Home | Community | Message Board

Shroom Supply
Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Edibles   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
InvisibleDiploidM
Cuban


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
Robot Colonies
    #6841715 - 04/27/07 05:08 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

This is similar to how genetic algorithms exploit tiny imperfections in the replication process (just like random mutations in biological machines) and then let natural selection decide which, if any, are advantagious and get passed on to the next generation.

--

Scientists to Build Robot Colony

No, seriously. Sixty robots are going to interact with each other in groups, learn from each other, and evolve patterns of behavior. Scientists who have clearly not watched The Matrix will study them.

It's all part of a four-year study spearheaded by the University of Abertay; the robots will be organized into groups, observe each other, and copy each others' behavior. The theory is that by modeling behavior based on observation, there will be slight variations in how that behavior is duplicated; then when conditions change, the robots will cope differently, and hopefully adapt. Biology professor John Crawford hopes that observing these evolving behaviors will provide clues as to how "human, animal or artificial societies" work.

At this point I have three scenarios playing in my head:

* A robot looks up from the colony at one of the scientists and saying, "Hu-man. Op-pres-sor." Then one of the scientists looks at another and says, "Wait. Did we give them voice chips?"

* Kent Brockman on the news saying, "And I for one welcome our new mechanical overlords..."

* Me armed with a pipe wrench, defending my family against a renegade microwave oven.

This sort of thinking is exactly why a group of researchers recently came together to discuss the implications of autonomous robots in our society. A bit piqued by glib presentations made by other scientists (and, no doubt, smart-aleck technology writers who watch too many movies), they think we should start asking some of the hard questions. Professor Alan Winfield of the University of West England asked of military sentry robots, "If an autonomous robot kills someone, whose fault is it?" University of Sheffield prof Noel Sharkey envisions the possibility of strikes being broken by robots armed with water cannons.

The slight irony here is that while they scorn sensationalism and seek serious debate, many of the scenarios they discuss -- including using robots to take care of the elderly so society doesn't have to -- have already been addressed in pop culture, sometimes in thought-provoking ways. Maybe they need to get out and catch a movie once in a while.

blogs.pcworld.com


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinedelta9
Active Ingredient
Male

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 5,390
Loc: California
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: Diploid]
    #6841908 - 04/27/07 06:02 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Maybe the author needs to stop equating the movies with reality. As a programmer who works with AI, I must say that really, this article is overly sensationalistic and involves little to no room for serious debate because its arguments are apparently entirely based on movies which are themselves sensationalistic and specious.


--------------------
delta9


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineNephlyte
Misfortunate One
Male User Gallery

Registered: 10/11/05
Posts: 1,025
Loc: South Texas
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: delta9]
    #6843303 - 04/28/07 12:28 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

ditto.


--------------------
"To do right is to know what you want. Now when you are dissatisfied with yourself it's because you are after something you don't really want. What objects are you proposing to yourself? Are they the objects you really value? If they are not, you are cheating yourself. I don't meant that if you chose to pursue the objects you most value, you will attain them; of course not. Your experience will tell you that. But success in getting after much labor what you really don't care for is the bitterest and most ridiculous failure." -George Santayana


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineMushroomTrip
Dr. Teasy Thighs
Female User Gallery


Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
Loc: red panda village
Last seen: 8 months, 23 days
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: delta9]
    #6844284 - 04/28/07 07:04 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

delta9 said:
Maybe the author needs to stop equating the movies with reality. As a programmer who works with AI, I must say that really, this article is overly sensationalistic and involves little to no room for serious debate because its arguments are apparently entirely based on movies which are themselves sensationalistic and specious.




Which stuff exactly do you find not up for debate?
The report looks to me pretty well balanced and no fluff involved.
They will surely store data in their memory and them mixed with other data which are stored, and with the help of the patterns they have they could be able to make certain connections and develop a behaviour.
What is so hard to imagine in all that?
Science has already evolved that much and I see no reason why it shouldn't keep walking on that road.


