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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally.
    #7431577 - 09/20/07 12:01 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)



Is this what just happened in that video?

Quote:

The writ of habeas corpus, guarantees a prisoners right to know the charges against them in a court of law without being held in indefinite confinement just because someone wants them detained. Without it Presidents and Kings have historically been able to lock people up, essentially throwing away the key, and disappearing them by allowing them to rot in jail. The writ of habeas corpus stems from the Magna Carta of 1215 and was so important for protecting peoples rights that when our forefathers wrote our Constitution in the United States, it became a foundation point for our own Bill of Rights. Having the writ of habeas corpus suspended for terror suspects, can also endanger American citizens as the Patriot Act defines 'domestic terrorists' as anyone that challenges the policies of government administration especially anti-war demonstrators.

Should the writ of habeas corpus be suspended indefinitely, it will only be a matter of time before anti-war, anti-police state, peace loving Americans like myself, yourself are locked up as a harassment measure and possibly indefinitely detained with charges considered 'state secrets.' We may then be brought before bogus 'military tribunals' where we can then be sentenced to death without every knowing or the government releasing what crime we may have committed and been sentenced to death for. If you think this is far from the truth, look into the case of Jose Padilla, an American citizen who was held without charge for 3 years on information considered 'state secret' until a federal judge expressed doubts about the strength of the government's terror conspiracy case against he and others. The judge ordered prosecutors to provide more evidence of alleged violent activities overseas because the judge could find no real concrete evidence for his prosecution or further imprisonment.




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Invisibleafoaf
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7431765 - 09/20/07 01:06 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

none of the cops took the bait...he tried so hard, too.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: afoaf]
    #7431871 - 09/20/07 01:36 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

afoaf said:
none of the cops took the bait...he tried so hard, too.




He did try hard. It was uncomfortable to watch how many times he asked, how many times, he and others asked, " What is the charge, why weren't they read their rights?", and the cops all keeping silent.

It seemed surreal and disturbing. Like he said, those guys took an oath to serve and protect us under the Constitution. Strange to see people being arrested without charge or rights, just for reading it.

Now that you watched it, do you think what I quoted in the first post was the new Patriot Act clause being enforced?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7431909 - 09/20/07 01:44 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Make a nice drinking game... take a shot every time he says "constitution".


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Offlinekotik
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432108 - 09/20/07 02:31 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

so wait...

they weren't asked to stop anything?
they weren't told what they did wrong?
they weren't informed of their charges?

and they are going to jail?

i can't wait for the comments defending cops in this thread.


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution outloud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432148 - 09/20/07 02:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Were they disrupting the speakers at the rally they attended and affording them an opportunity to be heard and exercise their own first amendment rights?

It is hard to say from just viewing the aftermath of the incidents rather than the incidents themselves. We are only seeing one side of the situation in the video.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432287 - 09/20/07 03:16 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes. We don't know that Zorb.

We DO know, that the police would not tell those they were arresting or those asking, what they were being arrested for. Charges of disturbing the peace, were never mentioned, no charges at all.

Now go back and refer to the quote on the Patriot Act I posted. It says, the police can remain SILENT about a charge when making an arrest, if the person is engaging in an act, that undermines the stabilization efforts in Iraq.

This seems to me, to be what just happened there. I was looking for discussion on that.

If so, I'm floored. When people first brought up this new addition in the Patriot Act with concerns of being arrested for speaking out against the Iraq war, others said, " You guys are paranoid, they are referring to Jihading terrorists, not U.S. citizens just speaking out in opposition of the war.

What's going on here in our Free nation anyway?


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432393 - 09/20/07 03:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I agree that the individuals arrested should have been told what they were being arrested for. If they were not I would find that disturbing.

But again, we did not get to see the part where they were initially arrested so we are forced to take one side's word for it. I would not be surprised if they were telling the truth but until I see more information I am withholding judgment. :shrug:


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432438 - 09/20/07 03:48 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zorbman said:
I agree that the individuals arrested should have been told what they were being arrested for. If they were not I would find that disturbing.

But again, we did not get to see the part where they were initially arrested so we are forced to take one side's word for it. I would not be surprised if they were telling the truth but until I see more information I am withholding judgment. :shrug:




The video shows that the first women being put in the car kept asking, " What am I being arrested for?" If they had told her at the scene, she wouldn't have been asking on her way to the car. In between she would say, "I was just reading the Consitution."

No one was able to answer that question for the guy with the camera, not those being arrested nor the dozen cops there.

It's very bothersom, if you can actually be be arrested without charge in this country , like it says in the new addition to the Patriot Act, for saying anything that undermines the stabalisation efforts in Iraq, that would include, reading the Consitution outside of a pro Iraq War rally.


I wish a follow up report would come out about this. I havn't seen one yet.


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Invisiblezorbman
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432493 - 09/20/07 04:00 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

No one was able to answer that question for the guy with the camera, not those being arrested nor the dozen cops there.




