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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally.
    #7431577 - 09/20/07 12:01 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)



Is this what just happened in that video?

Quote:

The writ of habeas corpus, guarantees a prisoners right to know the charges against them in a court of law without being held in indefinite confinement just because someone wants them detained. Without it Presidents and Kings have historically been able to lock people up, essentially throwing away the key, and disappearing them by allowing them to rot in jail. The writ of habeas corpus stems from the Magna Carta of 1215 and was so important for protecting peoples rights that when our forefathers wrote our Constitution in the United States, it became a foundation point for our own Bill of Rights. Having the writ of habeas corpus suspended for terror suspects, can also endanger American citizens as the Patriot Act defines 'domestic terrorists' as anyone that challenges the policies of government administration especially anti-war demonstrators.

Should the writ of habeas corpus be suspended indefinitely, it will only be a matter of time before anti-war, anti-police state, peace loving Americans like myself, yourself are locked up as a harassment measure and possibly indefinitely detained with charges considered 'state secrets.' We may then be brought before bogus 'military tribunals' where we can then be sentenced to death without every knowing or the government releasing what crime we may have committed and been sentenced to death for. If you think this is far from the truth, look into the case of Jose Padilla, an American citizen who was held without charge for 3 years on information considered 'state secret' until a federal judge expressed doubts about the strength of the government's terror conspiracy case against he and others. The judge ordered prosecutors to provide more evidence of alleged violent activities overseas because the judge could find no real concrete evidence for his prosecution or further imprisonment.




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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7431765 - 09/20/07 01:06 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

none of the cops took the bait...he tried so hard, too.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: afoaf]
    #7431871 - 09/20/07 01:36 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

afoaf said:
none of the cops took the bait...he tried so hard, too.




He did try hard. It was uncomfortable to watch how many times he asked, how many times, he and others asked, " What is the charge, why weren't they read their rights?", and the cops all keeping silent.

It seemed surreal and disturbing. Like he said, those guys took an oath to serve and protect us under the Constitution. Strange to see people being arrested without charge or rights, just for reading it.

Now that you watched it, do you think what I quoted in the first post was the new Patriot Act clause being enforced?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7431909 - 09/20/07 01:44 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Make a nice drinking game... take a shot every time he says "constitution".


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432108 - 09/20/07 02:31 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

so wait...

they weren't asked to stop anything?
they weren't told what they did wrong?
they weren't informed of their charges?

and they are going to jail?

i can't wait for the comments defending cops in this thread.


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432148 - 09/20/07 02:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Were they disrupting the speakers at the rally they attended and affording them an opportunity to be heard and exercise their own first amendment rights?

It is hard to say from just viewing the aftermath of the incidents rather than the incidents themselves. We are only seeing one side of the situation in the video.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432287 - 09/20/07 03:16 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes. We don't know that Zorb.

We DO know, that the police would not tell those they were arresting or those asking, what they were being arrested for. Charges of disturbing the peace, were never mentioned, no charges at all.

Now go back and refer to the quote on the Patriot Act I posted. It says, the police can remain SILENT about a charge when making an arrest, if the person is engaging in an act, that undermines the stabilization efforts in Iraq.

This seems to me, to be what just happened there. I was looking for discussion on that.

If so, I'm floored. When people first brought up this new addition in the Patriot Act with concerns of being arrested for speaking out against the Iraq war, others said, " You guys are paranoid, they are referring to Jihading terrorists, not U.S. citizens just speaking out in opposition of the war.

What's going on here in our Free nation anyway?


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432393 - 09/20/07 03:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I agree that the individuals arrested should have been told what they were being arrested for. If they were not I would find that disturbing.

But again, we did not get to see the part where they were initially arrested so we are forced to take one side's word for it. I would not be surprised if they were telling the truth but until I see more information I am withholding judgment. :shrug:


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432438 - 09/20/07 03:48 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
I agree that the individuals arrested should have been told what they were being arrested for. If they were not I would find that disturbing.

