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Offlinedeformedreality
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what is this world coming to?
    #7409599 - 09/14/07 02:55 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I just got some bhut jolokia, habanero and tabasco seeds from the chile pepper institute today.. of the 3 different seed packets i got only one came with a "unauthorized propagation prohibited" sticker on the back.. the bhut jolokia..

"All rights to produce or sell seeds derived from this seed resides solely with the chile pepper institute. by opening this envelope, you acknowledge this ownership and agree to this condition. if you do not wish to be bound by these terms, all seed must be destroyed or return to the chile pepper institute."

is this legit or just a fake threat? cause id like to grow them for seeds and pass them around to other people cause there is only one legit source of these seeds right now (the chile pepper institute of new mexico)


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Offlinesublimistri
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7409648 - 09/14/07 03:03 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I doubt theyd be able to catch you spreading the seeds, and like i said who the hell are they to say you cant trade seeds from a plant?


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7409654 - 09/14/07 03:04 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

who the hell gives them the right to set claim to mother nature anyways?


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7409910 - 09/14/07 04:01 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

yeah man you can't patent mother natures processes.
 
  like yeah I am about to patent human birth.  if I find out anybody gives birth without my consent they are in deep shit :tongue:


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Offlinesupra
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7409917 - 09/14/07 04:03 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

not only that, IF they did catch you, how would the prove that the seeds you are giving away originally came from one of their seeds. Just tell them you found a wild plant and picked a pepper an grew those seeds....

peace


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: supra]
    #7409930 - 09/14/07 04:07 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

they really dont have the right to say you couldnt give out seeds as a result of your growing the plants from the seed you bought from them.

have you heard of the genetically modified veggies and fruits that don't produce seeds??? that way the farmer has to go buy new seeds every year from the same place.
money fucking hungry bastards


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410024 - 09/14/07 04:27 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

you know, fuck them. im going to grow all the seeds, produce as many fruits as possible and collect the seeds and give them out to memebers or trade them.. :^)


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OfflineNalim
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410081 - 09/14/07 04:43 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

cpw1971 said:
they really dont have the right to say you couldnt give out seeds as a result of your growing the plants from the seed you bought from them.

have you heard of the genetically modified veggies and fruits that don't produce seeds??? that way the farmer has to go buy new seeds every year from the same place.
money fucking hungry bastards




Just a thought: Where do you think the money for R&D comes from?
It doesn't pour from the sky that's for sure.


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


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OfflineNalim
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Nalim]
    #7410090 - 09/14/07 04:46 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

That is not to say that I do not agree with the deformedreality : The fuckers shouldn't get away with keeping a species/subspecies for themselves.


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410128 - 09/14/07 04:54 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

basically the terms of agreement only apply to me.. so if i brake their agreement and give out the seeds than you guys dont have to abide by the agreement right? ;]  If you guys dont know what bhut jalokia is, it was named the worlds hottest pepper of 2007 by Guinness..

http://www.slashfood.com/2007/02/20/guinness-names-worlds-hottest-pepper/

i dont think anyone should be able to lay claim to something that cool ;] erhm.. i mean hot :laugh:


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410140 - 09/14/07 04:56 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

:awesome: I want a plant!!


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410184 - 09/14/07 05:06 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

:] ill spread the joy later. Ill keep ya in mind k?


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Nalim]
    #7410191 - 09/14/07 05:07 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Nalim said:
Quote:

cpw1971 said:
they really dont have the right to say you couldnt give out seeds as a result of your growing the plants from the seed you bought from them.

have you heard of the genetically modified veggies and fruits that don't produce seeds??? that way the farmer has to go buy new seeds every year from the same place.
money fucking hungry bastards




Just a thought: Where do you think the money for R&D comes from?
It doesn't pour from the sky that's for sure.



whats R+D??
so you agree with GM plants????
I think thats fucked up and its also destrying the environment.


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410215 - 09/14/07 05:14 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

research and development. and nalim gave me an idea..

