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Offline_JJ_
PsychedelicRevolutionary
Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 369
Loc: NSW, Australia
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: Asante]
    #675904 - 06/13/02 01:38 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks Wiccan..
I'm on a low dose of Metroponol (forget exactly).. he told me to halve it if it made me feel a bit dizzy when I stood up. It didn't but I think I'm gonna halve the dose anyway to be on the safe side Hopefully I'll have a good sleep and it'll all be over tomorrow..
Shrooms aren't anticholinergic? hmm.. I'll talk to him tomorrow.. Might have to have a session or two with the psychiatrist or something heh. I'm still fighting on.. I got a bit panicky after I wrote that last message but I managed to overcome it again.

Needless to say.. I'm never using *any* psychotropic drugs again.


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Offlinegrowin
addict
Registered: 03/11/02
Posts: 484
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #675918 - 06/13/02 02:10 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

when i took lsd 4 the 1st time it was a super week trip, didnt feel it even.
3 days later i went to see 'american psycho' with my dad and i n the parking lot i cought myself thinking 'what if i'll kill him now...'.
i love my dad very much and my relationsheep with him is great, i just got realy in the movie. i didnt link my emotional status to the lsd i took 3 days ago, since i already forgot i took it.
i was in a extreem mood, and i didnt know how to cope and what to cope with, so i put my walkman on and went to the park , there i ran and screamed and danced, after letting all those emotions out i sat down and rationlaized thinking what could make me feel like this, and then i rememberd the trip i took 3 days ealier.
afterthat i knew the reason im thinking in that way and just playied with it.


just telling my story - maybe you can learn from it somhow.

a growin original


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InvisibleAsante
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Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,997
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #676374 - 06/13/02 09:10 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Hi JJ!

The doc might be confused with Amanita Muscaria (fly agaric) which IS anticholinergic. In fact in old literature I've seen it's active Muscimol discribed as "Pilzatropin"; "Mushroom Atropine" and I know it to be an Anticholinergic compound.

JJ: it must be quite a shocker for you... I had a 24hr. prolonged reaction once, real scary too. It slowly built up to a climax of severe dyscomfort & dysphoria, fears & dispair racing trough my mind accompanied by the wildest thoughts... Suddenly my body started tingling intensely. I got this WEIRD feeling in my head: like I had been tensing up my brain like a muscle the whole day long & suddenly it relaxed. I felt a decompression inside and the negativity I had felt growing throughout the day suddenly turned into... peaceful normalcy.
There I sat, on the toilet in the middle of an insomniac's night, bewildered what had happened. Having read alot of Grof I decided some kind of resolution had been achieved. From strong bad-triplike effects to normalcy in under 10 seconds! I felt like I had passed some kind of test, had worked through something important & went to sleep.

Biology, Psychology or both: I can relate to the feelings you must be having. Things like: "Now you REALLY DID IT, WS! You've managed to shatter your brain & you'll never recover!" went trough my brain as probably in yours. But I didn't read anything in your postings that suggested it might be permanent. Have faith. Try to hang on some more, although I know it's scary terrain you're in. Don't curse yourself or the mushroom, or God, or whatever & play for time. Reread the Psychedelic FAQ: it might prove to be reassuring. To me it seems highly likely you're just in an "emotional rollercoaster" sick of it, yes, but in my view the ride is about to end. Maybe it'll end like mine: that it'll get worse before it gets better.
Have faith in your sanity!


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offline_JJ_
PsychedelicRevolutionary
Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 369
Loc: NSW, Australia
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: Asante]
    #676967 - 06/13/02 03:24 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

I think I've figured out what *was* affecting me.. when you're under the influence of shrooms your brain control can go out the window. You can't suppress thoughts and have to let them flow. I think I forgot (temporarily) how to suppress thoughts and so bad introspective thoughts had free rein over my mind. I'm going to go and see the psychiatrist for some extra advice just to make sure.. but I believe that's what it was.. you need to rein in fleeting thoughts and maintain a hold on your mind. I have experienced something similar before, though not as bad as this, after having a panic attack on marijuana.
Anyway.. so ends my drug expedition
Fun while it lasted and I've learnt much. Now to take what I've learnt and go out and live my life! Good luck to you all!


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #677761 - 06/14/02 05:51 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

JJ:

Personally I believe thoughts should be as free as the air we breathe & that one should strive to not supress them.
But I'm not you. To each his own; It's your brain, your Life.

It's good you got someting positive out of all this. It's certainly true for most that whilst under Psilocybin (self)control is lessened.
I chose for this but I perfectly understand it might not be your choice.

Too bad your days on High are over.
Take your Insights, Hopes & Ideas & make your Life more beautiful than you imagined could be possible.
P.E.A.C.E !!!


