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Nothing you have stated (as your opinion no less) has had any shred of truth to it, it is merely your unfounded opinion, or the regurgitation of other peoples opinions.

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jesus...... how can I show proof against something which has absolutely no truth to it?

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Many people in L. Rons family were quite pissed off to find out that all of their inheretance had gone to Scientology and not them.... so understandably they could be pissed.

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Also.... Scientology doesn't claim to be a science...

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see this is what I am talking about, you make claims, which you think are solid fact, and then expect me to disprove them? how can i do that when you only offer opinions or other peoples opinions, which I personally know to be delusions born from ignorance of the subject?

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Do you realize that you have yet to actually bring up anything about the churchs beliefs or framework? Do you realize that your entire argument has been to attack L. Ron Hubbard. It is like saying Pope Benedict was a member of the nazi party, so all of catholocism is pure bullshit.

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Maybe if you offered something more than ad hominems and strawmen arguments, I could offer proof, but until then I am stuck showing hopw ignorant you are regarding this matter.

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So no proof then? 
Not even ONE STORY of someone Scientology has helped from an independent source?
Ad hominies and straw men huh? Thats your argument? Do you know the meaning of the words you are using?I gave you a few links, and plenty of evidence, not to mention an opinion or 2 from what I have SEEN, not just heard. And thats what you say in return.

Well, I don't want to get ahead of myself here. But SET POINT MATCH.
YOU LOSE.
Unless you have something to offer? Some proof? Anything???

And BTW, a CHILD can often see through Scientology's techniques, and fraudulent therapy. So try and grow up a little huh?  Your last post was the weakest of all. I am no expert on debate, but I would say your losing bro

ok Napoleon, I didn't know that was the kind of "proof" you wanted.

First off, regarding the name Scientology, as I have stated in this thread, and many other, translates in to the "Study of Knowledge" or sometimes considered "learning how to Learn".....

If you want success stories, then search for them online. Here.... really quick..

http://www.seekers-of-truth.com/success_stories.htm

in fact, there a probably a million success stories online..... but I dont really consider that "proof" just as I dont consider someones account of being scammed as "proof" against... it is biased both ways.

And if you want a personal account.... I personally know a bunch of people whos lives are better because of Scientology.

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Yes it does. It claims to help people, using their techniques. And tell me, why the name Scientology?

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So play on if you want to.... I will sit by while you scramble to educate yourself in a cliff note fashion so you can respond to my aforementioned question regarding their beliefs, practices and "techniques".

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I haven't read your whole post yet, but you often attack me personally, and my methods, maybe because you realize you have lost. I will admit it, I went right to the bottom of your post, I wouldn't doubt everything above it is just as "educational." 

If I were to take a vote, you would lose, I don't feel like rubbing it in, and I really don't want to discuss some stupid cult and the people that blindly accept them, maybe tomorrow. When I feel like it. I have to "ruin" my mind with some Cannabis and have dinner.  Then maybe a movie, or I might install a video game, both of which will be more interesting then talking to you. 

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Lightningfractal said:
Scientologists can choke on their own vomit.

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Yes, it is possible for them to choke on their own vomit..... much like Jimi Hendrix.

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Sinbad said:
You seem very defensive about Scientology. Are you Tom Cruise? Or have you simply been brainwashed through a Scientology schooling program?

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Viveka said:
Would you mind explaining what, in the Scientologists view, constitutes the 'soul', or the essence of self? Scientology makes it very clear that they are a religion and that they provide methods to empower the individual who chooses Scientology. They also make it clear that they are not fatalists, they don't believe the human animal is the true individual, but that you and I are somehow everlasting. Shit, don't take my word for it, read the following which I took straight out of the final sequence of the Scientology Orientation Video:

"In this brief moment, we have our temporary chance for handling and continuing life. Clouds loom over this culture and planet. In this short interval, in this one place, we have our freedom before us. We can arise above the decay; the final flash that will inevitably extinguish this planet. It is not our mission to save it. It is our mission to free you. You are an immortal being. Your life will not halt because this planet halts. You can go on."


So...where do we "go on"? In what form? What constitutes my "immortal being"?

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Viveka said:
By "particular characterization" of the soul are you refering to body thetans? What of the whole thetan thing anyway? Is that just part of the science fiction element of Scientology that should be ignored entirely by those looking to understand the practical worth of the religion and its practices or is the body thetan thing an integral part of the whole auditing process? My understanding is that it was and if it is, don't you think it shines a pretty unfavorable light on the whole affair?

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Another red flag about the paragraph I quoted above is that it seems designed to address and allay prospective members fears of the unknown, or to provide an escape from the concept of their own annihilation. Not only is that dishonest but it perpetuates an even bigger problem, ego identificatiion. It's telling people YOU are this concrete identity and what you understand to be YOU from a human perspective is this important everlasting thing, so much so that you will continue to thrive when the planet is scorched, so long as you join Scientology. It's no different than the priest who says, accept Jesus and you'll ride his coattails to everlasting paradise, or the fatwah that declares, kill this infidel and you'll enjoy 69 virgins to the end of time. The essential similarity is that neither the priest, the cleric, nor L. Ron Hubbard have any idea what happens to the individual upon death. So why not drop the whole "spiritual" element and just present Scientology as something to improve human experience? The answer(s) to that question is what puts the whole affair in question.

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