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OfflineYosefxp
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What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common?
    #7469172 - 09/30/07 05:55 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

So I want to know if anyone else thinks this. When I look at organised religion all I see is brainwashing and this is how I see it as working.


In my experience there are two types of people in organised religious groups: The ones who know and the ones who don’t. They are really easy to distinguish...all you have to do is walk up to someone and start a conversation about religion: if they start listening to you and try to relate what they believe to what you believe then you have someone who knows. If they stand there, refuse to listen and tell you they’re wrong; they don’t know. I have come to the belief that the people who know are fine, maybe slightly misguided; but the people who don’t, and I think they are by far the majority(~95%), who are brainwashed.


I believe in the idea of what I like to call personal religion which is the belief that everyone has inside themselves the power to know what is right and wrong for them. That is, there is no true universal right and wrong; just what is right individually. And it is that right and wrong which I believe we can all know by looking inwards and this is where I think the brainwashing starts.


We live in a material world. We spend most of our lives living outside ourselves: at work, school, socializing and many people can spend their entire lives living out there without ever pausing to look inwards and this is where organised religion gets its’ foot in the door.


We all have a need to feel part of something bigger than ourselves but at the same time we are incredibly lazy so when someone comes along with a 2000 year old book and says this will tell you everything you need to know; we take it. We see everyone else at church happy in their ignorant bliss seemingly fulfilled and want a part of it. We go to church we can be told by a man, in black and white, what is wrong and what is right. And while you’re at it he can tell you exactly how to live your life for you. He can stir up the crowd and make you think that the feeling of crowd hysteria is actually god inside you (see a fundamentalist church service). And to top it all off he will tell you that this is the only one true correct way and that everyone else is wrong just to add to the sense of belonging to this elite and righteous club.


Now the really sad part is most people can actually feel themselves saying that this particular religion is wrong for them. They feel like they want to go out and party, drink and do drugs and many of them do before the conditioned-by-the-church sense of guilt creeps in the next day. They know that what is being taught is wrong but organised religion is smart, tricky and it’s had 2000 years of practise. They have a word for that feeling: Satan. “No no,” they say. “It’s not you who wants to party with your friends, drink and do drugs; it is Satan and ‘temptation’ trying to trick you. You must resist temptation, suppress your urges and surrender to the never ending love of god and Jesus Christ”. This is where the grey sneaks into the black and white teachings of the pastor.


Now doesn’t that make you sick? I have a flatmate who is currently in the process of changing who she really is in order to fit into the Christian religion and I can tell you it is a painful process. She goes out, has a few drinks, parties her ass off and has the time of her life but the next day “reason” creeps in and she feels guilty as hell. Alcohol lowers inhibitions so now tell me; if god is supposed to be inside you, be such an integral part of you and your soul, why is it that you must rely on learned “reason” and “inhibitions” in order to do what’s right?


Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not specifically attacking Christianity here. I think it’s a perfectly good religion, probably one of the better ones out there, and when I talk about people who know I’m talking about the people whose personal religion matches up perfectly with the organised religion they are part of. When I say they’re misguided I mean they still think they are 100% right and everyone else is wrong. While I will agree they are 100% right, it is only 100% right for them and they need to realise that I am just as right as they are when I say there is no god.


It’s the people who don’t know that I feel the worst for. They have had their own personal religion suppressed for so long, had WHO THEY ARE buried to the point where they will believe anything they are told. When I try to have a conversation with one of these people I am reminded of the people of North Korea or Nazi Germany. Brain washed.

In behavioural psychology there are two types of learned behaviour in humans. Rule governed and contingency shaped. Rule governed is seeing a sign on an electric fence and learning not to touch it from reading the sign. Contingency shaped would be actually touching the fence and learning by being in contact with the contingencies not to touch the fence. As you can see, rule governed behaviour is much easier; you don’t get shocked. With organised religion we see a series of rules that must be followed; with true religion we see people looking inside and feeling what is right and wrong.


Now you might say “But Yosef, I don’t just believe every rule I see.” Correct! There are several reasons why we would be more inclined to follow a rule and is just so happens that smart, tricky 2000 year old organised religion uses several of these.

1: Consequences. If you see a sign that says don’t take this cookie or you will be fined $0.20c; the consequences are trivial and you’ll take the tasty cookie. But let’s say another sign says don’t take it or you’ll go to prison. You’ll probably go without. Now imagine a sign that says you’ll spend eternity in hell. It’s a no brainer right? That’s what organised religion wants you to think.

2. Authority. We believe people who are famous and successful. How many of our governments are religious based? How many celebrities thank god in their Oscar speeches? Paris Hilton’s converted to Christianity??? Let’s do it!