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offline_JJ_
PsychedelicRevolutionary
Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 369
Loc: NSW, Australia
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: Asante]
    #679345 - 06/14/02 07:27 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Wiccan.. I know what you're saying.. but then please tell me how do I control bad thoughts? Thoughts which scare me and make me fear for my mental health? I believe my experience has given me (hopefully temporary) anxiety disorder. I have it under control mostly but I still have 1 or 2 bad experiences each day.. any ideas?
Maybe something to do with meditation could help?


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #679419 - 06/14/02 08:54 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Hi JJ!

Anxiety disorder... Hm, may be too soon to say that. Aftereffects of especially difficult sessions are more common than alot of shroom-enthousiast like to admit.
You see alot of it here on the Shroomery.

Remember that aftereffects may leave you at any given time, Swami sez it's all Biology, but I think there's a psychological factor involved also.

How should you control your thoughts? I can't say, really: dunno what you're dealing with. I myself believe in letting thoughts flow as they come, and had many a disturbing thought: Ultraviolent fantasies (even involving loved ones), sexually, er.. disturbing fantasies of a masturbatory nature, the Ultimate Violence, suicide & in bouts of strong depression I've been known to pray the Comet down on us, so to speak. Now alot of people claim they don't have "strange/disturbing thoughts". They're lying, not to you but to themselves.
Truth is a brainfunction we can bend at will. If we believe it ain't true it isn't, ei?

There's always the countercurrent. People have "personality-alien" thoughts from time to time to balance their mind out. Oh we like to think black or white, but in the end the sum of things is we're all gray. Countercurrent thoughts can really send people on guilttrips. "I'm a MONSTER for thinking this!!!" "God will send me to Hell for having these thoughts!!!" This isn't necessary.
Over 20% of new mothers have strong recurring urges to strangle/mutilate their babies. It makes the postnatal stress quite more severe to them.
But it's natural, perfectly natural to have personality-alien thoughts. They serve only to keep us sane.

You might be young, say 12-25 or otherwise in the midst of upheavel in your life causing a flood of negative thoughts to surge upwards. It might also be you're obsessed with being mr. Perfect (no offence intended!) and simply can't tolerate being imperfect like all of us.
Vividly fantasizing about spilling blood by the gallon or what-have-you-not does NOT make you a killer.

The mind works symbolically & such is the content of your thoughts, just like dreaming, really. They try to tell you something, usually less extreme & archetypal than the scene depicted. Thoughts of suicide might indicate there's a dissatisfaction in life, which may be your Chemteacher or office Boss. The thought of applying a blunt hacksaw to your mother's neck & slowly saw her head off might indicate that there's interpersonal issues & stresses to be delt with, maybe to move out, even, but it's never that your brain tells you it's time to go to the toolshed. Your girl may argue or threaten to leave you & you get an H-bomb blast inside. There's no telling WHAT might be going on in your head.

If you think your thoughts aren't too taboo, how about dumping them off right here at the Shroomery? Some time ago I started an explicit & taboo thread on the topic of LOTR demihumans getting it off together & me getting off on that, just to see if the Shroomery's "Free" reputation isn't hogwash.
It wasn't.
I got some caustix & flames flew all over the place, but over half was either neutral or positive, trying to offer advice & generally helping.
I didn't have to change my username: there was NO real harassment afterwards, no hate-PM's, nothing. It was difficult to deal with some of the negativity but it proved to be a very positive experience.
And there's always PM's!

Meditation? Lie down in your bed in darkness, eyes closed & let uncensored thoughts flow. Do a bare minimum of active thinking & let go if you get stuck on what you might think is trivia. 1/2 hour a day should be great & it is quite relaxing too! Hope to have helped!



--------------------
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higher knowledge starts here


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Offline_JJ_
PsychedelicRevolutionary
Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 369
Loc: NSW, Australia
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: Asante]
    #680788 - 06/15/02 04:43 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks again Wiccan.. well it's kinda like this.. I've got exams coming up (yea I know it was stupid to dose at this time) but I'm finding it hard to concentrate. My brain will run off and start thinking about other things.. occasionally I'll get panicky feelings and thoughts which make me scared.. such as will this ever go away? Am I going insane? Am I going to die? Why did I risk my mental health? I try to suppress them but these just seems to make them worse..
I'm making progress insofar as that now instead of suppressing the thoughts I let my mind flow and conciously analyse the thoughts.. like I guess your mind it supposed to work. I think I also have a viral infection which isn't making things any easier as it gives me stomach discomfort and sometimes a feeling at the back of my throat which I believe I subconciously (or something) associate with bad tripping effects and hence gives me anxiety. I start thinking about how I might lose to will to keep fighting on and the virus might kill me or something.. it's all really defeatist and stupid but sometimes I just can't shake the thoughts...


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Anonymous

Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #680923 - 06/15/02 05:55 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

JJ

I think these people are being too nice to you, JJ.

I think you need to stop being a pussy looking for attention and stop blaming all your shit on the trip.

That or strap a mattress to your back and start hookin your ass on a street corner cause it's all down hill from here for you buddy.

