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Offlinefuturamaar
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northern california shrooms
    #6641581 - 03/06/07 04:01 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)
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*These shrooms were found in Northern california in a field on manure. They were maybe 100 feet above sea level.
* gills are a chocolate brown, however the gills appear more white on younger specimens, the gills are attached to the stems.
*Stems avagerage between 2 to 4 inches depending on age of specimen, stems are not too big in diameter ranging from 1 to 2 centimeters, the stems are a whitish bown, they dont turn blue when bruised however become a yellowish goldish color much like the cap. Also a dark ring appears on most of the stems about an inch down from the cap (but this could only be a dark ring because maybe spores fell on it) . The stems are smooth, hollow.
* The Cap is conical, and convex. the caps are smooth and shiny. They are a brownish tan in the middle and become more white towards the outside. Caps vary in diameter based on specimen age. When smaller specimen have 1-1.5 inch cap however larger specimen have around 3 inch caps. Also older specimens have caps that become broad and flat
* the spore print color is purple, dark brownish
* Mushroom doesnt bruise any certain color stem only starts to become tanish yellowish like the cap


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InvisibleCureCat
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: futuramaar]
    #6641599 - 03/06/07 04:05 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

I'm currently on a computer which i cannot download to. You should upload the photo to Shroomery. Many people do not download files or click off-site links.

Very good description- from the description alone, I tend to suspect a Stropharia.


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Offlinefuturamaar
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: futuramaar]
    #6641746 - 03/06/07 04:38 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)



url=http://www.shroomery.org/forums/files/07-10/321660089-pic_4_Quick_e-mail_view.jpg]




here are some pictures that I uploaded I hope this helps


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InvisibleCalifornia
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: futuramaar]
    #6641803 - 03/06/07 04:55 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)


^these ones resemble dried up stropharia semiglobata.


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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: California]
    #6641902 - 03/06/07 05:23 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Ahh, now I'm sure they are Stropharia, likely S. semiglobata, as Oregon mentioned.


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Offlinefuturamaar
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: futuramaar]
    #6642173 - 03/06/07 06:51 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

are these active at all?


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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: futuramaar]
    #6642642 - 03/06/07 08:38 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Not at all.

You are in california, you shouldn't be looking on cow poo for active mushrooms. Look at the San Francisco bay area thread stickied at the top of the forum for info on actives in your area.


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Edited by CureCat (03/06/07 08:40 PM)


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: CureCat]
    #6642825 - 03/06/07 09:25 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

CureCat said:
you shouldn't be looking on cow poo for active mushrooms.




ahem. what about a little thing called "Panaeolus subbaltaetus"?


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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: Mitchnast]
    #6642858 - 03/06/07 09:32 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

A few things...

In my personal opnion (and many people will concur), if you live in northern california, it is not worth hunting Panaeolus subbalteatus because they are frequently very weak in potency, compared to Psilocybe cyanescens, Ps. cyanofibrillosa, and others.

Further more, Pan. subbalteatus is far more common growing from fertilized grass, than it is found growing from straw or manure; even less so, manure.

That is why I did not mention subbs.  :smile:


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: CureCat]
    #6642945 - 03/06/07 09:54 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

i used to find them on dung all the time, and potency varies, sometimes they are quite potent.
in fact, the pic i posted shows them growing on dung.

and where you can find dung, you can also find dung heaps and stable shavings.  on which they are much more common than on lawns, unlike the inactive Panaeolina foenisecci.

i think it was angryshroom who found a HUGE score in cali on a dung heap.

i used to regularly fill backpacks off of dung and even feild manure after rains.

threw pan subb parties.
NOBODY was complaining about the potency :smile:


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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: Mitchnast]
    #6643276 - 03/06/07 11:05 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Huh. I have scoured TONS of horse manure heaps and stables, a cow pasture or two, with big piles of bleached manure, and countless rotting straw bails, and never found ONE subb growing on any of it.

I have, of course, found more subbs on fertilized lawns than i could possibly pick, and the potency was very very weak.

I've talked to a few other people who are familiar with hunting subbs, and the concensus seems to think that substrate is at least an indicator of some variance in potency - lawn subbs being noticeably less potent compared to straw or manure subbs.

And the subbs I picked very often showed bluing at the base of the stipe.


