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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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On-Topic Fat Thread
#6504769 - 01/28/07 12:32 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I am still interested in discussing a topic that was in a thread that has been locked, so I am going to copy and paste a post I made in that thread and then reply to it with some more thoughts on the subject. Please do not make negative comments about fat people in this thread. That is a fair warning - don't make me whip out the ban stick.
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: If over 9 out of 10 affected people cannot do it, in a population that spans tens of millions of people in all the countries of the world and a period of over 50 years, would you not say that unreasonable demands are being made.
Perhaps. I guess it depends on a case-by-case basis. I'm not certain that living healthy is an unreasonable demand - it is a lifestyle, and it requires considerable change in one's life. Perhaps that is an unreasonable demand in that most human beings develop such a routine that even minor changes in their life are difficult for them to maintain, myself included.
I mean common sense says get with the program, but the reality of the problem worldwide clearly demonstrates how common sense here simply does not work, for a zillion reasons.
Quote:
Perhaps the world doesn't work that way Fireworks. It's a blow to the face for all optimists and strivers. Up to a point we all got to deal with the cards that we get, and all of us know from experience that doing your very best simply won't be enough to get what you want.
It isn't like flapping one's arms in a vain attempt to fly. Perhaps I am viewing it too simply, and have not researched into it adequately enough, but I would think it all comes down to the amount of calories we intake, which is something that is within our control (we don't automatically eat, like our heart beats), and how much energy we expend through our daily activities.
Now, clearly some bodies have fucked up metabolisms. Sometimes it might be genetic or a physical problem, and sometimes it is simply due to one's activities and one's eating habits. If someone is barely eating and is exercising a lot, in a responsible way, and their health is not improving, then I'd start to look closer at the chemical processes and all of that... I understand there are medications to take to assist metabolism, but I haven't truly looked into it much.
Quote:
Most people find it cruel to say to a person who has lost his eyesight that he can see if only he had enough willpower.
I'm not convinced of the similarity.
Quote:
These people generally find no such objection to say the same to someone with severe obesity, even though it is proven that over 9 out of 10 of them cannot escape that fate no matter what they try.
Nine out of ten severely obese individuals have all made dramatic lifestyle changes in an attempt to become healthy? For how long? What kind of study are you referring to?
Quote:
Here's some other math: When you are really hungry your body is blackmailing you into taking in say 600 kcal. If you try to cheat it with a 100 kcal apple your body will send deprivation and frustration signals until the 600 calories are taken in. So, to comply with your body you eat "one meal" to get those 600 kcal.
"Until the calories are taken in". I think this is what I was referring to, about willpower. Individuals who are not obese face this same thing when they fast (I have some great threads on fasting in P&S we could link to for more information on that). One would think that fasting would be more difficult for those who are not obese, as they do not have such a margin of energy stored as fat.
I would never suggest starving oneself, but I am given to understand that fruit juice fasts are highly effective.
Quote:
The obese guy's body will thus blackmail his brain in every possible way to take "two meals" because that is "enough".
Precisely. Ride through it - willpower. I'll see if I can find some threads on fasting. The body's negative experiences it will inflict upon oneself to get you to needlessly consume more do not last for long, and this is what these fasters say. Past the third day, eating does not enter one's thoughts at all. 
Quote:
This isn't a matter of his "willpower", this is entirely a medical matter as his metabolism is broken. It is a disease. You can tell it is a disease because their bodies swell by dozens of pounds over time.
His metabolism might not be working effectively, but this is due to habit over time. One has to force it to correct itself. It is a matter of willpower in most cases, I have to assume.
Quote:
Common sense sometime is flawed, and one such flaw is to expect the willpower of a mere mortal to overcome a physical disease with factors beyond his control.
A mere mortal? We are capable as long as we realize it and exert ourselves. What factors are beyond control?
Quote:
No matter if it were brought on by bad habits or genetics - the result is a broken metabolism that needs to be healed, if diet and exercise are to have any effect other than temporary.
How does one heal oneself if one continues the patterns of behavior that are responsible in the first place? The body might desire more food, and that seems to me to be the cornerstone of the problem. Answer: willpower.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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All right, now I simply wanted to clarify that I was not proposing that fasting is a solution to obesity. I was simply using it as an example of willpower that relates to the topic at hand, since the body would be compelling one to consume more food in both situations.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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roby000
me

Registered: 02/28/05
Posts: 9,189
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Moderator edit: This post does not address the topic at hand as I have outlined it.
Edited by fireworks_god (01/28/07 12:44 PM)
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Innominate


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2,136
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: roby000]
#6504798 - 01/28/07 12:41 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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There are many things people can do to lose weight, but most obese/overwieght people just are not willing to change their lifestyles. If someone is seriously motivated and has the willpower, there's no excuse. There are harder things in life to do than to quit eating.
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Baby_Hitler
Errorist



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Willpower works for alot of things.
Trying to not eat is even worse than trying to quit cigarettes or heroin.
Dieting accomplishes nothing without exercise, BTW
-------------------- Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ (•_•) <) )~ ANTIFA / \ \(•_•) ( (> SUPER / \ (•_•) <) )> SOLDIERS / \
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers


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I guess I would lump obesity in with other addictions I dont understand, like smoking/drinking.
I mean...I guess I just dont have an addictive personality. I dont understand how if someone doesnt want to do something, they cant just stop.
My Mom has been trying to quit smoking since I was a kid, and every time I'm at home I grill her about it. I mean, the solution seems fool-proof to me. Dont buy them, take them out of the pack, light them, inhale them, etc. There are 100 actions along the way you could take that would stop you from smoking. It boggles my mind that she cannot see this. The only conclusion I can draw is that she *SAYS* she wants to stop, but in reality does not.
To me, fat people are the same. Just STOP eating so much shit. Dont eat Ho-Hos, dont eat Grilled Stuffed Burritos, and dont drink fucking root beer w/ ice cream all day. There is no magical mystery here. If you CONSUME less calories than you BURN, you will lose weight. 100% GUARANTEED.
If you are unwilling to take even the basic steps to maintain a healthy lifestyle, dont come crying to me when the airline wont let you take up seats A-C because you cant fit in one. Does this make sense?
Moderator edit: Removed comment that is inappropriate for this discussion.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
Edited by fireworks_god (01/28/07 12:45 PM)
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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I agree; the smoking addiction is one that really irks me. People start talking about how they want to quit, and then they pull out a cigarette and light it. One could argue that there is a chemical dependancy; however, one's choices got one into that situation, and it will only be solved by one's conscious choices. You literally have to stop picking one up. Willpower.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Baby_Hitler
Errorist



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Innominate]
#6504820 - 01/28/07 12:47 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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You could say the same thing about poverty.
It's poor people's own fault that they're poor.
-------------------- Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ (•_•) <) )~ ANTIFA / \ \(•_•) ( (> SUPER / \ (•_•) <) )> SOLDIERS / \
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Kid_Orgo


Registered: 09/24/03
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Loc: Hale-Bopp
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There is an incredible burden placed on the health care system from obesity.
This comes from the prevalence of fast food and sedentary lifestyles.
I don't buy genetics as an excuse, no way has the genetic makeup of America changed alone in the last hundred years.
The friend that I have that is wicked obese has been raised with a very poor diet, and, as such, has bland-ass food preferences. I will eat anything, exotic, international, anything. I am skinny. He only eats porkchops and shit, he's fat.
I think it's useless to really get on anybody about their weight, weight is punishment itself. How many obese old people have you ever seen?
If my buddy wants to fix his weight problem, it's just like me fixing my girl problem, or me fixing my drinking problem. Has to come from within.
-------------------- He was a cowboy in one of the seven days a week fights. No business, no hangout; no friends, nothing; just what you pick up and what you need.
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memes
Blessed


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 27,785
Loc: In a Tree
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Quote:
Baby_Hitler said: You could say the same thing about poverty.
It's poor people's own fault that they're poor.
not really, but to a degree.
in america - maybe thats the way it is, but in other less developed countries, there literally are not jobs for people to do.
but here in america - yes, theres always a job to be done, it all depends on whether or not poor people wanna get out there and find it.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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Perhaps it is, in some situations.
Being poor is often more situational; for example, being born into it. Being obese is primarily the result of one's eating habits, which might be conditioned into one, conscious or subconsicous, yet that is precisely the point - it is an exercise in willpower to overcome that. It is not a simple task, often, yet it is as easy as one makes it for oneself.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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B) I agree completely and 100% percent Fireworks_God. I see myself getting fatter after gourging and binge drinking. I can control it. I could control. I choose not too.
Moderator edit: I have removed a comment that does not pertain to the topic at hand. Please stay completely on-topic.
Edited by fireworks_god (01/28/07 12:54 PM)
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Innominate


Registered: 06/12/05
Posts: 2,136
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Kid_Orgo]
#6504836 - 01/28/07 12:53 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Kid_Orgo said: How many obese old people have you ever seen?
Plenty. If fat people live to be old, and they still haven't changed their habits, they usually end up sucking up tax payers money and claiming disability.
Getting paid for being overindulgent.. I've seen it all.
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YuckMan
Student


Registered: 11/28/06
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Quote:
Madtowntripper said: I guess I would lump obesity in with other addictions I dont understand, like smoking/drinking.
I used to feel the same way, it's partly the reason why i started smoking. I just couldn't understand how addiction worked... I understand fully now. You're better off not understanding it.
As for obesity, I battle it myself. I'm about 230lbs and 6 feet tall, i have a verry active job and only eat one small meal a day. usually just a sandwich. My metabolisim is just extremely slow. It's kinda nice that i don't have to spend much money on food, but i would like to be a little lighter. I've tried the "many small meals" a day to speed up my metabolisim, using about 5 triscuit crackers every 3-4 hours with little to no effect. I've also tried metabolisim drugs, none of wich worked.
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
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I don't like the idea that people just become obese and they can't control it.
There is a difference between being a little chubby and being 350lbs. The later is from poor diet and lack of exercise in most cases. There aren't allot of people around that are 7 feet tall. (so don't bother pointing that out people)
I can't stand the idea its often socially(in many circles*) acceptable to tell skinny people that they need to eat a sandwich, your a twig etc, but when one shows concern for someones health, and the fact someone is over weight, even in a polite way, they are deemed cruel.
Its important to note that many people grow up with bad eating habits and keep them for life. In fact most experts on obesity would agree with the idea that the most important time to make the right choices is when you are a child. Too bad children often make poor choices, and its too bad their parents do to 
Many kids these days are raised on Coca Cola, and fast food.  (and all sorts of other junk) Whats even more pathetic is when food is used as a controlling mechanism, parents feed their children certain unhealthy foods to get the behavior they want from their children. Which is really a bad tactic, because it backfires eventually, and then parents end up giving their child anything they want just to get the behavior they are after.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: YuckMan]
#6504842 - 01/28/07 12:56 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Please elaborate on what you refer to as a "very active job". What do you do?
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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I think that we have neglected Stress as a factor to obesity.
People that live stressful lives, and are mentally stressed, tend to store fat more readily. Additionally, individuals who live stressful lives tend to eat poor diets based on so called "comfort foods".
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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That is a great point, and it probably plays a signfigant role in the epidemic.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: memes]
#6504865 - 01/28/07 01:03 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Everyone likes to reduce poverty to simple discussions but its not a simple topic. Chaos theory affects everything, even the economy. Plenty of hard working people find themselves in tough situations all the time.
However living frugally is a great way to stay a little more insulated from the ups and downs of the economy. And thats one of the many reasons I don't drive.
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YuckMan
Student


