ochs ideas are the real things; what we see in the world of experience are only their shadows.
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HugaDeadHead
yogi


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Posts: 417
Loc: here, there, and everywhe...
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: mr.shankly]
#7478065 - 10/02/07 04:38 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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achew
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HugaDeadHead
yogi


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timothy leary had watered garden with LSD.
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Only indoles/tryptamines that are unhydroxylated or hydroxylated in the 4 position can use the psilocin biosynthetic pathway. At least that seems to be the way it works. 5HTP has been suggested and tried by many members here, with nothing to report. It's cheap enough and easily available so we would know about it by now if it did anything interesting.
5 hydroxylated tryptamines are mostly inactive as far as I know, so even if some sort of transformation occurred it would be to worthless 5-HO-DMT (AKA bufotenine). While not exactly inactive, it certainly isn't described as pleasant or really psychedelic...
Quote:
TiHKAL #19. 5-HO-DMT
QUALITATIVE COMMENTS : (with 1 mg, intravenously, over a three minute period) "Within a minute (from the start of the injection) I had a tight feeling in my chest and my face felt as if it had been jabbed by nettles and this lasted for about 6 minutes. I had fleeting nausea."
(with 2 mg, intravenously, over a 3 minute period) "I felt a tightness in my throat and stomach and it seemed that my pulse was racing, although apparently there was no change in either my pulse or blood pressure."
(with 4 mg, intravenously, over a 3 minute period) "During the injection, I first felt a burning sensation in my face, then a load pressing down from above, and then a numbness of the entire body. I saw red and black spots -- a vivid orange-red -- moving around. Apparently my purplish face color lasted some 15 minutes, well after my visual things had disappeared."
(with 8 mg, intravenously, over a 3 minute period) "I became lightheaded as soon as the injection started, and then my face turned purple and I became nauseated and I felt I couldn't breathe. I see white, straight lines with a black background. I can't trace a pattern. Now there are red, green and yellow dots, very bright like they were made out of fluorescent cloth, moving like blood cells through capillaries, weaving in and out of the white lines. I another two minutes, everything was pretty much gone."
(with 10 mg, intravenously, over a 50 second period) "My face was suddenly very hot. I could not breathe fast enough."
(with 10 mg, intravenously, over a 77 minute period) "There were no psychological changes."
(with 16 mg, intravenously, over a 3 minute period) "Almost immediately I felt a burning sensation in the roof of my mouth and I felt a tingling all over my body. My face turned purple, and my chest feels crushed. Everything has a yellow haze, and I was sweating heavily and I vomited. Words can't come. My mind feels crowded. When I start on a thought, another one comes along and clashes with it. I can't express myself clearly. I am here and not here. It has now been forty minutes and I feel better, but I still feel like I would like to walk it off, like a hang-over."
-FF
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mr.shankly
A Charming Man



Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 18
Loc: texas, the evil empire
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: fastfred]
#7485883 - 10/04/07 06:11 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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thanks for the input! looks like i need to study chemistry a little further
-------------------- ''It is wrong to expect a reward for your struggles. The reward is the act of struggle itself, not what you win. Even though you can't expect to defeat the absurdity of the world, you must make that attempt. That's morality, that's religion. That's art. That's life.'' - Phil Ochs ideas are the real things; what we see in the world of experience are only their shadows.
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mr_minds_eye
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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: fastfred]
#7488654 - 10/05/07 02:23 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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That's by itself though. Bufotine is also the main alkaloid in Yopo snuffs which while being a difficult experience in the beginning, is very much worthwhile. I am sure it is due to the other alkaloids that it is different than those THIKAL entries. But I seem to remember seeing an alkaloid analysis of Liberty Caps and bufotine was in there. 5-HTP was too. So maybe it would do something. Even if it is bufotine it might not be entirely worthless. I would just eat a few 5-HTP caps a hour or so before dosing and towards the end. You will get more out of them that way most likely.
-------------------- Our quest for discovery fuels our creativity in all fields, not just science. If we reached the end of the line, the human spirit would shrivel and die. But I don't think we will ever stand still: we shall increase in complexity, if not in depth, and shall always be the center on an expanding horizon of possibilities. -Stephen Hawking
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fastfred
Old Hand



Registered: 05/17/04
Posts: 6,899
Loc: Dark side of the moon
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Everything I've read about bufotenine indicates that it is indeed worthless. Most of the literature indicates that it is a peripheral toxin with almost no CNS activity.
To my knowledge there has never been a positive report relating to the usage of bufotenine. It may be a component in some entheogenic brews, but reports of experiences with the pure chemical would indicate that it is an undesirable side product and not a source of any activity.
-FF
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mr.shankly
A Charming Man



Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 18
Loc: texas, the evil empire
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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Re: 5-HTP & 4-HO-DMT [Re: fastfred]
#7494498 - 10/07/07 01:45 PM (16 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
mr_minds_eye: I would just eat a few 5-HTP caps a hour or so before dosing and towards the end. You will get more out of them that way most likely.
that's usually the case with me. i've noticed a daily regimen of 5HTP has increased the intensity and duration of my recent tryptamine sessions. i suppose either route, external or internal could produce a marginal difference. i'll proceed with the scientific method and see what turns up.
-------------------- ''It is wrong to expect a reward for your struggles. The reward is the act of struggle itself, not what you win. Even though you can't expect to defeat the absurdity of the world, you must make that attempt. That's morality, that's religion. That's art. That's life.'' - Phil Ochs ideas are the real things; what we see in the world of experience are only their shadows.
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