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InvisibleSirTokesALittle
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Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage
    #6701431 - 03/23/07 01:17 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

AKA Sage.
Contains more thujone that wormwood! And less bitter, also containing piny and mentha oils and many other unique characteristics.
Here's my question, why not just use fresh sage to make a delicious drink, even distill it yourself? Shouldn't one get a potent thujone drink?
Of course practice would have to be made to use the right about of sage. So what might this be?
Does ANYONE have sage wine or extract links/experience that they would like to share?
I've searched all over the web and I am going to do a multi mint and sage fused into some home brew wine that I have in the works.


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Unlike many herbs, mint likes it moist.


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Offlineguitarguy0123
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: SirTokesALittle]
    #6710893 - 03/25/07 10:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I haven't heard of this, but it sounds like a good idea. Let us know what you come up with.


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I don't know what's gonna happen man, but I wanna have my kicks before the whole shithouse goes up in flames. -Jim Morrison


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InvisibleSirTokesALittle
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: guitarguy0123]
    #6712843 - 03/26/07 03:01 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

So far from what I've come up with is only one gardening forum mentioning it.
However further searching wiki-pedia I find it's true the sage contains HIGH thujone content( how come most people don't know this?)
It is said " Why should a man die, with Sage in his garden"
There's got to be a drawback to using sage for "absinthe", which is why they only use wormwood.
The questions stand! Where's the sexperts?:link:


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Offlinefetalscab
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: SirTokesALittle]
    #6731747 - 03/31/07 03:08 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

well is it safe to eat sage? i mean i have no idea but if people aren't using it its probably because it is somewhat toxic...check this out:
"Very few side effects have been reported from the consumption of sage leaves; however, those using more concentrated forms of this herb, such as tea or extracts, may experience inflammation of the lips and lining of the mouth. This inflammatory response is probably due to a toxic chemical in sage called thujone. In very large amounts, thujone has been shown to cause convulsions. Concentrated sage oil is toxic and its use should be restricted to aromatherapy."

http://www.vitaminstuff.com/herbs-sage.html


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Clouds are thoughts and feelings floating by
You have them but you are not them
Whatever you do
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Offlinefetalscab
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: fetalscab]
    #6731830 - 03/31/07 03:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

i had green devil absinthe i ordered a kit and made it, it was supposed to have 8 times the thujone content as the stuff you get overseas, it doesnt do shit but put a bad taste in your mouth and get you drunk, absinthe is a joke


"Absinthe has been longed believed to be hallucinogenic but evidence supporting this is questionable. Ten years after Dr. Magnan's wormwood oil experiments he studied 250 cases of alcoholism claiming those who drank absinthe were worse off than those who just drank alcohol and they experienced, among other things, rapidly brought on hallucinations.[30] Few descriptions of these hallucinations exist from actual absinthe drinkers beyond a few quotes from poets after a long night of drinking. In one of the most famous, Oscar Wilde describes the feeling of tulips on his legs after leaving a bar at closing.[31] These beliefs got a boost in the 1970s when a scientific paper mistakenly reported thujone was related to THC and most likely had similar hallucinogenic properties based on its shape.[32] With the advent of usenet and web recipes 'trip reports' have been circulating for many years. These home recipes sometimes call for known hallucinogenic herbs in a mistaken attempt to recreate Absinthe's supposed hallucinogenity.

Today it is known that absinthe does not cause hallucinations, especially those described in the old studies. Thujone, the supposed active chemical in absinthe, is a GABA antagonist and while it can produce muscle spasms in large doses it does not cause hallucinations.

The effects of absinthe have been described by artists as mind opening and even hallucinogenic and by prohibitionists as turning "good people" "mad and desolate". Sometimes called 'secondary effects', the most commonly reported experience is a 'clear-headed' feeling of inebriation - a 'lucid drunkenness', said to be caused by the thujone and other compounds. Some, such as chemist/absinthe historian Ted Breaux, say that these effects may be caused by the fact that some of the compounds act as stimulants, others as sedatives, overall creating a neutral effect.[33] Most others feel that the placebo effect and individual reaction to the herbs make these secondary effects subjective and minor compared to the psychoactive effects of alcohol."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe

