Jickey Mouse said:

Do you think that knowledge and information are being kept from the majority of people on Earth?

Do you think a few are controlling the many?

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Deluded people...Learn that there exists a conspiracy in favor of despotism against liberty, of incapacity against talent, of vice against virtue, of ignorance against enlightenment…This society aims at governing the world…its object is universal domination…No such calamity has ever yet afflicted the world - Marquis de Luchet (Essai sur la Secte des Illumnines, 1789)




Behind the division of humanity stand those Enlightened Ones whose right and privilege it is to watch over human evolution and to guide the destinies of men…This they do through the implanting of ideas in the minds of the world thinkers, so that these ideas in due time receive recognition and eventually become controlling factors in human life. They train the members of the New Group of World Servers in the task of changing these ideas into ideals. These in turn become the desired objectives of the thinkers and are then taught to the powerful middle class and worked up into world forms of governments or religion, thus forming the basis of the new world order - Alice Bailey (Occultist. Fabian Author. Head of the Lucis Trust)




…We see our edifice…crumbling and covering the ground with ruins, we see the destruction that our hands no longer arrest…a great sect arose, which taking for its motto the good and the happiness of man, worked in the darkness of the conspiracy to make the happiness of humanity a prey for itself. This sect is known to everyone, its brothers are known no less than it name. it is they who have undermined the foundations of the Order to the point of complete overthrow; it is by them that all humanity has been poisoned and led astray for several generations…They began by casting odium on religion…Their masters had nothing less in view than the thrones of the earth, and the governments of the nations was to be directed by their nocturnal clubs…the misuse of our order…has produced all the political and moral troubles with which the world is filled today…we must from this moment dissolve the whole Order - Duke of Brunswick (Grand Master of Freemasonry. Manifesto to the Lodges, 1794. Source: La Franc-Maconnerie dans sa veritable signification)


I have been convinced that we, as an Order, have come under the power of some very evil occult Order, profoundly versed in science both occult and otherwise, though not infallible, their methods being BLACK MAGIC, that is to say, electro-magnetic power, hypnotism and powerful suggestion. We are convinced that the Order is being controlled by some Sun Order, after the nature of the Illuminati, if not by that Order itself - The Duke of Brunswick




Amidst the universal storm produced by the present revolutions in the political and moral world, at this period of supreme illumination and of profound blindness, it would be a crime against truth and humanity to leave any longer shrouded in a veil that can provide the only key to past and future events, things that should show to thousands of men whether the path they have been made to follow is the path of folly or of wisdom. It has to do with...all degrees and of all secret systems - The Duke of Brunswick (Grand Master of Freemasonry. Manifesto to the Lodges, 1794. Source: La Franc-Maconnerie dans sa veritable signification)


A great sect arose which, taking for its motto the good and the happiness of humanity a prey for itself. This sect is known to everyone: its brothers are known no less than its name. It is they who have undermined the foundations of the Order to the point of complete overthrow; it is by them that all humanity has been poisoned and led astray for several generations. The ferment that reigns amongst the peoples is their work.


They founded the plans of their insatiable ambition on the political pride of nations. Their founders arranged to introduce this pride into the heads of the peoples. They began by casting odium on religion...They invented the rights of man which it is impossible to discover even in the book of Nature, and they urged the people to wrest from their princes the recognition of these supposed rights.


The plan they had formed for breaking all social ties and of destroying all order was revealed in all their speeches and acts. They deluged the world with a multitude of publications...they deluded the most perspicacious men...They sowed in the hearts of youth the seed of covetousness, and they excited it with the bait of the most insatiable passions...Indomitable pride, thirst of power, such were the only motives of this sect; their masters had nothing less in view than the thrones of the earth, and the government of the nations was to be directed by their nocturnal clubs- ibid




Masonry, successor of the Mysteries, still follows the ancient manner of teaching. Masonry is identical with the ancient Mysteries - Albert Pike (Morals and Dogma, 1871)



