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Invisibletakk
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: ashfiken]
    #6382151 - 12/18/06 03:11 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

lol hijacked

yeah take some time off, reality's all good  :thumbup:


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OfflineExplosiveMango
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: ashfiken]
    #6382299 - 12/18/06 06:33 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

ashfiken said:
shrooms or lsd CANNOT cause n e type of tumor although the spine thing is somewhat true... lsd stays in ur spine for ur entire life but this is a thread on shrooms so... if u really feel so inclined lay off, but i dont think you have any sort of "condition" the shrooms just boggle ur mind. especially if uve been hittin it pretty heavy for 2 mths then it would definately leave u sorta dazed so lay off for 2 wks and i dont c any reason u wouldnt b fine




Man, don't repeat misinformation for fucks sake... LSD does NOT stay in your spine.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.


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Offlinekevbo
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: ashfiken]
    #6382301 - 12/18/06 06:34 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

ashfiken said:
haha yep thats y i got that info just to b sure and c wat it says?? lol :naughty:




You do realize that the link you posted is DISproving the myth that LSD stays in your spine, right?


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OfflineKickleM
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: kevbo]
    #6382903 - 12/18/06 11:39 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

LOL, everyone is bashing the poor guy to a pulp. I give him credit for finally taking the time to look up the proper information. Good job, do it more often.

The way he types is murder, though.


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain


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OfflineSyle
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: Kickle]
    #6383000 - 12/18/06 12:16 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

yes, definently good job for looking it up.

i feel bad that he got jumped on when people thought he was a self-proclaimed schizo.

also, ashfiken, thanks for realizing the wrong information from the right. knowledge is key. now spread the knowledge to your misinformed friends!


--------------------
https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!


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OfflineCryptix
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: Syle]
    #6383293 - 12/18/06 01:57 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

nice spelling... schizofrania... lol


--------------------
"The real voyage of discovery
consists not in seeing new landscapes,
but in having new eyes."

"Small doses suck dogs cocks, smoke that shit until the elves piss in your eyes. " -Hanky


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: Cryptix]
    #6383382 - 12/18/06 02:19 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

pikashroom, mushrooms do not cause schizophrenia, they only surface the underlying psychology illnesses, so if u became schizophrenic after a shroom trip, it was because you were like that already.

if your worried you might be schizo, and by your posting it doesnt sound like you are, then i think you should be looking into other areas for clues. how was your life growing up? were you abused? were you forced to take on a sepperate face (putting on a face for someone, being someone other than you to be comfortable with someone else) at a very young age?
also, weed and shrooms can make u quite mixed up sometimes, but a good few months of sober time does one well.
the first times shrooming, your so excited and into it and wanting to learn, that u take it every chance you get.
after some experience, you start to view it like TMshroom stated, a reboot/rebirth to the psychological system.
I have not ingested mushrooms for a long time, where i used to take them every weekend, and sometimes ingest up to 200 grams of more of fresh mushrooms. now i dont think i would want to for at least another 6 months, if not a few years. high doses and constant use can leave you kind of mixed up afterwards, and its best to lay off for a while on the mind altering substances til you can get yourself straight again.

ashfiken, its better you read rather than post, as thats some of the funniest propaghanda/bullshit ive heard in a long time. reminded me of the "shrooms make ur brain bleed" thread that i just read. :rotfl:
props for admitting you were wrong though, you will often see alot of knowledge battles in here :lol:
teh elite > :nutkick:  < teh n00bs


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OfflineChemiker
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: keefboy]
    #6383590 - 12/18/06 03:24 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

keefboy said:
however, I wouldn't take this to mean much because terms like schizophrenia don't mean much really.


Schizophrenia is a psychotic disorder and schizophrenics generally suffer from a lot of anxiety and fear. The term does mean a lot and it is a condition that requires medical attention and compassion. Though there are problems with the definition of schizophrenia, it is certainly a meaningful term.

