The Shroomery


This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: North Spore Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

Jump to first unread post Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Icelander]
    #6925213 - 05/16/07 01:53 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

I think that this is the quote which I read as implying that more-evolved thinking was undesirable:

Once the assemblage point has moved, the movement itself entails moving from self-reflection, and this, in turn, assures a clear connecting link with the spirit. After all, it was self-reflection that had disconnected man from the spirit in the first place.

Self-reflection is what makes us what we are, homo sapiens sapiens, thinking thinking man. We are able to reflect upon ourselves, upon our thoughts, to take a step back from our reactions to events & consider what we might do differently.

While it might be true that obsessive thinking could separate us from spirit, or at least interfere with our enjoyment of being alive, I cannot see how self-reflection, in and of itself, would disconnect us.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
Female User Gallery


Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Icelander]
    #6925262 - 05/16/07 02:06 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

In my opinion this is a matter of semantics. From what I recall, the “thinking” Castaneda was mentioning were in fact questions with a paranoid attitude. By thinking I understand something more lucid and elaborate and also something based on logic, which was not the case presented there since all he did was a constant denial that there might of been more to reality then his eyes could see and his ears could hear. That is fixed thinking, which also, in my opinion, puts a stop to getting further into a lucid inquire. Having the thought that he was being fooled by some master-tricks of Don Juan is not a healthy attitude and does not sustain any form of rational since, having that in mind, he continued being Don Juan’s apprentice.
So, in my opinion, what Don Juan was disagreeing was that paranoid attitude and not thinking itself. Sometimes putting too many questions are an impediment to real thinking because they confuse us even more. Trying to find equivalent from the material in the esoteric is like thinking your meditative state. This is all about mind states and having to put a stop to ones thoughts for a period does not exclude the ability to think in other circumstances. More to that, I think we get out more of any experience if we use them both in the right circumstances.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,689
Loc: On the Border
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Veritas]
    #6925688 - 05/16/07 03:57 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

More evolved thinking...as you put it...is very suitable to rational tasks, but quite undesirable for non rational based functions such as creative thought. I do not think Castaneda ever considered complex thought undesirable, as he was very invested in his intellectual achievements and often said so. I do think that he thought that there was also a time and place for more basic thought as well. Both forms of thought are nothing but tools with specific uses. Self reflection IS what separates us from other species...and the true seat of power for homosapien, but it is also the root of misery for our species as well.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #6925852 - 05/16/07 04:50 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

but it is also the root of misery for our species as well.




Only because, without that capacity, we could not engage in neurotic thinking. Self-reflection does not cause misery, but it can be utilized ineffectively through what CC refers to as indulgence and self-importance.

To say that self-reflection is the root of human misery is akin to saying that having opposable thumbs is the root of stabbing yourself with a knife.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHuehuecoyotl
Fading Slowly
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 10,689
Loc: On the Border
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Veritas]
    #6925896 - 05/16/07 05:04 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

I agree, and that was what I intended to mean.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleVeritas
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/15/05
Posts: 11,089
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #6925921 - 05/16/07 05:11 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

What?  You mean we agree, as usual.  How boring.  :wink:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinegrebarius
Whitebread
Male


Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 155
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Veritas]
    #6927380 - 05/16/07 10:32 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
According to Carlos Castaneda's Don Juan anyway, there was a time according to him that humans possessed silent knowledge. Knowing without thinking. He called it seeing. When mankind began his self reflection he kicked himself out of Eden so to speak.



Yep evolution's a bitch :crazy2:. The period of silent knowledge sounds to me like the period when humans didn't have language, the period when there was no internal dialoge, the period when we unintillegent.

Quote:

Icelander said:The path of Sorcery then is a way of returning to silent knowledge by dethroning self-importance as our primary way of relating to our experience.




Im going to side with Veritas here and say de-evolving and obsessive thinking aren't necesary, that it is in front not behind where we should look. I do agree that the ego must be kept in check, but that is what we have that wonderful internal dialogue for. I know am just an animal here but dethroning self-importance? Now i have to side with Ayn Rand and disagree with that. Dethroning my self-importance would extinguish the fire inside. Just sit back and kill motivation?

