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OfflineHakim0777
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Karma
    #7468280 - 09/29/07 08:20 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Does anyone here believe in karma? Do you really think theres some preexisting force that punishes the wicked?

I sure dont! For one thing whats right and whats wrong is decided by man. When shit goes bad alot of people will say oh must be karma, usually when the wrong is ironic to the end result.But theres such evil people out there who continue to exist with out karma ever affecting them. I beleive what you put in is what you get in the world but thats far from some cosmic force which btw was originally conceived to benefit the brahmins.

What do you all think?


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Invisiblewps
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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7468290 - 09/29/07 08:24 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)



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"America touts itself as the land of the free, but the number one freedom that you and I have is the freedom to enter into a subservient role in the workplace. Once you exercise this freedom you've lost all control over what you do, what is produced, and how it is produced. And in the end, the product doesn't belong to you. The only way you can avoid bosses and jobs is if you don't care about making a living. Which leads to the second freedom: the freedom to starve."

- Tom Morello

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OfflinePhanTomCat
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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7468462 - 09/29/07 09:19 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I believe in a karma-t....
I have two of them myself....!    :beartrap:


>^;;^<


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I'll be your midnight French Fry....  :naughty:

"The most important things in life that are often ignored, are the things that one cannot see...."

>^;;^<

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Invisibledblaney
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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7468547 - 09/29/07 09:45 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Karma is just the law of cause and effect, as applied to actions. Any thing, any action you take, any deed you perform, will have results. It is generally recognized that a 'good' action will have 'good' results, and a 'bad' action will have 'bad' results. But who knows what this 'good' or this 'bad' really is?

Selflessness and selfishness? Pleasure and displeasure? I really don't know.


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"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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InvisibleVeritas
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Re: Karma [Re: dblaney]
    #7468593 - 09/29/07 09:56 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

But do you really see this playing out in general?  I mean, "bad" actions seem to yield beneficial results for many, many people in organized crime, as well as quite a few politicians.  By contrast, "good" actions can yield no results or bad results.  :shrug:

It seems to me that your comment that no one really knows what "good" or "bad" really are is more accurate than the rest of your post.  If we don't know how to correctly apply these terms, then who does?  Some Big Daddy in the sky?  A punishing/rewarding energetic force in the Universe?  The Flying Spaghetti Monster?  :confused:

Karma seems like another made-up human idea to keep people well-behaved.

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OfflineHakim0777
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Re: Karma [Re: Veritas]
    #7468634 - 09/29/07 10:15 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Veritas said:
But do you really see this playing out in general?  I mean, "bad" actions seem to yield beneficial results for many, many people in organized crime, as well as quite a few politicians.  By contrast, "good" actions can yield no results or bad results.  :shrug:

It seems to me that your comment that no one really knows what "good" or "bad" really are is more accurate than the rest of your post.  If we don't know how to correctly apply these terms, then who does?  Some Big Daddy in the sky?  A punishing/rewarding energetic force in the Universe?  The Flying Spaghetti Monster?  :confused:

Karma seems like another made-up human idea to keep people well-behaved.




thats basically what im trying to get at.


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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: Karma [Re: Veritas]
    #7468643 - 09/29/07 10:18 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Karma is real, I will tell you that. I can't prove it to you though.

Veritas, I don't really understand your post. First you say that bad actions can lead to good results, in such cases as organized crime or politicians (they gain wealth and happiness?) and that good actions can have bad results. Then you go on to say that good and bad are just concepts which can't be accurately applied to anything.

I mean, sure, everything is just a made-up human idea if you want to look at it that way...

What dblaney is talking about is cause and effect, and we can see this play out in situations at every single moment. If you are not intent on being socially open and an efficient person, you will be isolated. Is this good or bad? It's simply the consequence of your own actions.

We carry certain attachments and we have certain motivations we take with us... they will decide what the art of our life will be, what we will communicate. How do we know if we are communicating or putting something "good" out to the Universe? Some might say they can just "feel" it, if you don't feel it, or you have to intellectualize it, you might be on a bad path.

We don't know what comes after death, if we take stuff with us from this life. However, some have seen this possibility that the stuff they've learned from this life will be carried with them unless they cast it off... they call this karma.