We form an association of brothers in all points of the globe…Yet there is one unseen that can hardly be felt, yet it weighs on us. Whence comes it? Where is it? No one knows…or at least no one tells. This association is secret even to us the veterans of the Secret Societies - Guiseppe Mazzini (Head of the Bavarian Illuminati 1800s. Successor to Weishaupt)




Freemasonry is a fraternity within a fraternity - an outer organization concealing an inner brotherhood of the elect...It is necessary to establish the existence of these two separate yet independent orders, the one visible and the other invisible. The visible society is a splendid camaraderie of free and accepted men enjoined to devote themselves to ethical, educational, fraternal, patriotic, and humanitarian concerns. The invisible society is a secret and most august fraternity whose members are dedicated to the service of the mysterious arcanum acandrum (a secret or mystery). In each generation, only a few are accepted into the inner sanctuary of the Work - Manly Palmer Hall (Lectures on Ancient Philosophy, 1929)




I do conscientiously and sincerely believe that the Order of Freemasonry, if not the greatest, is one of the greatest moral and political evils under which the Union is not laboring - President John Quincy Adams (Conspiracy Against God and Man)



There is sufficient evidence that a number of societies of the Illuminati have been established in this land. They are doubtless striving to secretly undermine all our ancient institutions, civil and sacred. These societies are clearly leagued with those of the same order in Europe...We live in an alarming period. The Enemies of all order are seeking our ruin. Should infidelity generally prevail, our independence would fall, or course. Our republican government would be annihilated - Joseph Willard (President Harvard University. Spoken during his retirement address of 1812)




The great strength of our Order lies in its concealment; let it never appear in any place in its own name, but always covered by another name, and another occupation. None is fitter than the three lower degrees of Freemasonry; the public is accustomed to it, expects little from it, and therefore takes little notice of it - Adam Weishaupt (Founder of the Bavarian Illuminati, 1776. From John Robinson’s Proofs of a Conspiracy, 1798)



A holy war will now begin on America, and when it is ended America will be supposedly the citadel of freedom, but her millions will unknowingly be loyal subjects to the Crown...Your churches will be used to teach the Jew's religion and in less than two hundred years the whole nation will be working for Divine World Government. That government that they believe to be divine will be the British Empire. All religions will be permeated with Judaism without even being noticed by the masses, and they will all be under the invisible all-seeing eye of the Grand Architect of Freemasonry - General Cornwallis to General Washington (as recorded by Jonathan Williams in Legions of Satan, 1781)




Now, you hear of the Rothschilds in the world of finance. They are not the originators of the control over finance and the practices therein. But they have been given a franchise to control the money aspect of the people of the world. In return for their exercising this control and keeping their mouth shut they are given handsome privileges of money manipulation and of course increase their money wealth by leaps and bounds - Norman Dodd (Research Director of the 1950s Reese Commission investing tax exempt companies and foundations. The papers and reports of Dodd can be found in the book: The Tax-Exempt Foundations, by Bill McLlhany)




"For more than a century ideological extremists at either end of the political spectrum have seized upon well-publicized incidents such as my encounter with Castro to attack the Rockefeller family for the inordinate influence they claim we wield over American political and economic institutions. Some even believe we are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as ‘internationalists’ and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure - one world, if you will…If that’s the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it "- David Rockefeller (Memoirs, Page 405)




"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine, and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subject to the bright lights of publicity during those years. But the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march toward world government "- David Rockefeller (Address to the Trilateral Commission, June 1991)



To play those millions of minds, to watch them slowly respond to an unseen stimulus, to guide their aspirations without their knowledge - all this whether in high capacities or in humble, is a big and endless game of chess, of ever extraordinary excitement - Sidney Webb (co-founder of the Fabian Society)



Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we - George W. Bush (Freudian-Slip during BBC interview)



...if the American people had ever known the truth about what we Bushes have done to this nation, we would be chased down in the streets and lynched - George Bush Senior (interview with Sarah McClendon, December 1992)



I am, of course, a Zionist, and have been ever since the Balfour Declaration - Winston Churchill (to President Eisenhower)



