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OfflineJoelLoveland5
Giant Reptile
Male

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 222
Last seen: 17 years, 1 day
Dunking vs Spraying
    #6593574 - 02/21/07 12:06 PM (17 years, 30 days ago)

I am currently using an invitro bag tek.

You can find the link here
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5278987/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1

In the tek Hydro420 explains that you can either dunk, or spray the inside of the bag. He also mention that you will probably get more flushes from dunking.

It seems to me that if dunking the colonized hpoo will absorb more water than if spraying conservatively. He never mentions how many sprays you should give each bag.

How many sprays would be sufficient?
Currently I have given some of the harvested bags 2-5 sprays, will this be sufficient?

Hydro420 also says to spray the "inside" of the bag.
Does he mean that you don't want to spray directly onto the hpoo?

Later

-JL5000


--------------------
Newb Friendly Tek for The Lazy by "Hydro420"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5278987/an/0/page/0

Great Newb Friendly Cloning Tek by "Creamcorn"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5874305#5874305

One Goal, One Passion - Joel Loveland

"Dont Be Wise In Your Own Opinions"

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OfflineJoelLoveland5
Giant Reptile
Male

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 222
Last seen: 17 years, 1 day
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: JoelLoveland5]
    #6597394 - 02/22/07 01:51 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

Any help wth this will be appreciated :wink:

Later

-JL5000


--------------------
Newb Friendly Tek for The Lazy by "Hydro420"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5278987/an/0/page/0

Great Newb Friendly Cloning Tek by "Creamcorn"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5874305#5874305

One Goal, One Passion - Joel Loveland

"Dont Be Wise In Your Own Opinions"

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OfflineMex
Mother Earth
Male

Registered: 12/25/03
Posts: 256
Loc: ITA ~ Earth ~ 13:20
Last seen: 17 years, 17 days
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: JoelLoveland5]
    #6597620 - 02/22/07 02:48 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

Hello! Well, what to say... mmh... I never used the invitro tek, seems like nice growing can come out from those plastic
bags thou... :thumbup:

To me, when I was cultivating or as the present am doing, I always use the DUNK tek, works really good and give the
chance to the mycelium to absorbe most of the water it needs to give good and pure mushrooms :smile:

I don't have any idea on how the dunk tek might work with an invitro cultivation, anyway I really suggest it to you
(maybe you can find some good directions googling the tek or by looking in the shroomery !).

You got any pics to share with us?!  Cheers!!!


--------------------

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OfflineFingerfoods
Pale Blue Dot
Male

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 181
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: Mex]
    #6597649 - 02/22/07 02:56 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

not trying to jack your thread or anything but also doesn't dunking potentially make you lose some nutrients when you drain?


--------------------
http://palebluedot.ytmnd.com/ watch this shrooming and youll never think the same about the world agian.

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Invisiblecreamcorn
mad scientist
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Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: Fingerfoods]
    #6597738 - 02/22/07 03:15 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

well to first quick get this out of the way, no, dunking does not mean you lose nutrients down the drain... even if it did, at this stage of the game in your later flushes, moisture is so much more important than nutrients that i'd make that trade off any day.

ok... with that taken care of... :smile:

lets put on our thinking caps for a moment and be logical.  (not trying to sound like a smartass or condescending, i want folks reading to think it through as they read :thumbup:)

to make the numbers easy lets assume the pretty good estimate that mushrooms are 90% water.

we also know that water conveniently weighs 1 gram per 1 ml.

lets say your first flush was yield was 200 wet grams from that bag.

so we're talking 20 grams dry fruits give or take, nice... we're also talking then 180 grams of water... or in otherwords, 180mL of moisture was taken out of there.

as an experiment just now i took a spray bottle and pumped it 5 times into a jar and sucked it up in a syringe.  3-4mL.  so those 5 pumps on your sprayer put 3-4 grams of moisture back into the bag.  you got a lot more ground to cover if you want a second flush remotely anything like the first. :smile:

now your next step is getting the mycelium to absorb it.  spraying mycelium directly is pretty ineffective.  spray it directly today, and you'll notice most of the moisture is still sitting there tomorrow.  its trying to draw the moisture from within out of the material its colonized.

casing layers help, since casing layers are partially colonized, you have areas you can hydrate (the uncolonized casing) and moisture will be absorbed a bit better.  there really isn't a casing per se in an invitro bag.

