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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #6731583 -

I consider myself to be Christian, but I am certainly not the two-dimensional sort of Christian who is called 'Fundamentalist' or 'Evangelical.' Such individuals usually seem to have a combination of extraverted personality type (which gloms onto non-inner-directed Christian 'directions'), an often pathological need for 'perfection' (which is enacted through rigid, often Obsessive-Compulsive moral imperatives), and a
Superiority Complex and power motive which is frequently confounded with the Holy Spirit (i.e., the Holy Spirit 'saves' people, not loud-mouthed evangelists).

It seems pretty obvious that this brand of Christian is here to 'save' the sinners that populate this site. However, we are ALL sinners according to the wretched doctrine of Original Sin (penned by Augustine, not Biblical authors btw). So the Superiority Complex operates (as complexes do) in an autonomous way which creates a psychological 'blind spot.' In other words, everyone else is a sinner, but the evangelizer experiences him/herself in a superior state of being (e.g., 'saved,' 'washed in the blood of the lamb,' etc.). While such a person will admit to being a sinner if asked, it is lip-service because the affect underlying the humble admission is rooted in the superiority complex or the Messianic Complex (which also feels superior). Then, to make matters even worse, Schizophrenics, Paranoid Type, post here, speaking in the first person because their Complex has usurped their personality, and they want Shroomerites to think that very God is talking through them. Check it out!

What blows my mind is that I get accused of using "psycho-babble" by these types of professing Christians when in fact, I am not babbling at all. I am speaking from years of analytical education and training. And what's worse is that more people do not question the underlying psychology of people who adopt these forms of religion with which they go out to assail and assault humanity.


Mental illness very often takes a religious form. Nazism was a religious movement and a whole nation went mad. Muslim suicide bombers are violently insane, believing propagandized delusions about perpetual sexual intercourse with forever young celestial virgins who have translucent skin and ruby marrow in their pearlescent bones. Japanese Kamakazi suicide bombers were taught that just by reciting "Nama Amida Butsu" - In the Name of Amida Buddha - the Buddha of Infinite Light, mass killing and their own death would result in arrival in the Buddhist 'Pure Land.' Fundamentalist Christians have their own delusions based on symbols found in Revelations. Why delusions? Because of Transcendental conditions, 1 Corinthians 2:9 says: "But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him," which means incomprehensible, for the simpletons who maintain delusions about 'golden roads' or 'lakes of fire.' We must not become angry with the delusional, while at the same time we must be fully cognizant that they are quite dangerous to life and limb, and enemies of Freedom on every level.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #6731766 -

MarkostheGnostic: to make matters even worse, Schizophrenics, Paranoid Type, post here...

Nothing like being stuck between a rock and a hard place, is there?


Mental illness very often takes a religious form. Nazism was a religious movement and a whole nation went mad.

I believe the process you're referring to is known as shadow projection -- you appear to be firmly mired in yours at the moment.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'm going to go hang with some paranoid schizophrenics -- they happen to be some of my favorite kind of people.



Music of the Hour: Halo


.


--------------------
~ Kindness is cheap.  It's unkindness that always demands the highest price.

Blogs: Spiritual Emergency | Spiritual Recovery | Voices of Recovery | A Jungian Approach to Psychosis

Edited by spiritualemerg (03/31/07 01:17 PM)

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732157 -

its fire and brimstone preaching. they think they are here evangelising but all they are doing is driving non-christians further away. they are not "sheltered" but they usually arnt really well traveled or experienced as some people are. they are the kind of people who attempt to evangelise without connecting. evangelism only works when the speaker truly connects with their auidience and people like that will never connect because they are too hard headed and intolerant.

so yea, its like it was said above. its all about evangelism to them, they just dont understand how to truly be evangelists with all audiences. and obviously like when they come in here and look like idiots. i wish people like that wouldnt even post. they are ignorant to the real world sometimes.

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: Proskier]
    #6732207 -

What annoys me is how they post in the Philosophy and Spirituality forum, for the purpose of open discussion. However, they do not engage in open, intelligent discussion/debate, but rather operate with circular reasoning and flawed logic while ignoring any posts/questions that could possibly invalidate their statements/arguments. (I wonder if this is even a conscious action, or if they just can't see them!) Seems like Mysticism, Religion and Paranormal material to me....


--------------------

"The choiceless truth of who you are is revealed to be permanently here permeating everything. Not a thing and not separate from anything."--Gaganji
"Yesterday is but today's memory and tomorrow is today's dream."
"My karma ran over my dogma!"

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: SoY]
    #6732212 -

Personally, I'd like to see them post in OTD.