The world’s power structures have always ‘divided to conquer’ and have always ‘kept divided to keep conquered.’ As a consequence the power structure has so divided humanity - not only into special function categories but into religious and language and color categories - that individual humans are now helplessly inarticulate in the face of the present crisis. They consider their political representation to be completely corrupted, therefore, they feel almost utterly helpless - R. Buckminster Fuller (Critical Path)

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"The hand that gives is above the hand that takes. Money has no motherland; financiers are without patriotism and without decency: their sole object is gain." - Napoleon Bonaparte
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"The financial system has been turned over to... the Federal Reserve Board. That Board administers the finance of...a purely profiteering group. The system is private, condudcted for the sole purpose of obtaining the greatest possible profits from the use of other people's money."- Rep. Charles. A Lindberg, R. Minn. 1923

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"These International bankers and Rockefeller-Standard Oil interests control the majority of newspapers and the columns of these papers to club into submission or drive out of public office officials who refuse to do the bidding of the powerful corrupt cliques which compose the invisible government." - Theadore Roosevelt - 1919 March 27th 1922 edition of the New York Times

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"The warning of Theodore Roosevelt has much timeliness today, for the real menace of our republic is this invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy length over city, state and nation... It seizes in its long and powerful tentacles our executive officers, our legislative bodies, our schools, our courts, our newspapers and every agency created for the public protection...
"To depart from mere generalizations, let me say that at the head of this octopus are the Rockefeller-Standard Oil interest and a small group of powerful banking houses generally referred to as the international bankers. The little coterie of powerful international bankers virtually run the United States government for their own selfish purposes."
"They practically control both parties, write political platforms, make catspaws of party leaders, use the leading men of private organizations and resort to every device to place in nomination for high public office only such candidates as will be amenable to the dictates of corrupt big business...
"These international bankers and Rockefeller-Standard Oil interests control the majority of newspapers and magazines in this counry." - John Hylan, Mayor of New York
New York Times March 26th, 1922

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"We have in this country one of the most corrupt insitutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board...This evil institution has impoverished...the people of the United States...and has practically bankrupted our Government. It has done this through...the corrupt practices of the moneyed vultures who control it." - Former chairman of House Banking & Currency Committee during the depression years , REP. Louis T. McFadden(R) Penn.

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"Most Americans have no real understanding of the operation of the international moneylenders...The accounts of the Federal Reserve System have never been audited. It operated outside the control of Congress and manipulates the credit of the United States." - Senator Barry Goldwater - R. AZ

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"The rich will strive to establish their dominion and enslave the rest. They always did. They always will... They will have the same effect here as elsewhere, if we do not by [the power of] government, keep them in their proper spheres."
-Gourvernor Morris

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Regarding the crash of '29
"It was not accidental. It was a carefully contrived occurrence... The international bankers sought to bring about a condition of despair here so that they might emerge as rulers of us all."
-Rep. Lous T. McFadden (D-PA)

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Most Americans have never heard that the Fed was responsible for the crash and subsequent depression, yet it is well known by economists.

"The Federal Reserve definately caused The Great Depresion by contracting the ammount of currency in circulation by one-third from 1929 to 1933."
--Milton Friedman, Nobel Prize winning economist

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As people here were starving, millions of dollars were spent rebuilding Germany after World War one.
Louis T. McFadden warns congress in 1931 that we're paying for Hitler's rise to power...

"After WWI Germany fell into the hands of the German international bankers. Those bankers bought her and they now own her, lock, stock, and barrel. The have purchased her industries, they have mortages on her soil, they control her production, the control all her public utilities.
"The international German bankers have subsidized the present Government of Germany and they have also supplied every dollar of the money Adolph Hitler has used in his lavish campaign to build up a threat to the government of Bruening."
"When Bruening fails to obey the orders of the German internation Bankers, Hitler is brought forth to scare the Germans into submission..."
"Through the Federal Reserve Board...over $30 billions of American money... has been pumped into Germany...You have all heard of the spending that has taken place in Germany...
modernistic dwellings, her great planetariums, her gymnasiums, her swimming pools, her fine public highways, her perfect factories. All this was done on our money. All this was given to Germany through the Federal Reserve Board."
"The Federal Reserve Board has pumped so many billions of dollars into Germany that they dare not name the total." -Louis T. McFadden