"In conclusion, there is no evidence that absinthe ever contained the high concentrations of thujone that would have led to detrimental effects or that it has hallucinogenic or mind altering properties. The health problems experienced by chronic users were likely to have been caused by adulterants in inferior brands and by the high levels of alcohol present. Claims for beneficial effects must also be treated with some scepticism as again, the detrimental effects of the alcohol would presumably outweigh any benefits. It seems likely that the phenomenal success of absinthe during the 19th century was due to one factor, the French love of aniseed drinks. The modern equivalent of absinthe, pastis, is by far the most popular distilled spirit in France with 125 million litres being consumed annually. Perhaps the reason that so much absinthe was consumed, and absintheurs waxed so lyrically about it was simply because it tasted good."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absinthe


--------------------
The mind is a bright blue sky
Clouds are thoughts and feelings floating by
You have them but you are not them
Whatever you do
Don't let them have you


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Offlinewillo
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: SirTokesALittle]
    #6732513 - 03/31/07 08:22 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

why would you wanna get intoxicated with tuhjone anyway?

about absinth,I thought that in the 19th century most people would add some laudanum to the drink,making it more intoxicating


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Offlinefalcon
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: fetalscab]
    #6732785 - 03/31/07 09:28 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

it doesn't do shit but put a bad taste in your mouth and get you drunk, absinthe is a joke

The hallucinogenic properties of thujone are probably a joke.

One of the things that thujone seems to do though is ameliorate the mental effects of alcohol leaving you physically relaxed but at the same time mentally alert when you have drunk enough to make you groggy, :smile: this may not be good thing for your liver.


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InvisibleSirTokesALittle
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: fetalscab]
    #6736388 - 04/01/07 11:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Very interesting folks. I don't want to get "Intoxicated" on thujone for say, just take it in the right amounts, in the safest way possible. Absinthee, once commercialized because weak, watered down, and possibly contained very little thujone at all.
I do think that if used correctly, thujone could be enjoyed responsibly from time to time, and I've heard of plenty of reports with positive overall verdicts.
I will just have to trial and error with this one I guess, really carefully.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: fetalscab]
    #6737861 - 04/02/07 01:22 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Actually Absinthe is hallucinogenic :smile2:

But as always there is a catch.

Absinthe is hallucinogenic in severe alcoholics only because severe alcoholics are prone to Delirium Tremens, and DT is worsened by GABA antagonists (Thujone) just like it is decreased by GABA agonists (benzodiazepines).

Thujone is a kind of stimulant, but an unpleasant one. Combined with alcohol it gives enhanced mental clarity to the intoxication, making it a bit more psychoactive than stupefying.

My own absinthe gets distilled so that the oils of 25-50gr wormwood herb end up in a liter of absinthe (just like in ancient recipies) and it does have an extra sparkle to it. However, hallucinogenic it is not, because I'm not on the verge of DT.


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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: Asante]
    #6741351 - 04/03/07 10:06 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

according to James Duke
http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/duke/farmacy2.pl

THUJONE Leaf 1,453 - 12,636 ppm JAD Plant 2,500 - 13,000 ppm HHB

Abortifacient CAN ; Anthelmintic JBH ; Antibacterial JEO7:271 ; Antiseptic CAN ; Antispasmodic ED50=0.127 mg/ml FT59:465 ; Cerebrodepressant DUKE1992B ; Convulsant 40 mg/kg RJH ; Counterirritant JBH ; Emmenagogue CAN ; Epileptigenic DUKE1992B ; Hallucinogenic DUKE1992B ; Herbicide IC50=22 mM 438 ; Neurotoxic ARO95:24 ; Perfumery ARC ; Pesticide DUKE1992B ; Respirainhibitor DUKE1992B ; Toxic ARC

Wiccan seeker, are you Taoist?


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: kadakuda]
    #6750769 - 04/05/07 03:48 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


THUJONE Leaf 1,453 - 12,636 ppm JAD Plant 2,500 - 13,000 ppm HHB





Thats nice and all, but that doesn't mean it actually ends up in the absinthe itself. Thanks for the info tho, Duke is a good source.

Quote:

Wiccan seeker, are you Taoist?




Nope, interested in some aspects though.


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InvisibleaNeway2sayHooray
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: SirTokesALittle]
    #6768214 - 04/10/07 01:58 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

food grade cooking sage has to have = to or below a certain amount of thujone.So says the FDA rules.

I was always under the impression that wormword contained way more thujone than A.officinalis and A.vulgaris


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:clementine:
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Offlinekadakuda
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Re: Salvia Officinalis- Thujone - Common Sage [Re: aNeway2sayHooray]
    #6768874 - 04/10/07 08:59 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

oddly, duke does not list a. absinthium....


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