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 FrenchSocialist
DarwinianLeftist
Registered: 08/02/06
Posts: 883
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
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 Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives.  [Re: GnosticWarrior]
#6785901 - 04/14/07 04:36 AM (17 years, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
GnosticWarrior said:
I agree with you here! But, I'd like to elaborate. From birth till a certain age, a person was not in control of their environment, parents, role models, and programing. This period determined the foundation of who a person is. As physical and mental growth progresses, one becomes less dependent on other people dictating choices for them. However, there's still a lot of external factors that one will never be in control of. All one can do is maximize the opportunities that are created by the Power of choice regarding the options that they are given.
Behavioral geneticists, based on what I have read describe it differently. What they state is that as you age, based on their research which is able to control for environmental factors, is that genetic factors begin to play a larger role then environmental.
Quote:
GnosticWarrior said:In essence, who you would become was not your choice but just a matter of fufilling your destiny. One can only be held responsible for the choices they were aware of. Ignorance should be forgiven. And it is possible for one to choose not to accept their destiny, thereby creating avoidable misery. There is no external benchmark that can accurately measure a person's internal efforts. And isn't this what a person should really be graded on, if any?
I think what you say makes a lot of sense, and I also very much agree with the notions of altruistic individualism and encouraging others to reach their potential. I think we are just describing different approaches to the issue.
All in all I just see telling people what to do as impractical. Research has shown some people spend their pay checks like drunken sailors, instead of setting sufficient funds aside for retirement, in part for genetic reasons. These people simply do not have the capacity to save money. Their minds are tied to the hunter-gatherer era where literally the next day could be their last. They are experiencing life at a shorter life expectancy. It is unreasonable to expect these people to start saving because we:
1- Wrote to them that they should.
2- Said to them that they should.
3- Threatened future punishment/social abandonment if they should not.
The same may go with people in other areas of life- saving for health care, academic aptitude, driving a car, getting over religion, etc.
It is unreasonable to expect everyone to meet certain requirements without any aid, and to deny them this aid is to deny them a chance to reach their potential. I don't see that as a constructive policy.
I also don't see the point in judging the value of a person's life by how well they are able to excel in a given area. Excellence is admirable, but I think such is superseded by matters like how ethical a person is or how true they are to those close to them.
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"Both liberty and equality are among the primary goals pursued by human beings through many centuries; but total liberty for wolves is death to the lambs" -- Isaiah Berlin
Edited by FrenchSocialist (04/14/07 04:42 AM)
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 Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: skeeter]
#6786113 - 04/14/07 07:57 AM (17 years, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
skeeter said:
The T.V. controls us and everything we do.
Think about it, everything "comforatable" is faced to a screen.
Drawing you in.
Inviting you to absorb all it has to say.
Turn on the news. Propaganda.
It raises your children. Tells their easily warped minds how to behave In every way it can.
Ask me questions.
Also on a different note, I hate private christian schools.
What you mean is TV controls everything you do.:p
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (04/14/07 07:58 AM)
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Clean
the lense
Registered: 05/11/03
Posts: 2,374
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: FrenchSocialist]
#6786418 - 04/14/07 09:48 AM (17 years, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
People do not choose to be poor or ignorant, it happens in accordance with physiological mechanisms and cultural programming. They may literally have no control over the situation.
First one needs to realize that they have in fact been programmed without their consent. That understanding is the starting point for any further explorations. Once that is realized one can begin to take control.
I think no matter what kind of society one grows up in, whether or not to pursue greater knowledge and experience is ultimately an individual choice. If the prevailing cultural influences are not conducive to such individual pursuits, the thoughtful person must sacrifice certain levels comfort in order to travel the paths of discovery. It is up to the individual whether or not they want to make the necessary sacrifices, or to even embark on the trains of thought which would reveal the nature of the sacrifices which need to be made.
Blame is not necessary. Living in ignorance of the nature of self and its relationship to society is punishment enough.
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skeeter
The $ickest Loco
Registered: 12/07/06
Posts: 1,604
Loc: wasteland
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: Icelander]
#6786980 - 04/14/07 01:09 PM (17 years, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
skeeter said:
The T.V. controls us and everything we do.
Think about it, everything "comforatable" is faced to a screen.
Drawing you in.
Inviting you to absorb all it has to say.
Turn on the news. Propaganda.
It raises your children. Tells their easily warped minds how to behave In every way it can.
Ask me questions.
Also on a different note, I hate private christian schools.
What you mean is TV controls everything you do.:p
Ha, not anymore.
Sorry I was coming down when I first wrote this, so it may sound wierd.
What I meant by 'us' is the heavy TV watchers, what I used to be.
--------------------
UncleLuke said:
you talking about the child porn? I can explain that... it's my nephew.
stickyicky13 said:
I'm not gay, I'm brittish! you let one guy put his wiener in your bottom and instantly everyone thinks you are a poofta
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GnosticWarrior
Hermit
Registered: 03/11/07
Posts: 241
Loc: Oahu, Hawaii
Last seen: 14 years, 10 months
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: FrenchSocialist]
#6787004 - 04/14/07 01:14 PM (17 years, 6 days ago) |
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Quote:
FrenchSocialist said:
Quote:
GnosticWarrior said:
I agree with you here! But, I'd like to elaborate. From birth till a certain age, a person was not in control of their environment, parents, role models, and programing. This period determined the foundation of who a person is. As physical and mental growth progresses, one becomes less dependent on other people dictating choices for them. However, there's still a lot of external factors that one will never be in control of. All one can do is maximize the opportunities that are created by the Power of choice regarding the options that they are given.