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Offlinedelta9
Active Ingredient
Male

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 5,390
Loc: California
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #6845489 - 04/28/07 04:25 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MushroomTrip said:
Quote:

delta9 said:
Maybe the author needs to stop equating the movies with reality.  As a programmer who works with AI, I must say that really, this article is overly sensationalistic and involves little to no room for serious debate because its arguments are apparently entirely based on movies which are themselves sensationalistic and specious.




Which stuff exactly do you find not up for debate? The report looks to me pretty well balanced and no fluff involved.



Well, that would be practically all of it.  I'll expound shortly.  What vantage point are you looking at it from?
Quote:

They will surely store data in their memory



Yes, that is generally where data is stored.  All computers do this.
Quote:

and them mixed with other data which are stored, and with the help of the patterns they have they could be able to make certain connections and develop a behaviour.  What is so hard to imagine in all that?



Nothing, who said it was difficult to imagine?

Quote:

Science has already evolved that much and I see no reason why it shouldn't keep walking on that road.



I'm going to make it run!

Moving on to the article...
Quote:

Emru Townsend for PCWorld:
Scientists to Build Robot Colony

No, seriously. Sixty robots are going to interact with each other in groups, learn from each other, and evolve patterns of behavior. Scientists who have clearly not watched The Matrix will study them.



Really, have the scientists CLEARLY not watched The Matrix?  This is the first of many specious points in this article that have no bearing upon reality whatsoever.  I'm sure SOME of the scientists might have not seen The Matrix, but I'm just as sure SOME of them saw all three.  I'm equally sure that The Matrix has no bearing on their experiment.
Quote:

It's all part of a four-year study spearheaded by the University of Abertay; the robots will be organized into groups, observe each other, and copy each others' behavior. The theory is that by modeling behavior based on observation, there will be slight variations in how that behavior is duplicated; then when conditions change, the robots will cope differently, and hopefully adapt. Biology professor John Crawford hopes that observing these evolving behaviors will provide clues as to how "human, animal or artificial societies" work.



Read the linked article on the study if you are interested in this; it is actually a news article and goes into more depth; however, he did what he was paid to do for PCWorld and summarised the BBC article.  No  argument here, just presentation of facts.

Quote:

At this point I have three scenarios playing in my head:



At this point, we leave reporting again for the world of fantasy - observe!
Quote:

* A robot looks up from the colony at one of the scientists and saying, "Hu-man. Op-pres-sor." Then one of the scientists looks at another and says, "Wait. Did we give them voice chips?"



Aside from the lack of "voice chips", it's totally sensationalistic to  intimate that these robots will be able to work with something that isn't there (i.e. with no external speaker, there will not be speech as we know it, and it cannot be suddenly developed out of nowhere) and furthermore that these robots will be able to recognize, even conceptually, "humans" and "oppressors".  They won't, the experiment doesn't deal with those kinds of things.  Furthermore, the experiment is with MINIATURES - *let* them come :tongue:.
Quote:

* Kent Brockman on the news saying, "And I for one welcome our new mechanical overlords..."



Maybe someday, but certainly not as a result of this experiment ( of course, Groening may prove me wrong yet :wink: ).

Quote:

* Me armed with a pipe wrench, defending my family against a renegade microwave oven.



Yeah, because a pipe wrench is going to do fuckall defending your family against the radiation your renegade microwave is spewing out of its mouth because that's all it can really move.  It's not going to be hopping around at the edge of its cord like some toaster from Ghost Busters.  It's still limited by what it has, and apparently, Mr. Sensational's microwave has mobility built into it.  Well, he should have thought about that before getting this model and running Windows on it.  So easy to infect.

Quote:

This sort of thinking is exactly why a group of researchers recently came together to discuss the implications of autonomous robots in our society.



This is another BBC article he sources so he doesn't have to do any work but still can get paid - it's pretty good, too, I suggest reading it, also.
Quote:

A bit piqued by glib presentations made by other scientists (and, no doubt, smart-aleck technology writers who watch too many movies),



For those of you who don't know, the author is most likely among the smart-aleck technology writers who watch too many movies.  He's from Canada, too.
Quote:

they think we should start asking some of the hard questions. Professor Alan Winfield of the University of West England asked of military sentry robots, "If an autonomous robot kills someone, whose fault is it?" University of Sheffield prof Noel Sharkey envisions the possibility of strikes being broken by robots armed with water cannons.