But again, we did not get to see the part where they were initially arrested so we are forced to take one side's word for it. I would not be surprised if they were telling the truth but until I see more information I am withholding judgment. :shrug:




The video shows that the first women being put in the car kept asking, " What am I being arrested for?" If they had told her at the scene, she wouldn't have been asking on her way to the car. In between she would say, "I was just reading the Consitution."

No one was able to answer that question for the guy with the camera, not those being arrested nor the dozen cops there.

It's very bothersom, if you can actually be be arrested without charge in this country , like it says in the new addition to the Patriot Act, for saying anything that undermines the stabalisation efforts in Iraq, that would include, reading the Consitution outside of a pro Iraq War rally.


I wish a follow up report would come out about this. I havn't seen one yet.


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432493 - 09/20/07 04:00 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

No one was able to answer that question for the guy with the camera, not those being arrested nor the dozen cops there.




The cops are under no obligation that I am aware of to inform a third party of justification for the arrests at the scene. She, of course, must be informed.

Again, we don't see what happened when she was initially arrested at the rally and don't know what the cops told her, if anything, at that time. The video starts only after she has reached the curb to be loaded into the paddy wagon. I don't see any reason to doubt her claims but I see no reason to believe her either. :shrug:

I would be interested in seeing other sources of information about the arrests before I reach any conclusions.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432501 - 09/20/07 04:02 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes, I'm hoping for more to come out about it.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432628 - 09/20/07 04:31 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Strangely, all I see is a big white square with no link to a video. At any rate, I hate videos, is there a print report somewhere?


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7432655 - 09/20/07 04:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

What if they were arrested by another cop and just handed off to someone who didn't know why they were arrested? Maybe he figured that once at the station they'd sort it out.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7432670 - 09/20/07 04:41 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Strangely, all I see is a big white square with no link to a video. At any rate, I hate videos, is there a print report somewhere?




It seems that when you post youtube video links here, they now automatically imbed.

I can't find the thread at another forum, that I got it from last night now. I was going to ask in the thread if there was any follow up or a newspaper report on it.

Looks like 3 were arrested from the video and about 12 cops were there. You'd think it would've made some newspaper. I ran some google searches looking for a story and couldn't turn anything up so far.

If I do, I'll add it.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432764 - 09/20/07 04:57 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Based upon what they were wearing those arrested appear to be members of Code Pink, a protest group whose members recently disrupted Gen. Petraus' congressional testimony:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_Pink


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432925 - 09/20/07 05:27 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

That's their name, thanks. You'd think it would've made their web-site at least. It's not even there.

I didn't know about them, and how many times they have been arrested for speaking. They get removed from the halls of Congress just for wearing shirts with peace signs on them. One woman has been banned from the whole city of DC for a year for " speaking". One was pulled from a Hillary rally just for wearing an " End the War Now" T-shirt.

I thought the US of A, was suppose to be setting an example of what a free, diplomatic, democracy looks like to the rest of the world. We are doing a lousy job of walking the talk. I can't imagine how this stuff looks in the foreign media.

Weather any of you are for or against THIS war, it's not what this is about.

I would expect to see people get jumped, arrested, tazed, and banned from cities for speaking verbally or via a message on a shirt, in say, CHINA. Not here in America.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7433234 - 09/20/07 06:25 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Funny.. there was an anti war protest in DC this past weekend and PRO WAR people were allowed to voice their opinions then.

I guess if there's a PRO WAR demonstration, anti war people aren't allowed to say anything.

Makes sense... sure...


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: BrAiN]
    #7434813 - 09/21/07 01:31 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

> i can't wait for the comments defending cops in this thread.

I don't see how either side could be defended based upon the video posted. There is nothing to show why the demonstrators were arrested. As far as defending the police, what have then done wrong (that is shown in the video)? Did they beat anybody? Did they tase anybody? Did they gas anybody? They refused to answer questions, which was a refusal to escalate an emotional situation. Most police are entitled to a small grace period between the time they make an arrest and the time charges have to be filed. Where I grew up, it was 48 hours.

So, your turn, what did the police do wrong, in the video posted. (What led to the arrests is not shown, so claiming the arrests are wrong is not a debatable topic.)


