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LuNaTiX
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What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling!
#7315100 - 08/20/07 05:39 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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http://www.gizmag.com/go/7817/
Quote:
August 20, 2007 Exceeding the speed of light may not be impossible according to claims reported by New Scientist. The debate surrounds an experiment by Günter Nimtz and Alfons Stahlhofen of the University of Koblenz, Germany, in which photons were propelled faster than the speed of light in a process known as quantum tunnelling. But does this really defy the 186,000 miles per second (300,000 kps) speed limit arising from Einstein's Special Theory of Relativity? In the weird world of quantum mechanics, where very little makes sense, it seems that it’s down to a matter of interpretation.
The research by Nimtz and Stahlhofen involved sending microwaves through two glass prisms to investigate quantum tunnelling – a process in which quantum particles violate the laws of classical physics by traversing gaps that they should not be able to pass through. In observing this phenomena the researchers conclude that the photons travel much faster than the speed of light – so fast in fact that it couldn’t be measured. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_tunnelling
The popular interpretation might lead to the conclusion that the ultimate cosmic speed limit has been broken, but as explained by Alan Boyle at Cosmic Log, it’s more a question of how these laws are conceived given that the weird behaviour of quantum particles tend to elicit loopholes in the Theory of Relativity. Part of this problem lies in the fact that light waves are massless and therefore don’t fit within the parameters of the 186,000 miles per second rule.
Like many aspects of quantum mechanics it just shouldn’t happen (take for example the ability of certain sub-atomic particles to react to interference with its quantum “partner” even when they are separated by large distances) but in a world full of “known unknows”, things aren’t about to get any simpler.
For further reading visit New Scientist or see Nimtz and Stahlhofen’s Research Paper entitled Macroscopic violation of special relativity.
This kinda stuff I like...
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chodamunky
Cheers!


Registered: 02/28/02
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: LuNaTiX]
#7315138 - 08/20/07 05:55 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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It's funny how science makes up rules and boundries, and then inevitably breaks them down
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The_Ghost
ゴースト



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: chodamunky]
#7315146 - 08/20/07 06:01 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
chodamunky said: It's funny how science makes up rules and boundries, and then inevitably breaks them down
Thats the only way science can operate. Its a study of limitation. Eventually the limits expand.
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automan
blasted chipmunk


Registered: 09/18/03
Posts: 8,272
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: LuNaTiX]
#7315153 - 08/20/07 06:04 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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may i move this to the science and tech forum to get a good debate going?
-------------------- No, no, you're not thinking, you're just being logical. ~ Niels Bohr
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Help on the Way
Slipknot420

Registered: 08/12/00
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: The_Ghost]
#7315155 - 08/20/07 06:05 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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thats the whole point of science... to define boundaries and then find exceptions to them to paint a better picture of reality
if something goes faster than the speed of light, will there be the equivalent to a sonic boom? What would that be? a huge flash of light? thats kinda cool
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*Divine Moments of Truth* "Limitless undying love which shines around me like a million suns - it calls me on and on across the universe" ~ John Lennon "Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right" ~The Grateful Dead "Religionists, with their guaranteed eventual paradise, of which they know nothing, taking it all on 'faith,' can't be expected to understand or sympathize with those with a yen to storm the Gate of Heaven and see for themselves what all the praying's about!" ~Robert Hunter
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LuNaTiX
Quarterback




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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: automan]
#7315161 - 08/20/07 06:10 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yeah, sure, I'm sure it will be more useful there.
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ApJunkie
part-time Ninja



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: LuNaTiX]
#7315188 - 08/20/07 06:26 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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we just had this debate in the Science forum. You can move it there if you want, but the conversation will be different here
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Newbie
User of semicolons.



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: The_Ghost]
#7315510 - 08/20/07 08:24 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yeah but dealing with quantum physics, there are no boundaries because it's all about possibilities.
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DieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: LuNaTiX]
#7315545 - 08/20/07 08:34 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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The quote states in fact that it does not break the limits of relativity. Still, interesting stuff indeed
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DieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: DieCommie]
#7315552 - 08/20/07 08:37 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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deimya
tofu and monocle



Registered: 08/26/04
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: Help on the Way]
#7321420 - 08/22/07 11:46 AM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Help on the Way said: thats the whole point of science... to define boundaries and then find exceptions to them to paint a better picture of reality
if something goes faster than the speed of light, will there be the equivalent to a sonic boom? What would that be? a huge flash of light? thats kinda cool
in a vacuum it is not possible since the speed of light in a vacuum is the universal limit. On the other hand, in any medium with a refractive index higher than 1, stuff can move faster than light does in that medium and it produce some kind of "sonic boom" glow called Cerenkov radiation. It is observed in nuclear reactor in particular.
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: Newbie]
#7322237 - 08/22/07 03:59 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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> there are no boundaries because it's all about possibilities.
Actually, it is more about probabilities than possibilities.
> As mentioned above, along the same lines...
Thanks, saved me the hassle of looking up the posts!
-------------------- Just another spore in the wind.
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imachavel
I loved and lost but I loved-ftw


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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: Seuss]
#8176053 - 03/21/08 02:00 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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damn, fascinating, so the article says it may be possible, but they can't prove it or something, right? but they got the photon to move at about the speed of light at least, right? interesting, what is a photon?
i feel like i'm watching star trek with this shit...
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I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!
I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk
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DieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: imachavel]
#8176229 - 03/21/08 02:55 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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A photon is a particle of light. Photons always move at the speed of light, because they are light.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: DieCommie]
#8176340 - 03/21/08 03:28 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
DieCommie said: A photon is a particle of light. Photons always move at the speed of light, because they are light.
It depends on your definition.
If you mean the speed of light, c, or 386,000 miles per second, then you are wrong. You can change the speed of a photon by making it travel through a medium.
But since photons are light, you would in fact change the speed of that "piece" of light.
But c is still the same.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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DieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: Madtowntripper]
#8176433 - 03/21/08 03:50 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think this has already been mentioned in this thread... if not it is in the threads I linked to above.
The speed of light is always c. The reason there is a decrease in a medium is because of the interactions between the light and matter takes time. But in between these reactions the light is traveling at c. So the apparent speed (the net speed) seems to be less than c, because the time it takes during the interaction. (Kind of like how stop lights greatly slow down your apparent speed, even though you may always travel at 60mph)
Light always travels at c. It has too. A massless particle must travel at c, just as a mass particle must travel <c.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: DieCommie]
#8176491 - 03/21/08 04:07 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I should read more.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Baby_Hitler
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: DieCommie]
#8177046 - 03/21/08 06:44 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I like π.
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DieCommie


Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: Madtowntripper]
#8177484 - 03/21/08 08:46 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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I sorry if I came off like a dick, didnt mean too.
Its normal to talk of speed of light decreasing in a medium. If you said that around a scientist they would know what you meant. I just like to make the distinction when somebody new asks, so they better understand the physics of light and light speed.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers



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Re: What's faster then light? quantum tunnelling! [Re: DieCommie]
#8177917 - 03/21/08 10:17 PM (16 years, 2 months ago) |
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Oh no, I wasn't taking any offense at all to what you said!
No need to apologize.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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