Classical hallucinogens, as someone pointed out, generally only cause schizophrenia in people who are predisposed to the illness (e.g. people with family history of schizophrenia). It is quite well known that those suffering from "natural" schizophrenia and "LSD psychosis" are indistignuishable [1]. The incidence of LSD precipitated psychosis is quite low, with estimates ranging between 0.25 to 0.08% of all users.

This represents a significant risk, but fortunately the risk can be avoided. If you have a family history of psychotic illnesses then I suggest that you avoid hallucinogen use altogether or have a sober trip sitter with you in a controlled, comfortable environment.

i think that most mild to moderate mental disorders can pretty much be resolved by meditation and taking control of your own mind.

Now, "taking control of your own mind" is a phrase that doesn't mean much.

they are not causing you to be scatterbrained (which is not even a symptom of schizophrenia by the way)

Disorders in thought process (aka. being scatterbrained) are certainly characteristic of psychotic illnesses.

[1] Nichols, D E. Hallucinogens. Phamacology and Therapeutics. 101, pp. 131 - 181. (2004)


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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: Chemiker]
    #6383655 - 12/18/06 03:49 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Now, "taking control of your own mind" is a phrase that doesn't mean much.




yes, it means alot. especialy in the way he spoke of it. :wtf: are you talking about? :stfu:


Quote:

Disorders in thought process (aka. being scatterbrained) are certainly characteristic of psychotic illnesses.




not always. anyone who smokes pot every day will eventualy get to the point of being a little scatterbrained, and need to cut back for a few days to regain clearity. this can also be experienced on numberous other substances including alcohol and even caffeine, though it is more rare for the less spacey of substances. also, he said it was not a symptom of schizophrenia, not that it wasnt a sign of some sort of mental illnesses. still that doesnt seem the case here.

also, you credit the information from nichols though most of what you said are your own opinions or suggestions? you should clearify what you are quoting him on, dont make him look like a fool because of it.


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OfflineChemiker
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: CptnGarden]
    #6383756 - 12/18/06 04:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

i]KidBotany said:
not always. anyone who smokes pot every day will eventualy get to the point of being a little scatterbrained,


"Not always" is right and I didn't say that "all people who experience being scatterbrained are also psychotic." I said that being scatterbrained is a characteristic of psychotic illnesses, which is true. In other words, a schizophrenic characteristically experiences thought disorders (ie. being "scatterbrained").

he said it was not a symptom of schizophrenia, not that it wasnt a sign of some sort of mental illnesses.

Well, he's wrong. Being "scatterbrained" certainly is a symptom of schizophrenia and schizophrenia is a psychotic disorder.

also, you credit the information from nichols though most of what you said are your own opinions or suggestions? you should clearify what you are quoting him on

If you were familiar with how citations worked, then you would realize that the one sentence that I put "[1]" at the end of is where I'm crediting him. This is how citations normally work. You put the footnote/endnote number at the end of the sentence where credit is to be given. That's exactly what I did.

IE:

"It is quite well known that those suffering from "natural" schizophrenia and "LSD psychosis" are indistignuishable [1]." <----
this is where I am crediting him and by convention this is how it is done. Thank you very much.

However, I really didn't credit him as much as I should have: The entire paragraph where I include the above sentence is all from Nichols's paper (ie. family history and estimated rate of occurence).

Disorganized thinking ("formal thought disorder") has been argued by some to be th esingle most important feature of Schizophrenia. Becuase of the difficulty inherent in developing an objective definition of "thought disorder," and because in a clinical setting inferences about thought are based primarily on the individual's speech, the concept of disorganized speech (Criterion A3) has been emphasized in the definition for Schizophrenia used in this manual. p.300

Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (Forth Edition, Text Revision). American Psychiatric Association. 200.

As for "taking control of your own mind", that means absolutely nothing. You are your own mind. Whether or not you're in control of it isn't something that has ever been answered (or can be at this point). If you advised a mentally ill person to take control of their own mind and two weeks later or a year later, they were still mentally ill, would you give them a hard time for not taking your advice? I once knew someone who claimed to have cured himself of schizophrenia by thinking, but so what? How do you really know you're in control of your own thoughts or mind? Isn't possible that it's an illusion?