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Quote:
fireworks_god said: Please elaborate on what you refer to as a "very active job". What do you do?
I make kitchen cabinets, and i'm constantly lifting large 4x8 foot sheets of plywood and and lage stacks of wood usually between 25-50lbs. It's verry fast paced, almost to the point of running around.
If i were to eat the "recommended" 3 meals a day, i would easily be 300+ lbs.
Edited by YuckMan (01/28/07 01:06 PM)
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
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Working construction as a labor supervisor had me looking and feeling fitter then I have ever been. But thats because unlike other supervisors on sites I actually worked my ass off.
(but I suppose even if I was standing around I would have been in pretty good shape as there was always plenty of walking to do)
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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Sounds like fun. I find myself nearly running at work sometimes as well.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Skunk420


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 18,524
Loc: inside
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wtf this is pointless. Go take it to the health forum or something.
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vinsue
Grand Old Fart


Registered: 02/17/04
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Loc: The Garden State(NJ)
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Skunk420]
#6504896 - 01/28/07 01:13 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I'm gettin' hungry...
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"All mushrooms are edible; but some only once." Croatian proverb. BTW ... Have You Rated Ythans Mom Yet ?? ... ... HERE'S HOW ... (be nice) . ...
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HeadTripVertigo
at least I'm housebroken



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: YuckMan]
#6504900 - 01/28/07 01:14 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
YuckMan said:
Quote:
Madtowntripper said: I guess I would lump obesity in with other addictions I dont understand, like smoking/drinking.
I used to feel the same way, it's partly the reason why i started smoking. I just couldn't understand how addiction worked... I understand fully now. You're better off not understanding it.
As for obesity, I battle it myself. I'm about 230lbs and 6 feet tall, i have a verry active job and only eat one small meal a day. usually just a sandwich. My metabolisim is just extremely slow. It's kinda nice that i don't have to spend much money on food, but i would like to be a little lighter. I've tried the "many small meals" a day to speed up my metabolisim, using about 5 triscuit crackers every 3-4 hours with little to no effect. I've also tried metabolisim drugs, none of wich worked.
it doesn't matter how active your job is, really...unless you're a runner for a living or something of the like. lifting cabinets or whatever you said all day isn't enough. it may be hard work, it might give you a little muscle, but it's inconsistent, at the least. if you want to build muscle you need to do continuous repititions using the same form etc. lifting random stuff at work isn't as controlled as say, lying down on a weight bench and not moving positions really except your arms when your do your reps. you need cardio. your job doesn't count. 
[edit by geokills: off-topic and potentially inflammatory comments removed]
-------------------- TACOS LIKE A MOTHERFUCKER
Edited by geokills (01/28/07 05:37 PM)
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DR. PRIME
Mental M.D.

Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 2,293
Loc: Chicago
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I say why should anyone care about the obesity problem. If you're not obese..don't worry about it. They can take care of it themselves if they care enough to.
If you're healthy and in shape, good for you. Why try to get everyone else on your side without any guarantee that they'll join your healthy lifestyle.
People hate to be wrong. The fact is if they want to be thin it is possible with the right approach.
Food is energy, that's all. You have to figure out your body because there are so many variables involved. If energy isn't omitted from your body but food is still being eaten, it turns to fat (extra stored energy).
People let themselves go. That's why some states take gym class so seriously. To teach a positive, healthy, and active lifestyle.
The world may have changed and we now have less of a need for physical demands as we did hundreds of years ago. But our bodies are made to take in food and burn the energy trying to get more food. You can't sit around and hope to undo evolution.
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Skunk420


Registered: 06/13/04
Posts: 18,524
Loc: inside
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: vinsue]
#6504905 - 01/28/07 01:15 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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this thread needs to be moved to a health fanatic forum.
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
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Ya until my boss decided it would be cool to pay two 16 year old girls almost the same wage as me and let them do nothing all day.
It was hard work, especially when I was still just a regular monkey(laborer), but it made me feel VERY good physically after awhile. And I will admit it feels kinda cool to walk around with huge steel beams. Made me feel like a real tough guy. Walking around with stuff like that on my shoulder 
I was happier, fitter, and I even digested my food better(IMO) Exercise is so damn important, sitting on my ass over the winter has made me feel like utter crap at times. And I realize now that bad cycles can effect my health in serious ways.
Being chubby is sometimes based on genetics, but being obese is a choice, or rather a series of choices that add up over time, and eventually people find themselves trapped by their weight so to speak. And losing it is hard, especially because their bodies become used to eating a certain amount of food, and certain kinds of food.
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eligal
Noobie


Registered: 05/25/05
Posts: 7,021
Loc: California
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Skunk420]
#6504912 - 01/28/07 01:18 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
skunk78395 said: this thread needs to be moved to a health fanatic forum.
Technically this thread has alot more to do with psychology me thinks. But Im stupid so who cares what me thinks....
-------------------- \m/ Spanksta \m/ "do you have the freedom to do with your nervous system what you want?" "MolokoMilkPlus said: I'll respect you if you let me give you a blow job" "tactik said: respect the can."
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Skunk420]
#6504938 - 01/28/07 01:23 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
The Pub (53 viewing) A place for laid-back discussion on any topic...
Deal with it.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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[edit by geokills: off-topic and potentially inflammatory comments removed]
Edited by geokills (01/28/07 05:37 PM)
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


Registered: 03/05/05
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i dotn know about yuo, psilocybeing, but most construction workers around me are fat asses. My best friend is a laborer and his body fat is the highest that i have ever seen for him.
i chalk it up to the fact that so many of them go home and drink a couple beers every day. or they all go to the bar after work, etc. they dont binge drink, but they drink EVERY damn day.
and because theyre so tired, they dont work out. and a lot of them do the bare minimum while theyre 'at work'. So, they feel like they are getting such a great workout because theyre doing physical labor, but seriously, this isnt so. They just get tired and sedentary.
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Skunk420]
#6504994 - 01/28/07 01:39 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
skunk78395 said: this thread needs to be moved to a health fanatic forum.
I think this thread might have hurt someones feelings ^^^^^ Health fanatic forum???
Come on man, why the anti-intellectual attitude?  I have a friend like you that considers anything on health "stupid", and only pussies care about their health etc.... the truth is, he is WRONG. And so are you 
"pussies" hide from discussions and topics that upset their comfortable often over indulgent egos. Food is great, and I love to eat, but there is nothing wrong with exercise and a balanced diet. Take your whining to OTD.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: DR. PRIME]
#6505001 - 01/28/07 01:40 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
ScYiNs47 said: I say why should anyone care about the obesity problem. If you're not obese..don't worry about it. They can take care of it themselves if they care enough to.
If you're healthy and in shape, good for you. Why try to get everyone else on your side without any guarantee that they'll join your healthy lifestyle.
What? OF COURSE obesity effects society. It's our taxes that will pay for their damn disability cause theyre too fat to walk on their own or work.
also, so many hospitals are having to buy all new beds and toilets and change the size of their doorways to 'accomodate' these fat-asses. The world just isnt equiped to handle 400 pounds of laziness.
it's an unecessary and avoidable BURDEN on all of us.
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505057 - 01/28/07 01:55 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I was a laborer... and I was promoted to being a laborer supervisor.
So thats why I stayed thin. Many of the drywall guys had healthy upper bodies, and fats stomachs, I think you are right about the beer thing, many of them that had worked in construction for years had fat guts. While the younger guys did not.
Diet played a critical part though because many of the construction workers I have meet are quite fit.
Painters are often thin, which makes sense because of the kind of work they do. And when you're a tradesman and you ask laborers to grab you everything thats heavy, you lose a huge opportunity to burn calories
There are too many managers in both private and public companies, and without derailing this whole thread, after reading an excellent book called The Unconscious Civilization I couldn't bare to be one of these bosses(lead monkeys) that just stood around and watched other people work. So while the person working opposite me for another company would stand around talking on her walkie talkie all day I would run around working, and helping my team.
I got allot of respect for that, and my guys worked harder, I didn't have to push them or be an asshole about it either, they just worked harder.
While she on the other hand was called a cunt behind her back, and was ridiculed and undermined at every turn. (which was nice to see ) Seriously, if I can recommend one book(today ) its The Unconscious Civilization by John Saul, seriously that book will blow your fucking mind.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: DR. PRIME]
#6505064 - 01/28/07 01:56 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
ScYiNs47 said: People let themselves go. That's why some states take gym class so seriously. To teach a positive, healthy, and active lifestyle.
indeed.
most people dont realize that you cant just lose fat like you gain it. Once your body creates fat cells to compensate for your overconsumption, you have them. You keep those fat cells through thick and thin in your diet. Theyre like little balloons that can fill up or shrink depending on teh circumstances. It takes a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time of good health and consistent aerobic exercise for your body to finally decide that it doesnt need those fat cells anymore.
so fat asses pick up a diet, lose a few pounds, say to themselves, 'great, this is lookin good,' and then gain it all back in a flash because they never worked hard enough to actually lose the fat cells.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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I agree with your mentality. I enjoy having help at work and giving direction, but I still like to become involved and play out whatever role will best help the stiuation as a whole. Ultimately, having help with some of the more basic operations will give you an opportunity to carry out other tasks that need to be done - planning, organization, etc.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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psilo,
10% of the people do 90% of the work. youre one of the hard workers.
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505076 - 01/28/07 02:00 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
What? OF COURSE obesity effects society. It's our taxes that will pay for their damn disability cause theyre too fat to walk on their own or work.
also, so many hospitals are having to buy all new beds and toilets and change the size of their doorways to 'accomodate' these fat-asses. The world just isnt equiped to handle 400 pounds of laziness.
it's an unecessary and avoidable BURDEN on all of us.
Fortunately there is a final solution for all people who by their quirks burden humanity. You're using the exact same rationale as that Action T4 poster. Is your solution the same?
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HippieChick
Chicks can do it too!