--------------------

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: SoY]
    #6732228 -

I agree with you soy.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: SoY]
    #6732243 -

Well yes, but then again, in Mysticism, Religion and Paranormal they wouldn't have so many opponents.
And I have a slight idea that they only feel strong and touched by God when everybody's against them... because they seem to develop a Jesus complex... having the impression that they're on a modern crusade, testing their strength having to deal with people that don't share the same opinions on the matter.
In fact, some of them don't even believe as much as they seem in their "preachings" and by doing it over and over again they're getting closer to program their minds with it...
Fri\om what I've seen what they do is has a dose of masochism...


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs
:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #6732246 -

Quote:
Interview With the Savior

August 27, 2005: I sat down with the Son of God to share a few drinks and talk about his thoughts, experiences and plans for the future. We both started out with a slight buzz, but finished up the evening totally ripped.


MR: So how have things been going?

JC: Great. I think things are pretty much as planned. I took some time off after the crucifixion tour and just hung out 'til the rest of my mates could join me. I have to admit, I really missed those guys. Especially Matt, Johnny and Pete. But we're all back together now and they're even helping with my upcoming "Second Coming" tour.

. . .

MR: Is there anything that you really hate?

JC: Fake fans. Sometimes I'm like, "Have you heard a fucking thing I've said?"


Source: Mickey Ripped




See also: Shadow Projection


Music of the Hour: Silence


.

Edited by spiritualemerg (03/31/07 04:54 PM)

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732319 -

No, I am not mired in "shadow projections," (8 1/2 years of Jungian analysis with 3 Zurich-trained analysts got me a little savvy about projection). I simply want those who are not seriously ill themselves to be ill-effected by getting involved in other people's delusions. Forum members are usually old enough to treat their conditions. If they refuse therapy and/or medication but choose to go about laying their bad trip on others, and others do not see what is going on, I'd like to provide a wake up call.

So, if you think I'm being unreasonable or arrogant, go off and hang with your favorite paranoid schizophrenics. I'm wondering which type of delusions you might favor.

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #6732349 -

hot48yearolds said:
I know this a free forum and anyone is welcome here,

But why the hell do you Fundamentalist Christians post here, what do you get out of a drug forum when drugs are prohibited by your religion?

Why don't you guys go hang out in a Christian forum?


Who are you addressing? Anyone that might happen by and consider themself to adhere to the vauge label you refer to? If you were addressing someone in specific, then it would be the content of a private message. I don't sense much of a philosophical or spiritual topic being presented.

Nevertheless, there is some decent discussion occuring, so there is no problem, but if some "fundamentalist Christian" emerges and personalisms are being exchanged, then I'll padlock this mother fucker. :evil: :lol:

:stoned:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #6732381 -

MarkostheGnostic: No, I am not mired in "shadow projections...

Okay.

I simply want those who are not seriously ill themselves to be ill-effected by getting involved in other people's delusions.

Freudian slip or were you just typing fast?

Forum members are usually old enough to treat their conditions. If they refuse therapy and/or medication but choose to go about laying their bad trip on others, and others do not see what is going on, I'd like to provide a wake up call.

You are in a community surrounded by people who routinely take illicit drugs for (presumably) the purpose of furthering their personal and spiritual growth and who also, presumably, do so with full knowledge and acceptance of the potential risks of that action yet... if someone you deem to be spiritually inferior (i.e. Evangelical, Fundamentalist) comes along to say, "I insist that you should do things my way because I've got it all figured out!" you feel compelled to stand up and "save the populace".

MushroomTrip had it spot on. You are welcome to reach into the depths of your soul, pull out a little resolve, and ignore them. The few posts those individuals might make are nothing compared to the rallying cry of the community members who gathered together in solidarity to kick the scapegoat of the hour with the full support and encouragement of those around them.

So, if you think I'm being unreasonable or arrogant, go off and hang with your favorite paranoid schizophrenics. I'm wondering which type of delusions you might favor.

Quote:
Psychotherapist / Hypnotherapist / Addictions Counselor / Crisis Intervention Specialist
Hobbies Growing up
Location South Florida
Bio B.A. - Philosophy, Long Island University
M.T.S. - Theology, Drew University Seminary
Ph.D. - Human Development Education & Clinical Psychology, U. of Maryland
Certified Diplomate in Clinical Hypnotherapy
Master Addictions Counselor





You don't mind hanging your professional shingle out there for all to see so I'm going to call you on it. Do you really think that belittling schizophrenics in public forums is the best that you're capable of?

... the evangelizer experiences him/herself in a superior state of being (e.g., 'saved,' 'washed in the blood of the lamb,' etc.). While such a person will admit to being a sinner if asked, it is lip-service because the affect underlying the humble admission is rooted in the superiority complex or the Messianic Complex (which also feels superior).

Bingo. The mirror has two faces.

See also: Marek: A Story About Schizophrenia


Music of the Hour: Away From The Sun



.