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: Mitchnast]
    #6645163 - 03/07/07 02:27 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

On the west coast of North America, the Panaeolus subbalteatus are more common in rotted hay and haystacks and compost heaps at riding stables and racetracks mixed in with stable shavings.

Theya re extremely rare in the Pnw on manure and when found, only a few cow pies. Years ago, Joshua found a patch on a lawn. He was the only one who posted images of a lawn of Pm. subbalteatus in the PNW region. Angry Shroom in California found a beautiful haystack with thousands of them. Also archived here at the shroomery and in the mj shroom world species section for pn. subbalteatus. Mitchnast has picked them in pastueres in Nova Scotia for years, and Lizard King and GGreatOne234 found a few over the years in Georgia and Florida, and I in a pasture on maui in every cowpie and along side of Copelandia cyanescens in a feild otn eh volcano Haleakala. On Oahu i only found them twice in ten years in manure and it was, again, only a few specimens.

I have also found them in top soil twice here in Seattle in the early 1980s on two occasions on First Hill in a parking lot and one time in mulch on campus at the UW. They are rare in manure in fields in the PNW. You need to start looking at riding stables where they pile their manure to compost in the months of March April and May. Keep going every few days after a good rain when the sun returns and the subs will be good for picking.

While Curecat claims they have a low potency, by chemical analysis the dosage is one fresh ounce or from 3-5 grams dried. I agree with that dosage which is the same almost for cubensis.


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Offlinexmush
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6645273 - 03/07/07 03:04 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

How many times have chemical analyses been published for subbs mj? Is this just one reference? Or do multiple chemical analyses from different populations, different substrates, time of year, cultivated vs. wild, etc. etc. show a similar potentcy? It seems that most people who try them find that they need to eat quite a bit, although some have been surprised by a higher potentcy. To me this suggests that there might be a lot of variation. The other explanation would be that all of these people mis-ID'd subbs. True for some, but I refuse to believe it for everyone, especially curecat who seems to know her shit.


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OfflineCiv
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: xmush]
    #6645866 - 03/07/07 06:09 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

if you live in northern california, it is not worth hunting Panaeolus subbalteatus




Haha you tried to put those things in our tea, and I was like helllll no.

Quote:

i used to find them on dung all the time, and potency varies, sometimes they are quite potent.
in fact, the pic i posted shows them growing on dung


.

Yeah in every part of the world this is true- but for someone in california to look for subbs in poo would waste a lot of time.

The "Subb poo pics" are one hit wonders- no one backs up with follow up pics of the next seasons. Who has a sub patch? ...and thats what its about. Anyone can find subbs but to have them dominate in an area with poop and stay season to season.. havn't seen it.

Quote:

While Curecat claims they have a low potency, by chemical analysis the dosage is one fresh ounce or from 3-5 grams dried. I agree with that dosage which is the same almost for cubensis.



3-5 grams of subbs is 30-50 of them. Get to work! CureCat knows her california subbs for sure, I have seen it myself.


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"...Gal's seem to hate the thought of blending chicken shit in a blender.
So, wash it well afterwards & DON'T tell them..."  -Agar


Edited by Civ (03/07/07 06:13 PM)


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OfflineSubbedhunter420
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: Civ]
    #6646051 - 03/07/07 07:04 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

On the subject of Subbalteatus, Its about all i hunt for actives wise and I live in Southern California. Yes, Southern california has plenty of Pan subbs to go around. specifically during September and May. (june-august is usually too dry.)

As for finding them on dung, pasture, lawns or compost, I found that they grow the most numerous and often is on well watered and sodded lawns. Like so...
sometimes on the compost piles, (but they dont usually get enough water to start a good patch of them.) and dung subbs are rare but not nearly unheard of. (i'd put that at the #4 place to look). I havent checked many stables because they are too dangerous to get into around where i live with everyone so close to your neighbors.

As for potencies, i gave 25 1/2 grams of WET subbs to TWO people and they both had strong trips. On the other hand, I have dried two ounces and cooked a tea for two and it only caused mild body highs. I have also discovered potency from subb to subb is immense. Some may have high contents of psilocybe and psilocin while others have practically none. I can tell you these were as potent as Cubes and they were also from a lawn..


