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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Beginner: Cultivation Summary
#7194949 - 07/18/07 10:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Hey Everyone,
I’m moving into to my own place here soon and I am very interested in mushroom growth, especially P. Cubensis. I think getting an understanding in the mushrooms life cycle will make my experiences so much more enjoyable, as I will have a new found respect for the hallucinogen.
Here is a modified description of the setup I plan on using for now. I am going with the PF Tek. Any tips and answers to my questions will be greatly appreciated.
Substrate
*Note: I think I have a really good understanding in the sterility of this project, so I am going to use a glove box and many more sterile practices not listed.
- I am going to mix vermiculite, water, and brown rice flour for the substrate. I will then place the substrate in ½ pint jars. And fill the last 1/2” with dry verm (Of course wipe the last ½” first)
- Lids will have 4 holes poked in and masking tape will be placed over them. A sheet of foil will be wrapped around the top of the jars. I will then place all of the jars in a pot with some kind of prop on the bottom and I will steam sterilize for 90 min. I will the let everything cool for 24 hours
Inoculating
- I will place all of my materials (syringes and jars) into my glove box. Sterilize the needles with a flame and inoculate the jars (3 Jars B+ strain and 3 equador strain)
- Here is where I have a couple questions:
• After inoculation, Will storing them in a closet with a few hours of natural light a day at Room Temp. (75 – 82 F*) be sufficient for mycelium growth?
• Or should I have an incubator exposed to a few hours of natural light?
- After the jars are covered 100% with mycelium, I am going to wait 4 – 7 days until birthing them.
Birthing
- After waiting a week or so after the cakes have been covered 100% in mycelium, I will start the birthing process.
- The cakes will then be removed from the jars (washed under cold water to get the dry verm. off) and placed in a pot to soak for another 24 hours.
• Should I cold shock the cakes or just store at room temp (75-82 F*) for this process?
- After the soak I will wash again under water and “dunk and roll” in dry verm.
• How necessary is this process?
- Now here is the part where I have a lot of concerns.
• I plan on inoculating and birthing 6 jars. Should I go with the PF Tek and just lay down wet perlite on the bottom of a Rubbermaid tub and place the cakes on top of that? Or should I go with a casing method? (Keep in mind this is my first time and I am some what willing to take on a casing process, but I do want moderate results my first time too without contamination)
• Any parameters for the best mushroom cultivation conditions (B+ strain and equador strain) for the fruiting method you think I should use, will be greatly appreciated.
- I think I covered most of my procedure (besides drying). Thank you to all who can help me out for my first experimentation with cultivating P. Cubensis. Without this community at shroomery.org none of this would be possible.
Thanks Again, AG Tek
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Brainiac
Rogue Scientist



Registered: 04/29/06
Posts: 13,259
Loc: 與您的女朋
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7194968 - 07/18/07 10:03 PM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Do both, so if one fails you have the other one.
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Fair is Fair
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7195837 - 07/19/07 12:37 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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Thats a pretty good idea that honestly I haven't thought of yet. Should I case each cake seprately to reduce the chance of contaminating my entire casing? Or try and attempt fruiting three cakes in one casing?
Thanks for your help, AG Tek
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Blutjager
Inhuman


Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 9,220
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7196044 - 07/19/07 01:34 AM (17 years, 6 months ago) |
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You don't have to incubate them at all unless you live in an igloo,Storing them in the closet is fine regardless of the light they receive,they do not need light at all at that stage in the game.Do not waste your time with a cold shock,it does now good and actually slows you down,and I agree with Brainiac that you should do three as cakes since that what you planned on and three should be cased so you can get a feeling for that as well
Jumping in head first is in my opinion the best way to learn allot and FAST.My 1st "Grow" was three grows...with out ever having done this before I did a in vitro bag grow,a double tub and a pf tek....
The only fruits I got were out of the in vitro bags and out of about twenty of them I got fruits out of only four the double tub grew nothing but cobweb and all the pf jars turned green...terrible I know but you figure out where you went wrong and go fix it,the more you do it the easier it gets just hang in there and keep trying
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: Blutjager]
#7199485 - 07/19/07 07:33 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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haha thats funny you say "unless you live in an igloo" blutjager. I live in Alaska in the states and its almost winter time (usually 0*F- 10*F outside). But i get your point, im going to be inside with room temp. around 75*F. I looked at the casing tek you made with the martha stewart closet and rye....What would you suggest for a cheaper method for fruiting the casings?
Thanks a lot for the tips, AG Tek
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Dem_Bones
Strangler