--------------------
~ Kindness is cheap.  It's unkindness that always demands the highest price.

Blogs: Spiritual Emergency | Spiritual Recovery | Voices of Recovery | A Jungian Approach to Psychosis

Edited by spiritualemerg (03/31/07 10:02 PM)

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Moderator Notification [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732456 -

spiritualemerg said:
Psychotherapist / Hypnotherapist / Addictions Counselor / Crisis Intervention Specialist   
Hobbies  Growing up   
Location  South Florida   
Bio  B.A. - Philosophy, Long Island University
M.T.S. - Theology, Drew University Seminary
Ph.D. - Human Development Education & Clinical Psychology, U. of Maryland
Certified Diplomate in Clinical Hypnotherapy
Master Addictions Counselor

 

You don't mind hanging your professional shingle out there for all to see so I'm going to call you on it.  Do you really think that belittling schizophrenics in public forums is the best that you're capable of?


Markosthegnostic did not post that information in this thread, so it is not open for discussion in the manner in which you are seeking to do so. Please review the forum rules. This forum is for the open discussion of ideas not the posters presenting these ideas.

I've already stated that, if this thread starts to become full of personalism exchanges, it would be locked, and I have made you aware that this type of discussion is not the purpose and intention of this forum, but rather philosophical and spiritual ideas. Please consider this when posting in the future. :wink:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732494 -

Quote:
spiritualemerg said:The few posts those individuals might make are nothing compared to the rallying cry of the community members who gathered together in solidarity to kick the scapegoat of the hour with the full support and encouragement of those around them.


Sure such dynamic arises, only naturally so, but this is not the most relevant issue here.

A forum will never have ignored posts. One may personally not post, but someone will, and the thread will end up the same - ugly. Yeah, ignore that as well, great.

This is particularly true since one may not gather the intentions of posters correctly, one could hope for an actual decent discussion, where points and counterpoints are acknowledged by all participants, a civil conversation. Only to have, after few failed tries, the worst frustration of all - of a completely wasted conversation, and due to essentially dishonesty of some participants.

A list of 'ignore these' for novices would help. But hows that any better than a formal action?

Honestly in real life, my reaction to what i percieve simply as verbal agression, would consist in a simple 'fuck off, leave me alone'. Its so easy to aviod such encounters, you just dont hang around such ppl and thats it, you dont typically share a public space with them.

This however is like looking at a newspaper that among great things, allso serves as a free media for evangelicals or whatever you wish to call this to me relatively unknown phenomena to propagate their message or whatever. Well, I would not waste time on a newspaper that would offer such free service to them; its unlikely one edited in this way would have anything Id be interested in, id choose a media more to my taste than that. But its far more confusing here, where while the site would not mind being essentially a free medium for such (ab)use, in all it seems filled with far better content.
So, its now advised that I simply filter in my mind the content I wish to avoid, when noticing it, biting my tounge and not replying to a provocation. Again, fine.
But, in no RL analogue situation would I ever find myself in such a dilemma, id just leave, as would all other. I wouldnt invite someone I find so irritating to (figurativelly) share a joint and discuss matters with my friends, nor would anyone else Id share that joint with do something like that. Certainly I wouldnt 'simply' ignore someone of those ppl, speaking that kind of nonsense while in the company, rather Id leave, as would all other.

Edited by aryah (03/31/07 06:52 PM)

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Re: Moderator Notification [Re: fireworks_god]
    #6732506 -

Fair enough. Regardless, it is a matter that he has chosen to display on his public profile.

What Markos did say in this regard is this...

Quote:
Then, to make matters even worse, Schizophrenics, Paranoid Type, post here, speaking in the first person because their Complex has usurped their personality, and they want Shroomerites to think that very God is talking through them. Check it out!




All religions are rooted in the altered states of consciousness their founders underwent: Moses had an indepth conversation with a burning bush; Christ battled Satan in the desert; Buddha kicked some Mara butt. In Western culture, those states are called "psychosis" and/or "schizophrenia". They are precisely the states that those of you who are using ethnogens are attempting to take part in. Why then, the separation into "Us" and "Them"?


.


--------------------
~ Kindness is cheap.  It's unkindness that always demands the highest price.

Blogs: Spiritual Emergency | Spiritual Recovery | Voices of Recovery | A Jungian Approach to Psychosis

Edited by spiritualemerg (03/31/07 06:22 PM)

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Re: Moderator Notification [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732520 -

Quote:
spiritualemerg said:In Western culture, those states are called "psychosis" and/or "schizophrenia". They are precisely the states that those of you who are using ethnogens are attempting to take part in. Why then, the separation into "Us" and "Them"?