3. Past experience. This is where religion gets even the best of us. Most people would have to agree that killing is wrong. Stealing is wrong. Being nice to others is good. We know that and our personal religion probably agrees. But hang on a minute; so does my local church! Wow, they happen to be part of the 10 most important rules in the whole religion. Well I guess if they get the important ones right they must be on the right track. Genius. They actually use our own personal religions to lure us in, to tell us something that we’ll almost certainly agree with and get that positive spiritual feeling flowing before they cram us full with other ideas about how homosexuality is immoral and it is our job to ‘help’ people see the light.


At the end of all that their rules seem all too easy to follow don’t they? You bet, and after the first few years of repressing who we are we learn how to follow the rules and ignore the contingencies which show up as feelings and we learn that they aren’t us, as they are in fact Satan tempting us.


I could write about this forever but for those of you actually bored or interested enough to read this far I will stop :laugh:. Except to say this:
You know who you are. Just sit down and meditate, go on a spiritual discovery mission, take a psychedelic drug and you will find it. Don’t listen to anyone else!! They don’t know you. And please, PLEASE stay away from organised religion. They are masters at mind control (or should I call it soul control :wink:).

Peace,
Yosef.


--------------------
Well it's alright riding around in the breeze
Well it's alright if you live the life you please
Well it's alright doing the best you can
Well it's alright as long as you lend a hand


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Invisiblearchenemy
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: Yosefxp]
    #7469186 - 09/30/07 06:07 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I agree 100% with you.
religion is mind control


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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: archenemy]
    #7469197 - 09/30/07 06:21 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah i agree. Questioning and working things out causes your mind to grow. Once you believe you know something you stop thinking. Which is bad enough, but atleast you developed the knowledge yourself. But when someone tells you what to believe, and you accept it blindly, thats the worst. Life is movement and change, things die when they stop changing, they decay.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469209 - 09/30/07 06:32 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Once you believe you know something you stop thinking.




I believe I'm using a keyboard to type this message. :smirk:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7469250 - 09/30/07 06:59 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Its handy for small things like that, so you dont have to analyse the basic things in life all the time. BUt then again the best ideas and inventions can come from analysing the most simple things.


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Offlinerizingfire
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469270 - 09/30/07 07:16 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

It's funny how you guys blast Christianity but Christ wasn't for organized religion either...course none of you posting this crap know that because you haven't studied the Bible...merely read 3rd party BS on websites and accepted it. Sure Christians are a pain in the ass sometimes and get over zealous but Christianity in itself is simple. If you accept Christ, even your future sins will not condemn you to hell. Just because the Roman Catholic abomination has spread your legalistic follow the rules or else crap[...but that is not Christianity and the RC church was established in 1050AD so unlike their claims they are far from the original church...actually church in the 1st century, unless it took place in a temple was more like a party, drinking wine, catching a buzz and having a good time praising God....I wanted nothing more than to prove Christianity untrue....was a witch prior and was very eclectic...but obviously God get's his way...further than that the irony is I used to stalk and torment Christians as a favorite passtime....and then I saw the truth...It is Ironic how much you guys bash it on here though...kinda gives to what the bible says about all the demonic ideology (basically what you believe) and your hatred is directed towards Christianity...when it should be directed towards the cause...You don't believe in demons? I did long before I was a Christian..You make your own choices but when thoughts jump in your head that are off the wall it isn't you...plus science says instinct takes over everything for survival so what is suicide?


--------------------
aka NHMI


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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: rizingfire]
    #7469319 - 09/30/07 07:39 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I think your right rizingfire that christianity has been corrupted by people rather than the actual original belief being corrupt. Although that is hard to tell since known versions of the bible were written along time after jesus death, also it has been controlled and probably changed by corrupt people throughout the ages. I think people also have a hard time putting their faith in a god who they have never met.


Edited by DimensionX (09/30/07 08:04 AM)


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: rizingfire]
    #7469362 - 09/30/07 07:51 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

And how do you know that god exists? That Jesus existed? That's all really true? :rolleyes:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


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Offlineshakercee
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7469398 - 09/30/07 08:04 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

merely read 3rd party BS on websites and accepted it.




same thing for his belief in god and jesus. :shrug:


--------------------
Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane


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Offlinefivepointer
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: Yosefxp]
    #7469403 - 09/30/07 08:05 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Your "religion" says:
All things are relativistic
No true universal right and wrong
God doesn't exist
Do what seems right

Aren't you just as bad about the dogmatism of your "religion"? Why are you trying to convert others to your way? Sounds like your brainwashed.


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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: fivepointer]
    #7469404 - 09/30/07 08:08 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

But at the same time, with all the relgious violence in the world at the moment, can you really blame him for feeling that way?