Registered: 02/12/05
Posts: 307
Loc: Oklahoma
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7199553 - 07/19/07 07:49 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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i have a sujestion ,, fuck cakes  there is no point to them,, a mono tub is super easy and you will so so mush more mushrooms. and buy the biggest PC you can afford even if it means having to wate alittle long to get started ( really thoe make sure it can hold at least 7 quart jars but more is better
-------------------- At the bottom of this page is a search bar to search all the post and threads on the forum so you can see all the other 500 people who asked the same thing.use the top search too it has shroomery approved FAQs USE IT YOU CAN DO IT !
Edited by Dem_Bones (07/19/07 07:50 PM)
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: Dem_Bones]
#7205361 - 07/21/07 03:12 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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alright thanks a lot people for the great tips and insights....i will keep you posted with a grow log with pics hopefully.
Thanks Again, AG Tek
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: Dem_Bones]
#7205366 - 07/21/07 03:14 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Dem_Bones said: i have a sujestion ,, fuck cakes  there is no point to them,, a mono tub is super easy and you will so so mush more mushrooms. and buy the biggest PC you can afford even if it means having to wate alittle long to get started ( really thoe make sure it can hold at least 7 quart jars but more is better
Much more prone to error and contamination. A big PC might be a bad investment if he's not necessarily going to get huge into the hobby (they ain't cheap). I don't think all this is great advice for a beginner, but that's just my perspective.
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7205376 - 07/21/07 03:22 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
• After inoculation, Will storing them in a closet with a few hours of natural light a day at Room Temp. (75 – 82 F*) be sufficient for mycelium growth?
No light is necessary at all during colonization, and in fact some people will say a dark place is preferable for speedy growth. Light is a pinning trigger for cubensis, meaning it is one of the many factors that tells your mycelial body when to start making mushrooms.
As others said, do not incubate higher than 75-79F, to be safe. 81F is the peak, but incubators do like to stray a few degrees warm. It's easier not to build an incubator, and to simply leave it in a slightly warmer part of your house (cabinet over the fridge is good).
Quote:
Should I cold shock the cakes or just store at room temp (75-82 F*) for this process?
Okay, cold shocking is a real notion in mushroom cultivation, don't get me wrong, but cubensis is a tropical mushroom, which means that when growing cubes, erase the words "cold shocking" from your mind. People put them in the fridge to decrease the risk of contamination during the dunk. I don't find that the fridge is necessary, but it's not a problem either. Most fridges are nasty enough (from a sterility perspective) to make it a complete toss-up as to whether refrigeration actually decreases the risk of contamination overall.
Quote:
- After the soak I will wash again under water and “dunk and roll” in dry verm.
• How necessary is this process?
Not necessary, but definitely ideal. I dunked my first time, but did not roll. My subsequent grows taught me that rolling is great for stimulating good pinsets, though, and bigger crops as a result. Rinse under water after the "dunk" (which is the stage of underwater re-hydration you were referring to as a cold shock), then, while they're wet, roll them in dry verm. Now place them in the FC and mist the hell out of that verm until it reaches "near-saturation"--basically, don't let water puddle up on them, but get them nice and moist.
I think you should make extra cakes, so you can try both cakes and a crumbled-cake-into-casing method. I learned well from cakes on my first try at cultivation, but casing is definitely the best way to get the most mushrooms the most quickly. In the end your yields will be about the same, but it will take weeks of nursing your cakes through all the flushes it will take to expend them of their nutrients, while a casing is usually done by the second flush (which can come as quickly as two weeks after pins form).
If you're only doing one or the other, do cakes first. It's a better learning experience because it teaches you more about the basic grow cycle, and it is a good insurance policy. You also have way less to worry about, because for me, figuring out when my casings were colonized (but not overlayed) was a big question mark the first grow. Casings are very practical once you have the hang of things, but they also invite contaminants, especially for the uninitiated grower. There's nothing to turn someone off to a hobby they might love than being disappointed on their first grow, which is why I think you should give cakes a go.
Good luck!
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Edited by figgusfiddus (07/21/07 03:26 AM)
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7205808 - 07/21/07 09:10 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Wow thanks a lot figgusfiddus,
-That was a lot of great tips that will definately help me out. Ithink im going to inoculate 10 1/2 pint jars. I will probably use 3 cakes for a casing. I was going to use the 50/50 mix, what do you guys think?
-Oh yeah, I was on ebay and I saw a bunch of PC's for cheap. But I couldn't really tell how much volume each one had just by looking at the pictures. What size do you think would be sufficient to inoculate 10 1/2 pint jars?
Thanks a lot everyone, AG Tek
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sproket13
Stranger