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"There will be in the next generation or so a pharmacological method of making people love their servitude and producing dictatorships without tears, so to speak. Producing a kind of painless concentration camp for entire societies so that people will in fact have their liberties taken away from them but will rather enjoy it, because they will be distracted from any desire to rebel - by propaganda, brainwashing, or brainwashing enhanced by pharmacological methods; and this seems to be the final revolution."
-Aldous Huxley ("The Final Revolution" 1959 speech at a symposium at the University of California medical school)

"It must be recognized that the power that these energetic left wingers exercised, was never their own power, or a communist power, but was ultimately the power of the international financial coterie."
-Dr. Carroll Quigley ("Tragedy and Hope" mentor to bill Clinton)

"From the days of Adam "Spartacus" Weishaupt, to those of Karl Marx, Bela Kuhn, Rosa Luxembourg, and Emma Goldman, this world-wide conspiracy has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the 19th Century, and now at last it grips the Russian people by the hair of their heads."
-Winston Churchill, written 3 years after Bolshevik takeover of Russia


"There does exist, and has existed for a generation, and international Anglophile network which operates, to some extent, in the way the radical Right believes the Communists act. In fact, this network, which we may identify as the Round Table Groups, has no aversion to cooperating with the communists, or any other groups, and frequently does so. I know of the operations of this network because I have studied it for twenty years and was permitted for two years, in the early 1960s to examine its papers and secret records. I have no aversion to it or to most of its aims and have, for much of my life, been close to it and to many of its instruments."
-Carroll Quigley

"The high office of President has been used to foment a plot to destroy the American's freedom, & before I leave office I must inform the citizen of his plight."
-President John F. Kennedy, 10 days prior to his assassination

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our response to a species threat doesnt need to be physical.

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Excellent point
I don't know where humanity is heading to, we are too many and diversified to tell that for sure. There are small groups and larger groups all different and if one sticks around only in one of them, chances are that he/she will apply in his mind an universal rule drawn from that particular circle.
For example, if one hangs around "psychonauts" where there will be lots of exchanges and upgrading of ideas, one could fall into the trap where one would believe that the entire world is changing in that direction.
It applies to any kind of group with it's specific patterns.
That's why, I think, until "the world" decides to change we can change on our own.
While I hope and try to do whatever I can with my own determination that there will be a large scale change, I strongly sustain individualism.

Pulsating said:

Do you think there will be a revolution or are most humans to beaten down and happy with it to do anything but keep watching TV and working until they die?

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By having a revolution, what exactly are you going to be able to do that you can't already do without the revolution....?
Turn off your TV, find a clever way to make money without working, and go to the library and get your information....   


>^;;^<

Pulsating said:

Do you think that knowledge and information are being kept from the majority of people on Earth?

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Why is it that no matter where you look, you get the same exact "news" story? (sometimes the words are changed to fit its intended audience)

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Why is it that we are being *entertained to death* with mindless garbage of no real importance?

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I believe the phenonemon is formally known as "supply and demand". Importance of content is a subjective conception. I personally do not feel that amateur singers being scoffed at is important enough for myself to invest my time in viewing such, yet clearly others do feel it is important enough. Again, it is not conspiracy, it is the choice of the viewer. The enertainment industry is a service industry and caters to the interests of their potential audience. They can broadcast whatever the fuck they want, but they will go out of business if no one tunes in - thus, they cater to the interests of their potential audience.

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Why is so much money/time/energy spent on entertainment (TV shows, movies, video games, toys) while *real* knowledge of who we are, where we came from, etc. is absent?

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The choices each individual makes for themselves. If people would rather enertain themselves than pursue knowledge of the nature of reality, then that is their decision. Is the notion that people make choices for themselves so very obscure?

