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NStoney
Stranger



Registered: 06/24/07
Posts: 105
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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Side Pins: I give up!
#7449836 - 09/24/07 10:58 PM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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So I have been battling massive side pinning ever since i switched to monotubs. I'm not getting many fruits but the ones I do have are always on the sides and huge (9-11"). I've tried everything I can think of to counter the side pinning (heavily casing the corners, not casing, wax paper over the top, etc etc.) On my latest tub the sides were pinning so well that I decided to just flip the whole damn cake over, remove it from the tub, and fruit it like a cake. Has anyone had any sucess with this technique?? Here is a pic....
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Is this gonna work? Or will these pins just abort on me because of the enviroment change? Would I be better off trying to make it pin properly from the top?
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Seventy
equanimitor



Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 912
Loc: Canada (PNW)
Last seen: 6 months, 28 days
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Re: Side Pins: I give up! [Re: NStoney]
#7449847 - 09/24/07 11:00 PM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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well I know this may sound repetitive to you but the pins do form where conditions are best. Im guessing you may still have humidity problems in your tubs? it could be any combination of pinning triggers I assume, though.
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TrippinTeddy
Lost Voyager



Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 18,461
Loc: Returning Video Tapes
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Re: Side Pins: I give up! [Re: NStoney]
#7449976 - 09/24/07 11:34 PM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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Are you using a clear tub? Have you tried cloning? Have you read Hyphae pinning strategies? are you making nice level and even substrates and casings? Are you misting before you initiate pinning?
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NStoney
Stranger



Registered: 06/24/07
Posts: 105
Last seen: 16 years, 2 months
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Yes(and no), Yes, Yes, Yes, and Yes....
Ok, i guess I should of clarified. The mycelium was cloned from B+ (cluster of 4, 9-11" high). The spawn material is pasturized 90/10% coir coffee. The tubs are spawned about 1:5, thoroughly hydrated and sealed with the lid.
I've used clear tubs (as is & w/ sides covered), opaque tubs, and aluminum foil trays. When the sides are covered, the casing just doesn't pin very well. Its not proportionate like if I cover the sides all those pins show up on the top.
I've read the pinning stratagy faq numerous times.
Substrate is level, but not so even. I think you might be on to somthing with this. I usually have the spawn/substrate ratio decreasing from the top of the casing towards the bottom. The idea behind this is to speed the colonization of the top layer because it is the most prone to infection, and given enough time the mycelium will evenly colonize the whole substrate (This is where I appear to be wrong).
Moisture shouldn't really be an issue because the casing is in a tub with the lid sealed and I rarely open it (only for pre-pin mistings).....
Light doesn't seem to be playing a major factor either. When I don't restrict light on the sides, pins will definatly form there. but when I do restrict light on the sides the pins still form on the sides, just more towards the top where they have an easy path to escape into the light.
This substrate consistency thing has got me thinking. I've noticed that all of my cakes are consistently less colonized towards the bottom. What I'm thinking here is that the bottom is to under colonized, the top is too dense, and somewhere around the sides the substrate has the best consistency which is why pins are forming there.
The only other major difference between the sides and the top is that the sides are pressed up against the walls of the tub. This seems to be where the pins are the happiest. I'm guessing this is an indicator that even though the casing is relativly sealed in the tub its still getting more moisture/humidity along the sides due to the close proximity to the walls. This is probably a good hypothesis to explore but I'm not exactly sure how to go about mimicking the conditions where the sides are pressed up against the tub walls but on the top of the casing.
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impeachme2
AmateurMycologist



Registered: 05/10/07
Posts: 646
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Re: Side Pins: I give up! [Re: NStoney]
#7454337 - 09/26/07 01:59 AM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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From what I can see, you have some nasty overlay on your casing. This is probably why it doesn't pin well on top.
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headieherbs
originalgangster (oflove)



Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 523
Loc: around the bend
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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Re: Side Pins: I give up! [Re: impeachme2]
#7454779 - 09/26/07 07:48 AM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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maybe try putting a sheet of wax paper over on top of your substrate to trap more moisture near the surface. Like others were saying, the problem is is that the microclimate isn't proper anywhere but the sides, where it's pinning. I'm sure it's a little warmer and more humid down in the crack between the tub/tray or whatever and the substrate, so they're coming from there.
you need to create these conditions on the top of the substrate, where you want the pins to form. INcrease rH while keeping FAE as high as possible and keeping light and FAE out of the areas you don't want to pin. I would think the easiest way would be with the sheet of wax paper. Also, if you haven't yet, try lining your tubs with aluminum foil, the substrate usually latches on and pulls the foil in as it shrinks, effectively blocking out light.
This happened to me the last time I did monos, and I just made up 6 more almost two days ago, I will be using the wax paper as soon as I add light and FAE so hopefully what I'm thinking is right.
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headieherbs
originalgangster (oflove)



Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 523
Loc: around the bend
Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
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Re: Side Pins: I give up! [Re: headieherbs]
#7454780 - 09/26/07 07:49 AM (16 years, 4 months ago) |
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oh yeah, it'd be helpful to see some pics of the tub setups you were using....
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