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OfflineSynthetic8
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Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan?
    #6186172 - 10/19/06 12:14 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Hello All! I was just wondering if anyone has ever heard of Stuntzii growing in the michigan area. I have found 3 patches of similar looking muchrooms, all growing underneath pine trees in the yard at a friends home, but I have only ever read that the species grows in the northwest. I heard stuntzii have a tendency for decomposing coniferous material so it seems like too much of a coincidence if they look macroscopically similar and are growing on the right substrate. Are there any mushrooms that look similar to this species in Michigan? I have to come back to this post and update with a spore print, a picture of the patch, which the mushrooms are practically falling over each other, and make a list of macroscopic details. I do need a microscope so I apologize for not being able to list the microscopic details.

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Offlinecanid
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Synthetic8]
    #6186187 - 10/19/06 12:19 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

no. P. stuntzii does not occurr in your area.

there are a large number of mushrooms in many genera which may be mistaken for P. stuntzii depending on how perceptive and observant you are being in your interpretation.

if you would like them id'd post a description and we'll be glad to help, but unless you happened [unlikely] to come across a patch someone had cultivated, they are not stuntzii.


--------------------



Attn PWN hunters: If you should come across a bluing Psilocybe matching P. pellicolusa please smell it.
If you detect a scent reminiscent of Anethole (anise) please preserve a specimen or two for study and please PM me.

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OfflineCiv
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Synthetic8]
    #6186191 - 10/19/06 12:20 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

It is critical that you describe mushrooms fully and accurately in order to get a proper identification.

A good picture of the mushrooms is invaluable, but not required.
Along with the pictures YOU ARE REQUIRED to provide the following data:

* Habitat (where [woods, pasture, state,province,country, altitude] and what [soil, dung, wood (dead, living, what kind of wood?)] does it grow on)
* Characteristics of the gills (color, attached/not, gills/pores, etc)
* Characteristics of the stem (length, diameter, color, texture, hollow/solid, thin/thick, etc)
* Characteristics of the cap (diameter,color, texture, conical/spherical, convex/concave, etc)
* Spore print color (very important!)
* Color that the mushroom bruises
* Scent of the mushroom
* Anything else you might find important






Read the forum guidelines and it will help you get a more accurate ID.


--------------------
"...Gal's seem to hate the thought of blending chicken shit in a blender.
So, wash it well afterwards & DON'T tell them..."  -Agar

Edited by Civ (10/19/06 12:20 PM)

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OfflineSynthetic8
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Civ]
    #6186291 - 10/19/06 12:46 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I understand that. That is why I said I'd update the post with the macroscopic details later on. I just wanted to know if their had been any cases of these being found in michigan.

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OfflineSynthetic8
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: canid]
    #6186367 - 10/19/06 01:05 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

I appeciate you takin the time to post. I doubt they're being cultivated. I appreciate that you'd put the info out there, but I'll pay Mushroom john a visit and get the details to save you time. I read erowid's mapping the mycelium and didn't see em listed that is why I was just checking up with some people that actually get out in the field because I've heard of certain mushrooms being found in areas where they are not known to originate from. Ex. someone finding morels in california, which I'm not sure if that is true.

I can give out these macroscopic details at the moment on these specimens.

Cap color ranging from a light brownish white to a light yellowish brown color with the color always originating from the center, which would usually be the darkest.

Gilled. The gills were a kind of white and drying brown I do believe.

I do remember making a spore print, but I am not sure if it is the lighter brown I recall.

Ability to peel the skin of the cap from the gills easily as if the gills were only supported by the stem.

Stem: white/straight or deformed/grainy(not very easily broken/more like you have to twist it apart.)

They were growing in a massive cluster of about maybe 30-45 specimens to each of the three patches I found.

I will update with more accurate information and macroscopic details about the youngest mushrooms and the oldest mushrooms.

thanks for everything

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Offlinexmush
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Synthetic8]
    #6186516 - 10/19/06 01:47 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

It's always worth keeping an open mind about a species jumping to a new location for whatever reason. Although you should be super-skeptical at the same time. But it's always possible for there to be some escaped cultivated mushrooms, mushrooms moving into a new habitat, or a new species being discovered. However 99.99% of the time with a find like yours, it will turn out to be some look-a-like. But that doesn't mean it's not worth posting a description like you did. Based on your description though, I would guess that you found some honey mushrooms. Look up Armillaria tabescens and A. mellea at mushroomexpert.com and see if that's what you have.

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Invisibleangryshroom
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Synthetic8]
    #6186532 - 10/19/06 01:52 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

There is always a possibility to find mushrooms growing in areas where they are not common. However, in this case, Psilocybe stunzii truely does favor the West coast. And, there is a possibilty to find them in Michigan, but, its sorta like the Dumb and Dumber possibility "1 in a million, I still got a chance?"

As your description does fit the description of Stunzii, unfortuently it also fits descriptions of many LBM's found. The possibility of finding another LBM is much, much greater than finding Stunzii in your area.

Taking a picture would help, if a camera is not available, take another sporeprint. These mushrooms will drop dark brown spores with an obvious purple tint. If they indeed turn out a rusty/orange brown then you might have a Galerina, which resembles stunzii tremendously, and is known to be extremely posionous.

Good luck!