The cops are under no obligation that I am aware of to inform a third party of justification for the arrests at the scene. She, of course, must be informed.

Again, we don't see what happened when she was initially arrested at the rally and don't know what the cops told her, if anything, at that time. The video starts only after she has reached the curb to be loaded into the paddy wagon. I don't see any reason to doubt her claims but I see no reason to believe her either. :shrug:

I would be interested in seeing other sources of information about the arrests before I reach any conclusions.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432501 - 09/20/07 04:02 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes, I'm hoping for more to come out about it.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432628 - 09/20/07 04:31 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Strangely, all I see is a big white square with no link to a video. At any rate, I hate videos, is there a print report somewhere?


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7432655 - 09/20/07 04:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

What if they were arrested by another cop and just handed off to someone who didn't know why they were arrested? Maybe he figured that once at the station they'd sort it out.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #7432670 - 09/20/07 04:41 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Strangely, all I see is a big white square with no link to a video. At any rate, I hate videos, is there a print report somewhere?




It seems that when you post youtube video links here, they now automatically imbed.

I can't find the thread at another forum, that I got it from last night now. I was going to ask in the thread if there was any follow up or a newspaper report on it.

Looks like 3 were arrested from the video and about 12 cops were there. You'd think it would've made some newspaper. I ran some google searches looking for a story and couldn't turn anything up so far.

If I do, I'll add it.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7432764 - 09/20/07 04:57 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Based upon what they were wearing those arrested appear to be members of Code Pink, a protest group whose members recently disrupted Gen. Petraus' congressional testimony:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_Pink


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7432925 - 09/20/07 05:27 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

That's their name, thanks. You'd think it would've made their web-site at least. It's not even there.

I didn't know about them, and how many times they have been arrested for speaking. They get removed from the halls of Congress just for wearing shirts with peace signs on them. One woman has been banned from the whole city of DC for a year for " speaking". One was pulled from a Hillary rally just for wearing an " End the War Now" T-shirt.

I thought the US of A, was suppose to be setting an example of what a free, diplomatic, democracy looks like to the rest of the world. We are doing a lousy job of walking the talk. I can't imagine how this stuff looks in the foreign media.

Weather any of you are for or against THIS war, it's not what this is about.

I would expect to see people get jumped, arrested, tazed, and banned from cities for speaking verbally or via a message on a shirt, in say, CHINA. Not here in America.


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7433234 - 09/20/07 06:25 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Funny.. there was an anti war protest in DC this past weekend and PRO WAR people were allowed to voice their opinions then.

I guess if there's a PRO WAR demonstration, anti war people aren't allowed to say anything.

Makes sense... sure...


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: BrAiN]
    #7434813 - 09/21/07 01:31 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

> i can't wait for the comments defending cops in this thread.

I don't see how either side could be defended based upon the video posted. There is nothing to show why the demonstrators were arrested. As far as defending the police, what have then done wrong (that is shown in the video)? Did they beat anybody? Did they tase anybody? Did they gas anybody? They refused to answer questions, which was a refusal to escalate an emotional situation. Most police are entitled to a small grace period between the time they make an arrest and the time charges have to be filed. Where I grew up, it was 48 hours.

So, your turn, what did the police do wrong, in the video posted. (What led to the arrests is not shown, so claiming the arrests are wrong is not a debatable topic.)


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: Seuss]
    #7434979 - 09/21/07 02:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Although I am sympathetic to the beliefs of anti-war groups like Code Pink, I must say I dislike their methods. I am a firm believer in civil discourse. I believe it is severely lacking in America today.

For example, I do not believe that dressing up like clowns and disrupting the congressional hearing of General David Petraeus is conducive to a dialogue between pro-war and antiwar factions. It is just not effective- it changes no minds, it merely antagonizes the opposing side and makes them dig in deeper.

It only deepens the divide.

Certain congressman had made up their minds before his testimony and before the man even spoke they were prejudging him. That is unfair.

Hear a man out.

Shouting down or drowning out an opponent's message represents weakness, not strength. If you truly believe in your message such tactics are not needed.

I would like to hear more about how this anti-war protest was carried out. Did the protestors use methods which disrupted other citizen's rights to free speech?

So far we only have the view of one side.


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Re: Arrested for reading the U.S. Constitution out loud, in a public park, at a pro war rally. [Re: zorbman]
    #7435081 - 09/21/07 03:07 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I have a feeling what happened (and what we didn't see on camera) is that there was a designated 'protest' area in the park and these people were not in it. The cops asked them to move, they refused, then the cops arrested them.

Assuming this scenario is correct, is it right to segregate protesters to one area of the park? I dunno, maybe.

Are people reading The Constitution protesters? I dunno, but I tend to think not.

Without knowing more details, it doesn't seem like these people did anything worthy of arrest. It would have been nice if the cops had informed the people they were arresting about the charges before taking them away.


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1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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