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: DR. PRIME]
#6505130 - 01/28/07 02:17 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
ScYiNs47 said: I say why should anyone care about the obesity problem. If you're not obese..don't worry about it. They can take care of it themselves if they care enough to.
Here's why . With obesity come many severe health risks . Diabetes , Heart disease and failure just top the list . America is the most obese country on the face of the planet . To the point where I've read papers that say if this fat fact doesn't change , it could bankrupt the Medicare , and damn near country when all the fat folk get old and their health goes . Don't your taxes help pay for Medicare ? Guess it does effect you .
This is a very serious problem . Our kids are getting fatter by the day . That's what happens when kids sit in front of video games all day eating shit food with their friends .
Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony Hippie Chick
-------------------- Peace,Love and Happiness HC Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose.............. I LUV My Greenhouse http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848 My First Pans http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058
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DR. PRIME
Mental M.D.

Registered: 12/14/06
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Loc: Chicago
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505155 - 01/28/07 02:28 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Psilo - 100% correct about skunk and people's stubborn attitudes when someone mocks their personal lifestyles. When you know you're wrong, you can finally start being right.
Colbadol - You may be right but they have no work ethic and you do. More power to you. In the long run who's gonna live a better life... You! So don't worry about it. Just keep doing what you're doing and it'll pay off. While your taxes, that you probably won't miss, will be helping them suffer longer and you'll enjoy the fruits of your labor.
HippieChick - If it doesn't bother me then it won't effect me. I can always work harder because my brain isn't flawed.. I don't mind some hard work to get something. If more people realized this then American's wouldn't be fat-asses.
Jumping through all the hoops in our current system sucks yeah...but learn to live with it and it's not soo bad. You can learn to manipulate it if you work with it instead of against it.
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Edited by DR. PRIME (01/28/07 02:36 PM)
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505180 - 01/28/07 02:38 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Its worth it in so many ways, being smart,or appearing that way , by coming up with what seemed like simple solutions to make everyones job easier ) and working hard is what got me a promotion.
Sure I would fuck around sometimes, everyone does, but at the end of the day, I can't be the kind of person I despise.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505185 - 01/28/07 02:41 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
What? OF COURSE obesity effects society. It's our taxes that will pay for their damn disability cause theyre too fat to walk on their own or work.
also, so many hospitals are having to buy all new beds and toilets and change the size of their doorways to 'accomodate' these fat-asses. The world just isnt equiped to handle 400 pounds of laziness.
it's an unecessary and avoidable BURDEN on all of us.
Fortunately there is a final solution for all people who by their quirks burden humanity. You're using the exact same rationale as that Action T4 poster. Is your solution the same?
There's quite a difference here. People can't help that they are a Jew, a Gypsy, or a mental handicap. Many people can help being obese but refuse to take the initiative to rectify the situation.
What do you think is harder to do: lose forty pounds or stop being an ethnic Jew?
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505231 - 01/28/07 03:00 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I think that near the start of that post you meant to say CANT, obviously, so yes I agree 100% with your post.
The truth is, IMO of course..... is that its much easier to gain allot of weight and much harder to lose it. Which makes some people assume that they were meant to be a certain way, or that genetics gave them a bad deal in life.
The truth is(IMO) people trap themselves, in their weight, and their lifestyle choices, and either cant see a way out, or lack the willpower to try. So they lie to themselves and others.
Exercise, eat well. It might take a long time to see allot of progress, but sitting down and having extra desert and making excuses wont get you anywhere.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Yeah, I meant "can't".
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505309 - 01/28/07 03:27 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
There's quite a difference here. People can't help that they are a Jew, a Gypsy, or a mental handicap.
I was referring to Aktion T4, which focussed on the handicapped:
Quote:
Action T4 (German: Aktion T4) was a program in Nazi Germany officially between 1939 and 1941, during which the regime of Adolf Hitler systematically killed between 75,000 to 250,000 people with intellectual or physical disabilities.Unofficially performed after 1941 the killing became less systematic.[1]
Obese people, in Colbadol's presentation of things, would be handicapped people in the same sense. Compare:
Quote:
OF COURSE obesity effects society. It's our taxes that will pay for their damn disability cause theyre too fat to walk on their own or work.
also, so many hospitals are having to buy all new beds and toilets and change the size of their doorways to 'accomodate' these fat-asses. The world just isnt equiped to handle 400 pounds of laziness.
it's an unecessary and avoidable BURDEN on all of us.
with:
Quote:
60,000 Reichsmarks is what this person suffering from hereditary defects costs the community during his lifetime. Fellow German, that is your money, too.
People should strive to take care of their own business, but to call the ill, unfit and handicapped a (costly) burden on society has a VERY eerie precedent. As you can read in the wiki I linked, it was intolerance towards the sick, handicapped and infirm that paved the way to the atrocities which were to follow.
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What do you think is harder to do: lose forty pounds or stop being an ethnic Jew?
What is harder to do? Stop being an ethnic Jew or stop being genetically predisposed to obesity? The answer is that both have exactly zero chance to change their nature. It is hardwired into your DNA.
It is easier for the average Jew to not appear Jewish than it is for the average obese guy to appear thin, because although 99% of all diets gets the weight off, only 10% of people keeps it off after 3 years, and in fact 30% are more obese three years after a diet where much weight was lost, than before it. That means that if you manage to lose the weight, you are three times more likely to weigh MORE after 3 years than that you have kept it off. For obese people, dieting itself is fattening. I've got a source for all that but it is in Dutch.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505328 - 01/28/07 03:34 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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That isn't an accurate application of that statistic. One is as likely to weigh more after three years "if one allows oneself to engage in behavior that will put that weight back on". The fact that only 10% keep the weight off and 30% gain more doesn't set the odds of what one's own result will be - it simply describes the failings of others.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505341 - 01/28/07 03:40 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
What is harder to do? Stop being an ethnic Jew or stop being genetically predisposed to obesity? The answer is that both have exactly zero chance to change their nature. It is hardwired into your DNA.
Nothing is set in stone when it comes to weight, the body can adapt. Some people are predisposed to being heavier, but the idea that its hardwired and they can never get fit is ridiculous.
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX And Redstorm, did you edit?? I don't see a message saying that you did, but I swore you would have had to, I'm pretty high but Did you use some sort of crazy mod edit that the rest of us can't see you shifty mo fo???
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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We don't make mistakes.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505362 - 01/28/07 03:49 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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wiccan, youre trying to line up my opinions on this with your belief that people are BORN to be obese. If this were the case, how come this is only a modern 'disease'? There is a correalation with obesity and societies average lifestyle. the fact is that yes, many people are predisposed to a higher body fat percentage, but like said before...they trap THEMSELVES>
frankly, i dont believe that it's a disease at all. it's a SOURCE of diseases like diabetes and hypertension, etc.
i hope youre just playing devil's advocate, because there is NO way to can defend this rediculously unhealthy lifestyle. Like, some people think that drug use is an unhealthy lifestyle, but there are many arguments against that, many heated opinions/misinformation, etc. With obesity, however, there is no argument.
obese people ARE handicapped. but i never suggested a one-click solution of KILLING them. I said that it is avoidable. im thinking long term gradual, not hack and slash.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Quote:
One is as likely to weigh more after three years "if one allows oneself to engage in behavior that will put that weight back on". The fact that only 10% keep the weight off and 30% gain more doesn't set the odds of what one's own result will be - it simply describes the failings of others.
Fireworks_God, statistics about a population are about a population. If a large group starts something and 90% consistently fails then the chance of failure is 90%.
The hard fact is that 90% of people who engage in that activity within 3 years "allows oneself to engage in behavior that will put that weight back on".
Quote:
The fact that only 10% keep the weight off and 30% gain more doesn't set the odds of what one's own result will be - it simply describes the failings of others.
You are being silly.
Quote:
The fact that only 1% survives falling off Golden Gate Bridge doesn't set the odds of what one's own result will be - it simply describes the failings of others.
No it doesn't "set the odds" and yet it is a real good indicator that some risk is involved, no?
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505377 - 01/28/07 03:55 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Sure some people are unable to lose wait b/c of a problem with their body. You won't see me denying that. I just find it hard to believe that anywhere close to a majority of the obese have this genetic defect.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505392 - 01/28/07 04:00 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: For obese people, dieting itself is fattening.
what are you saying here? that obese people will get fatter no matter what? oh lets feel sorry for them all, they try sooooo hard. it's just that damn evil fat gene. boo hoo.
the fact is that they just arent working hard enough at it. this isnt entirely their fault. society helps them along by supporting their obesity. hell, theyre the perfect consumers arent they? they'll also get tons of prejudice from the people, which add's to their low self-esteem --> turning to what makes them happy...EATING JUNK!
let's feel sorry for them...maybe sympathy will make them happier.
FUCK THAT. These people need a kick in the arse. They need motivation.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505408 - 01/28/07 04:10 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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what i'm trying to say is that these people get discouraged because they spend their entire lives getting fat, and they expect to lose it in 1 month with as little effort as possible. and there's a serious market for this. Businesses supply them with misinformation, bad diets, and shortcuts that dont work...all at a nice price.
if you look at a failed diet or a failed workout plan, and really disect it you WILL find a reason as to why it didnt work. eating one meal a day? NO WONDER your metabolism is soo low. Doing abs with your new expensive machine but not getting a flatter stomache? But it's supposed to work, isnt it?
LIES> theyve all been LIED to. dont support this.
support work ethic, self-respect, and perseverence.
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505411 - 01/28/07 04:13 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
people are BORN to be obese.
Some people are, yes. As a species we have seen much famine and this has predisposed much of humanity to obesity, and of those some far more than others through a combination of nature and nurture.
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If this were the case, how come this is only a modern 'disease'?
It's not. Except most people never could afford or obtain fattening foods and a low-activity lifestyle to go with that. If you look at whatever culture, look at their rich people and you see a lot of them are very obese. The western problem is that we are so rich that almost everybody is rich to the standards our ancestors lived by.
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the fact is that yes, many people are predisposed to a higher body fat percentage, but like said before...they trap THEMSELVES
The mouse traps himself by eating the cheese in the trap, and yet he is just following his nature. It is part of human nature to overeat and get redy for the next famine. With no famine, people get obese.
Quote:
i hope youre just playing devil's advocate, because there is NO way to can defend this rediculously unhealthy lifestyle.
I'm not defending it! I am however saying that society should accept the fact that obesity is a real problem. The World Health Organisation in fact considers it one of the worlds biggest problems. People should become more tolerant and accepting of differences, especially if they cause as much sorrow and suffering as obesity does.
But actually if I wanted to I very well can defend the "obese lifestyle". We are a DRUG COMMUNITY. We are accepting of people who stick 100 dollar bills up their nose and dirty needles up their arm. We have the right to live and die as we choose if the burden of harm falls onto ourselves. People may drug themselves to death, race themselves to death in speedboats and fast cars, and if they want to they can eat themselves to death.
But most obese people do not want that "lifestyle", they are stuck in it, so acknowledging the realness of their problem instead of blaming them and pointing fingers and calling them a "burden to society" would be the high road.
I am confident that if you change the food/exercise culture of the nation, and find a medicine that can undo the metabolic damage done by years of obesity, that few people will be "stuck" with obesity problems.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505424 - 01/28/07 04:18 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Fireworks_God, statistics about a population are about a population. If a large group starts something and 90% consistently fails then the chance of failure is 90%.
Incorrect. The chance of failure are determined by the specific variables in the situation of the individual. If I trip and fall at work, and 25% of associates trip at work, that does not mean that I have a 25% chance of tripping and falling at work. That chance is determined by factors, such as the surface that I'm walking on and what is also on it, the stability I am maintaining, etc.
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The hard fact is that 90% of people who engage in that activity within 3 years "allows oneself to engage in behavior that will put that weight back on".
That does not mean that one is facing a 90% chance of failure. 
Quote:
You are being silly.
Afraid not. One determines one's results through one's actions, not the percentage rate of how others have acted. 
Quote:
No it doesn't "set the odds" and yet it is a real good indicator that some risk is involved, no?
Not really. Taking the viewpoint that, as 90% of people gain the weight they lose on a diet within a few years, one has very slim odds ( ) of becoming a healthier person, is a detriment to one's ability to lose weight and become more healthy.
Ultimately, it sounds like justification of failure to act, to me.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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KingOftheThing
the cool fool