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Do we just not know, or does someone know and is keeping it from us?

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If I wanted to control you, the best way to would be to keep you ignorant of the truth that you were being controlled AND keep your attention consumed and wrapped up in some bogus and meaningless junk (left vs. right, dem vs. repub, you know the usual sh*t you see going on)

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And how would you accomplish that? People tie their own hands in this regard. You can't force anyone to watch television instead of reading a book. You cannot force them to not contemplate the nature of reality. Personal choice, and no one could take it from us.

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Control of information = control of people's minds.

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Do you think a few are controlling the many?

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PhanTomCat said:

By having a revolution, what exactly are you going to be able to do that you can't already do without the revolution....?
Turn off your TV, find a clever way to make money without working, and go to the library and get your information....   

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psyka said:

Jickey, here is something for you contemplate on:

Ever since the end of the 1800's (or so), music for the most part has been getting more simple. Is this an act of conspiracy, or a natural trend in music production? Think about it, back in the day you had to be extremely rich to go out and buy a grand piano or a violin, and also had to be formally educated to learn how to play it. Nowadays you can goto a store a few miles down the road, pick up a keyboard or even buy a cheap crappy guitar at Walmart, then goto the library to learn how to play the instrument (granted you know how to read and comprehend).

Perhaps, this is just a natural stage in an impersonal process of world learning.

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Most human beings are in a situation in which they can activate tremendous opportunities for personal growth, and these opportunities are more and more available than they ever have been, to a larger and larger amount of people. Its simply a question as to whether or not we make a personal decision to seize those opportunities.

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The choices each individual makes for themselves. If people would rather enertain themselves than pursue knowledge of the nature of reality, then that is their decision. Is the notion that people make choices for themselves so very obscure?

We choose to not find out for ourselves.

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Exactly. We need to stop feeling like helpless little kids which are being controlled no matter what they and that need to be saved by an exterior force under different names such as God, Jesus, revolution, riot, best friend and blah blah . It's always our choice who we are, we can't eliminate "disturbance factors" and the assumed mind control techniques, not for all everybody. We all can do it for ourselves though. I myself like the overabundance of information and I'm aware it also has disinformation, but I like to take it as a challenge not as a lost fight.
We have where to chose from and that's good, delusional people must feed with delusion, it's probably the faze they must be in regarding their course of life. What's wrong with that? Why push them into something else?
The only duty we have is the duty to ourselves. And we can go and search for the right information, we can find balance from within, use the techniques we find more appropriate to become lucid and level-headed.

And for the original poster: one is controlled as long as one thinks that he is being controlled. As long as this thought is occupying one's thoughts, it is one of the most subtle and addictive forms of manipulation. In other words, one controls his own mind thinking that somebody else does.

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Unsolved Mysteries and the History Channel and all such junk are just
as much mind control (making you now think there are conspiracies,
and making you actually worry about them). The most useless thing to do is to
worry about conspiracy theories if that is all you do; pure paranoia
that does absolutely nothing but guard some damnable hidden object
like it were some godhead behind the simulacra. Guarding the conspiracy
like some useless monk guarding the god of a dead religion.

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I'd add here the fact that some people actually feed on paranoia. Out of the need to feel important or to add their lives a little flavor. What's sad is to see is because of that and their determination they become very good orators and story tellers and get other people into that trap too. It is a dead end. It takes one nowhere thing which leads me to the thought that a part of these people use "mind control" as an excuse for all their failures and misfortunes.

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Why do we have conspiracy theories? To assume there are people pulling
the strings and then to make conspiracy theories about them is not
the way to go understanding this: to think like this is circular.

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Fetish?
Fear maybe?
Our own missed acts which we keep so well in the dark that they take monstrous forms?

Pulsating said:

Who owns the Federal Reserve? (The Federal Reserve is the private bank which "creates billions of $$$ out of thin air" lends it to our govt. and charges interest...and the gov't doesn't pay the interest back...we do...it's called income tax.)

