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InvisibleInnominate
Male


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2,136
Tree Spiking
    #6894149 - 05/09/07 03:29 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

How many of you are familiar with this? How many of you condone it? What are your opinions?

Basically tree spiking is when someone puts a large metal object such as a nail or rod into a tree to discourage loggers from cutting it down. People who do this shouldn't just go out to any random tree and spike it, because that can be very dangerous and you could be putting lives on the line. Instead, the way I believe it should be done, is to spike trees on your property and then place a sign warning loggers in the future 10, 20, 100 years from now that it would be in their best interest to not cut those trees down. You could make it a part of your deed and such. All in all I don't think it's such a bad idea, but obviously there are drawbacks.

Here is some reading you might want to check out on the subject-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_spiking

http://ragette.org/treespike/how.htm

http://www.iww.org/unions/iu120/local-1/EF/JBari11.shtml


Discuss.

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Offlinehobbitxkillyou
Shark wrestlingchampion


Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 943
Loc: Pennsylvania
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894173 - 05/09/07 03:40 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I think it's one of the dumber ideas hippies came up with. As a student getting into the Forestry Science field, I've read stories and heard from people how bad it can be. It's never easy, unless blatently obvious, that a tree has been spiked. If run though a sawmill, the nail couple ricochet and cause some serious hurtin to people.

Plus, there are practices known as thinnings and partial cuts, which can greatly help an ecosystem. Spiking is detrimental to these.

Loggers don't, and haven't for awhile, been clearcutting without regard for regrowth. That's a thing of the past. The industry realizes it can't get by without practicing sustainable cutting.

Tree spiking is dangerous and stupid to one of the biggest and most sustainable energy industries in the world. Don't do it!


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When the going gets wierd, the wierd turn pro.

-H. S. Thompson

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InvisibleFerris
PsychedelicJourneyman
Male

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 03/12/06
Posts: 11,529
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: hobbitxkillyou]
    #6894180 - 05/09/07 03:43 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Time can be better spent planting trees and trying to save the environment in other ways.


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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
Not here
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Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,509
Loc: Longitudinal Center of Canada ...
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894201 - 05/09/07 03:48 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

It's dogmatic terrorism. Same as bombing abortion clinics.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Offlinewillo
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Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 628
Loc: 106
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894217 - 05/09/07 03:52 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I think it's retarded because you damage the envirment by adding to the bark thousands of injecting sites for pathologies nut if you want to save your little piece of "forest"... in my opinion some countries let loggers ruin their landscapes and there should be laws against it,providing that all cuts are substainable choices that only help the forest to promote new growth.In my country it should be like that but some other contries allow to cut down all the trees in one area and this is wrong and destroys a semi natural forest.
what is really awful is what happens in poor countries who let large logging companies do what they do completely destroying any resorse that a land may have to offer and that's retarted,shit they may as well sink it all in the ocean for what they are doing

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Offlinehobbitxkillyou
Shark wrestlingchampion


Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 943
Loc: Pennsylvania
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: willo]
    #6894227 - 05/09/07 03:56 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

A common misconception is that when a forest is clearcut, it is doomed for eternity. This couldn't be more wrong. If left to it's own, a completely cut forest will have sprouts and small trees in 20-30 years, only a little longer than if saplings were planted.

Do you think that with all the clearcutting done in the early 1900s, everyhting was replanted? Nope. Much natural growth happened.

"The more you know...."


--------------------
When the going gets wierd, the wierd turn pro.

-H. S. Thompson

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InvisibleInnominate
Male


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2,136
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: hobbitxkillyou]
    #6894229 - 05/09/07 03:56 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

hobbitxkillyou said:
I think it's one of the dumber ideas hippies came up with. As a student getting into the Forestry Science field, I've read stories and heard from people how bad it can be. It's never easy, unless blatently obvious, that a tree has been spiked. If run though a sawmill, the nail couple ricochet and cause some serious hurtin to people.

Plus, there are practices known as thinnings and partial cuts, which can greatly help an ecosystem. Spiking is detrimental to these.

Loggers don't, and haven't for awhile, been clearcutting without regard for regrowth. That's a thing of the past. The industry realizes it can't get by without practicing sustainable cutting.

Tree spiking is dangerous and stupid to one of the biggest and most sustainable energy industries in the world. Don't do it!




Well you pretty much just invalidated all my points on why I thought it was a good idea. Mind you I only just read about this topic 10 minutes prior to posting this thread. What do the "thinning" and "partial cut" practices you mentioned entail?

Quote:

WhiskeyClone said:
It's dogmatic terrorism. Same as bombing abortion clinics.




I wouldn't go that far. I don't see why it would be so horrible if a person with a substantial amount of land did it to his property and posted ample warnings about. I'm not talking about blindly going out into forestry zones and doing this just to get back at the loggers. Unlike bombing abortion clinics, revenge/harm isn't the point. It's more of a deterrence than anything.

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Offlinewillo
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Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 628
Loc: 106
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: hobbitxkillyou]
    #6894233 - 05/09/07 03:57 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Hi I'm a forestry sudent in my 4th year!nice to see a "fresh student" having a decent opinion

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Invisiblejewunit
Brutal!
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Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 34,264
Loc: Ohio
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894236 - 05/09/07 03:57 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

But... how many loggers go onto random large areas of private property and start chopping away?


