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Offlinethink_about_it
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URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems...
    #6386771 - 12/19/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Hello,

It is right before harvest of a small casing and I spy some greenness in the stems of some of the shrooms. Does this mean that they are rotting?! ;-(

What do I do? Only some of them have had their veils break, and only just yesterday.

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Offlinethink_about_it
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386776 - 12/19/06 02:20 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Could it be due to too much humidity? I do not mist, but I do have two casings in a decent sized tub with about an inch or so of perlite at the bottom (no standing water).

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386787 - 12/19/06 02:22 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Ok, I actually picked a couple of them and they seem REALLY damp, if not gooey... When I examine the center of the stems of some of them (by cutting them open down the center) they are greenish and somewhat gooey-like. What to do!?!?

The smell is not that bad, but not totally pure shroom smell.

Edited by think_about_it (12/19/06 02:22 PM)

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Offlinethink_about_it
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386794 - 12/19/06 02:23 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Should I remove the perlite completely from the tub? They seem waterlogged and I have NOT been misting or spraying anything at all.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386859 - 12/19/06 02:40 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Should I just chop off the parts that are mushy and green and keep the rest?

I mean, at what point do you know that there is too much rotting? What if it is only a littttttle green on the inside?

Edited by think_about_it (12/19/06 02:40 PM)

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Offlinethink_about_it
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386910 - 12/19/06 02:52 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I have also heard of some that have had green INSIDE the stems (like this case) and dried them with no problems... Help!

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6386956 - 12/19/06 03:07 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

conversations with yourself????

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Offlinethink_about_it
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: daytripper05]
    #6386970 - 12/19/06 03:09 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah... ;-)

But it got you here, didn't it? ;-)

Seriously though, I just had some subsequent thoughts after my initial post. That's all.

I am done now... Waiting for some thoughts/suggestions to come in now.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387061 - 12/19/06 03:33 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

One more observation to add to the list above:

Some of them are drooping over. I am assuming this means that they are weak and weighed down from having so much moisture in them?

So, what to do? Some of them clearly look like that have some greenness lurking inside of them, others don't. Should I just harvest those ones and get them out of there?

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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387195 - 12/19/06 04:06 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

It sounds like you're seeing totally normal blueing.  Sometimes it can look greenish because mushrooms are tan colored, and yellow+blue makes green.

Does it look like they're stained green, or is the green something growing ON them?  If you're not sure, wipe it with a qtip or paper towel.  If the green rubs off, you've got mold.  If not, you've got perfectly normal fruits. 

I don't know what you mean by gooey or overly damp, those things can be interpreted different ways... but they're mushrooms.  They're over 90% water.  Not sure what you're expecting there... of course they're going to feel damp :wink:

As for all your other moisture questions back and forth I'd say don't worry about it yet.  Sounds like you're being over-paranoid on several different counts here :wink:  If you had a serious problem one way or another, you wouldn't have fruits to deal with.  Something is working ok.

Pictures would help if possible.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: creamcorn]
    #6387211 - 12/19/06 04:10 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Thank you for your response.

Nothing is growing ON them, no. It is a coloration that I can see WITHIN the stems of the mushrooms, like a greenish/blueish color. Keep in mind that I have not been tampering with them AT ALL. They are in a tub that has poly-filled holes in it so it has remained closed the entire time. I do not mess with them.

Well, I harvested a few of them and the insides of some of the stems in question did not look too healthy to me. Gooey, brownish, green... Kind of messy. Have never seen something like this before (I worked with cakes before).

Again, nothing growing on them but their growth does seem to be slowing down and some of them are shrinking a little, welting, if you will.

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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387240 - 12/19/06 04:18 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Well if they seem to be wilting, that's a bad sign.  If you see gooey brown, that's also a possible sign of rotting.

A greenish blueish coloration within the stems is normal.  But the other stuff may not be depending on how drastic it is.

Think of it this way, take all the psychedelic mushroom mystique away for just one second.  Look at them as food.  Do they look like spoiled food, or would you eat them? :smile:

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: creamcorn]
    #6387253 - 12/19/06 04:22 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Well, some of them did have a gooey brownish look inside, once I sliced the stems down the middle to take a look inside.

Others had a greenish/blueish appearence. Again, all of this is INSIDE the stems, not outside or anywhere else.

As for the ones that are welting, as it were, they are REALLY small, some of them possibly being considered aborts.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387262 - 12/19/06 04:26 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

post a pic or two. Sounds like you are fine to me. Sounds like blueing, which is a good thing.

-Prim


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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387266 - 12/19/06 04:28 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Well, as for pictures, I have pretty much plucked the ones that I was suspicious about, kept the ones that did not look that bad in the middle (greenish/blueish a little only) and I chucked the rest (which were only a few really).

Here are some pictures of some of the remaining ones (do they look a little too damp/watery?):


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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387276 - 12/19/06 04:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

The blueing reaction is oxidation of psilosin. It happens when cell walls are broken and it is exposed to air. It makes sense that if you cut a stem open you'll see it appear on the inside. Squeeze the heck out of another stem without cutting it open, I bet you'll see it change to the same color within a few minutes. I wouldn't worry much about the coloration there.

