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Crazy people
    #688794 -

We are all crazy, but the crazy crazy people are those who want to speak to a doctor and live in a clinic.. Any other views on crazy people?


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I see trees of green, psylocibe mushrooms too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself what a wonderful world

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #688812 -

no the crazy crazy people are those who want to speak to a clinic and live in a doctor


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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #688824 -

Crazy is voting for someone you never met to give them control over your life and the lives of all those you love based merely on the lies he/she carefully formulates for public consumption.

Madness, pure madness...

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #688825 -

In reply to:
crazy crazy people are those who want to speak to a doctor and live in a clinic


What a crazy thing to say....


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"New shit has come to light..."

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Re: Crazy people [Re: GRTUD]
    #688829 -

Yes, yes, only "crazy" people speak to doctors! I bet when they're sick too.


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"New shit has come to light..."

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Re: Crazy people [Re: GRTUD]
    #688830 -

I'm sure people who reply to themselves on message boards are quite sane! (Wew, I was getting nervous.)


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"New shit has come to light..."

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #689092 -

You are all a bunch of crazies

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #689391 -

everyone [ i hope ;] has doubts about their sanity occassionally, but when you learn that medicine knows just as much about your 'condition' as you do.. you realise that it can be just a state of mind, a desire for an alternate reality, and you can fix yourself without any of this antidepressant bs

i was walking home the other day past the place where peole are singing, rain hail or shine, night or day.... i thought thats got to be a 'retreat' in there... and sure enough i finally checked it out and theres people in blue gowns chain smoking, pacing, hopping, singing, dancing..... it only has knee high fences tho... maybe its a level one retreat, the first step on the ladder, apprentices of the insane, where they work themselves up to straitjackets padded cells thorazine... the real deal
crazy.... i wonder what its like being them... theyre not crazy, they just belong in a beautiful land only accessed sometimes in our dreams....

heres me

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Re: Crazy people [Re: deepr]
    #689413 -

I agree, we should give them their own land and let them run wild.

maybe they are ahead of their time. They are showing us what life is all about - chain smoking, pacing, hopping, singing, dancing.....

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Re: Crazy people [Re: deepr]
    #689423 -

Have you seen K-pax? Very cool movie..


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I see trees of green, psylocibe mushrooms too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself what a wonderful world

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Re: Crazy people [Re: deepr]
    #689600 -

you realise that it can be just a state of mind, a desire for an alternate reality, and you can fix yourself without any of this antidepressant bs

As a life-long depressive, I can tell you that it is not just a "state of mind", but is caused from bio-chemical imbalances. BTW, I have never taken prescription anti-depressants (as I don't do drugs).

One cannot just think, chant, dance, exercise or whatever, their depression away any more than you can think your diabetes away.

Please refrain from making ignorant statements. If you are really interested in this condition, do some research before posting.



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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Swami]
    #689725 -

I would like to comment since I have been diagnosed as a severely depressed person in the past, due to chemical imbalances like you said.

I was on the medications.. they did nothing but give me a false sense of happiness and did more harm than good. That was my experience with them anyway. I got off them and discovered meditation.

Now, maybe I am just imagining it, but I have been much more at peace and happier with myself over the past few years after finding meditation. Maybe the chemical imbalance is still there, as I can tend to go through depressive episodes... but for the most part I think that the meditation DID in fact help with the chemical imbalance. I have done a fair amount of research on the subject, and it seems that we really don't know much about depression at all.

Now I am not saying that some people don't need these medications, and that some people don't have a serious case of depression that they cannot really control. But for me, I have been able to control it to a certain extent. I think depression is half a chemical imbalance, and half a state of mind. Maybe more or less in different people.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #689856 -

I will agree with you, that it may be somewhat in our power to control, but if you have a predeliction for it, you must be constantly on guard to prevent the fall into the abyss. Meditation can help as one can learn to control certain thought-patterns that may exacerbate the condition.

My main point being that depression is not just a mental outlook; thinking happy thoughts will not CURE you.

I wish I had the title, but recently perused a new 600 page semi-autobigraphical book about one man's 30 year search for a cure. It covers everything from diet, therapy, medication, to yoga and meditation. His conclusion: one can learn to control the mood swings somewhat, but there is no cure.

On another note: many people on the Ayahuasca board state unequivocally that Ayahuasca gave them dramatic improvements in overcoming depression. Limited research shows that Ayahuasca is unique among psychedelics in that it increases receptor sites and elevates seratonin levels (unlike LSD and psilocybin which deplete serotonin levels.)