Registered: 11/17/02
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505438 - 01/28/07 04:25 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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fat peole like to cry and blame things on metabolism and such. when it comes down to it though, every fat person ive met eats like shit and doesnt excersise. they will all throw the excuse at you "i tried but im just fat" which means they tried working out for like a week and didnt see results. or they refuse to alter their eating. fat people are the worst kind of gluttons. they stuff their face full of garbage and complain about fatness. most of them eat fast food like its their job. cakes, cookies, doritos, ice cream, they cant help themselves. some of them eat healthy in front of people then binge at home. i bet $10000000 i could take any fat person and get them to lose weight. just look at any of those fat person reallity shows. when forced to workout and not stuff their faces with garbage they all do lose weight. its a fucking fact. most of them plump righ tback up again after the show. fat people have no self control. they eat selfishly stuffing their fat faces. gross
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505439 - 01/28/07 04:25 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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By saying that it's MOSTLY genetic is NOT facing the real problem. In fact, this is more modern thinking which is making people 'accept' their problem. Accepting a problem does NOT equal facing a problem.
drugs, sports, racing around...these are all life experiences. You can do one, move on to the other and have a very fulfilling life. eating yourself to death is NOT living. It prevents you from doing anything else but cramming more food into your face and feeling sorry for yourself.
youre right, most obese people dont want to be like that, and they are stuck in it. But like explained before...they trap themselves.
Society already KNOWS that this is a real problem. By saying that you 'accept' your obesity as being beyond your own control (which youve equated to taking the moral high ground) will only make things worse.
it's not the moral highground. it's a weakness.
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Asante
Mage


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505451 - 01/28/07 04:29 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
what are you saying here? that obese people will get fatter no matter what?
Try to imagine the horror of that being true for some people. That just like with Arthritis you slowly lose more and more functionality, medicines (diets) provide temporary relief but slowly but surely you are sliding off to partial or full disability.
Because that's the reality that many obese people face. Take a group of obese people. Flashforward to 2017, and most are worse off. Back to 2007 again. All this talk of hope and self-empowerment. That happened to the obese of 1997, and they are worse off in our 2007. That happened to the obese of 1987, most of whom who were worse off in 1997. None of the positive thinking blabla worked for them. America is fatter than ever.
Ten years later and you almost invariably are worse off. Thats the reality of chronic illness, including obesity. Once you have been heavy enough for long enough, chances are that ten years from now you'll be worse off.
Many people flat out dislike obese people. That is a cultural deformity (like segregarion was) and that has to be overcome too.
Quote:
Sure some people are unable to lose wait b/c of a problem with their body. You won't see me denying that. I just find it hard to believe that anywhere close to a majority of the obese have this genetic defect.
Many people in the USA who are obese do not have strong genetic tendency towards obesity as far as we know. But genetics isn't as much the issue as is understanding that if you are fat enough for long enough, you will forever tend to put on weight thereafter. It is the obesity itself that breaks your metabolism, regardless of what brought it on. If you stuff your kid to be fat between ages 6-12, chances are that he'll be fat for life, regardless of genetics.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505452 - 01/28/07 04:29 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Some people are, yes. As a species we have seen much famine and this has predisposed much of humanity to obesity, and of those some far more than others through a combination of nature and nurture.
Substantiation? We do not instinctually gorge ourselves. 
Quote:
The mouse traps himself by eating the cheese in the trap, and yet he is just following his nature. It is part of human nature to overeat and get redy for the next famine. With no famine, people get obese.
It is only a part of human nature due to the manner in which you are choosing to act in this moment. Human nature is our actions, right now. We are not mouses, as we can see the trap for what it is. We should act accordingly.
Quote:
I'm not defending it! I am however saying that society should accept the fact that obesity is a real problem. The World Health Organisation in fact considers it one of the worlds biggest problems. People should become more tolerant and accepting of differences, especially if they cause as much sorrow and suffering as obesity does.
Tolerance is superb, and yet we don't stop at identifying a problem - we effectively solve it. I don't think anyone really thinks that obesity is not a problem. The question is what are we doing about it, and the people who should be asking this question are primarily those who are obese. What am I going to do about it, what am I doing about it?
Quote:
But actually if I wanted to I very well can defend the "obese lifestyle". We are a DRUG COMMUNITY. We are accepting of people who stick 100 dollar bills up their nose and dirty needles up their arm.
I thought we were a community that encourages informative and safe drug usage, not acceptance of every moron who gives it a bad name. Reading the posts of users who criticize the people who show up in the articles in the news forum for their stupid arrests would seem to evidence this. Defending an unhealthy choice simply because one can make that choice doesn't make a lot of choice. 
Quote:
We have the right to live and die as we choose if the burden of harm falls onto ourselves. People may drug themselves to death, race themselves to death in speedboats and fast cars, and if they want to they can eat themselves to death.
True. Great. Why should they? Because they can?
Quote:
I am confident that if you change the food/exercise culture of the nation, and find a medicine that can undo the metabolic damage done by years of obesity, that few people will be "stuck" with obesity problems.
How does one change the food/exercise culture of a nation? By choices on the individual level. Ultimately, all I am hearing is that "One's body blackmails oneself into eating too much, human beings are naturally this way, once one is this way it is extremely difficult to change, and that if only the entire world changed then one would get better".
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505463 - 01/28/07 04:33 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I do not believe you will be fat forever. If you do not have a genetic indicator which makes you fat, it IS only a matter of willpower to lose weight. It may be hard and it may take a great deal of time, but it will happen. One just sitting back and allowing it to happen is not going to solve any problems.
Everything you have said could also be applied to someone with a gambling addiction. If someone gets into it for a long enough time, they will not be able to stop. You wouldn't suggest that they should just keep gambling and deal with it, would you?
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impgl
CrimethINCspecial agent

Registered: 02/07/06
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I being a bike messenger
-------------------- omg really?
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505479 - 01/28/07 04:37 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Because that's the reality that many obese people face. Take a group of obese people. Flashforward to 2017, and most are worse off. Back to 2007 again. All this talk of hope and self-empowerment. That happened to the obese of 1997, and they are worse off in our 2007. That happened to the obese of 1987, most of whom who were worse off in 1997. None of the positive thinking blabla worked for them. America is fatter than ever.
Who is talking about positive thinking? The reason that people who are obese typically do not stop being obese is because they do not change their patterns of behavior which are responsible for being obese. The fact that one is stuck in a rut implies that one will have to exert themselves to get out of the rut. The fact that this is true, that it will take a distinct change in behavior to seize the opportunity to not be obese is quite likely the reason that it doesn't happen - no will-power, once again.
Quote:
But genetics isn't as much the issue as is understanding that if you are fat enough for long enough, you will forever tend to put on weight thereafter. It is the obesity itself that breaks your metabolism, regardless of what brought it on. If you stuff your kid to be fat between ages 6-12, chances are that he'll be fat for life, regardless of genetics.
Chances are due to the fact that one continues to consume more energy than one is expending. Cut the calorie intake and start exerting oneself! Why isn't it that simple? If you take in more calories than you burn, then you take on more calories. If you take in less than you burn, then you are burning more calories. I'm not certain why we have to complicate the matter beyond that.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: impgl]
#6505484 - 01/28/07 04:39 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I bet you do. I was going to suggest bicycling earlier in this thread.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505503 - 01/28/07 04:47 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
I do not believe you will be fat forever. If you do not have a genetic indicator which makes you fat, it IS only a matter of willpower to lose weight. It may be hard and it may take a great deal of time, but it will happen.
If you look at the statistics, it is clear that you are not being realistic. We can't all be billionaires. By the end of the day theres only one billionaire and ten million are not.
So how about stopping tormenting those ten million with promises of how willpower will get it done - when the statistics show that nearly all will not succeed?
I'm all for people taking charge of their own lives, that should be clear, but a large part of the problem is the insensitive and persecutory attitude society has towards people with this condition. It is downright inhumane and clear to be seen to all who honestly look at the cultural image of obesity.
It is this cruelty I am arguing against, and I am amazed once more at the hardened, trench warfare attitude of coldness that prevails on this topic, as it does on many others. The Shroomery used to be a warm welcoming place, nowadays it is tough on everything.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505520 - 01/28/07 04:53 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: So how about stopping tormenting those ten million with promises of how willpower will get it done - when the statistics show that nearly all will not succeed?
The reason they won't succeed is likely because they don't understand what the statistics mean, use them in the wrong context, and lack the willpower or fail to utilize it as an opportunity to develop willpower because they just sort of shrug lazily and look to rationalize it.
Quote:
I'm all for people taking charge of their own lives, that should be clear, but a large part of the problem is the insensitive and persecutory attitude society has towards people with this condition. It is downright inhumane and clear to be seen to all who honestly look at the cultural image of obesity.
Perhaps that attitude is prevalent, and it is troublesome that it is; however, it is simply one more excuse as to why one cannot assume personal power for themselves and initiate action to lead one's life in a responsible manner.
These people need help, yet the only way that change can be produced is through applying themselves. Give them the resources and understanding necessary to change themselves, and encourage them to get off of their ass and do it. 
Quote:
It is this cruelty I am arguing against, and I am amazed once more at the hardened, trench warfare attitude of coldness that prevails on this topic, as it does on many others. The Shroomery used to be a warm welcoming place, nowadays it is tough on everything.
The "For shame!" bit is ineffective.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505523 - 01/28/07 04:53 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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That is an absolutely absurd comparison. Wealth is much more of a zero-sum game than weight, since there is a limited amount of currency at any one point.
While me having more money means that elsewhere someone else can't have that money, me losing weight does not prohibit someone else from losing weight. Making money is often outside the realm of will-power while obesity (not counting genetic dispositions) is not.
Also, there is always the option of not becoming obese in the first place. People need to have a little responsibility for their action for this to work, however.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505548 - 01/28/07 05:00 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Rationalization is a strange phenomenon...
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505559 - 01/28/07 05:05 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Perhaps that attitude is prevalent, and it is troublesome that it is; however, it is simply one more excuse as to why one cannot assume personal power for themselves and initiate action to lead one's life in a responsible manner.
Bullshit. It is done onto them. That is not their fault.
Quote:
Also, there is always the option of not becoming obese in the first place
Tell that to the 6yo that are round as barrels. Tell them about the option of making their own choices. Most seriously obese people were seriously obese before they were ten years old. Their metabolism was broken before their mind could object.
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HippieChick
Chicks can do it too!