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Seuss]
    #7434979 - 09/21/07 02:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Although I am sympathetic to the beliefs of anti-war groups like Code Pink, I must say I dislike their methods. I am a firm believer in civil discourse. I believe it is severely lacking in America today.

For example, I do not believe that dressing up like clowns and disrupting the congressional hearing of General David Petraeus is conducive to a dialogue between pro-war and antiwar factions. It is just not effective- it changes no minds, it merely antagonizes the opposing side and makes them dig in deeper.

It only deepens the divide.

Certain congressman had made up their minds before his testimony and before the man even spoke they were prejudging him. That is unfair.

Hear a man out.

Shouting down or drowning out an opponent's message represents weakness, not strength. If you truly believe in your message such tactics are not needed.

I would like to hear more about how this anti-war protest was carried out. Did the protestors use methods which disrupted other citizen's rights to free speech?

So far we only have the view of one side.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7435081 - 09/21/07 03:07 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I have a feeling what happened (and what we didn't see on camera) is that there was a designated 'protest' area in the park and these people were not in it. The cops asked them to move, they refused, then the cops arrested them.

Assuming this scenario is correct, is it right to segregate protesters to one area of the park? I dunno, maybe.

Are people reading The Constitution protesters? I dunno, but I tend to think not.

Without knowing more details, it doesn't seem like these people did anything worthy of arrest. It would have been nice if the cops had informed the people they were arresting about the charges before taking them away.


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4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineBasilides
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7435108 - 09/21/07 03:28 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

It is highly doubtful they were arrested for simply "reading the Constitution".. that's just an appeal to emotion. Organized public protests are almost always regulated and planned on some degree, and it is usually small, disorganized counter-protests that end up violating some dot and title of the civil code, which is likely what happened in this case. If someone was honestly arrested for simply reading the U.S. constitution, it would likely be a major national headline. This.. this is just an obscure YouTube video.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Basilides]
    #7435415 - 09/21/07 07:33 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Basilides said:
It is highly doubtful they were arrested for simply "reading the Constitution".. that's just an appeal to emotion. Organized public protests are almost always regulated and planned on some degree, and it is usually small, disorganized counter-protests that end up violating some dot and title of the civil code, which is likely what happened in this case. If someone was honestly arrested for simply reading the U.S. constitution, it would likely be a major national headline. This.. this is just an obscure YouTube video.




do you always discredit brand new stories based on hypotheticals and assumptions?


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Diploid]
    #7436204 - 09/21/07 01:34 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

There are many unanswered questions about this situation. But Code Pink's usual tactic as of late is shouting down those they disagree with.

They did it recently at the televised congressional hearing of General David Petraeus. Several Code Pink members wearing silly pink costumes were seated in the public section of the meeting room. At a certain point they stood up and displayed signs while shouting. They were escorted out and most likely arrested.

So I would not be surprised if they had set up shop without permits next to the pro-war rally and attempted to drown out the speakers there, ironically depriving them of their constitutional right to free speech, and were arrested. Makes sense to me.

I don't believe that is the right way to make your point. If you want to get your message out, hold your own rally elsewhere rather than disrupting the free speech of another group of citizens with opposing view points.

Such tactics do not persuade people, they merely make you look like an ass.


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Edited by zorbman (09/21/07 07:48 PM)


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7436596 - 09/21/07 03:27 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

They whole thing they did at the hearing was retarded. It was a friggin' PROGRESS report. They did more harm to themselves than good with that one.

How the hell did they even get in there in the first place?


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Offlineandrewss
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7436665 - 09/21/07 03:42 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Would like to see more of the context... would be better to form more of an opinion, however regardless thats some pretty ridiculous stuff :frown:


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Basilides]
    #7436778 - 09/21/07 04:07 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The openning question I asked was if this arrest, appeared to be one under this new law in the Patriot Act.