Other people's words, but people who actually know what the fuck they are talking about.  Again, no argument here, just facts, though I will add a quote from the article of my own:  "It's poorly informed, poorly supported by science and it is sensationalist," said Professor Owen Holland of the University of Essex.  I think Professer Owen Holland would agree that this article is also poorly informed, poorly supported by science, and sensationalistic.

Quote:

The slight irony here is that while they scorn sensationalism and seek serious debate, many of the scenarios they discuss -- including using robots to take care of the elderly so society doesn't have to -- have already been addressed in pop culture, sometimes in thought-provoking ways. Maybe they need to get out and catch a movie once in a while.



The great irony here is that while they scorn sensationalism and seek serious debate, generally, a movie for popculture may be thought provoking, however, it will still be sensationalist and that's what we're trying to avoid here.  Again, maybe the author should stop equating movies with reality.


--------------------
delta9


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineRuNE
bomberman

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 09/24/00
Posts: 2,331
Loc: tartarus
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: delta9]
    #6854007 - 04/30/07 03:41 PM (14 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

He's from Canada, too.





Yeah. Canadians.  They should go back into their igloos, those retarded ignorant imbeciles.  How dare they exist next to our superior intellect.


:rolleyes:


--------------------
~Happy sailing~


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 5 months, 27 days
Re: Robot Colonies [Re: delta9]
    #6857102 - 05/01/07 08:33 AM (14 years, 7 months ago)

> Maybe the author needs to stop equating the movies with reality.

I agree completely.

> If an autonomous robot kills someone, whose fault is it?

Duh... whoever owns, or was responsible for the machine is at fault.  If the parking break fails on my car, and my car rolls down the hill and kills a kid playing near the street, who's fault is it?  ... it is my car, thus it is my fault.  This isn't really too difficult...

> University of Sheffield prof Noel Sharkey envisions the possibility of strikes being broken by robots armed with water cannons.

Oh no, not robots with water guns... *gasp*  The horror... the horror...

Lemme guess... these boneheads are probably part of the "Scholars for Truth" 9/11 conspiracy crap as well... give somebody a diploma in underwater basket weaving, and all of the sudden they are an expert on everything from President Bushes hemorrhoids to the taste of Zebra semen.

> Biology professor John Crawford

... needs to stick to biology rather than spouting drivel in another field which he obviously knows nothing.  (Assuming I am reading the story correctly... "Me armed with a pipe wrench, defending my family against a renegade microwave oven"... :rolleyes:)


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


Extras: Filter Print Post Remind Me! Notify Moderator Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Edibles   PhytoExtractum Buy Bali Kratom Powder, Kratom Powder for Sale   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Hello lets talk about robots! AlienMix 616 4 06/12/06 08:06 AM
by Seuss
* New Self-Replicating Robot -- A First Step To Gray Goo? DiploidM 1,065 4 07/02/06 10:52 PM
by Learyfan
* Japan/South Korea to program robots with 'code of morals' FrenchSocialist 1,398 8 03/10/07 05:07 PM
by supra
* Why are Japanese scientists the best at making Robots ?????????????????????????????????????????????? Mirth 2,937 17 07/02/06 10:38 AM
by Colonel Kurtz Ph.D
* Bacteria Could Power Tiny Robots ivi 692 2 04/01/06 06:46 PM
by Asante
* 60 Mile Super Ant Colony Worf 1,119 9 09/07/04 05:16 PM
by Hooty
* Rat-brained robot does distant art wingnutx 1,353 8 08/02/03 03:51 PM
by morbydvisns
* Ghoul Robots eats dead flies as renewable source of fuel blink 868 4 01/04/05 08:38 PM
by RuNE

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: trendal, automan, Northerner
1,465 topic views. 0 members, 0 guests and 1 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Print Topic | ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2021 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.038 seconds spending 0.009 seconds on 16 queries.