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Offlinefivepointer
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469411 - 09/30/07 08:11 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

DimensionX said:
But at the same time, with all the relgious violence in the world at the moment, can you really blame him for feeling that way?



He might start attacking Christians or something and think that by doing so he is helping the world by attacking organized religion which he views as harmful.


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Offlinestellar renegade
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: rizingfire]
    #7469426 - 09/30/07 08:18 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I think that some people here are percieving more hatred than there is, at least in the OP.  That post was very calming.

I know that the church changed after about the 3rd century, and somewhat before that, and your depiction of it is close to accurate (except that they met in their own homes, and there were no official leaders, just one big circle of friends).  The conflict between neo-Christianity and non-Christians has me wanting to die sometimes.  No one understands the original and so the ghastly war continues.

Like I said in another post, no one would know what evil is unless there was some conception of a higher good.  Also, the abuses would not be so bad except in the place of something better.  Having a personal religion is great, but since we are all the same, the faith would be linked together and synchronous for all of us.

Don't have time to post more on that now, meditate on that and peace out. :sheesha:


--------------------
"I threw a small stone down at the reflection of my image in the water, and it altogether disappeared. I burst as it shattered through me, like a bullet through a bottle... and I'm expected to believe that any of this is real!" -mewithoutYou

"To believe in the wide-awake real, through all the stupefying, enervating, distorting dream: to will to wake, when the very being seems athirst for godless repose: these are the broken steps up to the high fields where repose is but a form of strength, strength but a form of joy, joy but a form of love." -George MacDonald


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: stellar renegade]
    #7469537 - 09/30/07 08:53 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

everything about the protection rackets is bully-ish
mafia's
governments
and churches are all entangled in the protection business, a kind of bullying and a kind of caring for children at the same time.

the insurance industry is absolutely huge, and secretly they control what might seem to be democratic legislation, Insurers are connected to banking with precision.

to do something meaningful we can immerse into these sectors and infuse what humanity is possible, i.e. try not to feed the negative, try to feed the positive.


--------------------
:confused: _ :brainfart:🧠  _ :finger:


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Offlinerizingfire
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469860 - 09/30/07 10:34 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

DimensionX said:
I think your right rizingfire that christianity has been corrupted by people rather than the actual original belief being corrupt. Although that is hard to tell since known versions of the bible were written along time after jesus death, also it has been controlled and probably changed by corrupt people throughout the ages. I think people also have a hard time putting their faith in a god who they have never met.




As for the manuscripts there are 7 complete and tons of pieces. The dead sea scrolls had coppies of some of the Bible books and they were unchanged. We have 1st century manuscripts and carbondating says they are that old. I did a lot of research for myself on the authenticity of our translated texts and they are pretty close for the most part. The only one missing a verse is the King James cuz it was translated only from the textus receptus where many translations use all of them comparitively. The creation story however is two different traditions combined and it doesn't specify that Genisis 1:1-2:4 is the yahwist tradition and 2:4 is the priestly tradition...Plus I don't put much stake in Genesis' accuracy because it was paassed down by word of mouth for years cuz the written language was 1-2000 yrs away with the invention of samaritain cuniform. The rest was written after writing had come about. We have things like the septuagint which is from 200bc and is the complete OT...and plent of 1st century anti-nicean writings (a few thousand pages) that back up accepted books, frauds like the gnostic gospels written by known heretics such as Maricon etc, the writings of Polycarp and Clement. Despite the lies of the Roman Catholic Church, you can trace the years that they developed before becoming an officail church in 1050AD and afterward you can see silly things like purgatory and being beaten added to control people...nothing to do with the love of Christ.

As for knowing Jesus is real? You're kidding right? His existence is not questioned by historians at all. He is mentioned in a few Roman biographys and the only thing in question was the ressurection. They know He said He was God and was put to death for it. Whether He rose again is the only debatable part of Christianity. The following He had and how it grew in record numbers after the supposed ressurection are all documented...by someone who hated them!


--------------------
aka NHMI


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Offlineleery11
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: rizingfire]
    #7470003 - 09/30/07 11:17 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Jesus is the devil.

Jesus is the devil because the only reason we look to Jesus is so that we can look away from the devil. This makes Jesus transparent and puts us in the bardo state of hell realms so that this is our standard of viewing the world as systematic devils and demons everywhere.