Quote:

The writ of habeas corpus, guarantees a prisoners right to know the charges against them in a court of law without being held in indefinite confinement just because someone wants them detained. Without it Presidents and Kings have historically been able to lock people up, essentially throwing away the key, and disappearing them by allowing them to rot in jail. The writ of habeas corpus stems from the Magna Carta of 1215 and was so important for protecting peoples rights that when our forefathers wrote our Constitution in the United States, it became a foundation point for our own Bill of Rights. Having the writ of habeas corpus suspended for terror suspects, can also endanger American citizens as the Patriot Act defines 'domestic terrorists' as anyone that challenges the policies of government administration especially anti-war demonstrators.

Should the writ of habeas corpus be suspended indefinitely, it will only be a matter of time before anti-war, anti-police state, peace loving Americans like myself, yourself are locked up as a harassment measure and possibly indefinitely detained with charges considered 'state secrets.' We may then be brought before bogus 'military tribunals' where we can then be sentenced to death without every knowing or the government releasing what crime we may have committed and been sentenced to death for. If you think this is far from the truth, look into the case of Jose Padilla, an American citizen who was held without charge for 3 years on information considered 'state secret' until a federal judge expressed doubts about the strength of the government's terror conspiracy case against he and others. The judge ordered prosecutors to provide more evidence of alleged violent activities overseas because the judge could find no real concrete evidence for his prosecution or further imprisonment.





I'm curious to know if the police are now enforcing that part of the Patriot Act, in some instances. I cannot find ANY news reports of an arrest being made, with charges, for this incident. Refer to the bolded sections.

I'd feel a sense of relief if anyone can dig up a " Disturbing the peace" or "protesting without a permit charge" placed against them for this incident. If they were chraged with breaking either law, then so be it. My question is resolved then.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7436788 - 09/21/07 04:11 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Someone should stand on a box in a park and start angrily reading the U.S. Constitution - translated in Arabic - while dressed as a sheik - a la TOOL's Die Eier Von Satan :grin:


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: BrAiN]
    #7437699 - 09/21/07 07:58 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

BrAiN said:
They whole thing they did at the hearing was retarded. It was a friggin' PROGRESS report. They did more harm to themselves than good with that one.

How the hell did they even get in there in the first place?




Unless the hearing is held in closed session (such as in the case of testimony involving covert intelligence) members of the public are reserved a certain number of seats in the hearing room. Basically, as long as they make it through the metal detectors they are allowed in.

The way it works is every few minutes a group is ushered quietly to their seats and after a specified time limit are rotated out to allow another group in. This way the maximum number of people are allowed to view the proceedings.

Before being ushered into the hearing room they are cautioned to remain quiet and make no display of either approval or non-approval of the proceedings.

This is done to prevent a circus-like atmosphere or environment where people feel they cannot speak openly and honestly.

Btw, I trained as a congressional aide which is how I know this.


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OfflineBasilides
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: kotik]
    #7438671 - 09/22/07 12:35 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
Quote:

Basilides said:
It is highly doubtful they were arrested for simply "reading the Constitution".. that's just an appeal to emotion. Organized public protests are almost always regulated and planned on some degree, and it is usually small, disorganized counter-protests that end up violating some dot and title of the civil code, which is likely what happened in this case. If someone was honestly arrested for simply reading the U.S. constitution, it would likely be a major national headline. This.. this is just an obscure YouTube video.




do you always discredit brand new stories based on hypotheticals and assumptions?




No, I'm just following a standard use of logic here. It's not illegal to "read the constitution" in the United States. That's ridiculous. What is more likely is that a regulated protocol was violated by this protest.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7438696 - 09/22/07 12:44 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

I cannot find ANY news reports of an arrest being made, with charges, for this incident




Do you have any information at all regarding the specifics of the protest itself? Where did it take place, even?

And do charges of "disorderly conduct" normally make the press rounds (that is, if you're not a U.S. Senator)?


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Basilides]
    #7439738 - 09/22/07 10:34 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

What I have to go on form the video...

They were U.S. Capital Police, so it was at apark in D.C.

It was at a pro war rally hosted by Senators McCain, Lieberman and Graham.

They were told they could stand there with their signs, but if they spoke, they would be arrested. A woman started reading the first amendment in responce, and she was the first to be arrested.

2 men also were, one being an Iraq War Vet.

Code Pink people were there, so I looked at their web-site for this one and though they post their activities and arrests, this one isn't there.