Leaf


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Anonymous

Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: HB]
    #680931 - 06/15/02 06:00 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Heavenlyblue

>"90% of the many trips I've taken have been bad or life-changing experiences. I continue to trip for many reasons, but I won't go into that now because it isn't necessary."<

No, no. I insist. Let's go into it. 90% of your trips have been "bad or life-changing experiences"? WTF? If the stuff doesn't agree with you, stop doing it. You're in control of your future.

Leaf


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #681165 - 06/15/02 11:12 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

D.O.N.T P.A.N.I.C !!!

You're very probably not going insane & going to die by the Shroom... Nope: don't think so. In my view, partially based on S.Grof's masterpiece "LSD Psychotherapy" repressing stuff only tends to make it worse. I don't wanna get all tough like Leafblowerz here, but there's a Dutch proverb that says:

"Wie zijn billen brandt moet op de blaren zitten."

Or, in English: "He who burns his butt has to sit on the blisters." No offence please, but your timing (exams) was very bad & the FAQ and tons of other infos state clearly you have to prepare before & have spare time afterwards to deal with a possible aftermath.

But: you're in shit now, so that's all redundant. Why you took the risk is something between you & your conscience. I can only repeat:

"Very likely these nasties WILL GO AWAY."

It's also likely it won't take more than a few weeks. It's very shitty to be in this place you're in & it's bad for the outcome of your exams, but you gotta take charge of your life & have faith in yourself. The viral infection may be just that, or it may be a psychosomatic response. Personally I think something big has come up, something you're discontent with & have to resolve. I think "shaking thoughts" is a wrong strategy if it's Big things you're facing. BTW, Important: Is there ANYTHING you're experiencing that even REMOTELY seems familiar to sensations you had in your life before imbiding? Think hard about this one.

It's like shoveling snow: if you push & push it away from you not making seperate mounds you'll find yourseld facing a heap that'll take all your strenght to move... Or maybe it won't bulge at all. I think it's best to have faith and wait for the thaw to set in: wait for it to reach it's end.
Something that may ease stuff out: 200mg of NiacinAMIDE (Vitamin B3) twice daily will make it easier to cope with the stresses. Do not opt for Niacin/Nicotinic Acid: it'll work to but also provides a bodyrush most find unpleasant.

Do stuff you like & try to face what's popping in your head when it appears, trying to not repress any thought. If you get a bizarre urge that isn't harmful to yourself or others (including animals etc.) DO IT: it may provide insight.
If it's at all possible postpone the exams until you're in the clear again. A simple exam might decide your career-future & should be taken dead serious.
Claim you're ill: in a way you are at the time. I don't wanna critisize you, but I think you probably handled the trip a bit poorly: not really listening to yourself & not following the "Golden thread" that leads you through the Experience. Or perhaps you mentally fled for a particular, crucial sensation. But then again: it may easily be Biological in nature, although I doubt that.

According to Grof: The more pressing the Psychedelic-related problem, the quicker it usually resolves & symptoms are a part of you HEALING yourself, not of the particular affliction. Hang inthere!


--------------------
Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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Offlineruskifile
droog

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 258
Loc: nowhere
Last seen: 16 years, 3 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #681211 - 06/16/02 12:33 AM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Oh wow I'm really sorry to hear that, JJ ......my commiserations.....

Can I suggest if you want to try meditation, look up Raja yoga meditation, which means the royal path, ie to become a king or master of our emotions/selves etc. This meditation also is a great help to boost self-esteem and and prevent negative thinking in any circumstances

I wish you the best in whatever you decide to do mate


--------------------
(zhukov in a previous life....)

2SER FM underground radio


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Offline_JJ_
PsychedelicRevolutionary
Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 369
Loc: NSW, Australia
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: Asante]
    #684671 - 06/17/02 05:58 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks yet again Wiccan.. you've been extremely helpful I think I have figured it out.. my weird thoughts were a product of an over-active mind following that trip. Yesterday, when I actually sat down and concentrated on studying the feelings left me. I think that by letting my thoughts run rampant I brought on a very introverted introspective thought path that took me through loops and insane states. I was always concerned with (during this period, not before this heh) how I felt, what I thought, how I thought rather than with other people and my responsibilities. For future reference, the best way to deal with such an episode of anxiety is to keep yourself occupied, not only physically but mentally. That way your mind is too busy with the tasks at hand to run off into crazy nonsensical thoughts about your own wellbeing. I think also, not having had this viral infection would've helped as I mistook an upset stomach as impending anxiety.

Thanks ruskifile


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InvisibleAsante
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Re: *bah* Help please! [Re: _JJ_]
    #687114 - 06/18/02 09:32 PM (21 years, 8 months ago)

Good for You, JJ!

Glad your ordeal seems over! I know what it is to be in a state of Hell & wish tons more people on the Shroomery tried to lend people a hand when they need it!
Great you figured it out!


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