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OfflineSymmetryGroup8
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Un-crackble... software??
    #6936937 - 05/19/07 02:30 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

SO I'm having this debate about software crack.

My point is that I think you cannot ever secure software. Software can be cracked under most circumstances. If they can secure software then how come you still have games cracked?

His argument is that software companies don't secure their software because they want to gain market share through piracy.

I'm not well informed enough on this topic so what do you guys think?

Also the guy claim that you can use one time encryption methods. But do that only apply to encrpyting files?

How can you encrypt a runnable program? As long as you run the program you can look at it's source code right?

Besides for software would it not be efficient if when you run any code you have to encrypt and decrypt on the fly.


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: Un-crackble... software?? [Re: SymmetryGroup8]
    #6937654 - 05/19/07 06:07 AM (13 years, 11 months ago)

There is no such thing as uncrackable software as long as the user has unrestricted access to the hardware. Period.

There are some hardware implementations that store their firmware (software) in a manner that makes it very difficult to crack. For example, the HC11 micro-controller has built in eprom to store the software within the CPU itself. You can store decryption software, and a key in the chip itself and use that code to decrypt whatever is stored in off-chip ROM.

The above would stop the typical hacker, but it is not going to stop the Chinese government, assuming they had unrestricted access to the hardware. With the proper tools, you can remove the dye from the chip and reverse engineer the entire thing, including whatever is stored in ROM on the chip.

In military hardware, the circuits are designed so that if the cases are improperly opened, or the hardware is improperly removed, they chips burn up, effectively restricting access to the hardware.

> How can you encrypt a runnable program? As long as you run the program you can look at it's source code right?

I wrote a virus one time that decrypted itself on the fly. On the 80x86 hardware, there is an interrupt that is called every time an instruction is fetched. I hooked the interrupt and used it to decrypt the instruction. I was more worried about altercation than anything, and the encryption was actually for error correction. Even if an antivirus guy changed the code while it was running, it would self corrects, assuming the changes were small enough. (I played with virus code to learn, never released anything.) There always has to be a small bit of code that is unencrypted to decode the rest of the code.

Regarding one time encryption... Won't work unless you call in to get the key... and once you have the key, anybody can decrypt it, unless every single copy has a different key. Again, it is pointless... as long as I control the hardware, I can crack the software... one time encryption, public/private key encryption, etc... it doesn't matter.

... and for those really difficult cases that I have a hard time cracking the software... I can write new software that will alter the "game" or whatever at runtime to fool the "game" into thinking it is a legit copy.


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Invisiblepoke smot!
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Re: Un-crackble... software?? *DELETED* [Re: Seuss]
    #6938774 - 05/19/07 03:22 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Post deleted by poke smot!

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OfflineSymmetryGroup8
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Re: Un-crackble... software?? [Re: poke smot!]
    #6939535 - 05/19/07 08:11 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Informative! Thanks.


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Offlinedelta9
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Re: Un-crackble... software?? [Re: SymmetryGroup8]
    #6942555 - 05/20/07 01:44 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Adding to the rest of the posts, just for good measure:
Quote:

There is NO SUCH THING as uncrackable software



All that can ever really be done in the end is obfusication through various means and multiple integrity checks that cause Bad Behaviour. This way, novice crackers will think they cracked your stuff and end up with something broken... but it is only going to slow down someone dedicated and/or experienced enough.


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OfflineLegend9123
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Re: Un-crackble... software?? [Re: Seuss]
    #6947795 - 05/21/07 05:33 PM (13 years, 11 months ago)

Great post Seuss. As many others have stated it is virtually impossible to create a perfect software encryption.

"Every day, man is making bigger and better fool-proof things, and every day, nature is making bigger and better fools. So far, I think nature is winning." -Albert Einstein


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Those who would give up a little freedom to get a little security shall soon have neither.
-Benjamin Franklin


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