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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271440 - 08/07/07 06:50 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Please do some research

Here's some more research for you:

news.bbc.co.uk

President: Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin

Vladimir Putin was elected to a second term as Russian president by a landslide in March 2004 with around 70% of the vote. His nearest rival, the Communist candidate, mustered 14%.

Western observers were quick to criticise media bias in favour of Mr Putin during the campaign.

They had been similarly critical when United Russia, the party backed by the president, won a landslide victory in parliamentary elections the previous December and liberal parties lost virtually all their seats.

Concerns about Mr Putin's attitude to the media are not new. They came to the fore when private TV stations critical of the Kremlin were forced off the air in his first term. Not everyone was convinced by his insistence that this was business, not politics.

Vladimir Putin started his career in the ranks of the KGB. From 1990 he worked in the St Petersburg administration, before moving to Moscow in 1996. By August 1999 he was prime minister.

He was named acting president by his predecessor, Boris Yeltsin, who introduced him as the man who could "unite around himself those who will revive Great Russia".

He went on to win presidential elections in May 2000, having gained widespread popularity for his pledge to take a tough line against Chechen rebels.

After the bloodbath which ended the Beslan school siege in September 2004, Mr Putin controversially took over control of the appointment of regional governors who had been directly elected for the previous decade. He said the move was intended to tighten the Kremlin's grip on the regions. Critics saw it as undermining democracy.

Mr Putin has said he wants to modernise Russia and has been credited with introducing economic reforms which have balanced the budget and cut inflation. As the birth rate falls and health problems persist across the country, he promises to seek ways of stemming a rapid decline in the population.

Vladimir Putin was born in St Petersburg in 1952. Under the current constitution, his second term must also be his last. Presidential elections are due in 2008.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271626 - 08/07/07 07:39 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Chechnya is its own issue and does not paint the picture for news coverage within Russia. What paints the picture of what I'm talking about is the anti-kremlin protest turnd riot that occured in March. The protest march was organized and led by a US agent, while permission to conduct the protest at that time had been denied and that the St. Petersburg square (where the march took place) had been set aside for a children's festival. Logically, when the march occured against legal authority riot police were dispatched to break up the protest. US news outlets and politicians then reported anti-democracy crackdowns were taking place in Russia, when the reality is that it had nothing to do with being anti-democratic.

What I said previously about his approval and everything else stands, and instead of going on tangents please quote me and provide a relevant response. Displaying that there was a lack of new on Chechnya does not mean that Russia is kept from hearing of criticism towards Putin, nor does it show that the US has not been trained, whereas the St. Petersburg protest incident does. I suggest this for reading.


http://www.youtube.com/v/WdI7cA06-M4
Notice how the CNN reporter, like you, holds the assumption that Russians don't hear of critial news, and notice how he's informed how faulty that belief is.


But in the end I'm not interested in arguing with someone who wouldn't know whether Putin is good or bad, instead I'd like to hear from The Cow, who at least has Russian citizenship (tho I don't know if that means he lives there) why he thinks Putin needs to go, and who he wants to have in place of him.


Edited by Disco Cat (08/07/07 08:01 PM)


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271684 - 08/07/07 07:52 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Chechnya is its own issue and does not paint the picture for news coverage within Russia.

Ah, so when I say that Russian media is controlled by the government, you call me a bullshitter. When I back it up, you backpedal and say that Chechnya doesn't count.

I see how it is. :thumbdown:

And Chechnya aside, you missed this part of the BBC report:

Concerns about Mr Putin's attitude to the media are not new. They came to the fore when private TV stations critical of the Kremlin were forced off the air

Putin may well not have been elected if not for the government's control of the media slant and shutting down private TV stations that reported unfalteringly about Putin. At least in the US, the media slants every which way and THE PEOPLE decide for themselves which one to believe.

And today the 70% approval rating Putin enjoys may not be there if the media were free to report whatever they wanted. Approval ratings in a state-controlled media environment don't amount to shit. This is why the comparison to Husein's 100% election result is apropos.