As for the evil people whom karma doesn't effect, I don't think it works that way. The concept of karma isn't about a man in the clouds shooting lightning bolts of judgment at you when you break a human law, it's the result of what you put in to the world, and that means the karma of all history as well as the karma of our individual actions here and now.


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Karma [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7468676 - 09/29/07 10:28 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

And it's a plain one-sided view to think that an action has only good or bad effects. Since everything that we do has multiple effects, both "good" and "bad" and everything in between.
How can you determine Karma then? From which of the infinity of the perspectives do you calculate it? :sherlock:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7468736 - 09/29/07 10:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I guess you can't really determine it... in infinity there is no us which karma applies to. I don't know, I thought I understood karma but now I'm questioning myself and what I saw... it was the magnification of my own beliefs I suppose, to look at people and think I could see that they were in different places in their own personal evolution and that there were certain lessons or struggles they would need to conquer to get higher to their goal.

Could that all be a projection of my mind? Is it?

Unless we could see ourselves from an infinite number of perspectives, and see which perspectives or actions were creating good karma and which ones were creating bad karma. If we saw from an infinite number of perspectives, wouldn't this be a kind of omnipotence where we would naturally know what the best possible choice would be?


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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Karma [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7468757 - 09/29/07 11:12 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Ahhh now you're talking about the best choice (on a personal level of course), which is something entirely different than Karma.
I view karma as a two dimensional map in a multi dimensional world. It might represent a route, but it's not the only one. It leads you to an understanding of the surface. Which, if we choose to take too serious, would put a stop to us seeing the rest of the possible outcomes.
The greatness, in my opinion, is to always stay perceptive to what's around us, in order to get as much as possible out of this reality.
Also, it is possible for two persons who share the same one-sided view on Karma, to find even more coincidences, but this only because they both see only what they were already expecting. Which can be a very impressive feeling but it's all there is.
The Will surpasses this plain old view and puts a congregation of new perspectives on the table. This is where we find freedom. :mushroom2:


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:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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OfflineHakim0777
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7468811 - 09/29/07 11:42 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

mushroomtrip +5 for being a smart ass...in a good way.


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Offlineshakercee
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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7469023 - 09/30/07 02:11 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I particularly hate the Karma of masturbation, that i am killing all the  living things (according to karmalogists) = sperms. :lol:


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Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Karma [Re: shakercee]
    #7469087 - 09/30/07 03:21 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Do you have any idea how many sperms are you killing just one time? :what:
You're so charged for massacre! :rolleyes:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Offlineshakercee
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7469096 - 09/30/07 03:36 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

:lol: The punishment for that is multiple births as a sperm, until you realize oh!!! sperms are sacred.  Now how does a sperm attain enlightenment? :shrug:


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Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane

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OfflineYosefxp
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Re: Karma [Re: shakercee]
    #7469104 - 09/30/07 03:44 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

It certainly makes more sense to me than an all powerful, all knowing consciousness ruling the heavens and deciding what's right and what's wrong...

But if you don't believe in regular karma...what about INSTANT KARMA??

Instant karmas gonna get you
Gonna knock you right on the head
You better get yourself together
Pretty soon youre gonna be dead
What in the world you thinking of
Laughing in the face of love
What on earth you tryin to do
Its up to you, yeah you

Instant karmas gonna get you
Gonna look you right in the face
Better get yourself together darlin
Join the human race
How in the world you gonna see
Laughin at fools like me
Who in the hell dyou think you are
A super star
Well, right you are

Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Well we all shine on
Evryone come on

Instant karmas gonna get you
Gonna knock you off your feet
Better recognize your brothers
Evryone you meet
Why in the world are we here
Surely not to live in pain and fear
Why on earth are you there
When youre evrywhere
Come and get your share

Well we all shine on
Like the moon and the stars and the sun
Yeah we all shine on
Come on and on and on on on

- John Lennon


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Well it's alright riding around in the breeze
Well it's alright if you live the life you please
Well it's alright doing the best you can
Well it's alright as long as you lend a hand

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Karma [Re: shakercee]
    #7469106 - 09/30/07 03:45 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Positive distribution :lol:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Offlineshakercee
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7469113 - 09/30/07 03:55 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

gee... a sperm would be more worried about competition..bump...bump...push..push. :evil:


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Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane

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Offlineshakercee
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Re: Karma [Re: Yosefxp]
    #7469114 - 09/30/07 03:58 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

what about INSTANT KARMA??




