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 pscyanescens
The Raindancer
 
Registered: 12/14/06
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Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
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 You cant eat cold water hash 
#6412711 - 12/31/06 03:51 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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OK this is opening up an old argument about the necessity of heat associated with the ability to consume marijuana or marijuana product in this matter. I believe heat is necessary from the research i have done and the questions i have asked.
StickWater has posted he ate 10grams of raw buds(cured & dried) and he says he felt nothing. He and i both agree this is due to the absence of heat. He gives a good explanation about how heat helps free the molecules in order to make them more readily available to make bonds and become available to our bodies. I will post if anyone cares.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/6398382/page/0/fpart/all/vc/1
This is the link to the thread that started it all
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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 elsig
Knowledgespeaks, wisdom listens
Registered: 09/14/06
Posts: 533
Loc: the beach
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 Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6412823 - 12/31/06 06:49 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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yes you need heat. not much but some is needet, a cold milk extraction of cannabis works poorly and a warm milk extraction works wonder. heat removes soemthing from the thc molecule which makes it orally active.
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omnicrap
Stranger
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: elsig]
#6413026 - 12/31/06 09:55 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Heat will isomerize other cannabinoids and make it much easier for THC to be dissolved in whatever fat or oil you're cooking it with. If it's not dissolved in some kind of oil you won't really absorb it orally, this is why Marinol (the synthetic thc prescription pills) has the THC dissolved in sesame oil inside a gelcap.
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A tight tie-dyed dress, she was a psychedelic mess
We toured to the north, south, east and west
We sold some mushroom tea, we sold some ecstasy
We sold nitrous, opium, acid, heroin and PCP
Now I hear the police coming after me
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: omnicrap]
#6414380 - 12/31/06 07:07 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Elsig: i have heard of cold water extraction, but cold milk and warm milk??? How is this done?
What about absorbing and crushing the hash into some sort of alcohol? I heard that would make the cannabinoids available by separating them from the plant matter. Then heat would not matter? Or will it still make more of the THC available.
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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Nalim
OTD Kelly Girl
Registered: 01/13/06
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: omnicrap]
#6414501 - 12/31/06 08:12 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Isomerization; making an ISOMER of a chemical; THC, CBD and CNB are NOT isomers!(they do not contain the same ratios of C:H:O)
I'm going mad from reading about Isomerization trough cooking! 
I'm not saying there cant be an increase in strength from cooking. I'm just saying if there is such a strength-increase it sure as hell ain't from isomerization! 
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Rodney Brooks on Robots 
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."
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yageman
already dead
Registered: 01/26/06
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: Nalim]
#6414527 - 12/31/06 08:26 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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I dont know the science behind cooking weed that is meant to be taken orally.
All I know is that cooking doesnt somehow make the thc orally active. Thats just too simple.
Thc *is orally active. Mj is orally active.
You *can eat weed and get very high.
My guess is that it just absorbs differently when its been cooked into butter or some oils.
I just wanted to mention that because some noobs might get the wrong impression that weed doesnt work if you just eat it.
I do understand why its better to cook it into a food dish or just some buttery concoction. It doesnt activate the thc. It only makes it readily availible for the stomach to absorb in a more efficiant way.
1.75 grams of weed gets me pretty damn stoned, for a long time. No prep, just chewing and swallowing the delicious goodness.
You are a fuggin vegitable if you eat 10 grams of good dried bud and dont feel anything. That really doesnt make much sense.
Im sure some people feel it more strongly than others, but to not feel it????......lol
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[quote]Me_Roy said:
You moron. Material is material is material. No 'thing' fixes any situation. If anything were so simple we would be living in a much better world.[/quote] <-----the dumbest thing I have ever read in my life.
Thanks shroomery.
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elsig
Knowledgespeaks, wisdom listens
Registered: 09/14/06
Posts: 533
Loc: the beach
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: yageman]
#6414549 - 12/31/06 08:43 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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well i dont know. i have tried eating resin powder from buds pure and did not get much effects but a much smaller amount of same resin powder heated together with butter ,mixed with hot chocolate and drinked knocked me on my ass for well 6 hours. im not saying your wrong but pure unprepared cannabis havent seem to give me any effects.
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: elsig]
#6414676 - 12/31/06 10:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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I ate 2 grams of raw marijuana and i felt absolutely nothing.
