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Offline2end4
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phalaris grass used in substrate????
    #7179928 - 07/15/07 04:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Any theories or experience with adding phalaris grass??? I know adding tryptophan could be benificial.


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Offlinemoon_glue
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7180114 - 07/15/07 05:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

im pretty sure the shrooms wouldnt absorb the DMT out of it. would be bad ass if they could

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OfflineMYSTIQUE
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: moon_glue]
    #7180670 - 07/15/07 08:07 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Sorry I asked this and RR shot it down He said they don't have circulatory systems they don't absorb stuff like that there was more reasons. Then I got some why don't you just take the dmt out yourself and not waste it answers.


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OfflineBipolarRocket
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: MYSTIQUE]
    #7180789 - 07/15/07 08:31 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I'm still confused as to why someone hasn't put up a Tek for introducing tryptamines into the substrate, mushrooms can effectively absorb tryptamines and change them into a derivitive which will be metabolised during digestion. (In some college biology book...)

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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7180817 - 07/15/07 08:38 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

last time i checked, you had to inject or smoke dmt.. swallowing it does nothing. and last time i checked on shrooms, people never inject it for obvious reasons, and smoking it doesnt do anything. so it would be pretty pointless to ingest a mushroom that has dmt in it right?


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Offlineboneynerd
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7181037 - 07/15/07 09:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

ive heard from another grower, who uses redwood bark in his substrate it increased his potency. but i dont know how much, or if it was just his strain is good and the dmt was not doing anything.

my opinion, is extract the dmt. extract psilocybin... eat/drink the psilocybin then smoke the dmt.. that would be the most effective way to go into orbit i suppose. but i dont want to venture their, they are each in their own category and would be a science experiment on your brain lol.


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OfflineBipolarRocket
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: boneynerd]
    #7181112 - 07/15/07 09:47 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

No, DMT has a good oral bioavailability. 2end4, go for it. Although... I don't know... I wouldn't like 5-MeO in there... you could always extract the DMT and put it into the substrate, though.

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OfflineMYSTIQUE
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: BipolarRocket]
    #7181630 - 07/15/07 11:39 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

BipolarRocket said:
No, DMT has a good oral bioavailability. 2end4, go for it. Although... I don't know... I wouldn't like 5-MeO in there... you could always extract the DMT and put it into the substrate, though.




If you put good DMT in a sub you should be kicked in the nuts.


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Dont know what the fuck I just said? READ THIS
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I ain't a hippy but I'm covered in dirt                         
Sippin lots of mushroom tea in a tye-dye shirt
Chasin' the Grateful Dead, no shoes on my feet
Beggin' in the parking lot for something to eat,

:onfire:DO NOT USE FIRE IN YOUR GLOVE BOX!!!!!!!:onfire:

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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7181740 - 07/16/07 12:10 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i was thinking that too, why waist already extracted dmt..


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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7181756 - 07/16/07 12:14 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

It's a waste, yeah, unless you don't want to go through the process of extraction.

I respect RR to no end, but I have read in advanced (from a lot of users, ones who seem to know what they're talking about) that shrooms can theoretically convert DMT into 4-Hydroxy-DMT (psilocin). RR's approach tends to be one of, "Why bother? Just grow some fucking shrooms. I'll show you how." If you prefer experimentation, sure, go for it, but don't be too disappointed if it doesn't work.

RR's response about circulation had to do with someone trying to blow smoke into an FC. Which is retarded.

Shrooms don't have a "circulatory system" in the sense that we do, but that doesn't mean they don't circulate their resources. If they didn't, they couldn't grow. That shrooms don't have a circulatory system is RR's standard response to questions like this, and as much as I do respect him I think it's short-sighted. Shrooms acquire all kinds of substances through the substrate--carbohydrates, moisture, toxins--and there's no reason an active chemical couldn't be one of them.

But, of course, there are no guarantees, and since most of us don't have an empirical method for testing potency at hand, we can't test it reliably.

In my mind, that's what it comes down to: we're unable to see whether or not it's working when we do it, so we can't really experiment with it effectively.


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Edited by figgusfiddus (07/16/07 12:15 AM)

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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7181795 - 07/16/07 12:25 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

the fact that shrooms effect everyone differently every time they do them might be the cause of not being able to determine potency or even if adding dmt did anything. If something works, why fix it?


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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7181839 - 07/16/07 12:39 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Right. Which is the traditional approach.

There are many types of growers. Some are interested in theory, some are purely interested in the practice. I like both a lot, but I tip toward the first. As a result, I'd fucking love to know whether a DMT additive can be synthesized into the shroom's natural actives.


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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7181866 - 07/16/07 12:47 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

im just as bad, i have 6 jars i just inoculated (with lc) today that the water put in the verm/brf mix had a crushed up centrum performance pill mixed in with it and a teaspoon of honey. just for kicks and giggles, cause i already had 18 jars going, might as well make it an even 24 and get some curiousity out of the way.


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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: deformedreality]
    #7182030 - 07/16/07 02:26 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

If you're going to experiment, be sure to record yields and perceived potency.


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Offline2end4
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: figgusfiddus]
    #7182720 - 07/16/07 10:26 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

The main reason im curious is because 5htp and tryptamine are known to increase potency. On top of that, I read a plant analysis that states precursors to DMT, like MT , gramine,and MDT(to name a few) at different stages of growth in different concentrations. Im open to the idea because of the different things ive read on the subject (online or in print). I know potency can vary many ways due to substrates and strains, but ive read it can reproduce the agent in "4-meo" form. Anyone had any experience with just 5HTP or tryptamine??????


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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7182728 - 07/16/07 10:33 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

A scientist (only one, I think) has gone on the record saying it works.

A few people have reported fiddling with it, but none of them seem to have adopted it as a regular technique, and none I've seen have stated a noticeable difference in potency. That doesn't mean it doesn't work, but it might mean it's impractical.


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Offline2end4
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7182735 - 07/16/07 10:37 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I fully agree with you figgusfiddus, do you believe that blueing of mycelium can be an indication of potency???


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Offlinefiggusfiddus
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7183213 - 07/16/07 12:52 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Technically bluing is more an indicator of psilocin content. As I understand it, Gartz's supplementation of tryptamine HCL to substrate produced an increase in psilocin content and a decrease in psilocybin content... so you'd see a lot of bluing there, in theory, but a lot of the actives you're seeing would oxidize, especially if you dried the fruits.

In other words, if you're seeing blue in any circumstance, it could just mean you're seeing actives that were present, but which have now oxidized away. Typically though, a bluer fruit is a more potent one, because so many actives wouldn't be oxidizing away if they weren't present in higher proportion to begin with.


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Offline2end4
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: figgusfiddus]
    #7183510 - 07/16/07 02:20 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for your input Figgus........your thinking is right up my alley!:thumbup:


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: phalaris grass used in substrate???? [Re: 2end4]
    #7183989 - 07/16/07 04:24 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

However, some of the most potent mushrooms I've ever eaten barely bruised at all. Other, non-active species also bruise blue, so I'm not too sure it's an indication of anything.

I've made many side by side grows with all sorts of supplements and haven't found a single one that I can document an increased potency from. At one time or another, I've tried everything in this thread, as well as just about everything ever suggested in the other duplicate threads on the subject, as well as dozens of substrate materials. Personally, none of them gave even a percieved increase in potency. Those were the experiments that led me to believe potency in mushrooms to be genetic.
RR


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