Registered: 02/20/05
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Quote:
fireworks_god said:
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Chances are due to the fact that one continues to consume more energy than one is expending. Cut the calorie intake and start exerting oneself! Why isn't it that simple? If you take in more calories than you burn, then you take on more calories. If you take in less than you burn, then you are burning more calories. I'm not certain why we have to complicate the matter beyond that.
:

It's easy to see the problem when Hubby has 2 Chineese restaurants that have buffets . Has nothing to do with the obese customers that have a plate heaped full of egg rolls and crab rangoons for an appetizer before moving on to their 4-5 heaping plates of dinner .
It's not so much how much you eat , but what you eat . And exercise .
When Hubby wanted to get in better shape 3 years ago , he started working out 4 days a week . He lost 35 pounds , from 215 to 180 , and the whole time he was eating over 4,000 calories a day . I was floored . He ate a 12 egg-white omelett and a 8 ounce chicken breast for breakfast every day , along with a protein shake .
He stopped working out almost 2 years ago , lowered his calories back to 2,000 a day and hasn't gained a pound back .
Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony Hippie Chick
-------------------- Peace,Love and Happiness HC Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose.............. I LUV My Greenhouse http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848 My First Pans http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505567 - 01/28/07 05:07 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Care to address my post as a whole rather than cherry-picking?
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505577 - 01/28/07 05:12 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Let's turn it around for a change.
Let's assume, like you and Fireworks do, that obese people have no willpower whatsoever. Not a shred.
Well, what would be your solution then?
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505578 - 01/28/07 05:13 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Hey, some of that was my post too.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505583 - 01/28/07 05:14 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I have never seen an obese person, whom after getting to know, did not exhibit that their obesity was due to poor diet and lack of exercise expend. Not one person.
Food for thought. ha ha
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



Registered: 10/08/02
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505585 - 01/28/07 05:16 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Let's turn it around for a change.
Let's assume, like you and Fireworks do, that obese people have no willpower whatsoever. Not a shred.
Well, what would be your solution then?
Gain some willpower. It's might be tough. They just gotta get off the couch to do it.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505586 - 01/28/07 05:16 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Let's assume, like you and Fireworks do, that obese people have no willpower whatsoever. Not a shred.
Well, what would be your solution then?
Take it as an opportunity to develop willpower. Begin to make decisions as to how one will act consciously. Start to take action.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6505592 - 01/28/07 05:20 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Gain some willpower. It's might be tough. They just gotta get off the couch to do it.
Quote:
Take it as an opportunity to develop willpower. Begin to make decisions as to how one will act consciously. Start to take action.
In other words - you have no solution.
Overweight? Lose the weight. No willpower? Develop willpower. Heroin addiction? Quit using drugs. Dying? Just don't die.
All this has just been an exercise in blabla. How utterly useless.
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505595 - 01/28/07 05:21 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Or they can just die from complications of being overweight.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505599 - 01/28/07 05:23 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: In other words - you have no solution.
Overweight? Lose the weight. No willpower? Develop willpower. Heroin addiction? Quit using drugs.
You're right! How could it ever be that simple?
"Instead of eating the doughnut... set it... set it, down? What is this, some kind of trick?"
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers


Registered: 03/06/03
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Quote:
Chances are due to the fact that one continues to consume more energy than one is expending. Cut the calorie intake and start exerting oneself! Why isn't it that simple? If you take in more calories than you burn, then you take on more calories. If you take in less than you burn, then you are burning more calories. I'm not certain why we have to complicate the matter beyond that.
Didnt I say this like, 8 hours ago?
I think we're talking ourselves in circles...
It boggles my mind how such a simple concept can cause so many people so much grief.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Chazzersize
Pokemon Master


Registered: 11/30/03
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I'm perfectly fine with fat folks.
The line is drawn when I have to deal with your fat ass on an airplane because you take up two god damn seats and I'M forced to move because you have no willpower whatsoever.
-------------------- Take off my mask and leave the lies to the liars.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers


Registered: 03/06/03
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Holy shit!
I said *THAT* 8 hours ago too.
This thread is very cyclical.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Its so cyclical I want a cyclizine 
I read it back here and there and - wow.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


Registered: 03/05/05
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505714 - 01/28/07 06:02 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Let's turn it around for a change.
Let's assume, like you and Fireworks do, that obese people have no willpower whatsoever. Not a shred.
Well, what would be your solution then?
they should tattoo on their HUMONGOUS forearm (they cant see any other part of their body) the phrase "JUST DO IT"
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505718 - 01/28/07 06:03 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
I am confident that if you change the food/exercise culture of the nation, and find a medicine(DAILY EXERCISE) that can undo the metabolic damage done by years of obesity, that few people will be "stuck" with obesity problems. (RED=my modification)
Glad you came around finally and see this situation for what it truly is, a health problem caused by overindulgence, and lack of proper exercise.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


Registered: 03/05/05
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Quote:
Psilocybeingzz said:
Quote:
I am confident that if you change the food/exercise culture of the nation, and find a medicine(DAILY EXERCISE) that can undo the metabolic damage done by years of obesity, that few people will be "stuck" with obesity problems. (RED=my modification)
Glad you came around finally and see this situation for what it truly is, a health problem caused by overindulgence, and lack of proper exercise.
but fat people (is wiccan fat?) want a pill!!!! they wont settle for anything else!!
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Quote:
AroundtheSon said: I have never seen an obese person, whom after getting to know, did not exhibit that their obesity was due to poor diet and lack of exercise expend. Not one person.
Food for thought. ha ha
Ditto. And I've met quite a few fat people.
Every extremely obese person I have met and spent any time knowing, had an extremely bad diet consisting of mostly saturated fats, sugars, and foods extremely rich in empty calories.
I myself struggle to GAIN weight while eating properly, which can be hard. The sheer amount of trash food available at most grocery stores is astounding. It can be hard to avoid it simply due to the massive quantities available. Junk food is over-abundant in our society and available almost everywhere.
That said I can admit to not having the best diet all the time. Hell, a lot of the time I've struggled just to AFFORD food so I'm not hungry all day, and I've been known to gorge on junk food. But I've never had a weight problem, maybe a heart problem somewhere down the line.. but I think not having a car for the past 2 years, and having to walk or bike everywhere has made a pretty big difference in my overall health. And my job usually involves physical effort, I don't just sit on my ass all day.
Bottom line is I understand HOW people get fat - sit on their ass and eat crap all day. I just don't understand how its possible. Maybe if I was rich too.. I'd love to eat all day. Except if I could afford good food, I wouldn't be eating ho-hos and doritos all day long..
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505758 - 01/28/07 06:14 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Can't you ask me directly?
Yes, I am quite obese.
Because the obesity (and/or genetics) have caused an underlying metabolic disorder, there should be a medical intervention (presumingly a pharmaceutical) to increase the effectiveness of the combination of exercise, coaching and diet.
A failure rate of diets of 90% is unacceptable so there must be an additional intervention.
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Spooge
The Nutter
Registered: 04/21/04
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505777 - 01/28/07 06:17 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Someone has said this, but I'm going to add onto it.
I also have not met one obese person that didn't have a problem with eating unhealthy with a lack of exercise. Meaning, every large person I've ever met takes in more calories than they burn.
Quote:
Overweight? Lose the weight. No willpower? Develop willpower. Heroin addiction? Quit using drugs.
Sometimes the solution IS that simple. And in this case, very much so.
Take baby steps. If a person is unhappy with their weight and they realize they have a problem, throw the tv in the dumpster or lock it in storage. Hell, even lock your books up. A person will find something to do real quick. Swimming is fairly effortless, when compared to jogging or lifting weights, so perhaps another step these people could take is to get a membership.
All of this will go nowhere if these people don't do something about their diet asap. They can make a meal plan and add up the total number of calories they would consume each day and then figure out how much exercise would be required to burn more than the said calories.
If they need to go to the local store, or a friends close by...walk briskly. If it's cold out, put something warm on. They need not make excuses.
I know from personal experience that for quite awhile, I've been consuming way more calories than I burn and it's starting to show. I'm making STEPS to combat it and it is working quite well. My mom and her entire family are very large and every single one of them could begin to DEVELOP will power to take the steps necessary to lose the weight.
Fireworks and Redstorm are right on the money...develop the will power to lose weight and take the small steps towards the goal.
That is the solution. And it's that simple
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