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6414683 - 12/31/06 10:38 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
Stickywater:
"As far as I understand the issue is that solid THC crystals can't be absorbed straight into the blood stream. I guess our body just can't metabolize it and passes it straight through. Keep in mind that in biology the slightest change in the atomic structure of a molecule can completely change its path through our bodies. Going on hypothesis alone I'd assume that like certain molecules (I believe cellulose? I could be wrong on that) simply aren't metabolized and just irritate our bowels so we poo. Although when you heat the THC it goes back into a gaseous state making it easier to absorb (molecules moving more freely and at a faster rate making them able to go through chemical bonds/reactions faster and easier,in the instance of smoking, where the THC vapor is inhaled and absorbed through the lungs). Assuming the statement about THC simply irritating the bowels or just not being metabolized in its natural solid state is true then that would mean that it would have to be taken out of this solid state and the chemical would have to be altered in some way. As smoking suggests, heating the molecules to accelerate them and make them more ready to perform bonds and reactions is one way. Another way would be to join them to another molecule that would allow them to be carried into the bloodstream rather than simply passed through the intestine and out the pooper. Of course this brings us to binding the THC with fat. As we all should hopefully know, heat speeds up chemical reactions and makes molecules more readily activated (I'm assuming that's not always the case but generally speaking of course) so therefore the heat would be required as a catalyst to seperate the THC molecules so they could bond to the fat.
Purely a hypothesis, but it does provide an explanation. "
Yageman: So you dont agree with any of this? Can you tell me why you think it doesn't make any sense?
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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StickyWater
Stranger
Registered: 06/09/05
Posts: 1,680
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6414739 - 12/31/06 11:33 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Edited by StickyWater (05/03/08 01:30 AM)
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minesstudent
Who knows?
Registered: 12/12/05
Posts: 400
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash *DELETED* [Re: StickyWater]
#6414844 - 01/01/07 12:31 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Post deleted by minesstudentReason for deletion: Guess i was wrong
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"The universe is the way it is because if it wasn't we wouldn't be here to talk about it"
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StickyWater
Stranger
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Posts: 1,680
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: minesstudent]
#6414872 - 01/01/07 12:51 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Edited by StickyWater (05/03/08 01:29 AM)
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yageman
already dead
Registered: 01/26/06
Posts: 4,965
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: minesstudent]
#6414874 - 01/01/07 12:53 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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I was only saying that it makes (no sense), "to me" when people who eat 10 grams of dried bud dont feel a thing.
I agree with you to some extent............ im sure, without ever reading your post. I am well aware that cooked weed foods are better than the plant its self.
If you eat weed it gets you high........... Thats all I was saying.
I was leveling with yall and also stating the obvious.
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[quote]Me_Roy said:
You moron. Material is material is material. No 'thing' fixes any situation. If anything were so simple we would be living in a much better world.[/quote] <-----the dumbest thing I have ever read in my life.
Thanks shroomery.
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StickyWater
Stranger
Registered: 06/09/05
Posts: 1,680
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: yageman]
#6414886 - 01/01/07 01:07 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Edited by StickyWater (05/03/08 01:29 AM)
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: StickyWater]
#6414906 - 01/01/07 01:41 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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My friend also said he felt something after eating a few grams. I don't know if this is placebo(probably) but he claims that the chewing process raptures the cells and releases the chemical to become available to our system. So proper chewing is necessary for maximum consumption of readily available THC. I'm not saying heat wont improve the effect but could this could increase the availability of what we desire right?
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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FreedomFighter
Stranger
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6414912 - 01/01/07 01:46 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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i've eaten weed plenty of times and every time i've gotten high
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StickyWater
Stranger
Registered: 06/09/05
Posts: 1,680
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6414928 - 01/01/07 02:06 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Edited by StickyWater (05/03/08 01:28 AM)
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cybrbeast
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: StickyWater]
#6415432 - 01/01/07 12:21 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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StickyWater is right. It's all about absorbing the THC into your blood. It's easy via your lungs cause it's in a gas or smoke form and your lungs are good at absorbing stuff they inhale.
You gut works completely different and the most efficient way of getting THC in your bloodstream through the gut is to dissolve it into something. It barely dissolves in water so alcohol or fat/oil is used. Applying heat works to speed up chemical processes, so the THC particles will more easily and quickly dissolve into the medium.
Sure some THC will enter the bloodstream if you chew in it, but it's not an efficient way.
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 futuretribe.space 
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Nalim
OTD Kelly Girl
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: minesstudent]
#6415527 - 01/01/07 01:20 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Quote:
minesstudent said:
You need heat to convert some of the chemicals in the bud into THC. Heat doesn't "activate" the THC, its already active. Using a lighter converts it, as does baking it. If you just eat it, a lot of that chemical (I don't know its name) remains. It doesn't get you high.