Why don't I delve deeper into Ayahuasca? Taste, nausea, vomitting and fear. Ayahuasca can take you deeper than your craziest shroom trip!


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #689873 -

In my opinion any chemical imbalance and resultant mental state(s) are only just karma.......accrued through false identification with one's own personal(separate) existence ........and your actual "being" exists entirely away from it.........but I could be wrong


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"Being crazier than a shithouse rat is not sufficient grounds for banishment"


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Re: Crazy people [Re: Swami]
    #689898 -

I would certainly like to try Ayahuasca. It has intrigued me for quite some time, and I have done some research on it and think that it is something that I would benefit from. Now where to obtain some..

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Re: Crazy people [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #689915 -

Well you may be right Freak.. but I think you may have a false interpretation of karma. Karma acts as a balancing force in the Universe, it is not for making people suffer or for punishment. It is the same as the waves in the ocean.. up and down. Which one is good and which one is bad? They are both good, because they keep each other balanced.
Karma is inherit in all beings, and it is carried by the soul. If you create "bad" karma for yourself, the point of that bad karma is not to make you miserable and suffer.. the point is to counter that bad karma and create good karma to balance it. This is what makes for growth. Without a bad or good karma, we would never learn anything, and we would never evolve. We probably wouldn't even exist.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #690008 -

Well I will be trying ayuasca this year, the ingredients are easy to get, in some of the online stores, I got them from basement shaman.
I will tell you how it goes after I do it.


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Re: Crazy people [Re: LOBO]
    #690049 -

Yeah I just found a source.. I will be ordering some and then using it when the time is right.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Swami]
    #690417 -

ok not all cases swami, i acknowledge that there are some 'sick' people out there , i thought i should have rewritten that for you ...
... but when a healthy 20%+ of people in the western world suffer depression at some point in their lives, blaming it on a permanent chemical imbalance is incorrect. this temporary chemical imbalance can be corrected in most through exercise, diet (omega3 etc) meditation, perspective etc. this is what i was talkin bout. i dont propose to have a cure all...

ive been interested in ayahuasca as well... reading that experiments have shown that it can temporarily increase serotonin reuptake (for about a month or two afterwards) these have not been duplicated by a 'lab' yet tho

i have suffered depression on and off (like most people on this board.... we think too much) and have taken antidepressants, and found that they gave me indeed, a false sense of happiness, but enabled me to get some perspective on the situation... that is all, the rest is up to me, it took an overhaul of thought patterns

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Swami]
    #690661 -

I agree that some people are genuinely crazy, they have physical defects in their brains or have chemical imbalances or something.

But I'm sure you know that there are millions of people medicating themselves with powerful drugs because they think have "generalized anxiety disorder" or bored housewives taking prozac. There is a pill for people who are shy. I had many friends in high school who were prescribed ritilin because they couldn't pay attention in class, isn't that normal? They even have medicine to help your depressed pets! Now this is truly crazy.

It seems like as a society, we are trying to wipe away all our problems with pills. Have you seen the ads for some of these? it's ridiculous.
it's crazy I tell ya!



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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #690711 -

read "The Myth of Mental Illness" by Thomas Szaz... incidentally, i recently learned that he is a board of advisor on Alchemind (along with Ram Dass, Laura Huxley, Dr. Shulgin, exc.) - way cool sight... www.alchemind.org
love & blessings, CJ


--------------------
Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: deepr]
    #690785 -

I hear what you are saying. Way too many people fail to take responsibility and blame it on some vague disorder.

I started with your premise. I always tried to tough it out like it was my fault in the way that I viewed the world (which is of course, a part), but then discovered that much of it was physiological.

At best, I keep it under control with Sam-E and St. John's Wort. The effects are very subtle, but others notice when I fail to maintain my regimen.


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The proof is in the pudding.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: LOBO]
    #690792 -

I also have been diagnosed with depression and I am currently on anti depressents. When I first went on them I could tell that they were changing my thought patterns, which could be called a false sense of happiness. I'm thinking about coming off them, but I do not want to go back into that pit again. For the sake of the people who know me if not for mine. Having said that ... I do not want to be on them forever, and I have this underlying feeling that this person who is on anti depressents is not "me", you know? How can I be me, if my state of mind is permanently altered.

I also have ayahuasca ingredients, and hope to try it soon at a low dose.


