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Offlinelonestar2004
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Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan
    #7423877 - 09/18/07 01:53 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Monday 17 September 2007

Michael D. Tanner, director of health and welfare studies:

Here we go again. HillaryCare is back, and its apparent that Sen. Clinton has learned little since the American people overwhelmingly rejected her last attempt to overhaul the U.S. health care system. Once again her plan, which would cost $110 billion per year in new taxes, calls for greater government control over American health care. If her plan were to pass this time, it would mean higher taxes, lost jobs, less patient choice, and poorer quality health care.


Among the worst features of her proposal:




.An individual mandate. Sen. Clinton would require every American to purchase health insurance or face penalties. There are many problems with such a mandate. It restricts individual choice and liberty. It will require a massive new bureaucracy to enforce. And it sets in motion a whole series of regulatory requirements that will ultimately lead to greater government control of our health care.


.An employer mandate. Sen. Clinton would impose a “play or pay “ mandate on American businesses, requiring them to provide workers with health insurance or pay an additional tax into a government insurance fund. Such a mandate simply increases the cost of hiring workers, meaning employers will inevitably hire fewer workers. Some may even be forced to layoff current employees and others will offset their costs by reducing wages or wage increases.


.Expanding government programs. Sen. Clinton would expand the State Children’s Health Insurance Program (SCHIP) to provide benefits for middle-class families. Yet studies show that many of those who would be covered by such an expansion already have private health insurance. Thus, Sen. Clinton would simply be moving people from private insurance to taxpayer-funded government care. She would also allow people under age 65 to “buy-in” to Medicare despite the fact that the program is already facing a financial crisis.


.Insurance regulation. Senator Clinton would require insurance companies to accept all applicants regardless of their health, and would impose “community rating” on health insurance premiums. As a result the young and healthy will be forced to pay more in order to subsidize the older and sicker. And those who practice healthy lifestyles will pay more to subsidize the irresponsible.

http://www.cato.org/homepage_item.php?id=656





“Sen. Clinton would require every American to purchase health insurance or face penalties.”


Clinton would force enrollment of young, healthy people, ages 18 to 30, who often forego insurance because they believe they will never get sick. Clinton said their participation was essential because premiums from healthy patients offset higher costs incurred by older patients.....



That cunt Hillary is in the pocket of the Insurance Companies. So I guess we will be going to Jail if we don’t have insurance.....


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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OfflineSyle
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7423889 - 09/18/07 01:58 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

she sucks balls, what more can be said.


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https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!


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OfflineBikerfool
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Syle]
    #7423944 - 09/18/07 02:13 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

The plan is flawed, but $110 billion a year isn't bad compared to the $10 billion being spent each day on Iraq.


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Just an angsty teen contributing to the pubs decline with contentless posts.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Bikerfool]
    #7423980 - 09/18/07 02:21 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Anyone who thinks it will really cost just 110 billion a year is too dumb to be allowed to vote. No government program having anything to do with medicine (such as medicare or medicaid) has ever come in anywhere close to the predicted figure. Usually, they haven't come anywhere close to being even a quarter of the predicted figure.




Phred


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Phred]
    #7424100 - 09/18/07 02:49 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

So?

His point is still valid.

If you accept that the War In Iraq is costing 10B a day, which I'm not sure about, even if this Healthcare program cost 3and a half TRILLION dollars, it would still cost less.

I know which I'd rather have my money spent on, and its not propping up some fucked up raghead government in some pissant shithole little country.


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #7424166 - 09/18/07 03:02 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I'm not sure what Iraq has to do with Hillarycare?


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Offlinelonestar2004
Live to party,work to affordit.
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Registered: 10/03/04
Posts: 8,978
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Phred]
    #7424189 - 09/18/07 03:06 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

In 2004 Medicare cost this country some $540 billion

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/01/29/bush.budget.ap/index.html

This bitch has no idea how much Hillarycare would cost this country.


--------------------
America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Registered: 07/20/04
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Phred]
    #7424206 - 09/18/07 03:10 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
Anyone who thinks it will really cost just 110 billion a year is too dumb to be allowed to vote. No government program having anything to do with medicine (such as medicare or medicaid) has ever come in anywhere close to the predicted figure. Usually, they haven't come anywhere close to being even a quarter of the predicted figure.




Phred




Ch ching!!!!!!!! :yesnod:

Not only are those phoney conservative figures, just wait and see how they get jacked up by the health care industry when the "system" is paying the tab. 

How quickly people forgot that the Government, when selling us this war plan, estimated the cost of invading Iraq would be 4 billion TOTAL, and that they said, Iraqi Oil would pick up that tab.


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Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Offlinenakors_junk_bag
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7424387 - 09/18/07 03:58 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

owning your own healthcare spurs the economy in good directions. If only the fucks would buy their own insurance without havin to be told.

It really is only a very superficial liberal abuse of the power the government should have natural rights to. If I get the jist of the story. I only gave it a most cursory of glances. its more hillary nonsnese.

If she expected me to pay for your insurance any more than I already do regarding medicaid and others, that would be bullshit in the extreme.


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Asshole


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7424492 - 09/18/07 04:36 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah... Mother Clinton is going to take care of all of us for our own good!