Both are based on government lies and half-truths.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271716 - 08/07/07 07:59 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I suggest this for reading.

Excerpt:

...But first, what is wrong with how the protest movement is being sold to the West. Gary Kasparov, the man they're making into the next Nelson Mandela, is what's wrong. You probably haven't read about this anywhere (unless you read the Russian blogger world), but Kasparov is so deep in bed with the vilest of America's neo-con goons, a VIP member of their PR-politics-lobbying network, that it almost seems like a bad setup. The strangest thing of all is how no one in the major Western media has touched on Kasparov's neo-con connections.

Gary Kasparov is a minor political figure at home, but he gets unusually high-profile access to every major media outlet in the West. The more far-right the media outlet, the more Kasparov-friendly it is. Case-in-point: The Wall Street Journal now identifies Kasparov as a "contributing editor" to that paper's opinion page, largely because he has been such a regular contributor. The Cheney/neo-con agenda, spelled out in the Project for a New American Century, calls for containing Russia and keeping it weak in order both to control the Caspian Sea resources and to prevent a potential rival from checking American power. That agenda exactly describes the opinion page of The Wall Street Journal. The Journal has been stridently anti-Putin, particularly since the arrest of former Yukos owner Mikhail Khodorkovsky -- an arrest which was a major blow to American oil interests.

Far more disturbing than Kasparov's status as a "contributing editor" to the Wall Street Journal, even as the same paper writes up his role in the protest movement, are his ties to the far-right foreign policy machine. Specifically, Gary Kasparov is, or was, a member of the neo-con Center for Security Policy. The think-tank's mission statement declares that it is "committed to the time-tested philosophy of promoting international peace through American strength." And Kasparov is not just a casual member - he once served on the CSP's National Security Advisory Council, an inner-working group headed by ex-CIA goon James Woolsey. It's a group with extensive ties to the Pentagon. The Center for Security Policy's member list reads like a Who's Who of the neo-con elite: along with Woolsey, it boasts Richard Perle, Douglas Feith, Elliott Abrams and Frank Gaffney, and was highly influential not just in formulating President Bush's disastrous imperial strategy in his first term, but also in lobbying for the repeal of the ABM treaty, a move which was in many ways the start of the growing rift between Russia and America.

The major Western media has yet to report Kasparov's role in the Center for Security Policy. And the organization has done its best to air-brush Kasparov's membership from its history. Kasparov's name no longer appears on the CSP's website, although if you look through wikipedia, you'll find the cached web pages that used to be up. Why would they try to erase the past?

One reason why Kasparov's name was removed has to do with conflict of interest. After last weekend's protest, not only did the Wall Street Journal shake its indignant fist at Putin's authoritarianism on behalf of its own contributing editor, but the Washington Times and other outlets printed an equally damning, pro-Kasparov piece by none other than Frank Gaffney, the Center for Security Policy's founder. Neither Gaffney nor the Washington Times mentioned his links to Kasparov.

It is not only odd that the Western media is ignoring this -- it's downright sinister. And it feeds into the paranoia and cynicism which fuels the Kremlin's thinking. It's almost too perfect, too clean: the leader of the anti-Putin movement is directly tied to the American far right, whose stated goal is to keep Russia weak and to claim the resources in its backyard. Meanwhile, the supposedly-free Western media not only doesn't report this, but builds up Kasparov as a modern-day Gandhi, much the same way that the Kremlin-controlled media here cynically builds up its own "virtual" nationalists and leftists and sells them to a gullible public that doesn't know any better. How could this be? What is this really all about?

* * *
The other fact missing from nearly every Western media account of the protests is that last weekend's marches weren't banned. People do have a right to hold anti-government rallies here. But they are restricted, sometimes severely. For example, the opposition wasn't allowed to hold their rally on Pushkin Square as requested; they were given nearby Turgenevskaya Square instead. Albeit just for an hour.

---------------------------------------------------


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271738 - 08/07/07 08:03 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

LMAO! :rofl2:

From your own source:

People do have a right to hold anti-government rallies here. But they are restricted, sometimes severely. For example, the opposition wasn't allowed to hold their rally on Pushkin Square as requested; they were given nearby Turgenevskaya Square instead. Albeit just for an hour.