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Re: Crazy people [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #691050 -

thats the problem with drugs... use them enough and you forget who you are, what you stand for, what you believe in, what to be angry about, what to be happy about.... use them to get perspective on what you were doing wrong i say ;] learn from them... dont live by them

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Swami]
    #691618 -

As a life-long depressive, I can tell you that it is not just a "state of mind", but is caused from bio-chemical imbalances
I totally agree with you. But think that eveything in our brain is caused by this chemicals. Why not can we make it balanced again? When we almost cannot pay attention to something, we can somehow make our mind focus. That's control on some chemicals also. I hope you understand what I mean. In the same way with little strugle everything is possible. It's our brain, why not control it after all?


--------------------
I see trees of green, psylocibe mushrooms too
I see them bloom for me and you
And I think to myself what a wonderful world

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #694541 -

In reply to:
we can somehow make our mind focus.


Technically I agree with what you are writing and I believe that this idea could be applied to all aliments. But try that idea on your next infection. If we were all Buddist Monks, I think we could accomplish what you are writing about, truth is we are not. The menal focus necessary for such victories over real, physical, ailments are far fetched, at best. Pop culture ideas about health and mental health are sadly off the mark most often, considering the fact that we are broadly ill equipped to tackle such abnormalities, based on our life styles and time constraints. If your point is the fact that modern society has left us unable to persue such possibilites, that would be a much more agreeable topic.
To start this process, we could all start praying for a society that truely prizes and rewards prioritizing time that is spent on that which is rewarding and prized.


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"New shit has come to light..."

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #734722 -

I believe there is no normal in human beings. We are all different in some way according to our DNA. Messing with natural processes is not the answer.
I dont trust any man made chemical, or doctors opinion.
They use drugs when they "dont know exactly what it does, but we know it work"

Some Natural substances (drugs) release more data into your receptors, that is probally related to increased thought, increased perception, and other occurances.

Man made drugs such as anti psychotics block the same receptors.
I was told it would decrease thinking patterns.
I heard one patient on the drug say "I dont like what this drug is doing to me, I can feel this void inside my head, this deep void, this thirst that cant be quenched."
The doctors diagnosed it and gave him more drugs to counter the effects.

Stay away from doctors, they can force you to take
medications you may not want or need. This is a serious offense to our human rights.


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Re: Crazy people [Re: FreakQlibrium]
    #735681 -

In reply to:
In my opinion any chemical imbalance and resultant mental state(s) are only just karma.......accrued through false identification with one's own personal(separate) existence ........and your actual "being" exists entirely away from it.........but I could be wrong



Do you think you could elaborate a bit more for me? Last time I shroomed I realized that I don't know who I am, and I've been acting for a long time to prevent people from putting me down (happened at least twice a day all through middle and highschool =( ) I guess I eventually just learned to block out my emotions, and to block out who I am inside. Now I really don't have much of a clue about myself.... I'm figuring it out slowly but sometimes I feel like a stanger to myself. I think all that bs throughout school is why I have such horrible anxiety now. I smoke cigarettes (a lot of them) especially in any social situation.

II'm fed up with this insane cycle. If I could have one wish all I'd ask for is to know without one doubt who I am, and to be able to be that person right now.




--------------------
"I see!" said the blind man to his deaf wife.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Chikhai]
    #735833 -

Chikhai, I had similar issues years ago. One day while in a book store I came across an audio tape from Nathaniel Branden about the psychology of self-esteem. I listened to his tape and it provided me with one of those "ah ha!" experiences and helped to send me in a direction of personal growth that was true to who I really was/am (in the core of my being) instead of who I was trying to be (which was based on societal/social/familial standards). I highly recommend some of his tapes/books on the subject.

Edited by Evolving (07/10/02 06:40 AM)

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #751200 -

I'm only crazy on one side.Hell you can even pick it.


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Well...Maybe just a little.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #785007 -

Cat's LIke PIANO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Weeeeeeeeeeeeehehehheheheeeeeeeeeheeeeeeeheeeeeeee!

(but seriously...or maybe, not so seriously) and I hate to see like such a MAD linker(not like i'm angry, just mad!)...
here is The Value of Psychotic Experience , by Alan Watts! Great insanity theory! Or better, an honest approach to the subject of 'CRAZY'...
have fun!

Thx,
the pale e

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Re: Crazy people [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #785016 -

I remember I got a PM once from a certain someone on this board who will remain unnamed saying they were seriously concerned that I was delusional schizophrenic. I told him if pursuit of spiritual wisdom is insanity, put me in a straight jacket and lock me in a rubber room.
WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!