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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: Subbedhunter420]
    #6652752 - 03/09/07 02:28 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

beautiful


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Offlinexmush
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6652827 - 03/09/07 02:51 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Are you going to respond or just ignore this MJ? I really am curious about this potency analysis which you use like a bat to hit everyone with who claims subbs have varying or low potency.


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: xmush]
    #6652917 - 03/09/07 03:20 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

As someone who has picked numerous pounds of this species in the mid to late 1970s, also picked many on Maui and have given them away at parties in both Eugene, Oregon, an area of the Willamette Valley which is rich in rotted haystacks and 25 years of growing naturally in that region, and in Hawaii on the Island of Maui, No one ever got sick and everyone at 3 dried grams or more had what they referred to as satisfactory trips on Panaeolus subbalteatus at those dosage levels, and I did not respond to this post until I reread it today and saw your asking me. I really do not hardly post here at all as it is. AS I have a cooler place to hang.

Here is a partial list. Look yup the papers. I do not have the time to dig around in thousands of files right now to verify something I know for a fact.

I also think that many times, lawn shrooms identified by newbies or interested partiesas P. subbalteatus could be a variation or different Panaeolus shroom other than P. subbalteatus

Psilocine in Panaeolus subbalteatus: Berkeley & Broome (Ohenoja et al., 1987).

Psilocybine in Panaeolus subbalteatus: (Beug & Bigwood, 1982; Gartz, 1993, Gartz, 1996); Ohenoja et al., 1987; Ott & Guzman, 1976; Stijve, 1987; Stijve & Kuyper, 1985).

baeocystine in Panaeolus subbalteatus (Gartz, 1993a; Gartz, 1996; Repke, Leslie & Guzmán, 1977; Stijve, 1987; Stijve & Blake, 1994; Stijve & Kuyper, 1985).

Singer, R. and A. H. Smith. 1958. About the identity of the "Weed Panaeolus" or poisonous Panaeolus. Mycopathologia et Mycologia Applicata vol. 9(4):280-284. September 29.

Stein, Sam. 1959. Clinical observations on the effects of Panaeolus venenosus versus Psilocybe caerulescens. Mycologia vol. 51(1):49-50. January-February.

Stein, Sam I. with Gearhard L. Closs and Norman Gabel. 1959. Observations on psychoneurophysiologically significant mushrooms. Mycopathologia et Mycologia Applicata vol. 11(3):205-216.
The clinical results and comparative effects of Panaeolus venenosus (syn.= Panaeolus subbalteatus) and Psilocybe caerulescens in human volunteers is presented.


mj


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: xmush]
    #6652966 - 03/09/07 03:29 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Xmush asks
Quote:


How many times have chemical analyses been published for subbs mj? Is this just one reference? Or do multiple chemical analyses from different populations, different substrates, time of year, cultivated vs. wild, etc. etc. show a similar potentcy? It seems that most people who try them find that they need to eat quite a bit,





One ounce of fresh Pan. subbs can be from 6-7 or as many as 40 to 50 depending on their size.

Guzman once ate over fifty small cubes from a pasture in Mexico. They weigh approx. one ounce according to Gaston. At the same time. One cube fresh could be an ounce or more. But if you spread out fifty small fuckers then you might claim that you had to eat a lot of them.

There are two to three doses in a fresh ounce of blue ringers (stuntzii;s) However> P. fiemtaria area slight more potent than P. stuntzii, although they are almost perfectly macroscopically similar in appearance.

People say you need to eat forty or fifty specimens of blue ringers to get high.

People in Texas and Louisianna say, "Shit, in Texas we only need to eat on and they are big.

Shit the weight is the same for an ounce whether it is one large shroom or forty or fifty smaller ones.

Liberty caps 20 to 40 or more. That could weigh one ounce or half an ounce depending on the size of the mushroom.

But Cubes by weigh are the weakest of the psilocybian mushrooms.

So I fail to see people complaining about eating a lot as a problem in how much they dose.

mj


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OfflineSubbedhunter420
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Re: northern california shrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #6652997 - 03/09/07 03:44 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Cant complain on this anymore. if we want to change the world of panaeolus subbalteatus we must first write essays and do experiments and shit. i dont have that kinda material to do an analysis but I will keep sending data from the field.


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