You, my friend, are mistaken. There is plenty enough THC to make you stoned out of your ass in any weed or hash thats not complete shit. the problem is with absorbing it(as stated numerous times in this tread).
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Rodney Brooks on Robots
Nalim said: "Quoting yourself is retarded."
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learning_byte
click here
Registered: 10/07/02
Posts: 1,280
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: Nalim]
#6417054 - 01/01/07 11:34 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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I had tripped balls from eating raw weed once, around half ounce i would say.
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Edited by learning_byte (01/01/07 11:43 PM)
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cybrbeast
Up, then down, then...
Registered: 01/06/03
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: learning_byte]
#6417481 - 01/02/07 06:16 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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You would have tripped much harder if you made spacecake -cookies -muffins etc.
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futuretribe.space
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sleepy
zZzZzZzZz
Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
Loc: 
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: cybrbeast]
#6417695 - 01/02/07 10:03 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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the heat doesn't do anything to the THC, it merely frees it from the trichome. you do not need heat!
heat is just ONE WAY OF GETTING IT OUT OF THE TRICHOME. the trichome is a solid ball which houses the THC. this "ball" is broken when marijuana is burned, heated, or smashed.
if the ball is not broken, it will pass thru you along with all the thc. the thc needs to get into your blood to have an effect but unless it is smoked, or combined with a fat and eaten, it doesn't work.
want an easy, cheap, and stealthy way to use cannabis?
buy a mortar and pestle, put your bud in the bottom and put in some olive oil, butter, whole milk, cream, or any fat, and then grind up the bud.
grinding breaks open the trichomes, but the OIL HAS TO BE THERE to "catch" the THC,
because if the newly released THC touches the air, it will become inactive.
this mixture will turn a dark color, and as long as all the bud is covered in oil, you cannot mix too much, so grind it real good.
this method is actually more efficient than smoking or baking because no heat is used which can cause some thc to go into the air.
anyway, now you have a mixture of THC and oil which you can eat. mix it with some dry oats, honey, and flour and make ganja goo balls. peanut butter would mask the taste well.
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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 Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: sleepy]
#6423718 - 01/04/07 01:43 AM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Is there a reason for the conflicting experience reports. One person eats 10grams and says he feel nothing. Another says he eats 14 and trips balls......... There should be some logical explanation. There must be something that is causing the THC to be absorbed in some and not others. What could this be? Tolerance?
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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sleepy
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Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 3,888
Loc:
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6426219 - 01/04/07 09:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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well, in my experience, which is none first hand (ive never tried to activate THC except by heating)
i know that if you use oil you need to either break the trichomes first mechanically (mortar + pestle or something similar) or with heat, which i guess is also mechanically. if the dude ate oil and then weed and then ran around, maybe that running was enough to break the trichomes and release the thc.
maybe it would only work with 10 percent of the people who try it, so it's a better bet to smush it or heat it if you are lazy, then eat it. 14 grams is ALOT to eat. if you do it correctly, 14 grams is enough to get super duper blazed like 10 times.
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: sleepy]
#6431528 - 01/06/07 03:20 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Heat does make the THC disolve quiker. However with out heat,fat or alcohol, most of the THC will disolve, or absorb so slowly it will pass through our bodies before it can absorb it all. My own hypothesis.
Am i going the wrong way with this?
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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spores
haploid
Registered: 02/18/99
Posts: 2,486
Loc: Washington
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: pscyanescens]
#6431834 - 01/06/07 04:33 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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http://www.cannabis-med.org/english/faq/12-heating.htm
the ratio of the phenolic form of cannabinoids (active) to cannabinoid acids (inactive) can vary a lot between different strains, plants grown in different areas and different preparations of the plant.
'Cannabis products with a high content of phenolic THC (e.g. hashish) may be very potent without heating, but usually the potency of cannabis products is considerably increased with heating (smoking, cooking).'
Edited by spores (01/06/07 04:45 PM)
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pscyanescens
The Raindancer
Registered: 12/14/06
Posts: 1,397
Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Last seen: 2 years, 2 months
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Re: You cant eat cold water hash [Re: spores]
#6432363 - 01/06/07 07:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago) |
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Spores:
Hashish is usually made with a heated press. Or heat is usually involved in most techniques. To go further the process of making hash reptures the cells and brakes them apart from the plant to be made into a refined resin. I would think that breaking and rapturing thees cells should help our bodies ability to absorb and dissolve thees cannababinoids.
-PS thanks for the link. It might take me some more reading to understand it all though. lol
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"With an abundance of Cyanescens... i would never touch another Cubensis again."
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