dunking now on the other hand, after a good couple hours, will soak up quite a large amount of moisture.  it makes its way through the nooks and crannies and into the "innards" of your chunk of substrate.  meaning there's moisture "within" again... and not just a little splashed on the surface.

if you want to do an experiment, dunk with a known amount of water - measure it out ahead of time.  do your dunk.  measure whats left.  figure out how much it absorbed.  compare it to those couple of pumps with a spray bottle.  you'll see the difference in black and white.

now to get to your actual questions... he probably means to spray the walls of the bag, just like it sounds.  because as i explained spraying a chunk of colonized substrate isn't very effective and can potentially lead to problems.  moisture all over the walls of the bags do help with humidity at least, and little bits that drip down can slowly be absorbed into the substrate.  so there is *some* benefit.  but think of the numbers again, think of yields again.  a couple mL of moisture here or there only equates to a couple of grams of wet mushroom, which equates to squat in the long run once you talk about dry fruits. :wink:

hope that makes sense.

as for HOW to actually go about dunking... your call.  get creative.  depending on what your invitro bag is like (i.e., how heavy duty it is, hopefully assuming you haven't torn or punctured the bag, and where the filter patch is) it might be as simple as filling the bag up  and carefully placing it somewhere (like maybe in a bowl - bag full water, substrate and all... just something to prevent your dunk water from spilling out all over your floor :wink:) in your fridge overnight.  maybe its easier in your situation to just take the substrate block out and dunk that in a bowl of water, and return it to the bag after.  however you work it, its pretty simple... soak the thing in water, preferably under refrigeration, to prevent bacterial growth in said water.  give it a good 12-24 hours if you can.  its really no different than dunking a big ol' cake.

now on the other hand if you do stick to spraying, you want some moisture droplets on the inner surface of the bag maybe, some small droplets on the substrate are ok.  just don't let it pool up.  don't spray more than happens to absorb.  use judgement there.

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Offlinejagxk800
Stranger
Registered: 01/29/07
Posts: 7
Last seen: 14 years, 2 months
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: creamcorn]
    #6597893 - 02/22/07 03:48 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

creamcorn,

now how would you dunk a cased substrate in an aluminum tray? Particularly, how would you drain it after it's full of water?

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Invisiblecreamcorn
mad scientist
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Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 2,962
Trusted Cultivator
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: jagxk800]
    #6597961 - 02/22/07 04:00 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

depends on the size of the tray

substrate/casings will shrink after the first flush, leaving a gap between your tray and substrate

smaller ones, i fill water in the gap as much as i can.  the substrate will float a little.  that's ok.  some people even set something (something clean :smile:) on top to weigh it down.  then cover and place in the fridge overnight... again, the purpose of refrigeration is to keep it cool so that bacteria will not grow in the dunk water.

larger trays that won't fit in the fridge, you'll want to put in a utility tub, or even your bath tub.  run a slow steady trickle of water into that gap between the substrate and tray, and let it go.  water will overflow and pour out.  goal here?  same thing, the moving water will prevent bacterial build up.

to drain it... 'tis not rocket science. :smile:  tilt the tray sideways and pour the water out.  the substrate will still be a pretty solid block.  its safe to handle with clean hands.  so hold it in place with your hand while you tip it over and drain it out.

with a large tub you could even poke a drainage hole in the bottom to let the water run out, then cover it back up with some duct tape after.

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OfflineJoelLoveland5
Giant Reptile
Male

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 222
Last seen: 17 years, 1 day
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: creamcorn]
    #6598765 - 02/22/07 06:21 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

Thanks again creamcorn

Later

-JL5000


--------------------
Newb Friendly Tek for The Lazy by "Hydro420"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5278987/an/0/page/0

Great Newb Friendly Cloning Tek by "Creamcorn"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5874305#5874305

One Goal, One Passion - Joel Loveland

"Dont Be Wise In Your Own Opinions"

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineJoelLoveland5
Giant Reptile
Male

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 222
Last seen: 17 years, 1 day
Re: Dunking vs Spraying [Re: JoelLoveland5]
    #6598886 - 02/22/07 06:40 PM (17 years, 29 days ago)

If you had a very large syringe (or used a small one many times), could you just inject into the hpoo?

Of course dispersing throughout, not just one injection site.

Later

-JL5000


--------------------
Newb Friendly Tek for The Lazy by "Hydro420"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5278987/an/0/page/0

Great Newb Friendly Cloning Tek by "Creamcorn"
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5874305#5874305

One Goal, One Passion - Joel Loveland

"Dont Be Wise In Your Own Opinions"

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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