I will take it. That would be fine.


--------------------
Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane

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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: Karma [Re: shakercee]
    #7469208 - 09/30/07 06:30 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I actually believe in it. My view is that if you are selfish and cruel, although you may get results and lots of money etc. In the end you will be unhappy. Its inevitable, the hate and anger will twist and destroy you...although you may die on a pile of money, you will never find peace. Where are as if you concentrate on good and try and achieve peace, you are on the road to self satisfaction. This dosent mean your magically protected, people can still hurt you, things can still go wrong. You cant control the outside world or other people, but the choices you make about yourself you can, and thats whats important.

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469223 - 09/30/07 06:43 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

I actually believe in it.




Taken from another thread, your own words:

Quote:

Once you believe you know something you stop thinking.




:strokebeard:

Quote:

My view is that if you are selfish and cruel, although you may get results and lots of money etc. In the end you will be unhappy.




Can you define selfish and cruel for me?
Also, your assumption is that all the people who have money are unhappy. This doesn't make any sense to me and I'm asking you to elaborate on it.

Quote:

Its inevitable, the hate and anger will twist and destroy you...although you may die on a pile of money, you will never find peace.




Ok, this sounds like a passage from a self help book. :rolleyes:
How do you know that all the people who have money are full of hate and anger? Is this something that applies to all the cases?
And the reverse... to be quite honest, I've seen a lot of poor people who never found happiness and which live in hate and frustration.
Conclusion: one's happiness doesn't depend oh having money or not.
You example is ambiguous.

Quote:

Where are as if you concentrate on good and try and achieve peace, you are on the road to self satisfaction.




And I'll have to ask you one more time: how do you know this?
And what's good?
Should we all feel obliged to fight for peace? :smirk:
I feel pretty darn happy and I don't fight for peace.

Quote:

This dosent mean your magically protected, people can still hurt you, things can still go wrong.




People don't "hurt" you, you let yourself get hurt by how you interpret the actions of others. Huge difference.

You still didn't bring any prof to sustain the existence of karma. :sorry:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Offlineshakercee
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7469234 - 09/30/07 06:49 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:


    Quote:
    I actually believe in it.



Taken from another thread, your own words:

    Quote:
    Once you believe you know something you stop thinking.



:strokebeard:




:lol: He would be speechless now.


--------------------
Pray, v.: To ask that the laws of the universe be annulled in behalf of a single petitioner confessedly unworthy - Ambrose Bierce

Medical science has confirmed what the male world has known intuitively for millenia: that scratching your ass is a great aid to complex thinking.

Its God's responsibility to forgive the terrorist organizations such as Jaish, Lashkar etc.
Its our responsibility to arrange the meeting between them and god."
- Indian Armed Forces

"Hey Monkey!! Get Funky" - Tarzan and Jane

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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: Karma [Re: shakercee]
    #7469242 - 09/30/07 06:55 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I dont expect to able to bring proof to anything. I was merely saying my own personal belief, based on my own experience. I dont think it would be possible to prove something like this. I never said fight for peace, so im not sure why you brought that up, it seems like a contradiction to me. I didnt actually mean that all people with money were bad, all i meant to say is that selfishness and related emotions can lead to material gain, but also to being basically unhappy. As to the belief thing, it an interesting question, I have beliefs, but i also like to leave them kind of open so that they can change as i learn more.

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OfflineDimensionX
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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469269 - 09/30/07 07:16 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

As to concepts of good and bad. Alot of the time they are just perceptions. My perception is that there are things which are good for humans and things which are bad. One of the problems to my eyes is that people aren’t sure what is good for them. Like people who are filled with hate and think that killing and revenge would be good or fun. I personally think that this is bad for them, because hate is painful, it is consuming and tiring. Where as peace leads to good things for everyone, because it is relaxing and happy.

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7469623 - 09/30/07 09:24 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Well, there is good hate and then there is bad hate...