Registered: 10/26/05
Posts: 571
Loc: FL
Last seen: 11 years, 6 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7205856 - 07/21/07 09:41 AM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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im growing 8 jars right now. i wanna case, but i think for my first time this will be just fine. ill try casing after this one goes well. so far the jars are about 25% colonized 5 days after inoculation. no contams yet! *crosses fingers*
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: sproket13]
#7206251 - 07/21/07 12:23 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thats awesome i hope i have the same luck. What is your setup you plan on using? You should definatley post pictures of your fruiting and harvest. What strain are you using?
Good Luck, AG Tek
-------------------- "Drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least they're the scenic route."~Author Unknown
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CaptainLinger
A Fungus Amongus


Registered: 05/25/07
Posts: 1,756
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7206609 - 07/21/07 01:56 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Your first comment on casing...sounds good, that's standard.
Quote:
-Oh yeah, I was on ebay and I saw a bunch of PC's for cheap. But I couldn't really tell how much volume each one had just by looking at the pictures. What size do you think would be sufficient to inoculate 10 1/2 pint jars?
Inoculation is the process of introducing your starter (mycelium or spores) into the jars. PC is for sterilization.
You don't have to do them all at once. Half pint jars are tiny too. If you're only doing 10 half-pints, just buy a tiny, cheap one. Do two batches.
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7207279 - 07/21/07 04:59 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
AG Tek said: Wow thanks a lot figgusfiddus,
-That was a lot of great tips that will definately help me out. Ithink im going to inoculate 10 1/2 pint jars. I will probably use 3 cakes for a casing. I was going to use the 50/50 mix, what do you guys think?
-Oh yeah, I was on ebay and I saw a bunch of PC's for cheap. But I couldn't really tell how much volume each one had just by looking at the pictures. What size do you think would be sufficient to inoculate 10 1/2 pint jars?
Thanks a lot everyone, AG Tek
The 8qt I sometimes use can only hold six half-pints, or one quart jar. Anything smaller than that (and most PCs are really tiny, 4qt or 6qt) is probably undesirable. Really though, the bigger the better. I'd kill to be able to afford one of those big AA models right now.
Like Linger said, though, it doesn't hurt to do multiple batches. Saving money is always nice, unless you're willing to throw it around and get a monster PC. I've been doing a lot of cakes lately for fun, and in the course of a day you can get three to four batches through your PC without a problem.
There's nothing prettier than having twelve cakes on every rack of your greenhouse at the same time.
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Edited by figgusfiddus (07/21/07 05:03 PM)
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7207485 - 07/21/07 06:11 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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I would really like to get a good PC eventually. Right now I think I'm going to use the boiling tek. I'm in the process of moving into an apartment so Ive been going throw a lot of money getting that set up. Right now my goal is to get a couple moderate yields without ANY contaminants so i can get some confidence under my feet, then I will look into bulk.
- Does anybody have any idea what type of yield I can expect from 7 BRF cakes in a fruiting chamber w/ perlite and 3 cakes in a 50/50 casing using only the boiling tek?
Thanks, AG Tek
-------------------- "Drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least they're the scenic route."~Author Unknown
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7207575 - 07/21/07 06:39 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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My average total yield (all flushes combined) from a single half pint cake is about 7g dry. Others have had similar results.
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7207646 - 07/21/07 07:05 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Thats the exact amount I've calculated for 1 cake by viewing another members grow log. I just wasn't sure where 7g dried stood for one cake as far being either above average or below average.
Thanks for giving me something to aim for, AG Tek
-------------------- "Drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least they're the scenic route."~Author Unknown
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figgusfiddus
Arrogant Worm


Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2,126
Loc: Figgus, Fiddia
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: AG Tek]
#7207724 - 07/21/07 07:34 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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Total yield is pretty much just a function of the amount of nutritious substrate used in a cake. Since it's always BRF, and it's always about the same quantity, it's going to be remarkably constant.
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AG Tek
Let The GoodTimes Roll



Registered: 07/16/07
Posts: 305
Loc: Alaska, United Sates
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
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Re: Beginner: Cultivation Summary [Re: figgusfiddus]
#7208179 - 07/21/07 09:59 PM (17 years, 5 months ago) |
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-Now do you know if there is any substitute that will yield better results using the PF Tek w/ perlite as opposed to BRF? (haha...am I spelling perlite right? its always underlined red as if I'm spelling it incorrectly)
-So "Since it's always BRF, and it's always about the same quantity, it's going to be remarkably constant." Why do some of us use 1/2 pint jars? (I am assuming when you say BRF you mean a brown rice flour/vermiculite cake)
Thanks, AG Tek
-------------------- "Drugs may be the road to nowhere, but at least they're the scenic route."~Author Unknown
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