So much for freedom of assembly in Russia: a single hour in an out-of-the-way place where few people will ever know about it instead of in Pushkin Square which is a mile from the Kremlin and where lots more people would have seen the demonstration.

You really should read your own sources before using them to (not) back up your position.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271749 - 08/07/07 08:07 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
Chechnya is its own issue and does not paint the picture for news coverage within Russia.

Ah, so when I say that Russian media is controlled by the government, you call me a bullshitter. When I back it up, you backpedal and say that Chechnya doesn't count.

I see how it is. :thumbdown:




Knock that shit out, I didn't say that at all. If you can't do better than acting like a baby in a quarrel, or raise your comprehension skills to an appropriate level I'm not going to waste time engaging. Or maybe you're intentionally slanting what I say and riding off on tangents, which would be quite ironic given the subject matter.


Quote:

Putin may well not have been elected if not for the government's control of the media slant and shutting down private TV stations that reported unfalteringly about Putin. At least in the US, the media slants every which way and THE PEOPLE decide for themselves which one to believe.



The media slanting every which way does not equal truth when averaged out, it means that any way people do choose to believe will be tainted one way or another.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271770 - 08/07/07 08:09 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
LMAO! :rofl2:

From your own source:

People do have a right to hold anti-government rallies here. But they are restricted, sometimes severely. For example, the opposition wasn't allowed to hold their rally on Pushkin Square as requested; they were given nearby Turgenevskaya Square instead. Albeit just for an hour.

So much for freedom of assembly in Russia: one hour in an out-of-the-way place where few people will ever know about it.

You really should read your own sources before using them to (not) back up your position.




LMAO! :rofl2:
You think that that line contradicts me, you clearly have been clueless during this whole discussion as to what we've been discussing and the extent of my claims :rofl2:
You also don't know the difference between restriced and silenced! LMAO :rofl2:


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271779 - 08/07/07 08:11 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You've been claiming that there is a free press in Russia. I've shown you (and you've unwittingly shown it as well) that this is bullshit. There is no free press in Russia, and that is in large part due to Putin's policies.

And if you think that a popularity poll in a controlled-media environment means anything, then I have some swampland in Florida I'd like to sell you.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271791 - 08/07/07 08:13 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
You've been claiming that there is a free press in Russia.



LMAO! :rofl2: No I haven't! I've been saying that werstern criticisms of Putin are largely doctored and a negative picture of him is being sold to US citizens beyond what is true.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


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Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271804 - 08/07/07 08:16 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You also don't know the difference between restriced and silenced!

Silenced? You mean like the several TV stations forcibly taken off the air when they pissed off Putin?

Forcibly taken off the air means they were silenced, in case you have trouble with reading comprehension.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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Offlineledfut
I once jerkedoff w/ bothhands
Male User Gallery

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1,459
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271814 - 08/07/07 08:17 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Diploid said:
LMAO! :rofl2:

From your own source:

People do have a right to hold anti-government rallies here. But they are restricted, sometimes severely. For example, the opposition wasn't allowed to hold their rally on Pushkin Square as requested; they were given nearby Turgenevskaya Square instead. Albeit just for an hour.

So much for freedom of assembly in Russia: a single hour in an out-of-the-way place where few people will ever know about it instead of in Pushkin Square which is a mile from the Kremlin and where lots more people would have seen the demonstration.

You really should read your own sources before using them to (not) back up your position.


sounds an awful lot like "free speech zones" that they have here in the states.

if you love bush & dick you get to put signs wherever you want. if you don't, well then we are going to lock you guys into a fenced in area at least 1/2 mile from where anything important is going on.


--------------------
May our only occupation be not having a job.
May the only cocktails that we make be molitov.
-Johnny Hobo and the Freight Trains


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


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Registered: 01/09/03
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Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: ledfut]
    #7271825 - 08/07/07 08:19 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

sounds an awful lot like "free speech zones" that they have here in the states

In the US, we don't restrict demonstrations to one hour. :shrug:

if you love bush & dick you get to put signs wherever you want. if you don't, well then we are going to lock you guys into a fenced in area at least 1/2 mile from where anything important is going on.