I did many searches on that McCain rally in DC and found nothing.

In the video, you can see a news cameraman.

Remember, the new addition to the Patriot Act say, you can be arrested without charge, as a domestic terrorists, for undermining the stabilization efforts in Iraq.

It happened next to a pro Iraq war rally hosted by 3 Senators.

I wish I could get confirmation on, if these particular arrests, were based on the enforcement against domestic terrorists as defined in the Patriot Act.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7439793 - 09/22/07 11:03 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

umm... why a pro-war rally anyways?

if they are so pro-war, why aren't they in the military, or over there right now as private contractors?


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: kotik]
    #7439804 - 09/22/07 11:07 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Because they need to feed the economic engine that buys the equipment that allows our intrepid soldiers the means to defeat the enemy. As opposed to the anti war protesters (Why aren't they over there as human shields?) who would just as soon fellate the enemy and beg their forgiveness.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: kotik]
    #7439889 - 09/22/07 11:44 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
umm... why a pro-war rally anyways?

if they are so pro-war, why aren't they in the military, or over there right now as private contractors?




Not sure about the other two Senators motives, but McCain is running for Pres, working to drum up support for the war on Iraq, to drum up support for his nomination. Maybe if he keeps singing his remake of Barabaran,  "Bomb Bomb Bomb Iran" enough, the American Idol voter will turn on to him. :shrug:

Whatever, I just want to know if they started arresting Iraq war protesters, under the new patriot act law that makes them domestic terrorists.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7439932 - 09/22/07 12:07 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Because they need to feed the economic engine that buys the equipment that allows our intrepid soldiers the means to defeat the enemy. As opposed to the anti war protesters (Why aren't they over there as human shields?) who would just as soon fellate the enemy and beg their forgiveness.




One of the men arrested at this rally, was serving in Iraq, making himself a human target.

Lets not forget that the bulk of campaign donations from the United States Military personnel are going to candidates who want to end this war.

Are they all domestic terrorists?


Seeing this new law in writing is one thing. If that video is seeing it being enforced in action, then, times have changed in America.

zap, what goes through your mind, when you hear that the Islamic terrorist LOVE this war because they are watching it...

erode away American freedoms and liberties,

stall the economy because people are afraid to spend.

kill and injury our military

run us into obscene national debt

and divide us on the issue?

They are winning their goals and will for as long as we keep sending troops, instead of diplomats there.

Edit- typo


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Edited by gettinjiggywithit (09/22/07 12:18 PM)


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7440267 - 09/22/07 01:52 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

lol, how annoying. freedom fighters for freedom!!


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7440287 - 09/22/07 01:58 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Because they need to feed the economic engine that buys the equipment that allows our intrepid soldiers the means to defeat the enemy. As opposed to the anti war protesters (Why aren't they over there as human shields?) who would just as soon fellate the enemy and beg their forgiveness.




One of the men arrested at this rally, was serving in Iraq, making himself a human target.




Which rally, the prowar or antiwar one? Which is irrelevant anyway. My response was to the idiotic "if you support the war why aren't you there fighting" meme. Capisce?
Quote:



Lets not forget that the bulk of campaign donations from the United States Military personnel are going to candidates who want to end this war.




Really? And yet they overwhelmingly support staying until the job is done.
Quote:



Are they all domestic terrorists?




What are you talking about? Who?
Quote:




Seeing this new law in writing is one thing. If that video is seeing it being enforced in action, then, times have changed in America.




What new law? I haven't seen the video, nor will I, and you seem incapable of finding a real report, so I can only assume that there is nothing here. You're making a big deal out of the cops not answering their questions. Tough, they don't have to. At any rate, you continue to blather on with zero information, just your ingrained hatred of police, and some fabricated notion of what they were being arrested for. This is Code Pink, home of St Cindy of the Ditch Sheehan, who has chosen to become a professional arrestee. Your dudgeon is farcical.
Quote:



zap, what goes through your mind, when you hear that the Islamic terrorist LOVE this war because they are watching it...

erode away American freedoms and liberties,

stall the economy because people are afraid to spend.

kill and injury our military

run us into obscene national debt

and divide us on the issue?