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Re: Crazy people [Re: Chikhai]
    #785040 -

Making a wish!
I dig it!

(k...i'm getting better, but bear with me)....
You are....

(lightly bow, and wait for applause)...
well! Dig it!

K it get's better...
And you are NOT, as well...

(still waiting for applause)...

Your prob being but down cause 89% of people on the planet are afraid of thinkers...I mean, ummm..
Smoke pot...wait for your POWERS of higher circuit evolution to evolve, and let the assholes Njoy their twisted delusions (like their taunts have any REAL meaning to you). When i was in school, i used to get picked on too!
Until i mastered the power of blinking my antognists outta existance....
I thought they listen then FOR sure! They just didn't seem to notice...
That's when i turned to indecent exposure....
oh...the looks on their faces then....
They should just be thanks-full that i didn't use IT as a bludgeoning tool...
thanks-full indeed...

Thx,
the pale e

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #785068 -

I remember I got a PM once from a certain someone on this board who will remain unnamed saying they were seriously concerned that I was delusional schizophrenic. I told him if pursuit of spiritual wisdom is insanity, put me in a straight jacket and lock me in a rubber room.
WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!


Actually, THIS is what you said:
(edit: Thanks for sharing that, but actually posting a PM is considered a big no-no. Notice I didn't say Sclorch, but I guess you blew the cover right off that one.)

There's a HUGE difference between wisdom and knowledge.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...

Edited by Shroomism (07/29/02 07:40 PM)

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Sclorch]
    #785078 -

I've noticed that a bit of a personal grudge has built up since I pondered Shroomism's mental health. I hope I'm just misperceiving things...


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Sclorch]
    #785134 -

Main Entry: wis?dom
Pronunciation: 'wiz-d&m
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English wIsdOm, from wIs wise
Date: before 12th century
1 a : accumulated philosophic or scientific learning : KNOWLEDGE b : ability to discern inner qualities and relationships : INSIGHT c : good sense : JUDGMENT d : generally accepted belief
2 : a wise attitude or course of action
3 : the teachings of the ancient wise men

Main Entry: knowl?edge
Pronunciation: 'n?-lij
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English knowlege, from knowlechen to acknowledge, irregular from knowen
Date: 14th century
1 : obsolete : COGNIZANCE
2 a (1) : the fact or condition of knowing something with familiarity gained through experience or association (2) : acquaintance with or understanding of a science, art, or technique b (1) : the fact or condition of being aware of something (2) : the range of one's information or understanding c : the circumstance or condition of apprehending truth or fact through reasoning : COGNITION d : the fact or condition of having information or of being learned
3 : archaic : SEXUAL INTERCOURSE
4 a : the sum of what is known : the body of truth, information, and principles acquired by mankind b : archaic : a branch of learning

Ok... I didn't save the PM so I wasn't sure of the exact wording I used. But what is so different about these two words? Yeah they are different, but I don't see a HUGE difference.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Sclorch]
    #785149 -

There is no personal grudge. And even if there were it wouldn't be from you questioning my mental health, that actually gave me a good laugh. If this perceived grudge you are speaking of is as a result of your edited picture in enter's chakra thread, it is because I found it highly offensive as the person who made that picture is my spiritual mentor whom I hold a deep respect for and you manipulated the picture with a very offensive description. Aside from that there is no grudge. Keep it respectful and we wont have any problems.

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Re: Crazy people [Re: ]
    #785169 -

Check your PM's.

I've posted that pic before in here (before the PM) and it received little flak.

Wisdom is SO different from knowledge... ask any epistemologist (they've torn me a new one for such things).

No hard feelings on this end.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Sclorch]
    #785191 -

Yeah, what Shroomism said!

We had a really cool place with very few rules. And then you screwed it up. You couldn't leave it alone. You just had to keep digging and poking and prodding and teasing and joking and typing until we got rules.

I hate rules.

You have ruined everything. j/k


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I've got just one thing to add [Re: dumlovesyou]
    #785268 -

My theory on psychological correction can be summed up in one simple set of Floydian lyrics:

You raise the blade, you make the change
You re-arrange me 'til I'm sane.
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head but it's not me.

enough said


--------------------


"Only those who risk going too far can possibly find out how far one can go..." T.S. Eliot

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Re: Crazy people [Re: Sclorch]
    #785296 -

Peace love and light my brother

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