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Economist said:

Oh my good Lord.
.
I don't understand how someone who creates a thread all about "questioning the system" has obviously accepted this load of bull without questioning it.

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It's easy....    (Some) People feed on DRAMA....
Conspiracy THEORY = invented instant drama
People take an invented theory as a fact, and the word of mouth "story" changes slightly at each stop....
And well, you see what happens as a result....


>^;;^<

trippindad82 said:

Why do we have secret policies and activities if there is not a conspiracy to control the people?

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Clean said:

I think the whole subject of the grand conspiracy is often approached from a rather crude angle.  People really want to be able to sum it all up in a few sentences.  There is a great tendency to make it all very black and white.
The idea that a huge portion of our history has been hidden from us - and the nuances of the manipulations required to keep it hidden - is such a huge subject that to give it proper treatment requires more time than I think any of us want to spend writing on a message board.

There have been many authors who's works are all very obscure (compared to books like the DaVinci Code) who have penned thousands upon thousands of pages on the subject decades, even centuries  before Wilson and Shea's Illuminatus! was even a hash induced fantasy.

There are a handful of authors today gaining exposure through the internet that have actually spent time reading these previous authors, and have made efforts to synergize, coalesce and disseminate interpretations of their works.

There are also plenty of folks out there today just trying to make some bucks grasping at conspiratorial straws and pressing people's panic buttons.

Personally I don't rule out the possibility that a few have desired to enslave the rest of us in order to control the planet's resources.  That is one huge possibility, and if it's true then I think the manipulation goes way deeper than one would be able to grasp upon first glance.

As it has been said,, no one can really control you but you.  We are however creatures susceptible to influence.  We can only control ourselves to the degree that we are aware of the choices we are making.  We routinely neglect our duties of personal sovereignty and allow other's beliefs to become our own without questioning.

  The mechanism by which one can be mistaken as to the existence of a conspiracy or not is the same mechanism by which a grand conspiracy could be perpetrated and perpetuated.  It is the power of belief.

  Hidden agendas are nearly impossible to prove because those participating in them will deny any accusations at all costs.

If all the conspiracy notions are not true at all then I'm amazed by the lengths people from every end of the spectrum have gone to to make it seem like there is indeed some reality behind it, and I wish that we spent all that time and effort gardening instead.

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Awesome post

Clean said:

I am quite aware of my intuition though, and it's telling me that something stinks.

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You have started with the conclusion that secret policies and activities would only exist as part of an attempt to control the people, and I suspect that your own research is focused mostly on gathering evidence to support this conclusion.

Personally I can think of MANY reasons why a secret policy would be enacted for reasons other than controlling the people. Graft and Job Security would be at the top of my list.

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con·spir·a·cy      /kənˈspɪrəsi/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[kuhn-spir-uh-see] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun, plural -cies.
1. the act of conspiring.
2. an evil, unlawful, treacherous, or surreptitious plan formulated in secret by two or more persons; plot.
3. a combination of persons for a secret, unlawful, or evil purpose: He joined the conspiracy to overthrow the government.
4. Law. an agreement by two or more persons to commit a crime, fraud, or other wrongful act.
5. any concurrence in action; combination in bringing about a given result.

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And it seems to me that by these definitions, there seems to be a conspiracy by the elite to keep power in their hands. Whether or not they want to completely control the population doesn't downplay that there is a conspiracy by a group of elite. But, at the same time, it seems to me that in order to keep top dog, you have to control the population. They don't have a conspiracy to overthrow the US govt and create a dictatorship (in a sense), but I believe that there is a conspiracy to change the govt enough so that these individuals (and no they are not reptilians from outer space) can keep their authority and power. My proof? The fact that we are now getting more and more stringent laws that take away what I thought were rights by birth and citizenship. Things are now happening in this country (or have been happening for a long time...watergate anyone???) that we have been told only happen in places like Iraq (saddass era), China, Korea, Vietnam, and other places. Spying on the general public, suppression and control of what news is out there, and insane war policies that do not benefit the american people.