Behavioral geneticists, based on what I have read describe it differently. What they state is that as you age, based on their research which is able to control for environmental factors, is that genetic factors begin to play a larger role then environmental.
When I wrote my reply I wasn't even thinking of the role of genetics. I was only looking at the role nurture plays. Yes, nature does play a bigger factor.
Quote:
FrenchSocialist said:
Quote:
GnosticWarrior said:In essence, who you would become was not your choice but just a matter of fufilling your destiny. One can only be held responsible for the choices they were aware of. Ignorance should be forgiven. And it is possible for one to choose not to accept their destiny, thereby creating avoidable misery. There is no external benchmark that can accurately measure a person's internal efforts. And isn't this what a person should really be graded on, if any?
I think what you say makes a lot of sense, and I also very much agree with the notions of altruistic individualism and encouraging others to reach their potential. I think we are just describing different approaches to the issue.
All in all I just see telling people what to do as impractical. Research has shown some people spend their pay checks like drunken sailors, instead of setting sufficient funds aside for retirement, in part for genetic reasons. These people simply do not have the capacity to save money. Their minds are tied to the hunter-gatherer era where literally the next day could be their last. They are experiencing life at a shorter life expectancy. It is unreasonable to expect these people to start saving because we:
1- Wrote to them that they should.
2- Said to them that they should.
3- Threatened future punishment/social abandonment if they should not.
The same may go with people in other areas of life- saving for health care, academic aptitude, driving a car, getting over religion, etc.
It is unreasonable to expect everyone to meet certain requirements without any aid, and to deny them this aid is to deny them a chance to reach their potential. I don't see that as a constructive policy.
I also don't see the point in judging the value of a person's life by how well they are able to excel in a given area. Excellence is admirable, but I think such is superseded by matters like how ethical a person is or how true they are to those close to them.
I see your point here. Even Warren Buffett says, that he is predispositioned to excel in today's captial market society and that he would make a poor hunter gatherer and would probably be killed off early in that era. However, I do believe that we are all born with the potential to bear certain gifts. This gift might not be highly regarded in current society but can still be beneficial.
So yes, preaching and telling people what they should do is of no help to them unless it can actually help one develop their gift. But I think we tend to do it bcs we might not know how to be of true aid to someone or are too self centered to see the role that each individual plays in the bigger picture. Too much emphasis has been put on the individual as being independent and not interdependent. I think our destiny is to learn how to help others with our gifts. Of course maybe hurting people with it might be part of the learning process.
Quote:
Clean said:
Blame is not necessary. Living in ignorance of the nature of self and its relationship to society is punishment enough.
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darnold
Stranger
Registered: 04/10/07
Posts: 37
Last seen: 15 years, 5 months
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: GnosticWarrior]
#6790111 - 04/15/07 11:15 AM (17 years, 5 days ago) |
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plus tvs entirely unproductive. the occasional sit down can be entertaining and relaxing but i know too many people who get home from work or school and just watch TV all day long. I have no right to say this is wrong of course because people have their own choices but i definately found for myself that theres alot more entertaining and productive things to do that also challenge the mind and is usually alot less bias and one sided.
Its another one of those examples too that shows how pathetic the war on drugs is. At least it seems to me that people can get so concerned that someone can get home after work and school then sit around and smoke pot all the rest of the day long, assuming that its bad, unproductive, addictive, and leading them away from what really matters. But on the otherside its perfectly exceptable to watch TV all day long.
I guess really i dont want to take the stand of whether either of those are right or wrong, but that they can be extremely comparable in context. Its about moderation and mindset.
Anyway just some thoughts that came to mind.
Danny
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fivepointer
newbie
Registered: 08/03/02
Posts: 1,428
Last seen: 7 years, 5 months
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: skeeter]
#6790671 - 04/15/07 02:05 PM (17 years, 5 days ago) |
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Simple solution, unplug it. I only watch it for weather before I go to work, other than that it stays off.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: fivepointer]
#6790887 - 04/15/07 02:48 PM (17 years, 5 days ago) |
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Wow fivepointer. That's not a bad post.
There may be hope for your soul yet.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
Edited by Icelander (04/15/07 02:49 PM)
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leery11
I Tell You What!
Registered: 06/24/05
Posts: 5,998
Last seen: 9 years, 14 days
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Re: The t.v. controls everything in our lives. [Re: fivepointer]
#6795896 - 04/16/07 05:59 PM (17 years, 4 days ago) |
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I always discourage my family from watching TV to find out the weather, because as a consequence they have to see the news and commercials.
It takes roughly 15 seconds to get a forecast by going to weather.com and putting in your zip code.
You have to sit and watch the "weather channel" for maybe upwards of 15 minutes just to see your local forecast, and in the mean time you get ads..... its a little silly.
So anyway, TV controls us so much that now I wonder if its evil at all, and all the evil is just in our imaginations, and its fine to watch. I wouldn't watch it, but it's too much energy to hate it.
it just clips ---------- consciousness ----------- into fragments ----------- that take your attention away just by virtue of being in exposure to the noise it emits
NO ONE in a crowd of people is going to be loud enough or authoritiative enough to speak their conversation with the zeal of a well rehearsed commercial actor........ the voices command authority while you are just sitting in a room eating, and they are armed with jingles and discusrive sound effects
what can we do except turn them off though..... in public buildings, go around turning them off..... has anyone done that?
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I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo! ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!
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