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Jerrico
Cat



Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 83
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? 1
#6952796 - 05/22/07 04:56 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Note: Yes, I have searched and read the forums for at least half an hour prior to asking the question.
After innoculating some BRF jars the initial germination and growth was at a decent speed but then after about 10 days it stalled at about 30% colonized. I can see the BRF mixture has shrunk up considerably where the mycelium is present and seems very dry. I have tried opening the jars in a glove box to give them air, but this did not restart the growth as it has been 2 weeks since then. I have incubated them at a constant temperature of 84F/28.5C in darkness. The vermiculite was moist as per instructions, and previously this water content worked well. The jars have self-healing injection ports and holes covered with tyvek for air exchange. I think the problem is that the spores were much older now (6 months old) and it may have took them longer to germinate (I'm not so sure about the exact time when i saw mycelium growth) so in the meantime too much water evaporated. I have found some good suggestions on the forum and I would like you to advise me on which is the best option (those available to me):
1-Boil water, draw into a syringe (which was sterilised in a microwave), and insert water into the jar through the inoculation ports inside the glovebox 2-(my idea) Same as #1 only give water a 1% H2O2 content just to be safe because mycelium isn't harmed by it. 3-Dunk the jars with lids off into water bath with 1% of H2O2 content for 24+ hours, then put lids back on and take them out.
Finally, if the air exchange isn't the problem, and this doesn't help, what else could be the reason for failure of colonization? Keeping in mind that i cannot see any contams.
-------------------- Curiousity killed the cat, so it can be curious only 8 more times.
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hyphae
born to grow



Registered: 12/13/02
Posts: 6,228
Loc: the rain forests
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: Jerrico] 1
#6952833 - 05/22/07 05:08 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Even moisture content is our goal here first and foremost. You could do a 3% peroxide dunk if your hellbent on this track. I would recommend doing another batch with proper moisture content. Keep the jars in optimum incubation conditions will only help things but is moisture content is off your screwed for the most part. GL either way bro
-------------------- Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is Gas Exchange vs. FAE "We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"
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Meatfart
Peek-A-BooMothafucker!



Registered: 04/04/07
Posts: 79
Loc: Tha Bayou City
Last seen: 16 years, 8 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: hyphae] 1
#6952859 - 05/22/07 05:14 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Would it be pointless to try to inject them with a little water at this point? (he's gonna have to toss them anyway) I've never heard of anyone tring that.
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Edited by Meatfart (05/22/07 08:00 PM)
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boneynerd
Mushway! EatFresh!



Registered: 04/23/07
Posts: 1,287
Loc: milkyway.usa
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: hyphae] 1
#6952860 - 05/22/07 05:15 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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re-inoculate with some liquid culture if a jar seems too dry. its quickest. otherwise, let it go. give it a few days if no progress then move on.
-------------------- "Your mama's grow was so contaminated, the shroomery got trich." -SpitballJediS "your a female, no one woulda cared you were naked,hell probably made someone's day, but I pull my balls out on a bus and im the bad guy.." -Bishlap
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Jerrico
Cat



Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 83
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: hyphae] 1
#6952875 - 05/22/07 05:20 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
hyphae said: Even moisture content is our goal here first and foremost. You could do a 3% peroxide dunk if your hellbent on this track. I would recommend doing another batch with proper moisture content. Keep the jars in optimum incubation conditions will only help things but is moisture content is off your screwed for the most part. GL either way bro
But you see all (ie 100%) of my BRF jars have stalled. And they all had proper water content which worked before. It's just that the spores seem to old and redoing it with them doesn't make much sense. The same thing would happen if I did it all over again in the same way. Maybe I could add more water this time?
However I will be getting fresh spores in a few days so I may try again with those. :P
I think I'll dunk them if nobody comes up with better suggestions.
Thanks
-------------------- Curiousity killed the cat, so it can be curious only 8 more times.
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boneynerd
Mushway! EatFresh!