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Karma [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7470463 - 09/30/07 01:24 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

What about medium hate?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleEternalCowabunga
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Re: Karma [Re: Icelander]
    #7470480 - 09/30/07 01:28 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Are emotions are always in infinite flux, there is no real hate :yinyang:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Karma [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7470490 - 09/30/07 01:32 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Then there is no real love.:rofl2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineLion
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Re: Karma [Re: Icelander]
    #7470499 - 09/30/07 01:33 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

What do you think?

Your mood status would seem to indicate you believe in love. :heartpump:


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“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Karma [Re: Lion]
    #7470507 - 09/30/07 01:36 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I don't believe anything, but I have many suspicions.

What the thinker thinks, the prover proves.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Offlineajdaak
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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7470516 - 09/30/07 01:39 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

i am someone that thinks everything happens for a reason. our reason for doing drugs and being on this page is to teach the younger generations


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Karma [Re: ajdaak]
    #7470519 - 09/30/07 01:40 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Programming.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: Karma [Re: Icelander]
    #7470826 - 09/30/07 03:15 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
What about medium hate?




Dude, we are NOT talking salsa here. :nono:


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OfflineHakim0777
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Re: Karma [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7471460 - 09/30/07 07:09 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
What about medium hate?




Dude, we are NOT talking salsa here. :nono:




While were on the subject newmans own makes some bomb ass salsa.


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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7471478 - 09/30/07 07:13 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

When I think of authentic Mexican cuisine, I think 'Newman'...


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Re: Karma [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7471533 - 09/30/07 07:34 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

When I think authentic mexican cuisine I think 'rats,mangos, and salsa''


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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7471554 - 09/30/07 07:39 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

And little beggar kids tugging and imploring you to by some Juicy Fruit gum.


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Re: Karma [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7471604 - 09/30/07 07:50 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I thought those were eastern Europeans?

close enough.


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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7471634 - 09/30/07 07:56 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Blame it on the TUBB (The United Brotherhood of Beggars) union.


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Re: Karma [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7471643 - 09/30/07 07:57 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

God damn the TUBB. To the chambers for them!


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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7473324 - 10/01/07 10:12 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

My understanding from Karma seems to differ from what has been posted so far, though I don't know if this is in fact actually what karma is, maybe I am wrong, but here goes:

Like others have said karma is simple cause and effect. Where my understanding differs is that people generally seem to think this means if you do something bad, something bad will happen to you in return. What I thought karma was is simply if you do something bad, something bad will happen (not necessarily to you). For instance if you are a bad parent and raise your child horribly, they will grow up with many problems, cause and effect. The bad result (effect) does not have to happen to you, it simply has to happen. This applies for 'good' and 'bad' w/e you deem those be.

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
People don't "hurt" you, you let yourself get hurt by how you interpret the actions of others. Huge difference.





Very true, we cause all of our own anguish by letter others affect us when they should not.

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Re: Karma [Re: krypto2000]
    #7473342 - 10/01/07 10:17 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

And yet another definition for Karma :lol:
How many are there until now? :strokebeard:

The example you gave is a pure psychological effect, which has nothing to do with karma. :shrug:


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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7473345 - 10/01/07 10:20 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

why not?

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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7473368 - 10/01/07 10:26 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Because, like I said, the example he gave represents a psychological effect. It is known by all the specialty books (and also by simply by being an aware observer) that if a kid is grown in an unhealthy manner, he will have issues.
That unless, you just want to see karma in everything, which can lead me to the conclusion that even taking a shit and hearing the after splash is karma too (cause & effect) :grin:


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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7473386 - 10/01/07 10:32 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Ive never really thought of karma as a magical thing. Ive always thought of it as being cause and effect, but with the opinion that it also applies to moral choices. And i guess the bad raising of a child is an example of poor moral choice, leading to a poor outcome.

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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7473421 - 10/01/07 10:45 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ive never really thought of karma as a magical thing. Ive always thought of it as being cause and effect,




This also has a name: life :smirk:
A chain of causes & effects, multiplied by an infinity of outcomes, and, for those who Want... also Free Will. :mushroom2:
Now karma already has a definition and I think that it has way too many errors, no need to amplify it by finding new interpretations of it.
See, what happens is, that if we choose to believe in karma, our freedom is being obstructed because we live under the impression that there is something/ somebody out there, watching us and judging us. How can this lead to a happy life? Why this need for an arbiter? I think it's about time for us to grow up and wipe our own asses when we need it.