Registered: 03/05/05
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505787 - 01/28/07 06:19 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: A failure rate of diets of 90% is unacceptable so there must be an additional intervention.
Wiccan. you have to let that go.
it's not the diet's fault. It's the persons fault for a) following a bad diet b) not exercising while dieting c) believe that there is an easy solution d) not knowing how his/her individual body works
JUST because a diet didnt work for you doesnt mean that youre DOOMED for obesity. Jesus christ.
and it's not that the people of america cant handle diets either. the reason why diets dont work is because you keep doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results...it's insanity. Diets arent the silver bullet to obesity (they were never meant to be), but many people think so because theyve been brainwashed by booksellers.
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Spooge
The Nutter
Registered: 04/21/04
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505802 - 01/28/07 06:22 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Another thing that I've noticed.
I've never met one person that just got obese all of a sudden. Some children are brought up with a horrible diet and lack of activity...it ends up screwing with their metabolism. In this case, the pounds can be put on fairly quickly, but it's not an overnight change. Problems with metabolism can be corrected with hard work. But it's exactly that, hard work.
Overweight people become overweight over time and taking it off is going to take double the effort/time.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6505805 - 01/28/07 06:24 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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yes, entity.
people look at fat children and then at their fat parents and assume it's genetic. NO. Children at a young age follow the lifestyles of their parents.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6505861 - 01/28/07 06:39 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Say, I hope that people understand that obesity isn't your tummy sagging a bit, but a condition where you're at the very least 25lbs overweight.
Quote:
Fireworks and Redstorm are right on the money...develop the will power to lose weight and take the small steps towards the goal. . That is the solution. And it's that simple
I love it when people are high on positive thinking and feel they can take on the world. See you in three years 
I've lost 50 pounds THREE TIMES, and recently another 33 lbs. When I weighed 220lbs I jogged 10 fucking miles. If you look at the graph of my average weight, I don't think it did me any good, any whatsoever, except for the high of feeling on top of things.
Currently I could stand to lose 100 lbs so I'm readying myself to enter a program of intensive cardiovascular exercise, fitness training, counseling and a deprivation diet which is supposed to keep me starved for a lifetime.
I enter this with hereditary obesity, vital medications which are fattening and a serious heart condition which has caused heart attacks before.
Develop willpower. As simple as that right? Gee.
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505879 - 01/28/07 06:45 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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perhaps a coach really would be the most help for you wiccan. i see where youre comin from. i believe that it's merely exposure. like, some people know how to fix cars because theyve been exposed to it. some people know how to fix computers because theyve been exposed to it. some people know how to exercise because theyve been exposed to it. no one is born knowing these things. they have to be shown.
there are so many small details that is very difficult to just straight up tell you. ive been a distance runner, swimmer, and cyclist for most of my life.
you ran 10 miles and expected something? That's actually very bad for you to just go out and do that. I dont know what kind of running base youve built before hand, but i hope you didnt get injured/burnt out. it's better to just run like 1mile or maybe 2 every other day. youll see results then. Just breaking a sweat will raise your metabolism for about 3 hours afterwards.
also, running while overweight is very hard on your joints. i recommend cycling. you stay in the aerobic, prime fat-burning range of 100-130bpm heartrate range for longer.
www.cyclingforums.com
dont be afraid to cram into some spandex and jump on a nice touring road bike. youd be suprised how many big guys do. they just laugh along. it's great.
edit: Lots of success stories in those forums, and theyre higher than dieting's measly 10%...check it out.
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Edited by Colbadol (01/28/07 06:58 PM)
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KingOftheThing
the cool fool


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505886 - 01/28/07 06:47 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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its not genetic, fat people have shitty eat habits they pass on to their kids...u take their kids into a healthy eating household, kid isnt fat
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Spooge
The Nutter
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505898 - 01/28/07 06:49 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
I enter this with hereditary obesity, vital medications which are fattening and a serious heart condition which has caused heart attacks before.
But wiccan, I'm almost sure that all of that was caused by the obeseity in the first place. You didn't just become obese overnight.
My entire family and extended family are very large people. I was born a humongous baby and was very chubby as a baby/toddler. My parents got me into so much activities and my mom was a stay at home mom until I was 12, who was strict with "meal plans", no snacking.
I exercised and was geuinely active until I was 18. I became extremely fit and my metabolism was incredible. I used to cycle, rollerblade, mountainbike, run and martial arts.
For a few years, I haven't been doing much activity besides occasionally lifting weights and my labour jobs. It's starting to show everywhere and if I don't DO something about it, I'll start getting heart conditions and other "ailments" that cause me to take medication that sure won't make it easier to lose weight(make it easier to gain if anything).
In that sense, I can feel for you(btw, I wasn't directing my original post at anyone in particular). At this point in time, you now have heart problems and medication that cause weight gain and in your case, to lose weight, you are going to have to put in a LOT of hard work, but also go about it carefully(which it seems your taking the steps to do )
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I've lost 50 pounds THREE TIMES, and recently another 33 lbs. When I weighed 220lbs I jogged 10 fucking miles. If you look at the graph of my average weight, I don't think it did me any good, any whatsoever, except for the high of feeling on top of things.
But that doesn't mean anything. I'm assuming it was daily? That's the sort of dedication and hard work it would take....but STILL...if you are eating more calories and fatty foods than you burn, that 10 miles is for nothing. Also, like buddy said, I hope that was something you worked up to?
As for heriditary obesity....I clearly have "fat genes" but with the proper steps it won't be my excuse.
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Asante
Mage


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Colbadol]
#6505936 - 01/28/07 07:03 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
perhaps a coach really would be the most help for you wiccan.
Oh it will all be part of one unified treatment, question is whether they'll take me, with the heart condition and all.
Quote:
some people know how to exercise because they've been exposed to it.
Oh I know how to exercise, but it all changes with a heart condition.
Quote:
you ran 10 miles and expected something? That's actually very bad for you to just go out and do that. I dont know what kind of running base youve built before you did that, but i hope you didnt get injured/burnt out.
I jogged 2 miles three times a week, with stretching exercises and the whole deal, then one day I decided to see how far it would go. Run 10 miles weighing 220lbs, strap on a 70lbs backpack and try it.
Quote:
it's better to just run like 1mile or maybe 2 every other day. youll see results then.
I'll pretend I didn't hear that. I say I'm more than 100lbs overweight and have a heart condition and you suggest me to run a mile or two.
90 percent chance that I'll fail in less than three years. In the past I lost a total of 200lbs or so of weight to no avail. That does not mean I'm not going for that 10%, but I know how my chances are.
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505941 - 01/28/07 07:05 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I'm assuming you gain back the weight that you lose after you stop doing the things that enabled that weight loss in the first place, right?
So how about removing that part of the equation, and maybe it'll stop being a zero-sum game.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505958 - 01/28/07 07:10 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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I have a very serious heart condition, it doesn't stop me from running, biking , having sex, or doing anything else that raises my heart rate.
I guess I could over-analyze and rationalize that every X number of beats I go through some pain... so if I just slow down I wont have to go through it as much, but I can't go about my life like that, sure I try to limit stress, but I have to get exercise sometimes, what heart condition do you have???
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Colbadol
Reality Mechanic


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6505963 - 01/28/07 07:10 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
90 percent chance that I'll fail in less than three years. In the past I lost a total of 200lbs or so of weight to no avail. That does not mean I'm not going for that 10%, but I know how my chances are.
Wiccan. it is a known FACT that if you kept that low body weight; sustained it for longer, you would have eventually gotten rid of your fat cells. Even if you went back to not caring anymore it wouldve taken longer to gain it all back. but idk, if you really tried, three years is a long time.
sustain 220lbs for three years, and itll get easier to keep it. dont give up.
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HippieChick
Chicks can do it too!


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6505981 - 01/28/07 07:15 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
entityexperiment said:
Quote:
I
As for heriditary obesity....I clearly have "fat genes" but with the proper steps it won't be my excuse.
Genetics does play a small part . Children of obese parents are 10 times more likely to become odese .
Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony Hippie Chick
-------------------- Peace,Love and Happiness HC Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose.............. I LUV My Greenhouse http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848 My First Pans http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058
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Madtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers


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But couldnt this be because they eat what their parents eat and do what their parents do?
I mean, if the parents dont have a healthy lifestyle, which they obviously dont in these cases I would think it would follow that the kids would have the same outlook.
-------------------- After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action. If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it. - Ernest Hemingway If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it. In the law courts, in business, in government. There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent. -Cormac MacCarthy He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God. - Aeschylus
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Asante
Mage


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6505998 - 01/28/07 07:19 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
But that doesn't mean anything. I'm assuming it was daily? That's the sort of dedication and hard work it would take....but STILL...if you are eating more calories and fatty foods than you burn, that 10 miles is for nothing. Also, like buddy said, I hope that was something you worked up to?
As you know you don't run to burn calories while running, but to enhance basal metabolism. The training years my knees and back put a stop to that - too heavy for running. And muscle became fat once more, dozens and dozens of pounds of it.
Quote:
But wiccan, I'm almost sure that all of that was caused by the obeseity in the first place.
Almost is not quite. My heart condition is entirely hereditary, my coronary arteries are everywhere except where they should be. For the record, I got my heart attack age 30 and am 34 now.
Quote:
As for heriditary obesity....I clearly have "fat genes" but with the proper steps it won't be my excuse.
It may be recessive in you, or perhaps you're just a bit slower to gain weight. I can tell you that you won't like what a good sports injury can do with your delicate equilibrium.
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Asante
Mage


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Quote:
I have a very serious heart condition, it doesn't stop me from running, biking , having sex, or doing anything else that raises my heart rate.
Ah but you know that every heart condition is different. I've got malformations in my coronary arteries and a tendency for cardiac oxygen starvation and (dangerous) coronary vasospasm.
If they'll take my I'll do most of the training under medical supervision in a physiotherapy center. (bless my good insurance!)
My condition is thus that at any moment I could drop dead by heart attack, which is quite something to learn to live with. How you deal with those things is very individual.
I assume you have a heart rhythm disturbance ofd sorts? Are you on pharms or operated on?
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HippieChick
Chicks can do it too!