You must be referring to the anti-Bush demonstrations that have taken place front and center recently in Washington, DC, right?


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271840 - 08/07/07 08:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

On the subject of comprehension, nice going taking the line out of its context of the allowance of organized protests back to the US special interest funded radio stations that were shut down and which resulted in the expelltion of several US spies.
I think this conversation has run its course, hopefully you agree.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271854 - 08/07/07 08:23 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

How about those whitehouse press conferences where the questions are doctored beforehand with their answers typed out, and if someone asks a question that isn't preselected the reporter is thrown out and never invited back. How wonderfully free the press is in the US. If you talk about something the Pres doesn't want you to he throws you out. You might say that the press is governmentally restricted, because that is in fact what it is.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271873 - 08/07/07 08:26 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

and if someone asks a question that isn't preselected the reporter is thrown out

I call bullshit.

Link up a news story where a reporter was thrown out of a White House press conference for asking a question that wasn't on the list.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271886 - 08/07/07 08:30 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Ha! I'm suprised you aren't aware. Call bullshit and do the research yourself. The fact that is isn't widely reported on is a comment in itself.

Remember that immigration protest in Los Angelos that occured 2 weeks after the St. Petersburg protest? Riot police beating reporters and demonstators... and unlike the St. Petersburg protest, the L.A. one was legal.


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InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
    #7271897 - 08/07/07 08:37 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

The fact that is isn't widely reported

Yeah, right. You expect us to believe that a reporter is kicked out of a White House press conference and it doesn't get reported?

do the research yourself

You're the one making the claim.

Second request:

Link up a news story where a reporter was thrown out of a White House press conference for asking a question that wasn't on the list.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7271965 - 08/07/07 08:56 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Still no link. So it's like I thought it was:

You're a liar.

You post lies because sticking to the truth would undercut your position. You debate to be right, not to converge on the truth, whatever it may be.

Way to go. :thumbdown:


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleDisco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR

Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Diploid]
    #7272083 - 08/07/07 09:17 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

What laughable nonsense from you. I've been in my kitcken cooking since my last post.

Where do you pull this "debate to be right" and "sticking to the truth" stuff out of? And with the dramatics of "Way to go :thumbdown:"... it's akin to watching Fox news.

There's a video someplace of a reporter being removed after asking one of the Bush Administration personnel an unscripted question at a conference. Don't know how I'd go about finding it tho.

Quote:


http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/3/8/12559/73819
Ari Fleischer admits Bush called from a prepared list of reporters

By maynard in Media
Mon Mar 10, 2003 at 05:28:45 AM EST
Tags: Politics (all tags)   
March 7th, 2003, at an official press briefing, White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer twice admitted under questioning that the President's staff preselected which reporters to call, and the order, for the East Room Press Conference on the evening of March 6th, 2003. This Press Conference was President Bush's eighth solo news conference since inauguration, and the second formally presented in the East Room during prime time.

Mr. Fleischer responded to a reporter's query over a short gaffe in which the President was heard to say to a reporter, "You'll be there in a moment," upon which he then called CNN correspondent John King and remarked "...this is a scripted...[pause]", after which an outburst of laughter from the press pool could be heard. The president then moved directly onto the next question. An audio excerpt of this gaff is available from this Buzzflash commentary.





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    InvisibleDiploidM
    Cuban


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    Posts: 19,274
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    Re: Russia Trying To Claim Ownership of the Arctic Ocean Floor and its Oil [Re: Disco Cat]
        #7272102 - 08/07/07 09:20 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

    Third time now:

    Link up a news story where a reporter was thrown out of a White House press conference for asking a question that wasn't on the list.

    This is what you lied about a few posts back, and this is what I'm asking you to back up.


    --------------------
    Republican Values:

    1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
    2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
    3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

    4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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