They are winning their goals and will for as long as we keep sending troops, instead of diplomats there.

Edit- typo




Are you a willing dupe or an accidental dupe? Hey gettinjiggy what do you think when the terrorists start spouting the left talking points like parrots? They know their best friends are what used to be called "Useful Idiots". What do I think when they start saying that stuff? That they can read and have an at least rudimentary understanding of the value of PR and antiwar moles. Osama rambling about US tax rates was just precious. You are being used.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7440613 - 09/22/07 04:00 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Which rally, the prowar or antiwar one?  Which is irrelevant anyway.  My response was to the idiotic "if you support the war why aren't you there fighting" meme.  Capisce?




I already understood that. Kotik made that argument. Capice? :wink:


Quote:

Really?  And yet they overwhelmingly support staying until the job is done.




Source?

Quote:

Quote:

Are they all domestic terrorists?




What are you talking about?  Who?




U.S. Military who financially support candidates wanting to stop this war, and those personnel and vets who actively are protesting it.



Quote:

What new law? 




It's the quoted section in my first post.

Quote:

I haven't seen the video, nor will I, and you seem incapable of finding a real report, so I can only assume that there is nothing here




I can't find one if it doesn't exist, and I'd like to since I want this cleared up for myself. The video shows about 5 people being arrested. Under the new law, you can be arrested without charge, and the charge and arrest, can become secrets of the state. The fact that I, nor anyone else, can find a report, makes it all the more possible, that these arrests were made under the Patriot Acts domestic terrorism laws.


Quote:

You're making a big deal out of the cops not answering their questions.  Tough, they don't have to


.

Well yes. I said I was wondering what anyone knew or thought about this being a Patriot Act arrest. Under it's law, no charge has to be made. Seuss, said, they can remain silent on that for up to 48 hours in some states. This incident is more then 48 hrs old and still nothing is turning up- not even at code pinks site, and they post everything. Yet these arrests are not there. It's strange.


Quote:

At any rate, you continue to blather on with zero information, just your ingrained hatred of police




Woahhhhhhhhhh. I never said I hated the police. I am very concerned about what Bush has been adding to the Patriot Act.


Quote:

and some fabricated notion of what they were being arrested for




Can't fabricate that because, I don't know what they were being arrested for other then what they said they were doing at the time they were arrested. Nothing else to go on. I am asking through this thread if anyone knows what the hell happened there?

Quote:

This is Code Pink, home of St Cindy of the Ditch Sheehan, who has chosen to become a professional arrestee.  Your dudgeon is farcical.




Not sure what that has to do with anything. Sheehan doesn't get a reaction out of me one way or another.


Quote:

Are you a willing dupe or an accidental dupe?




Since the Americans are playing into terrorist hands, I'd say, anyone going along with this " ooh I'm scared game" is being played hard. Terrorists scare people to get them to do what they want. Look at the dog show hoops this nation has jumped in response to 9/11. Who is holding the power leashes here?

Giuliani and Bush, were not capable of preventing the attacks on the WTC or Pentagon. Why do have any confidence in them for the future?

I give fear of Islamic radical terrorists, no thought. Drunk drivers on the road, and all the crap they poison our water, air and food with, is more of a threat I feel I have to contend with. Any American can put a bullet in my head. I'm more concerned with the INSTABILITY of this nation, way before I am that of Iraq or terrorists from abroad threats.




 
Quote:

Hey gettinjiggy  what do you think when the terrorists start spouting the left talking points like parrots?




Example?

Quote:

They know their best friends are what used to be called "Useful Idiots".




Careful going there.  Remember that the Bush's and Bin Ladens are tight friends. :lol:


Quote:

What do I think when they start saying that stuff?  That they can read and have an at least rudimentary understanding of the value of PR and antiwar moles.  Osama rambling about US tax rates was just precious.




I'm not convinced that he said those things if you are referring to his latest supposed video release. I don't trust Al Queda or our Government to not being pulling hoaxes.

There is a lot of reason for the CFR group- which is made up of Dem's and reps alike,  to want see this economy crash. It's the perfect intro into why we will need the PSP aka NAU to save the day for us. 