What Jesus actually is from the standpoint of non-mind control is us, our actualized self, Brahman, Atman, and then one may simply feel more comfortable calling him Jesus than Buddha or ME because they are raised into a culture which does that

and that is okay as long as they know

those that don't know run the show, they are the sribes and pharisees Jesus condemns

and Leary condemns
and many people condemn
and we condemn

because the story of Jesus is accurately, the story of a man who defied the authorities of man-kind, government, and religion, and radically subverted much of the status-quos to teach inner realization

for this he was crucified because people incessantly said he was a demon or otherwise blasphemous

though he spake truly

and he spoke truly because of this:
he was his own authority figure, he spoke from the Father

that is, his own inner-God, he was self-actualized and he wasn't afraid to express it

so he did it.

the Bible attempted to encapsulate this, and if you read it the right way it will work for you the right way and it will be Good

but what happens is that as soon as you let any other authority figure (aside from those who are awakened in CONSCIOUSNESS) interpret the Bible for you

you are becoming demoniacally possessed through mind-control the exact way television works

and the Bible becomes a capstone with an eye in it just like the television is

because you aren't using the tool, the tool is using you

if you just randomly fip the Bible open to read a short verse whenever you have a question it will begin working as a Tarot or dowsing process and align you with your own inner divinity

how do I know I can look at shroomery through IHOP?
flip ----- why are you afraid of being persecuted, know not that I will protect you?

yeah, the exact message I knew it would give me

useful, isn't it?

Depends, if it isn't DON'T use it

because mind control is convincing you to USE SOMETHING THAT IS EITHER NOT USEFUL OR ACTUALLY DETRIMENTAL TO YOUR WELL-BEING AND THEY CALL THIS THING JESUS (GOOD HEALTH, FIGHT CAVITIES, STAY SAFE FROM CRIME, EAT POTATO CHIPS TO BE AT ONE WITH BLISS JOY AND THE SPIRIT OF GOD, I'M LOVIN' IT!!!!!) and this is what preachers do they

they say oh memorize who beget so and so and who beget this man and who he was begetten by before Jeshu-shrub-adub-manningGoddingTon

no no no no no

its you and you have to be your own authority

why any Christian should refuse to go to churches, stupid weak sheeple in need of seeing the clarity of Christ-Consciousness

drugs are okay

what is the stoners favorite verse you know? The only thing I could even have against the Bible is:
the violence in it,
the judgments against homosexuality

but if you know WHAT IT IS then it can communicate with you telepathically through synchronicity

and so can internet message boards and etc


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


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OfflineMycomyth
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: leery11]
    #7470232 - 09/30/07 12:15 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

My take on organized religion is....
If it wasn't necessary, it wouldn't exist. Many need those structures along their way home.

M


--------------------
Wave upon wave of demented avengers marched cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: rizingfire]
    #7470399 - 09/30/07 01:06 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I attended Baptist Bible Collage in Michigan. I studied the bible for many years.

.course none of you posting this crap know that because you haven't studied the Bible...merely read 3rd party BS on websites and accepted it. S

So tell me dude, but first hold up a mirror and take a good look, who is full of crap?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisiblewps
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: Icelander]
    #7470421 - 09/30/07 01:13 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

:lol:

yeah, no shit, dude :thumbup:

I studied the bible for years as a child.  Because I was FORCED to.  Just like MILLIONS of other impressionable young minds in American society. 

its pretty hard to accuse Americans of not knowing the bible.  most of us have studied it quite a bit!  I mean its not like its hard to come across.  the damn thing is in every hotel room in this country!


--------------------
"America touts itself as the land of the free, but the number one freedom that you and I have is the freedom to enter into a subservient role in the workplace. Once you exercise this freedom you've lost all control over what you do, what is produced, and how it is produced. And in the end, the product doesn't belong to you. The only way you can avoid bosses and jobs is if you don't care about making a living. Which leads to the second freedom: the freedom to starve."

- Tom Morello


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Offlineleery11
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Re: What do Organised Religion and Mind Control have in common? [Re: wps]
    #7471011 - 09/30/07 04:07 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Christianity is a string that is connected to the posts of the internet users here.

Because there is no consensus of what Jesus is, the name keeps evolving to fit the times, always being evil, always being malicious lie.

And so look, we paint a consensus that YES Jesus = Buddha
but Jesus is the devil he is RED he is a rising flame.

and so when we do this, it is pretty absurd because we are sitting here writing the truth, yet employ the same tactics outlined in OP's post

we are being stuck here

this causes massive confusion, the Christians will agree with you completely on all the issues you care about then say they believe them too but from the vantage of their inverse paranoia i create a temporary bardo reality where i am sucked into the fear of HELL FIRE such a lie completely to the extent that I begin to immerse myself in it for to say something like this is to rest my finger on their trigger, becuase all they are is a gun

Christianity is a gun pointed at you, and you grovling on your knees

it is ridiculous evil from the vantage of the devil, for it creates the idea of evil.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


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