Registered: 04/23/07
Posts: 1,287
Loc: milkyway.usa
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: Jerrico] 1
#6952885 - 05/22/07 05:24 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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dude, re-inoculate with some Liquid Culture.. it adds more moisture/water... gives some sugar (small amount but thats ok) and some more mycelium... means its steroids for stalled jars =P i do it all the time (last 12 jars loved it when i added some lc if they looked dry).
-------------------- "Your mama's grow was so contaminated, the shroomery got trich." -SpitballJediS "your a female, no one woulda cared you were naked,hell probably made someone's day, but I pull my balls out on a bus and im the bad guy.." -Bishlap
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Jerrico
Cat



Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 83
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: boneynerd] 1
#6952901 - 05/22/07 05:30 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
boneynerd said: dude, re-inoculate with some Liquid Culture.. it adds more moisture/water... gives some sugar (small amount but thats ok) and some more mycelium... means its steroids for stalled jars =P i do it all the time (last 12 jars loved it when i added some lc if they looked dry).
Uh... yes sorry I skipped a reply to you, but I don't have any liquid cultures available. Though I do have 3 fully colonized jars in the fridge. So I was just reading up on how it's done, cause I've never made liquid cultures. I might give it a go, let me think about it. It might be the speediest solution!
-------------------- Curiousity killed the cat, so it can be curious only 8 more times.
Edited by Jerrico (05/22/07 05:30 PM)
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boneynerd
Mushway! EatFresh!



Registered: 04/23/07
Posts: 1,287
Loc: milkyway.usa
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: Jerrico] 1
#6952982 - 05/22/07 05:55 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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if you get another spore syringe, definately get like 2-3 jars of Liquid Cultures going its not hard. There is allot of teks available, but basically what I do is:
1. get a 1/2pint jar with lid, or a baby bottle works GREAT *jar needs to have 2 holes, 1 for pressure release the other for using your syringe in.
2. fill jar/baby bottle with 1/2 cup of water (bottle or top)
3. pour 1 teaspoon of light corn syrup (karo or any other store brand works too) into the water
4. pressure cook for 20-30minutes (liquid sterilizes easier the substrate so you wont want to go longer then 30 minutes). Since its liquid, you can even just boil it for 45-40minutes on the stove (ive done this with 100% ive never had a bad LC, even now after i have a pressure cooker cause water is so easy to sterilize).
5. let jar cool, move to glovebox... sterilize needle, and inoculate the LC with Half a CC(ml) or more of spores... let sit for 5-10 days and ur all set! I recommend puttin the LC in a warm place, it goes quicker and contams (if any) will show faster too.
Plus with this liquid culture when you run out of spores, you can just sterilize your syringe and suck it up and use it just like spores.. and its quicker 
but im sure youll learn this in a tek somewhere.
-------------------- "Your mama's grow was so contaminated, the shroomery got trich." -SpitballJediS "your a female, no one woulda cared you were naked,hell probably made someone's day, but I pull my balls out on a bus and im the bad guy.." -Bishlap
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hyphae
born to grow



Registered: 12/13/02
Posts: 6,228
Loc: the rain forests
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: Jerrico] 1
#6953030 - 05/22/07 06:07 PM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Well if you have the proper moisture content then adding more water won't do any good. If you have three fully colonized cultures then you'll want to do the 3 to 1 tek which entails making up 9 more BRF jars and spawning each jar in three separate ziplocks at a rate of 3 uncolonized jars to one colonized jar doing this in a glovebox of course. This will leave you with a very nice amount (after fully colonized) for making up some casings. (recommended)
-------------------- Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is Gas Exchange vs. FAE "We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"
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Jerrico
Cat



Registered: 09/25/06
Posts: 83
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: boneynerd] 1
#6955224 - 05/23/07 04:41 AM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
boneynerd said: if you get another spore syringe, definately get like 2-3 jars of Liquid Cultures going its not hard. There is allot of teks available, but basically what I do is:
Thanks for the introduction. I will do this in addition to dunking some of the other jars.
Quote:
hyphae said: Well if you have the proper moisture content then adding more water won't do any good.
I have proper moisture content for fresh spores, not for old ones. I think I've seen people recommend more water content if spores are older, or did I?
-------------------- Curiousity killed the cat, so it can be curious only 8 more times.
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hyphae
born to grow



Registered: 12/13/02
Posts: 6,228
Loc: the rain forests
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
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Re: Stalled jars seem too dry, what to do? [Re: Jerrico] 1
#6955392 - 05/23/07 06:27 AM (16 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Jerrico said:
Quote:
boneynerd said: if you get another spore syringe, definately get like 2-3 jars of Liquid Cultures going its not hard. There is allot of teks available, but basically what I do is:
Thanks for the introduction. I will do this in addition to dunking some of the other jars.
Quote:
hyphae said: Well if you have the proper moisture content then adding more water won't do any good.
I have proper moisture content for fresh spores, not for old ones. I think I've seen people recommend more water content if spores are older, or did I?
You may have heard that but they are incorrect. Older spores need to rehydrate before they can germinate true but the amount needed is very minor certainly not to the point of throwing off a jars moisture content as the spores themselves will not absorb any noticeable amount of water.
-------------------- Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy. Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is Gas Exchange vs. FAE "We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"
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