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Offlinefreddurgan
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Original sin
    #7218994 - 07/24/07 05:01 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

It seems to me that original sin is just another way of looking at the inherent dissatisfaction that comes in life. The dissatisfaction of life's transitory nature. We feel bad about it, it's in us. That pain is always there, hence it is original. It is there from the beginning. The sin is just the Christian packaging of that pain. Dukkha, original sin. Same difference.


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OfflinePanoramix
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Re: Original sin [Re: freddurgan]
    #7219079 - 07/24/07 05:23 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Original sin as a theological doctrine insures that people feel inherently guilty about life and particularly about some of the joys that make life truly magnificent, in my eyes. Dukkha as I understand it serves to insure that people are aware of the impermanence of all things and thereby not feel so personally put upon when life is horrible for them. That strikes me as a pretty big difference.

It strikes me as being ungrateful to walk around in the mindset that you should feel bad because life is often a shabby and temporary type of thing, and often unpleasant. This strikes me as the reason to celebrate every leaf and cloud. Even from a cristian perceptive, it seems to me to be terrible ingratitude not to rejoice in the miracle of life, the direct work of God, innit?


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Invisibleemeryg89
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Re: Original sin [Re: freddurgan]
    #7219081 - 07/24/07 05:23 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

The original sin, translated by Qabbalists (which is what the bible is based on - the old testament, a jewish doctrine) is Man eating from the tree of knowledge. This is synonomous to God (the divine man) seperating himself from the Unity of All, in order so that he (god or divine being) may better know himself. All incarnations lesser than god (persons, plants, planets, and elements) are all 'thoughts' of God, which give birth the the material sphere, or inferior plane. This is the world in which we now exist... where we are so far, yet so close to god. We can only realize the closeness, when we realize that we inherently are God, at least a piece of him. Humanities quest, and the reason for all religion, is the search back to unity, where we become once again meshed with the all-pervading consciousness of God. We are sinners in that we have been seperated severely from god, to the most inferior to his existence (I use him, but god cannot be personified)... this doesn't mean we are all bad, and wrong... if God is all, then the universe(s) are all just pieces of that one great Holiness that extends beyond the imagination... this means earth, and our material sphere, is part of him. We are all part of him. Take the cells of your skin. Would you say that these cells are not you? Would you say that your stomach and liver are not you? Of course they are. Without them, you would not be you... the same is true with God... Dining on the tree of knowledge is the birthing into the material sphere and the search back to unity. Only when you reach unity, may God's will have been done, and the knowledge he sought to gain through inferior seperation will come back into his being.

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OfflinePanoramix
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Re: Original sin [Re: emeryg89]
    #7219209 - 07/24/07 05:50 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

"We can only realize the closeness, when we realize that we inherently are God, at least a piece of him. Humanities quest, and the reason for all religion, is the search back to unity, where we become once again meshed with the all-pervading consciousness of God."
-emeryg86

Search back to unity? Unity is already in you, you are of it and going off searching for it is what seperates you from it, so don't seek. Be and know, act in the precise harmony that comes most naturally, ziran zhili type o' deal. Seriously, strive to make yourself entirely concious of the moment you're existing in, reason with every cell. Highly recommended...

It's a personal journey, so having authoritative instituations involved at all seems unwise to me. Unity with God (if you want to phrase it like that) is all around us.


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Offlinefreddurgan
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Re: Original sin [Re: Panoramix]
    #7219991 - 07/24/07 08:52 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah, and what's the Christian method of relieving yourself of this original sin? Accepting Jesus Christ as your savior, their method of rediscovering your unity with God.

I stand by it that they are the same idea.


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InvisibleLakefingers
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Re: Original sin [Re: freddurgan]
    #7220998 - 07/25/07 05:54 AM (16 years, 8 months ago)

It's all clear, but how about going behind,
what and who would spread guilt and why?

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Invisibleemeryg89
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Re: Original sin [Re: Lakefingers]
    #7222108 - 07/25/07 12:41 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

I guess I didn't make my view clear enough before...

Yes, unity is ALL around us... being of the substance of God, we are obviously partaking of his divine essence. The unity is always here. There is no 'place' to go and find unity. There are however steps to take to realizing and becoming that unity... becoming a god among men. This is what I meant by the search to back to unity. Many have forgotten their godlihood, and thus we have the world as it is now. Is it wrong? No. It's just a stage in growth (evolution) for our species, the planet, the universe, and God.

It's funny because after posting this thread last night I was reading some Manly P. Hall, and the chapter I started was dealing with the Christian's idea of redemption, which was just brought up in the thread. Synchronicity abounds.

Yes, modern christian thought has portrayed that we can partake of godliness simply by accepting Jesus Christ as our savior and knowing him as the Son of God (or Son of Man)... Modern, spiritually illiterate man takes this very literally (good pun) thinking that by simply accepting Jesus... however, few modern christians realize the bible is a book of allegories and allusions (which all sacred doctrines partake of). Jesus is just another figure to represent old pagan principles. Jesus is synonomous to Bacchus and Dionysus... review some dying god texts, and you'll see the similarities. Jesus is also a symbol of the Sun, yes, the literal SUN of Man. He is the radiant force - who's birthday is the end of the Winter equinox (25th of December)... this is the birthday of the Sun for the Pagans. As for the ressurrection of Christ on the 25th of March, this is the exact ressurrection date of the Sun, when spring begins and growth is allowed once more. This is not to mention the similarity between the Sun and the 12 houses of the stars who rule alongside the sun (zodiac), where Jesus, being the sun, has his 12 apostles next to him.

In the beginning christianity was just a religion that adopted beliefs from all other religions. Jewish, Egyption, Roman, Greek, Oriental, and Pagan mysteries were all contained in the doctrine. Most have lost touch with the innate truths that lie behind the curtain of the text which have literally been around for ages. Everyone preaches the same thing in different words. Only the adept few can contemplate and understand the real meaning behind the seemingly impossible tales contained within sacred doctrines.

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OfflineBlueCoyote
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Re: Original sin [Re: emeryg89]
    #7226760 - 07/26/07 01:53 PM (16 years, 8 months ago)

'Everything happens for a reason.'


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Though lovers be lost love shall not  And death shall have no dominion
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"Our scientific power has outrun our spiritual power. We have guided missiles and misguided men."Martin Luther King, Jr.
'Acceptance is the absolute key - at that moment you gain freedom and you gain power and you gain courage'

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