Registered: 02/20/05
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Quote:
Madtowntripper said: But couldnt this be because they eat what their parents eat and do what their parents do?
I mean, if the parents dont have a healthy lifestyle, which they obviously dont in these cases I would think it would follow that the kids would have the same outlook.
That's my thinking . Kids learn what they live .
Didn't say why . Just said they were 10 times more likely .
Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony Hippie Chick
-------------------- Peace,Love and Happiness HC Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose.............. I LUV My Greenhouse http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5545848#5545848 My First Pans http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6212058#6212058
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Asante
Mage


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Quote:
That's my thinking . Kids learn what they live . Didn't say why . Just said they were 10 times more likely .
It often will be a combination of both. But, like you say: nature or nurture - the bottom line is that they're ten times more likely.
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Spooge
The Nutter
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506051 - 01/28/07 07:38 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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You should take up swimming if running is to hard on your back and knees then.
Quote:
Almost is not quite. My heart condition is entirely hereditary, my coronary arteries are everywhere except where they should be. For the record, I got my heart attack age 30 and am 34 now.
But are you quite sure that if you hadn't let your sports injury make you put on all the weight, you would of developed the heart condition?
All sorts of horrible, SUPPOSEDELY hereditary, heart conditions/diseases, cholesterol problems are in my family. My father, mother(who are quite young) but have suffered heart attacks and have heart conditions(my dad has some crazy cholesterol problem too). For that matter, I can't think of any one of my mom or dad's brothers and sisters that don't have heart problems.
I'm sure I have a heart condition too, but I'm too stubborn to have a doctor give me his opinion on it.
I think it's a safe bet to say that if you didn't gain those lbs in the first place, your chances of developing the "hereditary" heart condition would of been very low, even non-existant perhaps.
Quote:
It may be recessive in you, or perhaps you're just a bit slower to gain weight. I can tell you that you won't like what a good sports injury can do with your delicate equilibrium.
I'm slower gaining weight because of the activity I do, well did. Right now, I'm not doing a lot and believe me, the lbs are being put on fast. I do agree, it would be quite a lot different if I had a sports injury which would hinder my ability to lose the pounds as easily. If such a thing occured, I'd IMMEDIATELY be finding alternatives to getting my exercise.
I think my main point is, in the end it is ALWAYS the responsibility of the person. Excuses don't help nor are necessary to achieving the goal. Regardless of family history, injuries, mental status...in the end that person can still take the pounds off and keep them off. And if they don't, there is no one to blame but themselves.
There shouldn't be one obese person in this world that couldn't, in a healthy manner, become a proper weight with the right attitude, diet and exercise.
edit: one thing I'm not clear on and it could change this arguement is, did you gain the weight after the heart condition or before?
Hippiechick:
Quote:
Genetics does play a small part . Children of obese parents are 10 times more likely to become odese
I think buddy below your post explained it well.
Edited by entityexperiment (01/28/07 07:45 PM)
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Spooge
The Nutter
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506076 - 01/28/07 07:42 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
It often will be a combination of both. But, like you say: nature or nurture - the bottom line is that they're ten times more likely.
I don't believe it is a combination.
If we establish this IS true(that it is in fact bad habits learned) and in my opinion there is no doubt in my mind about it, then we now know, with the help of parents or whoever, they have developed this weight problem. They weren't born fat. Taking it off is going to be twice or even triple the work, especially being raised like that, but it's still completely possible.
Like I said, I don't believe there isn't one person who can't take the weight off they actually got motivated enough.
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506165 - 01/28/07 08:08 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
I have a very serious heart condition, it doesn't stop me from running, biking , having sex, or doing anything else that raises my heart rate.
Ah but you know that every heart condition is different. I've got malformations in my coronary arteries and a tendency for cardiac oxygen starvation and (dangerous) coronary vasospasm.
I don't doubt you have a serious condition, I do to, but is a vasospasm VERY? similar or the exact same thing as a serious heart murmur?? ... I just wonder if you are trying to make is sound more dramatic, cause a heart murmur doesn't sound all that dramatic. (and thats one reason why I ignored and and remained ignorant as to the seriousness of my condition for YEARS) Not trying to be a dick, or say that you are being a baby 
Quote:
If they'll take my I'll do most of the training under medical supervision in a physiotherapy center. (bless my good insurance!)
Bless the Dutch government in general! (although haven't allot of immigrant hatting backwards right wingers come to power recently... it was looking scary for coffee shops there for awhile ... I COULD be over blowing that though... I'm really not an expert on the dutch, even though I love so much of what I hear My GF's family always yells out something that means "eat hearty" before each meal... I cant seem to write it in dutch though )
Quote:
My condition is thus that at any moment I could drop dead by heart attack, which is quite something to learn to live with. How you deal with those things is very individual.
I agree. Its an individual choice, I live in the moment and try not to think about it, I have finally gotten over the idea I may need to have a vavle replaced and I am going to start seeing a cardiologist again, I wish I reached this conclusion sooner 
Quote:
I assume you have a heart rhythm disturbance of sorts? Are you on pharms or operated on?
Neither. In fact I treated it as just a minor problem. Which I think was the combination of a bad doctor. And youthful ignorance. Only in the last year or so have I realized the scope of my problem. I was talking to someone online that had a major operation because of his heart murmur and he explained to me that it is not some minor detail. Then I spoke to my mother "I never ONCE told you it was no big deal, you assumed that, not me" She said.
Not to go too far off topic... But the worst part of this right now....  Is that my family doctor closed his office over a scandal, and now my records are locked in an office I cant get inside. Or even phone. So I am going to go see a care clinic doc and ask him to refer me to a cardiologist.
I really DO have sympathy for you, this year I had what I assume could have been a minor heart attack... while reading about my murmur, of all things geez!!!,so it could have been panic based, but I was dizzy, and I thought I was going to pass out. I had to fight to stay "awake"(alive??) and conscious, I started to sweat horribly and I went numb, then afterwards I looked like a ghost and my lips were blue!!! 
I get terrible pains in my chest and sometimes and I wonder... shit, is this it? I have had so many attacks I never know whats happening ......
Anyway, I will cut you some slack, for sure. But not most of the overweight population.
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Hyper_Panda_GO
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To be quite honest, I find certain fat people attractive
Just throwing that out there
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Spooge
The Nutter
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Reading posts like that really make me re-evaluate my ignorance towards my heart.
Everything you described has happened to me countless times. It's all happened in the last 4 years(i think my unhealthy lifestyle contributed greatly to this).
I'm still trying to ignore it.
What kind of tests do need to be done out of curiousity, to examine every possibility of problems with my heart?
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Chazzersize
Pokemon Master


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6506199 - 01/28/07 08:19 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Wiccan Seeker,
Describe your own diet on any given day....and dont just tell us what we want/dont want to hear.
-------------------- Take off my mask and leave the lies to the liars.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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LOL you are very permissive 
You can't be sure if it's a heart attack unless you were tested for Troponins in the blood, a conclusive test. I have had one heart attack that was confirmed, and I believe two more, earlier.
I've been on the border of life and death in the intensive care unit. Heartrate kept dropping below 50, nurses kept storming in. It was a mess. They kept me for over a week on the ICU and then 2 or so weeks on the regular heart ward. Yup, that was a real heart attack.
Coronary vasospasm, in my case means my coronary artery can cramp shut, which can well mean an instant heart attack, one that can be deadly. This probably gave me my last attack.
Quote:
I am going to start seeing a cardiologist again, I wish I reached this conclusion sooner
Dammit you need to have it all checked out and determined. It can be a matter of a pill, a lot of pills, a surgery or who knows, but the full extent of your heart condition should be determined. All that fuss they make in hospitals is there for you too 
Quote:
I get terrible pains in my chest and sometimes and I wonder... shit, is this it? I have had so many attacks I never know whats happening ......
I'm not going to play doctor, but it is obvious you should have it checked out. It can be innocent or it can be really dangerous. Strong chest pain with the feeling of passing out is never good. Make that appointment this week so they can hopefully stabilize whatever you have.
Quote:
I was dizzy, and I thought I was going to pass out. I had to fight to stay "awake"(alive??) and conscious, I started to sweat horribly and I went numb, then afterwards I looked like a ghost and my lips were blue!!!
Sweet Jesus man, 911 should have been called! With heart problems there often is a danger of a heavier crisis following shortly after a lighter one. If you smoke pot STOP IT until you're checked out.
Quote:
Anyway, I will cut you some slack, for sure. But not most of the overweight population.
I feel privileged
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Leanin
Student of theIron Game

Registered: 04/18/06
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dont be lazy and eat clean foods. its not that hard people.
dont blame it on fast food joints either.
I have a pretty chisled body and it ticks me off when people say how lucky i am and that its genetic. sure some of it is but its HARD WORK. stop blaming others and do something about your problem.
Edited by Leanin (01/28/07 08:36 PM)
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Spooge]
#6506258 - 01/28/07 08:42 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Well bro...
The first time it happened I was just starting grade 8... and I felt a pain in my chest, that felt almost like something was clogging, and then slowly moving through my veins. and its one of the most painful things I have ever experienced. (it was as if I could feel its path  Luckily for me that was not the case(not that I was about to get GOOD news)
After this happened quite a few more times, I went to the doctor... It was quite simple, most docs can tell after a quick listen with the stethoscope... then most likely they will send you for an X-ray, and an ultrasound.
I had an ultrasound on my chest.... doctor told me... "ok now look at this picture, your murmur should be coming up very soon.........THERE IT IS SEE THAT"
And what I saw on the screen, was one of my heart valves twisting inside out, and then shaking madly 
So now, I have a picture to go with my pain. A picture I will never forget... but dont let that scare you, there is no reason to be ignorant about the health of your heart. Do you smoke(cigs???) At least a "healthy"(more or less) alcoholic can poison his liver for well over 30 years at a time. If you have heart problems, you have to be careful.
I have stopped caring what other people think of me(GF's family etc) I work hard to avoid stress, and I now WALK AWAY from fights with my GF, and others, and I try to laugh as much as possible. Read the book Mind Matters, laughing IS medicine.
And this last year, I took more then 4 months off work, I have the money,and I earned it, LEGALLY, so FUCK anyone that doesn't understand But I also exercised allot during that time. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Anyway, I hope you take what I have said to heart (my puns are LAME) But seriously I have ONE QUESTION for you.
Do you want to live another 3 years?? or another 50-60 years?? GO SEE YOUR DOCTOR. I should have taken my problem seriously allot sooner.
Good Luck
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Quote:
Wiccan Seeker, Describe your own diet on any given day....and dont just tell us what we want/dont want to hear.
Are you looking for confirmation that I'm hanging in front of the TV with a big bottle of cola and a bucket of KFC?
Oook, bear in mind I'm 6'4" and BIG:
8 slices of whole wheat bread as 4 sandwiches throughout the day with with normal stuff in normal proportions between.
2-4 pieces of fruit
a plate of salad (salad being just veggies, no sauce or other rich stuff)
5oz potatoes/0.5lb veggies/4oz of meat or 5oz fish
1 pint of yoghurt (yoghurt as in the plain unprocessed cow stuff, no sugar or fat)
1-2oz nuts/seeds
1 glass of absinthe or a can of beer
3/4 gallon water
vitamins/minerals
Now, if only you ate as healthy.
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Hyper_Panda_GO
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506298 - 01/28/07 08:56 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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How big are you?
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Asante
Mage