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I am quite aware of my intuition though, and it's telling me that something stinks.

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Yes, something stinks. We are being "lied", all of us, in a bigger or smaller measure. What I was arguing about is that this shouldn't get paranoid over this (regarding my response to the original poster) because the moment we become paranoid and start to see conspiracies all around us is the moment when we're most controlled, and it's a very tricky ground since, when being paranoid, we tend to think that we become more aware and can see the "truth" more clearly. By thinking that we're being blinded in an endless circle of mysteries.

Instead of that I prefer to stay more calm and even if something might be "stinky", to take my time and analyze how important it is for me to go further into any kind of investigation regarding the matter. By that I'll have to think how much it affects my life and my mental stability, to see what my priorities are and then act in consequence. This also doesn't mean that I shall just stay careless about everything and ignore the existence of any potential conspiracy .

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To the curious, I submit these pages for your consideration.

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"I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past, I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain."

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Clean said:

I don't need to justify my mental meanderings to anyone. I'm not seeking approval from anyone.

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Pulsating said:

People who believe that there is no major world conspiracy which involves a small number of people manipulating humanity through a hierarchical structure of control toward a New World Order, all have one identical factor in common.

They have, in actual fact, not looked genuinely into the abundance of well-researched information on world conspiracy to see if there is one!

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Contrary to common understanding, most human beings (unless we are extremely enlightened) have desires consciously or unconsciously to manipulate others to some degree or other. However, very few people are immune to this conditioning.

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Economist said:

This is patently untrue. Icke is neither omniscient nor has he asked every single skeptic in the world whether or not they have actually examined the evidence.

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I'd also argue (as above) that this is a prime example of the "reverse scientific method". You begin with the conclusion that there is a conspiracy and then work backwards, ignoring evidence that doesn't fit your conclusion. This results in entire fields of inquiry being ignored.

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Instead, if we look at the basic hypotheses behind any conspiracy theory and collect the available evidence to either back them up or refute them, cracks begin to appear immediately.

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We know that it doesn't actually take membership in the "vast conspiracy" to get rich in the first place, as the traditional "New World Order" seemed to miss out on many contemporary booms (Silicon Valley, Walmart, China) while others gained from them. So, if you don't need to be in the conspiracy to become wealthy, and if participation in the conspiracy requires additional effort, why would you ever join in?

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EsKregg said:

could someone who does not believe in a select global elite that 'controls' vast portions of the earth's power and resources please give us some evidence that it does not exist? Thanks.

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It is dangerous to dwell in victim-hood. Yes there may be secret societies and groups of individuals exerting influence which serve to subjugate and dehumanize us, but it is our responsibility for going along with it. Our enemies know exactly how we tick, and they have exploited every weakness so that we may turn ourselves in to our own biggest obstacle in the way of truth and sovereignty.

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Mushroom Trip, have you noticed that knowledge and responsibility are connected in a way that one is dependent on the other?

Interestingly, Control is the third part of it. Knowledge, Responsibility, and Control are intimately connected.

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Have you ever known anyone who has repeated something, as if it were fact, that they only had knowledge of through the TV? "BS News reported..." Oh BS News said it? Where did they get their info from?

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Pulsating said:

fireworks god, you claimed that control of information wasn't related to the control human minds.

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Yes, I equated control of information with control of information and stated that no one could "control" a human mind. Could one control information in order to influence the information that a mind utilizes in its understanding of reality? Of course, but this is not control of the mind itself. This is why I equated control of information with control of information.

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Communication is the broad term which means to pass information. Why is so much being done to force people out of communication with other people?

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Could you substantiate this assertion? In what ways are people being forced out of the ability to communicate with other people? I would have been given to understand that, contemplating the nature of the Internet and of cell phones, that the act of freely communicating with others is more prolific now than it has ever been. Idea exchange through unobstructive mediums can be instantaneous. Look at the repository of information that this website exists as for a perfect example. Access to this kind of information has never before been possible.

Once again, how precisely are we being forced out of the ability to communicate with others?