"All rights to produce or sell seeds derived from this seed resides solely with the chile pepper institute."

it says nothing about live plants ;] it directly and clearly states "seeds"


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OfflineNalim
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410304 - 09/14/07 05:39 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

GMOs are cheaper, better and in some environments the only feasible way to grow. Thanks to GMOs millions who would have starved to death would now be dead.

Without money to R&D the GMOs couldn't have been developed and without a commercial gain in developing them there would have not been any investors. Sometimes making GMOs infertile is the only way to be able to earn anything from developing them and without that millions would die from starvation and poverty.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug
Said to have saved a billion people.


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


Edited by Nalim (09/14/07 05:46 PM)


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410334 - 09/14/07 05:48 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

you have a point, i totally agree.. but not like anyone is planning on mass producing crops of bhut jolokia, not that many people would buy them and go through them very fast.. im suprised this pepper is even legal in this country at this moment.. The u.s. government has banned very hot peppers before in the past.

Habenero are 80,000+ scovials
Jolokia are 1,000,000+ scovials

Now if it were a special breed of bell pepper, i could understand restricting its spread because there is a big market for bell peppers (2 dollars a piece..) i spend more money each month on bell peppers than i do on gas and i drive a lot ( 40 miles to the gallon :] )


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OfflineNalim
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410357 - 09/14/07 05:53 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Oh, I'm not arguing for the developers of bhut jolokia. I don't feel anyone has any right to keep a crop to themselves if it hasn't got some kind of built in "piracy protection"(:lol:) like infertility.

If you can propagate and spread it I feel that you have the right to do so.

I just don't agree with cpw's idea that the people who make GMO's that cant be propagated by the consumers are "money fucking hungry bastards" as they actually save lives.


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


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Offlinedeformedreality
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410388 - 09/14/07 06:01 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

plus it took them time and money and time is money so money 2x to develop the GMO's If they can get away with it, more power to them.


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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7410469 - 09/14/07 06:24 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

This is a state University. Hence, taxes and tuition mostly pay for their work.(or at least the people of New Mexico do)

It seems by this threat that they just want to have a monopoly on this pepper for as long as they can until it becomes widespread in the states....


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"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
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"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Nalim]
    #7410546 - 09/14/07 06:46 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

yeah Nalim theres many things that can go wrong with GM crops though.
http://www.ratical.org/co-globalize/MaeWanHo/corporation.pdf


Edited by cpw1971 (09/14/07 06:48 PM)


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410564 - 09/14/07 06:52 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/7409599/an/0/page/0

you gotta read that one
that shit's gonna kill us all in time. sure it may save millions at the cost of all of humanity


Edited by cpw1971 (09/14/07 06:54 PM)


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410569 - 09/14/07 06:56 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)



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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410907 - 09/14/07 08:47 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I thank its only for seed businesses.

The only down side to GM seed.After so many growings is that it will,
revert back to the characteristics of the parents.


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Brainiac]
    #7410917 - 09/14/07 08:51 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

have you heard about the bees all dying all over the place???
  yep gm crops
  once theres no bees to pollinate our crops were fucked :eek:


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410928 - 09/14/07 08:54 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

oh maybe I am worng and it is due to a virus  :confused:
  maybe not...
  http://www.rense.com/general76/gent.htm


Edited by cpw1971 (09/14/07 08:55 PM)


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7410943 - 09/14/07 08:58 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)



--------------------
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:cool: Fair is Fair :devil:


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Brainiac]
    #7411683 - 09/15/07 12:34 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

it said opening the envelope. just plant the whole thing without opening it and photograph it. case closed? or mail them to someone outside of country to grow and spread so they are not bound by us law.


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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7411790 - 09/15/07 01:50 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Then way hasn't it been, killing out the (AHB) killer bees ?