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Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7424535 - 09/18/07 04:47 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

lonestar2004 said:If her plan were to pass this time, it would mean higher taxes, lost jobs, less patient choice, and poorer quality health care.



Another false attack piece from Cato...

Higher taxes would more than be canceled out by the lack of medical fees. Parasite health insurance jobs should be lost, all those insurance bottom feeders contribute nothing and rape everyone for big money. Less patient choice is a false claim. Poorer quality health care for whom? Strawman! Every American would receive excellent quality health care. Tell that BS about lower quality care to the people in England and France, they'll laugh in your face.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #7427024 - 09/19/07 06:15 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nah fuck it, it's better to have 43-47 million uninsured, fuck them and better to have my insurance company fucking me over by not paying shit and me filling for bankruptcy, yes, I like it that way.


--------------------



http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: lonestar2004]
    #7427039 - 09/19/07 06:25 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

> I'm not sure what Iraq has to do with Hillarycare?

People are claiming that the money we are wasting in Iraq would be better wasted at home by giving it to insurance companies.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #7427230 - 09/19/07 08:18 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Madtowntripper said:

If you accept that the War In Iraq is costing 10B a day, which I'm not sure about, even if this Health care program cost 3and a half TRILLION dollars, it would still cost less.

I know which I'd rather have my money spent on, and its not propping up some fucked up raghead government in some pissant shithole little country.




Have you considered that right now, the war is being funded by loans from the Federal Reserve Banks. You havn't felt the hit because what you pay in income tax hasn't changed, yet.

Under Hillary care, you will be forced to buy into a health insurance program, at whatever cost is set for you, or be forced to pay a penalty or go to jail. You'll feel this one hit your wallet now.

This whole plan is unconstitutional. I don't see how the Supreme Court could allow for it.

It's a frightening prospect and so is she.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisiblepsilomonkey
Twisted brainwrong of a oneoff man mental

Registered: 08/08/03
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Phred]
    #7427329 - 09/19/07 09:17 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Phred said:
Anyone who thinks it will really cost just 110 billion a year is too dumb to be allowed to vote. No government program having anything to do with medicine (such as medicare or medicaid) has ever come in anywhere close to the predicted figure. Usually, they haven't come anywhere close to being even a quarter of the predicted figure.

Phred




The National Health Service in the UK costs around 92 billion pounds a year to run, serving a population of 60 million. Its not exactly what you would call a Rolls Royce service.

At the same spending per head of population in the UK you are talking around 900 billion dollars a year.

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/reprint/329/7458/128-a.pdf


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: gettinjiggywithit]
    #7427350 - 09/19/07 09:28 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

gettinjiggywithit said:



Under Hillary care, you will be forced to buy into a health insurance program, at whatever cost is set for you, or be forced to pay a penalty or go to jail. You'll feel this one hit your wallet now.






I have a real job, and thus, insurance. I would not be buying into any insurance program. Again, I dont see anywhere I can opt out of the Iraq War spending frenzy...


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: psilomonkey]
    #7427352 - 09/19/07 09:29 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

> The National Health Service in the UK costs around 92 billion pounds a year to run, serving a population of 60 million.

Converting to US population size and US dollars, this equates to 923 billion USD.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisiblegettinjiggywithit
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: psilomonkey]
    #7427374 - 09/19/07 09:36 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Add to that figure, the rising costs of the doctors, pharms and hospitals that WILL raise prices if this goes though, and the insurance companies, that will jack up theirs. Because they have the largest lobby, they will be able too do that too.

Hillary is helping to line their pockets with this plan. She receives more lobby money/campaign donations from the health care Industry then any other candidate. Obama runs a close second.

There are a number of 18-29 year olds here all complaining about how they don't go to the doctor or dentists because, they have no insurance because they can't afford it.

Hillary knows they won't read through her 1,400 page plan. She knows they will hear her " Health care coverage for Everyone under my plan" sound bite, get all excited thinking the government will pay for it and vote for her.

She'll get you coverage alright. She will FORCE you to buy the coverage you already can't afford, through your employer. It will be deducted from your pay check. Your age group will pay the highest rate under her plan.

Wake up!

Her plan is not that you will be covered from out of the income tax pool like how it works in Canada. Her plan forces everyone to buy coverage, through pay check deductions, in addition to the income tax, state tax, and SS tax deducted from your pay check.


--------------------
Ahuwale ka nane huna.


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Invisiblepsilomonkey
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: Seuss]
    #7427382 - 09/19/07 09:40 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Thats kinda what I said :smile:


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OfflineBrAiN
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Re: Cato Scholar Comments on Hillary Clinton's Health Plan [Re: psilomonkey]
    #7428395 - 09/19/07 02:14 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I hate Hillary, but I kind of like the plan. Only because I think it actually WILL reduce the cost of health care. The more people that are covered (including especially young people), the overall HEALTH of this country will increase over time, costing everyone less.

I mean... once you turn 65, you're going to leech off society anyways even if you're against universal health care (COUGH COUGH.. MEDICARE). WOuldn't it be nice if everyone required LESS medication when they turn 65?

Although... I'm doubting she actually wants to enact this plan because she CARES for anyone.. she probably is just getting paid by the insurance companies to do this because they'll see a huge profit initially.


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