I dont think so; as I understaind it theres no commonality at all bw states ones in if 'schizophrenic' (if for the sake of argument one would assume this even exists) and inebriated by entheogens. Distinct realms of the psyche.

Edited by aryah (03/31/07 06:24 PM)

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Re: Moderator Notification [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732523 -

aryah: rather Id leave, as would all other.

I believe that's a wise choice.

Regards.


--------------------
~ Kindness is cheap.  It's unkindness that always demands the highest price.

Blogs: Spiritual Emergency | Spiritual Recovery | Voices of Recovery | A Jungian Approach to Psychosis

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Re: Moderator Notification [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732543 -

spiritualemerg said:
aryah: rather Id leave, as would all other.

I believe that's a wise choice.

Regards.


thats a curious way of editing my post. Was my point so poorly stated as to not have been understood, or is this just a rethorical point-scoring game?

Edited by aryah (03/31/07 06:58 PM)

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Re: Moderator Notification [Re: aryah]
    #6732677 -

It shouldn't really be necessary aryah, but since it seems to be so, I'm not editing your post -- I'm taking your advice. I came into this forum to take part in a discussion related to psychosis. I already noted that I'd be leaving when it came to its natural conclusion, which it seems to have done. I probably should have left then but there was a brief spell of a few hours when I felt something akin to comfortable here. Truth is, I was on my way out from the moment I arrived.






.


--------------------
~ Kindness is cheap.  It's unkindness that always demands the highest price.

Blogs: Spiritual Emergency | Spiritual Recovery | Voices of Recovery | A Jungian Approach to Psychosis

Edited by spiritualemerg (03/31/07 10:52 PM)

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: spiritualemerg]
    #6732685 -

Here's a little schooling from the one with the credentials that seem to intimidate you.
There is a difference between 'Projection,' and 'Projective Identification.' In Projection, there is the case of 'Remove the beam from your own eye before you point at the dust mote in another's eye.' Psychological blind spot when it comes to seeing stuff in yourself, but one sure can see it in others!
In Projective Identification, an individual projects contents that they reject in themselves onto another, and then proceeds to react to that person as if the person really embodies those rejected and projected contents.
I think you should become acquainted with these processes for obvious reasons.

I don't remember "belittling" paranoid schizophrenics, I remember suggesting that individuals with this disorder seem to post here with regularity. Did you hear some inappropriate joke about people's illnesses? I wasn't joking or "belittling." Moreover, like a Bipolar Disordered individual who refuses to take medication because they enjoy manic highs, untreated schizophrenics can and do ill-effect unaware people. No Freudian slip, no fast typing. I choose my words carefully. My take on mental illness is that I am tolerant about hanging with people as long as they are not harmful or dangerous to others - including myself. So either you are standing up for a malicious, albeit sick, individual on this forum, you are defensive because a loved one has the disease, or you are taking offense because you are suffering from the malaise yourself. Whichever one it is, you are reacting with far too much emotion for it to be just a matter of principle.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"So, if you think I'm being unreasonable or arrogant, go off and hang with your favorite paranoid schizophrenics."

This was indeed mirroring of your inane (no, not insane, inane) comment about paranoid schizophrenics being your favorite people. Would that mean 'among' your favorite people, or that you 'only' hang with diagnosed paranoid schizophrenics?

My bio is posted in the appropriate section of the Shroomery. Anyone who is interested can access that. Your purpose for copying it here is inappropriate. I also have business cards, letterhead, share a website and I actually have a real wood shingle hanging in the entryway to my residence.

Lastly, the only people whom I consider "spiritually inferior" are those people who identify with being spiritual, but who go through life doing mental, emotional or physical violence to others.

If I inadvertantly offended anyone who is struggling with schizophrenia, I assure you that no offense was intended. If I offended someone who has freely entered into a sick mind set, bought into a malevolent delusion which intends mental, emotional or physical harm to others; or who adopts a practice which knowingly results in mental, emotional or physical illness to self or other, I'll be available to call your attention to it. If you don't like it, feel free to get a second opinion. After all, I'm not your doctor and you haven't paid me a fee.



As to the rest of your post, it is vague beyond any reasonable understanding on my part.

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Re: Why are Christians on the Shroomery? [Re: hot48yearolds]
    #6733983 -

hot48yearolds said:
I know this a free forum and anyone is welcome here,

But why the hell do you Fundamentalist Christians post here, what do you get out of a drug forum when drugs are prohibited by your religion?

Why don't you guys go hang out in a Christian forum?


this is a forum of discussing philisophical ideas. 

in hindsight, I do see what you mean about people 'preaching' rather than discussion.

then again everyone preaches in some form or another, but to what level should we cut it off?

In the end we do generate philisophoical discussion, but I do feel that this idea needs to be tended to.  I shall make a poll to see what others think.

:laugh:


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.

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