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Nickster_154371
entheogen enthusiast
Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 469
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags
#6480019 - 01/20/07 02:16 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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This is a 2 part question. First, my friend is considering not using jars anymore and instead using the the spawn bag tek http://www.shroomery.org/8398/Preparing-spawn-bags . Must a pressure cooker be used, or can the typical boiling for 90 minutes work? I don't see why one can't pack the substrate into the bag, impulse seal it tight, then boil for 90 min. as one typically would for jars. Also, could the bag be injected with spores instead of liquid culture?
I can see this method as a great time saver as my friend right now currently is using his jars to spawn to larger containers which are then used as spawn for larger rubbermaid grows. Not having to spawn to the larger containers would be great.
Next question, my friend needs some tips on putting together a bulk substrate for his current grow... He will be using the oven-bag sterilization method and is thinking of a combination of straw or wheat combined with horse or cow poo. The staw or wheat will be easy to get, however could the typical bag of cow poo from walmart or a supplies store work well?
Thanks for the tips.
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Sillicybin
Registered: 02/14/05
Posts: 2,134
Loc:
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Re: Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags [Re: Nickster_154371]
#6480152 - 01/20/07 03:31 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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If you boil sealed bags, two things will happen.
1) They won't get sterilized. It takes 2-3 hours in a PC to sterilize a loaded spawn bag. There's just too much substrate for the heat to penetrate that large of a medium.
2) They'll expand and burst. The water in the substrate, when it converts to steam, will expand and eventually bust the bag.
Injecting spawn bags with multispore is hit and miss. Some people have eeked by, but it's much better to use LC. Otherwise, you're setting your project back 2-3 days while the spores germinate, increasing the risk that any stray contam that might have made its way in can take hold first.
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Blutjager
Inhuman
Registered: 06/11/06
Posts: 9,220
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Re: Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags [Re: Sillicybin]
#6480263 - 01/20/07 04:25 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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Even if the bag didn't bust weather you were to boil in bags or jars it still wouldn't be get hot enough by boiling to sterilize grain
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Nickster_154371
entheogen enthusiast
Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 469
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags [Re: Blutjager]
#6482388 - 01/21/07 01:01 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Blutjager said: Even if the bag didn't bust weather you were to boil in bags or jars it still wouldn't be get hot enough by boiling to sterilize grain
Are you saying grains must be used if planning on using spawn bags? How about the typical BRF/Verm mix? Looks like my buddy has got to look for a pressure cooker now!
Cheers
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Sillicybin
Registered: 02/14/05
Posts: 2,134
Loc:
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Re: Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags [Re: Nickster_154371]
#6482444 - 01/21/07 01:20 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Nickster_154371 said: Are you saying grains must be used if planning on using spawn bags? How about the typical BRF/Verm mix? Looks like my buddy has got to look for a pressure cooker now!
The problem is the substrate depth.
Even with BRF, there's so much depth that the middle will still be MUCH cooler than the outsides. It's possible that it could be done, but it would take HOURS. You'd want to put a spike thermometer in the center of the bag to see how long it took you to get the center as close to 212*F as you could (which would take quite some time), and then you'd have to keep it there...
The reason the PF tek uses 1/2 pint jars is because the substrate is shallow in all directions. This makes it easier to heat up the center enough to kill contams. Even with that little amount of sub, it still takes 90 minutes.
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Nickster_154371
entheogen enthusiast
Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 469
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: Help with bulk substrates and spawn bags [Re: Sillicybin]
#6482808 - 01/21/07 02:58 PM (17 years, 2 months ago) |
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Can typical cow/horse manure found at walmart or a general store work with the oven-bag pasteurization tek, http://www.shroomery.org/8393/Oven-Bag-Pasteurization-Pictorial, when mixed with chopped up straw?
Finding fresh poo is not an option right now. What kind of poo should my friend be looking for?
-N
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