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Posts: 86,793
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6'4" 
If you mean the other big, 319 lbs Sumo size.
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Hyper_Panda_GO
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506315 - 01/28/07 09:01 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Woah, are you Latin?
I think I know you
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Asante
Mage


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That would be interesting, your name is somewhat familiar too.
But no, I'm Dutch. If I still fit the description drop me a PM with a more precise question. I'd laugh my ass off if you're who you might be.
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Edited by Asante (01/28/07 09:10 PM)
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Chazzersize
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506347 - 01/28/07 09:11 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
Wiccan Seeker, Describe your own diet on any given day....and dont just tell us what we want/dont want to hear.
Are you looking for confirmation that I'm hanging in front of the TV with a big bottle of cola and a bucket of KFC?
Oook, bear in mind I'm 6'4" and BIG:
8 slices of whole wheat bread as 4 sandwiches throughout the day with with normal stuff in normal proportions between.
2-4 pieces of fruit
a plate of salad (salad being just veggies, no sauce or other rich stuff)
5oz potatoes/0.5lb veggies/4oz of meat or 5oz fish
1 pint of yoghurt (yoghurt as in the plain unprocessed cow stuff, no sugar or fat)
1-2oz nuts/seeds
1 glass of absinthe or a can of beer
3/4 gallon water
vitamins/minerals
Now, if only you ate as healthy.
You'd be suprised 
Priding yourself on eating right doesnt account for shit if your body doesnt reflect such.
IF ONLY I ATE AS HEALTHY. God, what a joke.
-------------------- Take off my mask and leave the lies to the liars.
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wazza
.22 silenced

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 266
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to make your salad a little more enjoyable,throw in a dash of balsamic vinegar,olive oil and lime juice
sugar is the enemy of all
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
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Quote:
Priding yourself on eating right doesnt account for shit if your body doesnt reflect such.
IF ONLY I ATE AS HEALTHY. God, what a joke.
So, you ask me something, and when I answer you respond with disrespect. WTF?
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Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!

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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506402 - 01/28/07 09:29 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Hmm, maybe not...
Do you live in the bay area in Northern CA?
Or CA in general?
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Dutch as in Holland, the Netherlands 
It would be scary if we did know eachother
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Hyper_Panda_GO
Team Action!

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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506433 - 01/28/07 09:37 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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Heh, it would be, but alas we don't
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eligal
Noobie


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6506475 - 01/28/07 09:49 PM (17 years, 3 days ago) |
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-------------------- \m/ Spanksta \m/ "do you have the freedom to do with your nervous system what you want?" "MolokoMilkPlus said: I'll respect you if you let me give you a blow job" "tactik said: respect the can."
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6507978 - 01/29/07 10:07 AM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
Wiccan Seeker, Describe your own diet on any given day....and dont just tell us what we want/dont want to hear.
Are you looking for confirmation that I'm hanging in front of the TV with a big bottle of cola and a bucket of KFC?
Oook, bear in mind I'm 6'4" and BIG:
8 slices of whole wheat bread as 4 sandwiches throughout the day with with normal stuff in normal proportions between.
2-4 pieces of fruit
a plate of salad (salad being just veggies, no sauce or other rich stuff)
5oz potatoes/0.5lb veggies/4oz of meat or 5oz fish
1 pint of yoghurt (yoghurt as in the plain unprocessed cow stuff, no sugar or fat)
1-2oz nuts/seeds
1 glass of absinthe or a can of beer
3/4 gallon water
vitamins/minerals
Now, if only you ate as healthy.
Cut the bread and potatoes. The moment I stopped eating sandwiches, and potatoes, is the same moment that I dropped a couple of pounds. 4 sandwiches seems like a lot, to me.
My buddy, whom is overweight, eats about three sandwiches a day. When I lived with him, I would be eating oats and flax, he would be eating roast beef with mayo and mustard.
Wiccan_Seeker, sorry for being so hard on you yesterday. I realize that there are a variety of factors that determine a persons body weight. Diet just seems to be the easiest to pick on, because we have the most control over it. Anywho, plain yoghurt tastes like dooky the first couple of days eating it, but with some fresh blueberries...omg.
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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Also, beer is most likely 100 or so empty calories.
Not that I don't enjoy six myself, but it's alwasy easier to point things out when its not about you
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6508002 - 01/29/07 10:22 AM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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You eat far healthier than I do.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Redstorm]
#6508091 - 01/29/07 11:04 AM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
AroundtheSon said: . Wiccan_Seeker, sorry for being so hard on you yesterday.
Hey all is well, I'm glad you get back on it though, not everyone does that.
Quote:
You eat far healthier than I do.
Thanks! The best way to wake up to healthy eating is to have a heart attack 
If you look at that list - that food obviously didn't get me over the 300lbs mark. I think that if I can get more exercise (under medical supervision) that I might start losing weight without significant diet alterations. Weighing 320 with taxed knees, a bad back and a serious heart condition isn't exactly inviting to get moving though, the physiotherapy center has medical personnel and materials on hand to deal with cardiovascular crises, so that would boost my confidence somewhat.
I did eat thrash food to get this heavy, but in the years that I put most on I was under tremendous stress and something just had to give, either my weight, a drug problem or my sanity probably.
Eliminating most thrash foods and keeping them away is a personal triumph over my nurture, but I've got a long road of constant weight effort ahead of me that realistically only ends when I do.
It is just very discouraging to on top of it all have to deal with social rejection by random people, often at first sight, which happens all the time when you are really obese. My personal favorites are complete strangers who out of the blue give you a testimonial of their loathing, and the occasional driver who uses his car for the joy of seeing you run. It's the same kind of shit black people get and a compelling reason to not carry a gun.
The worst thing about being obese is the attitude of people who are not, which is a solid wall of rejection, and especially in the former thread that attitude got me riled up.
Lack of empathy and compassion (in the broadest sense) is the biggest problem humanity faces, and it is gaining more and more ground here on the Shroomery too
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Chazzersize
Pokemon Master


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6508134 - 01/29/07 11:21 AM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Though I do not know the feeling of being overweight....I wish you the best of luck with your weight.
I would love to point you to some online journals of folks I knew that went from 300-350 and managed to slim down pretty well.
I guess I got an attitude because I believed you were one of the obese folks that demanded sympathy when the problem lies within themselves and their eating habits.
Keep us updated
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Quote:
I would love to point you to some online journals of folks I knew that went from 300-350 and managed to slim down pretty well.
There are people who went from 300-350 kilos to an acceptable weight, but the bitch is the 3 year mark - even for them 90% sees all efforts undone because they can't keep up all their plans and intentions.
It can be done, but beyond an individually determined obesity mark, it's a lifelong struggle which tends to get harder as age progresses.
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HippieChick
Chicks can do it too!


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6508431 - 01/29/07 01:01 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Fuck more WS .
That's how I keep the weight off Hubby;) and stay at 100 pounds myself .
Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony Hippie Chick
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Chazzersize
Pokemon Master


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Asante]
#6508569 - 01/29/07 01:57 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Well, atleast you tried.
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Cepheus
Balance



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MOD EDIT: no trolling please.
Edited by Wiccan_Seeker (01/29/07 06:00 PM)
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Nalim
OTD Kelly Girl


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Cepheus]
#6508660 - 01/29/07 02:49 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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you're going to get into a lot of shit over that...
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    Rodney Brooks on Robots Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."
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Jadian
Ninja


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Nalim]
#6508821 - 01/29/07 03:58 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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Well at least someone has our future energy concerns in mind
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HeadTripVertigo
at least I'm housebroken



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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Jadian]
#6508978 - 01/29/07 04:48 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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we need to close this thread, since everyone is just rehashing everything that's been said already. fat people can get in shape. most are just lazy as our culture has gone from having the favorite pasttimes of playing sports outside and the like to sitting around watching tv all day and eating fast food, in less than 100 years. it's still the individual's fault, bottom line.
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Psilocybeingzz


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Re: On-Topic Fat Thread [Re: Cepheus]
#6509100 - 01/29/07 05:17 PM (17 years, 2 days ago) |
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That fucking retarded and not funny. I would have assumed that with you being from Britain and all you might have sense of history, and you might not say something so fucking stupid. I suppose I was wrong. 
EDIT: I've been banned for things that were not even CLOSE to that bad, if you dont get a warning at least, I call bullshit on some of our mods. What a fucking joke, I cant call a guy an idiot, but you can say that
Edited by Psilocybeingzz (01/29/07 05:24 PM)
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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You need to calm down there buddy.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Spooge
The Nutter
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Quote:
Psilocybeingzz said: That fucking retarded and not funny. I would have assumed that with you being from Britain and all you might have sense of history, and you might not say something so fucking stupid. I suppose I was wrong. 
EDIT: I've been banned for things that were not even CLOSE to that bad, if you dont get a warning at least, I call bullshit on some of our mods. What a fucking joke, I cant call a guy an idiot, but you can say that
Yeah I agree. I shook my head at that one....no room for shit like that in this thread. Disrespectful....people need to realize the huge differences between the pub and otd.
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
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I am calm. I just think thats bullshit. (he better get at a warning at least) Hey did you see my post about editing the shroomery yet?? Check it out,
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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I think the people can police themselves just fine.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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I think you have difficulties with reality.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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Psilocybeingzz


Registered: 12/15/02
Posts: 14,463
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A fucking *)&)*( ^%& little %$#^& like you would say that, wouldn't he. Who edited my post??
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


Registered: 03/12/02
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You did.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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AroundtheSon
Learning to See


Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 4,427
Loc: Midwest.
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So quick to anger.
Well, 2 or 3 people immediately said that the comment was wrong.
No similar comments were made. Sorry, I just don't like censorship.
The people enforced the law of hate speech morality. No foul.
I rest my case, your honor
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Psilocybeingzz


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Neither do I. But I gave up(here, in the pub) , I have been censored far too many times.
And FG, I KNOW, it was a lame joke, DUH.
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Asante
Mage


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 86,793
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Nope, it's trolling and he's right about that.
I don't think he actually believes there should be another holocaust, so it's merely trolling to get a rise out of people.
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger


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Quote:
Psilocybeingzz said: And FG, I KNOW, it was a lame joke, DUH.
I'd say.
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If I should die this very moment I wouldn't fear For I've never known completeness Like being here Wrapped in the warmth of you Loving every breath of you
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