Quote:

but with the opinion that it also applies to moral choices. And i guess the bad raising of a child is an example of poor moral choice, leading to a poor outcome.




Can you define "moral" for me? :thanx:
In actual, practical and discernible terms.
Also, what does morality have to do with raising a kid in an unhealthy way? There are parents who have "issues", fears, frustrations, inhibitions... etc, and by simply raising their kids they transmit all of those to them. Should we label all those psychological problems and a lack of "morality"? :rolleyes:


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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7473426 - 10/01/07 10:47 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Sorry i missed out the part your probably going to disagree with the most:tongue: Negative moral values lead to negative results for the person who has them. So in this case, i think its inevitable that the parents will have some kind of negative impact on themselves because of the way they think and act. I mean anyone who would negelect a child obivously has some issues which are going to come back to bite them.

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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7473432 - 10/01/07 10:49 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I guess morals are a personal value system

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Re: Karma [Re: DimensionX]
    #7473452 - 10/01/07 10:56 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

So, if morals are a personal value system, how can karma (which is intrinsically linked to morality from your own words), apply to a mass of people who's measurements for morality differ?
Am I getting through to you with that?

Quote:

mean anyone who would negelect a child obivously has some issues which are going to come back to bite them.




You never really explained how this is karma.


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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7473589 - 10/01/07 11:34 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
And yet another definition for Karma :lol:
How many are there until now? :strokebeard:

The example you gave is a pure psychological effect, which has nothing to do with karma. :shrug:




I would not argue that that is pure psychological effect, but why can this not be karma? No one has said karma has to be some otherworldly or a mystical type of thing. There are many different definitions according to various religions, but I was trying to explain what I think karma is in it's most basic worldly form.

In the end karma is a subjective term. With anything that has multiple definitions, or vague ideas expressed behind it is left up to the individual to decide what they think it truly means.

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Re: Karma [Re: krypto2000]
    #7473598 - 10/01/07 11:36 AM (16 years, 5 months ago)

There's nothing wrong with subjective terms as long as you keep them out as arguments in philosophical discussions. :shrug:


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Re: Karma [Re: Hakim0777]
    #7473695 - 10/01/07 12:00 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

I'm too damn lazy to write a summary of Karma, so I'll quote someone else who did a good job at it:

Quote:

Karma, in the original Buddhist scriptures, is a blind machine; in fact, it is functionally identical with the scientific concept of natural law. Sentimental ethical ideas about justice being built into the machine, so that those who do evil in one life are punished for it in another life, were added later by theologians reasoning from their own moralistic prejudices. Buddha simply indicated that all the cruelties and injustices of the past are still active: their effects are always being felt. Similarly, he explained, all the good of the past, all the kindness and patience and love of decent people is also still being felt.

Since most humans are still controlled by fairly robotic reflexes, the bad energy of the past far outweighs the good, and the tendency of the wheel is to keep moving in the same terrible direction, violence breeding more violence, hatred breeding more hatred, war breeding more war. The only way to "stop the wheel" is to stop it inside yourself, by giving up bad energy and concentrating on the positive. This is by no means easy, but once you understand what Gurdjieff called "the horror of our situation," you have no choice but to try, and to keep on trying.



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Re: Karma [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #7473850 - 10/01/07 12:36 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Karma *DELETED* [Re: Icelander]
    #7473868 - 10/01/07 12:41 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Post deleted by trip2night

Reason for deletion: ...


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Re: Karma [Re: trip2night]
    #7473877 - 10/01/07 12:45 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

:smile:


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:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

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Re: Karma [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #7475108 - 10/01/07 06:59 PM (16 years, 5 months ago)

Your not getting through to me yet, because i havent found a way to explain to you properly what i mean. It dosent matter if everyones view on morality is different, 1 + 1 still equals two. Say for example you get really angry at someone, that anger is harmful to you because it is a narrow way of thinking stopping you from being happy. So anger is an emotion which has what could be called negative karma attached to it, it always results in harm to the person feeling it because its in its nature to do so. I wish i could find my book by the dalai lama , he explains it so much better than me. Karma is about removing human suffering by realising that negative thoughts towards life and other people actually cause harm to your well being and have a dominoe effect. I'll look for that book today.

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