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See question in the original post about entertainment. And why is information repeatedly repeated no matter where you look in today's media?

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Because there is a demand for the information. Once again, personal choice. I guess I really don't know what you refer to about information being constantly repeated in today's media because my only exposure to it is web articles that I choose to seek out and read for myself.

Perhaps some live in a matrix of being fed select information in an attempt to control - its a possibillity considering the nature of the advertising industry and the way that a media wants to ensure that its viewers continue to view. Remember in my previous post what I was referring to in regards to personal choice? Precisely..

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Those few who control this place know that we live in a society of hypnotized people and all you have to do is repeat something a few times and they'll repeat it, too. Only they won't know the truth because they are watching the football game and having a beer.

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Hypnotism is one person controlling another or others. What's the best way to communicate to mass amounts of people at one time? Why the surge in TV screens in people's homes since the 1950's. Why does the same news story get repeated no matter where you look?

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I already answered this question and you failed to respond. Clearly each media outlet will carry the same stories because they are the stories that are generating interest, and they want to cater to that interest in order to be viewed, in order for their sponsors to receive the benefits of paying them for ad-space, so that they get paid. It isn't a conspiracy.

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Do you recall when War of the Worlds was enacted on radio the night of 30 Oct 1938? It's actually quite fascinating what happened.

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Have you ever known anyone who has repeated something, as if it were fact, that they only had knowledge of through the TV?

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Yes. Once again, personal choice. People choose what they do with their own minds, their minds are not controlled, even as others control information in order to influence them. Everyone controls information in their day-to-day interactions, it is the nature of being a human. Your points speak more for the fact that human beings make bad choices regarding their processing of information and where they seek it from than for a conspiracy to control their minds.

Pulsating said:

First, all you seemingly do is engage in straw-man arguments and they might work on the simple-minded but they don't work on me.
...
You see, Icke never claimed to be omniscient. Nor did he claim to have asked every single skeptic on Earth, but he has encountered hundreds of thousands of people in his research, as well as traveled extensively to over 40 countries and I am sure has found certain common denominators to those with viewpoints like yours.

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Pulsating said:

Another dazzling straw-man! Icke didn't start out claiming there was a conspiracy. He had a life changing spiritual experience and began to research.

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Pulsating said:

Also, what are you doing? You start out with an idea ("there is no conspiracy") and instead of researching, just start spouting off about how it's impossible that a small group of insanely wealthy families control this place.

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Pulsating said:

How do I know what you have/have not researched? The same way you know what Icke *has* researched!

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Pulsating said:

Really? Show me this irrefutable proof that there is no conspiracy. Maybe because it's not reported on TV?

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Pulsating said:

Another straw man. No one in this thread said it took membership in anything to become wealthy although you implied that I said it.

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Pulsating said:

And no one *joins* this little clique. It's largely bloodline or invite. There is no application.

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Pulsating said:

You see, you have such a short sighted look at this whole thing.

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Pulsating said:

It's not about money...it's about control (of which money is a one aspect of, information being another, etc.)

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I already answered this question and you failed to respond.

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Pulsating said:

You simply seem to have a belief system to defend and will work things around until they make you right in your mind.

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MushroomTrip said:

The thing with the conspiracy theory is that it has already became a propaganda term which makes the paranoid and the uninformed feel important and safe from the potential threatening matters.
That way, the most absurd theories are being born and people fall in their trap for many different reasons, but mostly because they sound sensational, out of the common and are being linked to secretive policies. Stuff like these are the trigger for one of our most basic human drives: curiosity.

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For me, the only conspiracy that is really threatening for our current society is the conspiracy theory itself, which offers constant distractions from the real social and individual affairs.
It's a vicious circle which is very hard to break or get out of for one who's already in.
A conspiracy theory can be released & constructed about any "big size" event.

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Seuss said:

> I believe 110%

How can you be more than 100% certain of something?

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Pulsating said:

Seuss said:

> I believe 110%

How can you be more than 100% certain of something?

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If it's too hard, just pretend the person said 100%. The same thing is intended.

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