Quote:

you are being used.




I obviously see it the other way zappa. The point of terrorism, is to get people to do what they want through the use of fear. By showing we fear them, we have giving up freedoms and civil rights, spent an unrepresented FORTUNE, in the name of defence against these people with "rudimentary reading skills" and needlessly sacrificed the lives of 5,000 soldiers and got another 50,000 injured.

Knee jerk reactions to fear can be costly and deadly in themselves.

It's simple for me-

I have always been for non interventionist foreign policy which is mostly why I always voted Green, and am switching to Republican just to vote for Paul. 

The creators of the Constitution warned against Empire building. They were great and highly educated students of history, and said, it would lead to our ruin like it did with the Roman Empire. They were being rational and logical, as you can only stretch your resources so far, until you snap and go bust.

Screw securing Middle east oil. We shouldve been on alternative energy sources, decades ago, and would be now if it weren't for the subsidies.

It's costing us far to much, to keep bases in the middle east to secure oil and protect Israel. It makes no sense to me other then to help those profiting from it.

edit- had to fix a quote bar


Edited by gettinjiggywithit (09/22/07 04:11 PM)


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7440761 - 09/22/07 04:56 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I made out the name of one of the people arrested from the video tape. It was Leah Bolger, 20 year Navy Vet.

I launched another web search looking for what she was charged with in this incident.

I found her blogs and news reports on all of her other protest arrests. Nothing on this one. I did find her phone number and e-mail address though. I called her and got the machine (cute little kid on the machine) I also just sent her an e-mail asking what the charge was for this one and wanting to know if she was out now. I'll let you all know if I get a response.

Doing the search, I found elsewhere that groups actually have a "Days of Remembrance for the Disappeared"- those U.S. citizens arrested for protesting who were never seen or heard from again.

Looks like my question was answered anyway.:crazy:


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7441004 - 09/22/07 06:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

the Patriot Act defines 'domestic terrorists' as anyone that challenges the policies of government administration especially anti-war demonstrators.

that would be a lie.


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Offlinekidaihuan
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: wilshire]
    #7442028 - 09/23/07 12:17 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The Patriot act is very... open to interpretation. So they could infact put almost anyone in the definition of terrorist, depending on how the government chooses to interpret the act.


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OfflineSneezingPenis
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: kidaihuan]
    #7442604 - 09/23/07 04:04 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Why do I never hear stories like this, but the other way around?
Meaning, why arent any republicans arrested in this manner for such bullshit?

It would be easy to answer if I only listened/watched liberal news sources, but I listen to a myriad of neo-con talkshows and cannot recall ever hearing one story about "their" protesters being arrested for speaking out.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: kidaihuan]
    #7443708 - 09/23/07 12:47 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

show me the part where it says that criticizing the administration or its policies means that one is a "domestic terrorist".


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: wilshire]
    #7443871 - 09/23/07 01:52 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Makes me want to burn my tires out in the middle of the road to piss the cops off.  Wonder what they'd do, they're all out of their cars busy arresting people, then someone does something insanely illegal like peeling out right in front of them, I'd have laughed.  It seems words don't piss them off, so do something illegal.  I want to shoot a cop in the face with a paintball gun. :laugh:


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Maverick]
    #7444169 - 09/23/07 03:42 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)



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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7444207 - 09/23/07 03:57 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Why do people like you parasitize drug forums with this bullshit that has nothing to do with drugs? Why are drug, hippy, alternative lifestyle forums all over the internet always filled with constant rants about the Iraq war?


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Luddite]
    #7446629 - 09/24/07 07:02 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

> Why do people like you parasitize drug forums with this bullshit that has nothing to do with drugs?

Take a long look in the mirror... might do you some good.

When you become an admin, then you can decide what people can or cannot discuss on your forum. If you don't like the open discussion that this site provides, then go somewhere else.

> Why are drug, hippy, alternative lifestyle forums all over the internet always filled with constant rants about the Iraq war?

I would assume because the people that frequent the types of sites listed are unhappy about the Iraq war.


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