*EDIT* - XMUSH you beat me! :laugh:

Edited by angryshroom (10/19/06 01:53 PM)

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Offlinecanid
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: xmush]
    #6186533 - 10/19/06 01:52 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

yeah, i'd never rule out the possibility of a species naturalzing in a new location [as long as conditions are supportive] but i'd never assume. i look for zeebras but i wouldn't hunt them if i was starving, so to speak :grin:


--------------------



Attn PWN hunters: If you should come across a bluing Psilocybe matching P. pellicolusa please smell it.
If you detect a scent reminiscent of Anethole (anise) please preserve a specimen or two for study and please PM me.

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Offlinexmush
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: canid]
    #6186539 - 10/19/06 01:53 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

concretefeet said:
yeah, i'd never rule out the possibility of a species naturalzing in a new location [as long as conditions are supportive] but i'd never assume. i look for zeebras but i wouldn't hunt them if i was starving, so to speak :grin:




exactly, when you hear hoofbeats, assume horses - but with this hobby you've always got to keep the zebras in mind just in case!

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Invisibleangryshroom
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: xmush]
    #6186553 - 10/19/06 01:57 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

xmush said:
exactly, when you hear hoofbeats, assume horses - but with this hobby you've always got to keep the zebras in mind just in case!




Yes, because a lot of these Hobbists tend to eat their specimens before-hand!
haha :laugh:

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Offlinecanid
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: angryshroom]
    #6186565 - 10/19/06 01:59 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:


Hobbists





is that like something between a hibbit and a hobbyist?


--------------------



Attn PWN hunters: If you should come across a bluing Psilocybe matching P. pellicolusa please smell it.
If you detect a scent reminiscent of Anethole (anise) please preserve a specimen or two for study and please PM me.

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OfflineSynthetic8
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: canid]
    #6187225 - 10/19/06 04:35 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)



Thanks for all the recommendations and as far as eating them goes it's not going to happen because I don't have hardly any experience going out and picking with someone who knows what they are looking for. I remembered I had taken a picture of them on my brothers camera and had him e-mail me a pic of them. Unfortunately, he gave me the pic of the mushrooms farther out from the pine tree and on top of it the quality is less than my standard. The other pics had younger and older mushrooms alongside each other, which would present the difference of how the younger mushrooms look more purplish towards the center of the cap. I don't know.. Now that I look at them they are macroscopically similar to Tampanensis or maybe even panaeolus subbalteatus, which does grow in Michigan. I will be able to get the spore print and some better macroscopic details tomorrow when i collect some specimens. My mind is not the best to reference. I wish I could find some metol I heard that stuff can create a reaction with the stems to validate that psilocybin is present. Does anyone know of a store that would sell that in the Michigan area? Maybe a camera supply shop or something similar?

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InvisiblePhish_Dude
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Synthetic8]
    #6187597 - 10/19/06 07:10 PM (17 years, 5 months ago)

yeah stay safe, don't go around eating random mushrooms. anyways, you can try looking for the metol in a science or mycology supply catalogue (or you could just google it).
here is a pic of the panaeolus subbalteatus if you think it might be it.(even though they are normally found growing in cow shit)

do Tampanensis really grow in Michigan? if they do can you insert a pic of them, i would love to broaden my knowledge of Michigan shrooms.


--------------------

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Phish_Dude]
    #6813136 - 04/20/07 01:48 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

P. tampanensis is a tropical mushroom found in Florida and Louisiana and Mississippi.

P. stuntzii is indigenous to the PNW only From San Francisco to British Columbia, Canada.

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Offlinephishhead
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6813379 - 04/20/07 03:33 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

To be honest it doesnt look like a psilocybe at all and its definately isnt subbs. Is there apparent bruising after picking or handling? Are the caps fibrous or smooth? Better pics would yield a better id. Great thinking on not just eating a wild mushroom, there needs to be more people who use their heads first rather than letting dying first and asking questions later...


--------------------
"Moderation is the key to life..."

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: Psilocybe Stuntzii in michigan? [Re: Phish_Dude]
    #6813665 - 04/20/07 06:08 PM (16 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Phish_Dude said:

here is a pic of the panaeolus subbalteatus if you think it might be it.(even though they are normally found growing in cow shit)

do Tampanensis really grow in Michigan? if they do can you insert a pic of them, i would love to broaden my knowledge of Michigan shrooms.




Panaeolus subbalteatus main habitat is composting hay. not directly from manure as you quoted above. they grow in cow manure sometimes in some fields. Rare. And then they grow in composting hay which is usually mixed with Horse manure and stable shavings and sometimes hickory nuts and/or dolomite (crushed oyster shells).

And then finally at times in a lawn. From being in the top soil with rich fertilizers. And sometimes even in mulch as seen below, Usually not for more than a season and then they are gone.



see http://www.mushromjohn.com/panaeolussubbalteatus2.htm

For those of you who do not known what a compost heap looks like, this is but a smaller version of four at this location. In Oregon, there can be twenty or thirty stacked higher than this and in large bales.

five images and some shrooms





Some Panaeolus sphinctrinus


Some Panaeolus semiovatus


A larger compost heap, one of four at this location:


Some more fresher Panaeolus campanulatus musrhooms


All of the green in the photo below and the beautiful yellow flowers in bloom are growing from Compost dumped over the hill from the riding stables. I have even picked here with Paul Stamets and Gartz and I collect Gymnopilus species hear and ever one year a slew of P. stuntzii appeared in the wood chips and manured compost. In this image, the compost was spread around the small field and heaps on the tops of two sides of this little field..



mjshroomer



mj

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