Quote:

Icelander said:Once obsessive thinking about ourselves is reduced or stopped for a time then we again experience silent awareness and are guided by a clear channel of intuition.




Whether it sounds like it or not, I DO understand where you are coming from, I do know the type of thinking/people you are talking about. We must keep ourselves in check by whichever technique we prefer.

Quote:

Veritas said:
The new brain will be in the driver's seat, whether we dream of steering with the old brain or not.  The question is, will that driver be clutching the wheel, overcome by Road Rage, drinking coffee and eating a sandwich while talking on the cell phone, or will that driver be calmly cruising through everyday life?




              :thumbup:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleLosAngelesGraff
Ca Shroomite
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 06/09/06
Posts: 7,047
Loc: Califas
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Icelander]
    #6928509 - 05/17/07 03:42 AM (16 years, 11 months ago)

:karatechop: thanks for the info!!! really tho


--------------------
:prawn::baggy::zilla:
Please help support cover-upz blog
http://cover-upz.blogspot.com/
Please PM me if you can help build cover upz blog.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinegrebarius
Whitebread
Male


Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 155
Last seen: 13 years, 2 months
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: LosAngelesGraff]
    #6928842 - 05/17/07 07:25 AM (16 years, 11 months ago)

blah, i should have read more thoroughly :crazy:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleRecondicom
Power of four
 User Gallery

Registered: 05/03/07
Posts: 226
Re: Sorcery, the journey of return. [Re: Veritas]
    #6929942 - 05/17/07 12:05 PM (16 years, 11 months ago)

The collective consciousness gives ideas to the individual. The chronological life is a conscious thought as well.
1913: Watson said that the subject matter of psychology should be behavior, not consciousness and gives allegations that consciousness is a hangover from our superstitious pre-scientific past, akin to belief in witchcraft. 1971 Skinner: in ‘Beyond freedom and dignity’, extends the work done with monkeys into the human realm; a deterministic denial of freedom in the post existentialist pre internet age. As Pavlov goes so is the power of rejection as we find new ways to describe its path to the genetic core. Casuistic anomalies find the way to reality. So there is The teachings of Don Juan followed by a Different Reality and The Clan of the Cave Bear followed by Valley of the horses by Auel. Agreement? According to sophism the truth is just a matter of votes / (therefore) the idea of magic is all-powerful. Said the millions.


--------------------
Wave.
'And for this reason repentance (metanoia) is an elevating means. For he who feels impatience with the circunstances in which he finds himself, devises means of escape.
  Now the chief thing in purification is the will. For then both deeds and words lend a helping hand. But, when the will is absent, the whole purificatory discipline of initiation is...'

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: < Back | 1 | 2 | 3  [ show all ]

Shop: North Spore Bulk Substrate   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* The Dark Legacy of Carlos Castaneda
( 1 2 3 all )
Huehuecoyotl 10,392 41 07/02/07 03:30 AM
by truekimbo2
* Carlos Castaneda, thoughts anyone?
( 1 2 3 all )
Cosmic_Monkey 7,373 47 07/18/10 04:21 PM
by OrgoneConclusion
* Castaneda...
( 1 2 all )
kratomboy 3,556 35 05/13/05 09:38 PM
by Huehuecoyotl
* castaneda
( 1 2 all )
Traveller 4,034 28 11/16/01 10:56 AM
by Traveller
* Lynn V. Andrews (female Castaneda)
( 1 2 all )
Swami 3,796 31 07/13/04 07:46 PM
by Huehuecoyotl
* Carlos Castaneda
( 1 2 all )
starptv23 4,698 34 07/26/05 05:16 AM
by Huehuecoyotl
* Carlos Castaneda
( 1 2 all )
Gomp 2,962 23 11/05/04 06:58 PM
by Huehuecoyotl
* Castaneda Complete
( 1 2 all )
Huehuecoyotl 4,548 25 12/09/06 01:05 PM
by Icelander

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
4,434 topic views. 0 members, 8 guests and 1 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Happy 4/20 from The Shroomery!

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.