Never any witnesses left.:grin:


--------------------
Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: cpw1971]
    #7412004 - 09/15/07 03:58 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

http://www.ratical.org/co-globalize/MaeWanHo/corporation.pdf



I can tell you about ten things that is wrong with that article.
Was this actually published in a scientific magazine or is this something that's transcribed from a lecture?
I really doubt this was published as it's filled with the researchers own bias and not much fact.
I've read plenty of better and more intelligent papers on the risks of gene modifying. Still I feel confident that we have no reason to worry. For every paper ranting on the horrors and risks of GMOs there are hundreds that show how small the risks are and that show ways to avoid the risks.

I feel that the potential gain from GMOs are huge and the dangers small.
The scientists that argue against GMOs are few and to put it bluntly overly cautious. There are risks but they tend to become inflated. The most important thing: all scientific gainings come with new risks, thats why we need research: to overcome and to minimize these risks.


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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."


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Invisiblecpw1971
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Nalim]
    #7412402 - 09/15/07 08:42 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Nalim
you are one smart dude but I still don't trust fucking with mother natures genetics.
maybe if it were indoors in a sealed controlled environment it would be fine but get that shit outside breeding with natural crops and theres bound to be shit we don't want to happen.
I mean sure it would be great if it went as planned but you gotta expect the unexpected.


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7414026 - 09/15/07 05:51 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

i agree, fuck em!


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The important thing is not to stop questioning. Curiosity has its own reason for existing. One cannot help but be in awe when he contemplates the mysteries of eternity, of life, of the marvelous structure of reality. It is enough if one tries merely to comprehend a little of this mystery every day. Never lose a holy curiosity. ~ Albert Einstein
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Invisiblethallus
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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: Locus]
    #7417096 - 09/16/07 04:34 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

I have some packs of bhut jolokia if anyone is looking. As for the condition on the pack, I think its more to stop farmers growing them most new plants carry them for the first five or ten years.


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: thallus]
    #7418521 - 09/16/07 11:56 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

watch "The Future of Food"

among other horrors, Montsanto is suing farmers whose crops are accidentally pollinated by proprietary Montsanto crops - AND WINNING. Specific genes can prove the origin; it might as well be a built in bar code. The farmers are then forced to destroy seed stocks that have been cultivating for decades . . . and buy "single season" seeds instead.

They (Montsanto, and others no doubt) are working on crops that will only germinate using a proprietary chemical treatment, and seed stocks that are self sterilizing.

capitalism is without conscience, and unbridled it is leading down some very dark paths.


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: thallus]
    #7418614 - 09/17/07 12:38 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

Also, GMO`s usually out compete their wild ancestors, when they escape into native populations. Like the extinction of native corn varieties, for Monsantos corn which whoever owns the patent on corn can profit from. When all banana trees, for instance, are eradicated and replaced with a GMO, because GMO`s are genetically same and show no variation, if a disease hit one tree all would fail. Causing the extinction of all known banana.


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"Please read and learn and relay knowledge not misinformation! Thank you"-hyphae


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: ralphroks]
    #7419401 - 09/17/07 11:23 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

my naga jolokia plant is doing quite well so far, and when it start producing peppers id be happy to send people seeds.



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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7419476 - 09/17/07 11:49 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

how old is that and did you get the seeds from the Chile pepper institute?


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7419495 - 09/17/07 11:54 AM (16 years, 4 months ago)

it's about two months old, and looks like it'll be needing a new pot soon.


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7419526 - 09/17/07 12:02 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

yeah i was like.. damn big plant small pot, must not have much roots or needs a transplant soon.


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Re: what is this world coming to? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7419660 - 09/17/07 12:56 PM (16 years, 4 months ago)

ill probably go get a new pot for it on my next free day. The leaves are big, turgid, and glossy right now, so it seems to be healthy, but a little room to grow is always good. It will be inside in a sunny window for the summer when it starts to get cold, but hopefully it'll give me some peppers still.


Edited by AgingHippy (09/17/07 12:57 PM)


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