Again brown goo is probably bad news though. Mushroom flesh should be relatively solid feeling (though stems are often hollow so don't confuse that). They won't be as thick and meaty or solid as a common store bought edible mushroom, but they should by no means be mushy either.

The others may very well be aborts, should be picked off, and toss them if you're not sure. Better safe than sorry.

Get the others drying ASAP. If they are beginning to rot, remember that rotting occurs because bacteria are decomposing the mushrooms. Drying them will stop that since bacteria can't live without moisture. Then if you're still paranoid, make a tea with them, so that if the bacteria will be killed completely before ingesting.

This is all a guessing game without pictures though unfortunately. I have a sneaking suspision they're fine though I don't want to make promises or risk giving bad advice.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: creamcorn]
    #6387279 - 12/19/06 04:32 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

The ones pictured look totally fine from here.

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387284 - 12/19/06 04:34 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Another pic (again, these are NOT ones that I am suspicious about, but how do they look? The stems?):


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Offlinethink_about_it
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387290 - 12/19/06 04:37 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

By the way, the ones that were suspicious (again, not pictured at all, they are gone!), were VERY mushy, not solid at all. Some of them had brownish goo inside, others there was a mixture of green/blue/brown... Needless to say, I got rid of all of those (like 5 or so).

These ones that I have taken pictures of, don't they look too moist?

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387292 - 12/19/06 04:37 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

they also look fine :thumbup:

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: creamcorn]
    #6387295 - 12/19/06 04:40 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Actually, it sounds like he had them sitting directly on the perlite and got them waterlogged. Boil into tea if you're going to consume them to make sure you kill the bacteria. Next time, set them on jar lids or foil.
RR


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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6387301 - 12/19/06 04:43 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for jumping in RogerRabbit... Actually, this is a casing tray that I am referring to. I had them sitting on a rack so that the surface area of the perlite at the bottom was exposed more. I have now removed the rack so that the tray is sitting directly on the perlite.

I still think they look waterlogged... What is the effect of that? Are they savable now that I have lowered the moisture in the tub?

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387331 - 12/19/06 04:54 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

They're not molding, but waterlogged mushrooms can have some pretty nasty bacteria that will give an upset stomach if you eat them raw. Just boil into tea and you'll be fine. If they weren't in contact with the perlite, they got waterlogged from excess watering, not the perlite which only provides humidity.

The green you saw was probably just bruising.
RR


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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6387350 - 12/19/06 04:59 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Hmmm, watering? I haven't misted or watered at all. I simply cased while the casing layer was just around field capacity. That's it.

There are four 1.5" holes on either side of the fruiting chamber, all stuffed with poly-fill. There is 1" of damp (strained) perlite at the bottom of the chamber. I had the two trays that I have in there sitting on little racks that allowed the surface area of the perlite to be greater. I have now removed these two racks and the trays are sitting directly on the perlite (and I am still getting humidity in the high 80's).

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387355 - 12/19/06 05:02 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I also have another question here:

When harvesting some of the shrooms, particularly the ones on the sides, I have noticed that there are some small shrooms growing underneath, or even sometimes there is shroom flesh, but not actual full shrooms. How does one go about clearing all this out without wrecking havoc on the casing layer? Could I just replace the entire casing layer after the first flush? I kind of feel like I want to chuck it all and make sure there are no rotting shrooms underneath or any partial shroom flesh or something (which will rot if it is left there, right?)

Thoughts...

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387356 - 12/19/06 05:02 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Then I don't see how they can be waterlogged. Put up a picture or just watch and observe.
RR


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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6387363 - 12/19/06 05:05 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I have those pictures above that I posted above (these are NOT the ones that had coloration inside of the stems. Those are all gone now. These ones do look a little damp to me):




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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387387 - 12/19/06 05:11 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

They're fine. Up your air exchange a bit.
RR


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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #6387396 - 12/19/06 05:15 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah, that is what I was thinking... Since the holes are only 1.5" (instead of monstermitch's 2" ones), I think that I need some extra FAE (more than is naturally provided by the presence of the poly-fil holes). I will start doing that now and see what happens.

Could you address my post #6387355 above: About harvesting and the casing layer, etc...

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6387565 - 12/19/06 06:19 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

think_about_it said:[/b

Could you address my post #6387355 above: About harvesting and the casing layer, etc...




Just leave it alone,it shouldn't rot unless they are aborts and if they are you will know it because they look like little mushrooms except their caps turn black and they never grow,don't destroy your casing layer trying to get everything,it will do much more harm than good

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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: Blutjager]
    #6387574 - 12/19/06 06:21 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Right, but what about those that I picked from the sides but I can tell there is still some "meat" (flesh) left underneath. For sure that will rot. Should I just dig that up and patch the area?

Edited by think_about_it (12/19/06 06:22 PM)

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OfflinePrimate
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Re: URGENT, right before harvest, see green in stems... [Re: think_about_it]
    #6388353 - 12/19/06 09:41 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

many say to remove it with tweezers. I haven't had any problems just leaving it tho. It will eventually just bruise alot then start turning back into regular myc.

-Prim


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