Edited by Chemiker (12/18/06 05:15 PM)


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Offlineashfiken
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: Chemiker]
    #6384318 - 12/18/06 07:33 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

thx to the people that defended the fact that i did look up the information in order to prove myself wrong and as for explosivemango and kevbo look into the comversation a little more of course i realized what was said was disproved by ME and sorry for my typing i dont take agonizingly long amounts of times to type thies posts :biggrin:


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OfflineDyeGreen
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: TMshroom]
    #6384542 - 12/18/06 08:36 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)






Ive stated this many times that a shroom trip is like a mind-reset/reboot and you can only reboot yourself so many times before you start wondering why it is you do it over and over, and whethere its needed at all.

Moderation. Marinate on that for a minute




Now this guy knows what he's talking about... A+ for you.


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Offlinekcobra15
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: DyeGreen]
    #6386810 - 12/19/06 02:28 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

pikashroom...I am sure that you are fine. The one thing any psychedelic user should consider before they start experimenting is their family history with mental disorders. If you have a family history of schizophrenia then you should really take that into consideration before you use a psychedelic. It is truly a risk that an extreme experience could precipitate a schizophrenic brake if it is in your genes. However, this will not happen to anyone who is not predisposed to mental illness. Psychedelics can only bring out an already underlying mental disorder, they cannot cause one.


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Om Gam Ganapataye Namah


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OfflineRoosterCogburn
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Re: Shrooms bring schizofrania? [Re: ashfiken]
    #6386850 - 12/19/06 02:38 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

ashfiken said:
yep lsd also stays in your hair just the same way weed does lol :grin: (thats y u cant b a pilot if uve smoked weed in the last 10 yrs cuz they test ur hair and it stays there for 10 yrs)




Hehehehe... Who the fuck has the same hair for 10 years? You wouldn't get hired as a pilot because you'd look like a fucking hermit!


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OfflineChemiker
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: kcobra15]
    #6386895 - 12/19/06 02:49 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

kcobra15 said:However, this will not happen to anyone who is not predisposed to mental illness. Psychedelics can only bring out an already underlying mental disorder, they cannot cause one.




Every person has at least some risk of developing a psychotic illness. For people with no family history of mental illness, their risk of developing one is very low and so their risk of a psychedelic substance inducing a psychotic illness is correspondingly low, but I don't think you can say zero.

When you say that psychedelics can only bring out an "underlying mental disorder", I think this is the same thing as having a family hisotry of schizophrenia.


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Offlinekcobra15
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: Chemiker]
    #6386957 - 12/19/06 03:07 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Ok i can agree wih that...but the risk is exeedingly low if you have no family history. Also schizophrenia isn't the only mental disorder that can be effected by psychedlic use i.e. bipolar disorder. Bipolar could be the "underlying mental disoerder" that I was talking about as well. Thanks for the correction though...it is important that have accurate info about psychedlics.


--------------------
Om Gam Ganapataye Namah


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OfflineChemiker
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Re: Shrooms bring schizophrenia? [Re: kcobra15]
    #6387209 - 12/19/06 04:09 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Agreed. Exceedingly low. I think the risk is probably so low for those without a family history of mental illness that they don't need to worry, but I wouldn't want anyone to think that there is absolutely no risk. I'd actually be interested in finding cases of psychedelic-induced psychotic illness in individuals without any clear family history of mental illness.

Also, I can't remember exactly how the articles put it, but basically the risk is higher for uncontrolled "recreational" settings than in controlled, clinical settings. Furthermore, the precipitation of these illnesses by psychedelics seems to be associated with "bad trips", which is probably what you would guess.

So, even a person who is at risk, could probably reduce the risk by having a sober, responsible person with them and ensuring that all of the conditions are set for a comfortable experience. Basically, this just means following the advice that a lot of people on this board would probably give: be responsible. Take care of set and setting. Though there's always going to be some outside chance that even the most level-headed individual could have a psychotic episode, there should be ways to reduce the risk.

Any suggestions?


Edited by Chemiker (12/19/06 04:14 PM)


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