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InvisibleWhiskeyClone
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Registered: 06/25/01
Posts: 16,509
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Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894240 - 05/09/07 03:58 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Innominate said:


Quote:

WhiskeyClone said:
It's dogmatic terrorism. Same as bombing abortion clinics.




I wouldn't go that far. I don't see why it would be so horrible if a person with a substantial amount of land did it to his property and posted ample warnings about. I'm not talking about blindly going out into forestry zones and doing this just to get back at the loggers. Unlike bombing abortion clinics, revenge/harm isn't the point. It's more of a deterrence than anything.




Um, if it's your land, nobody should be cutting down the trees on it.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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InvisibleInnominate
Male


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2,136
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: jewunit]
    #6894251 - 05/09/07 04:01 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

jewunit said:
But... how many loggers go onto random large areas of private property and start chopping away?




After many years the tress will obviously be much larger. If you own a substantial amount of land with many trees, after many decades a logging company might want to come by and log a large amount of land, part of which may include your property. If you mention in your deed that you trees are spiked, well you get the point.

Mind you at this point my opinion on the issue has changed, but I still don't believe it to be a horrible idea.

The second website mentioned spiking on their own private land-

"On Private Lands
Tree spiking on someone else's private land is probably even more controversial, but spiking you own woods shouldn't cause any problems at all if its done correctly.

Recently we spiked several tracts of forest on our homestead/farm in Lincoln County, WV. Although we have always understood that we would never cut trees on the bulk of the property, the act of tree spiking with neighbors and friends fixes the idea and actuality of a wilderness area in the mind of the community. We can’t change our minds about timber harvesting this area, nor can future owners of this property."

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Offlinehobbitxkillyou
Shark wrestlingchampion


Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 943
Loc: Pennsylvania
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: Innominate]
    #6894254 - 05/09/07 04:02 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Thinning and partial cuts are basically the same, with some subtle differences.  Basically, it's cutting down some of the bigger, older trees that are taking up space and sunlight in order to stimulate new growth.  These often valuable trees are then sold to sawmills and used instead of concrete, steel, cement, whatever.

As to spiking trees on your own property...it's still a dumb idea, even if you're looking at "down the road."  Timber is an extremely valuable resouce.  Good oaks, hickories, cherries, pines, and spruces can cost a few thousand per tree.  Some even ten thousand.  Spiking a tree immediately lowers its value to zero.  If you have a hundred thousand dollars worth of trees on your property, would you really want to ruin it?

By the way, I like talking about forestry, so any questions about it I'm more than happy to answer.  I actually have a final for a forestry related class in an hour, which I plan to smoke. :rockon:


--------------------
When the going gets wierd, the wierd turn pro.

-H. S. Thompson

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Invisiblejewunit
Brutal!
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Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 34,264
Loc: Ohio
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: hobbitxkillyou]
    #6894260 - 05/09/07 04:04 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Smoking your final will probably result in an F.


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Offlinehobbitxkillyou
Shark wrestlingchampion


Registered: 08/11/05
Posts: 943
Loc: Pennsylvania
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: willo]
    #6894262 - 05/09/07 04:05 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

willo said:
Hi I'm a forestry sudent in my 4th year!nice to see a "fresh student" having a decent opinion




Hey man, nice to see someone of like mind. I'm in my second year/thirdish year. Where do you study? What are you plans for a job? I'm hoping to get a full time spot with the National Park Service and eventually get into research on non-researched places. Like the baobab trees in Madagascar, haha. I actually have my first summer job with the NPS coming up.


--------------------
When the going gets wierd, the wierd turn pro.

-H. S. Thompson

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OfflineNoviseer
Percussion isFree
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Registered: 03/18/03 Happy 21st Shroomiversary!
Posts: 3,994
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #6894277 - 05/09/07 04:11 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

WhiskeyClone said:
Quote:

Innominate said:


Quote:

WhiskeyClone said:
It's dogmatic terrorism. Same as bombing abortion clinics.




I wouldn't go that far. I don't see why it would be so horrible if a person with a substantial amount of land did it to his property and posted ample warnings about. I'm not talking about blindly going out into forestry zones and doing this just to get back at the loggers. Unlike bombing abortion clinics, revenge/harm isn't the point. It's more of a deterrence than anything.




Um, if it's your land, nobody should be cutting down the trees on it.




ftw


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namaste said:
no flamz in da ODD, if you got nothing to contribute then keep yo lips zipped
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Offlinewillo
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Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 628
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Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: hobbitxkillyou]
    #6894285 - 05/09/07 04:14 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

I study at University of Padova,Italy. I don't have plans yet because I'm not too sure of what I want at the moment,plus my foot may be a problem for my previous plan to work as a survey technician,what you will want to do this summer I guess!
So maybe I'd like to work in a laboratory studying mushrooms or flowers,but at the moment I'm thinking of slightly changing field and getting into ornamental arboriculture.
Lots of cool jobs for us foresters at the moment!one of my dreams is too work for my city's Botanic gardens.
Most of all i need to finish my exams and get out on the field because one thing is for sure,italian university sucks and I need to get out of it.
cool pet you have by the way!

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InvisibleBrainiac
Rogue Scientist
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Registered: 04/29/06
Posts: 13,259
Loc: 與您的女朋 Flag
Re: Tree Spiking [Re: willo]
    #6894746 - 05/09/07 06:33 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

how about planting some bamboo, it grows faster.


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