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 Hypercube
80 SRM
 
Registered: 12/18/05
Posts: 814
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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 DO NOT VOTE 
#6351277 - 12/09/06 02:52 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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The point I find worth arguing about with all these "vote for your rights" freaks is the contention that we are living under a genuine democracy, and that voting is our means to enact the democratic process.
We are, however, far away from a democracy. Political parties represent different colours in a single pile of feces. To make the allegory more accessible, let us represent the different parties as finger-puppets on someones hands. Sure, we have a variety of choices on the left and the right, and the one that eventually claims the stage is, in our minds, somehow different from and better than the other 9 members. We may superficially differentiate these finger-puppets based on the colour of their felt and the length of the finger that supports them, but in the end, they are all fingers. What's more, they all belong to the same person.
Voting, then, accomplishes very little. Year after year, we elect different fingers to represent different points along an imaginary left-to-right line. But year after year, nothing new happens. New laws get passed, sure, and these puppets are seemingly busy pushing various things through 'the system,' but such decisions are based more on the zeitgeist and the will to maximize public support than the nuances of a government's platform, and more often than not they are based solely on corporate interest.
Voting is merely a feel-good form of disposable activism. It is easy to do, and after we do it we feel we have contributed to the progression of society. But you haven't contributed to anything. You have been tricked into accepting a superficial "choice," when the real decisions have already all been made for us. Big business runs this show. The finger-puppets are being controlled by a CEO. As corny as it sounds, the only real voting we can ever do is with our dollars.
I, for one, do not want finger-puppets up on stage creating a realm of easily accessible "issues" in which we can bicker and bitch among ourselves while the wizard is behind the curtain pulling the levers.
I think we need an alternative. I'm not sure what this might be, for I don't have all the answers. But this world is going to hell in a handbasket very quickly. And no party front is going to provide any solutions as long as that CEO is behind the stage.
Think about what governments have actually done, ever. How come this "war on drugs" isn't over? How come "combating homelessness" and "fighting crime" are still buzz terms? We need to get away from this mentality that political parties, in all their fighting and combat, are weilding any sort of weapon at all against the ailments of society. They are reinforcing the systems of power that keep their pockets full and the people complacent and afraid.
I urge you, in coming elections, to not vote. Drop out of this silly little game they have set up for us...if enough people don't vote, there will be a crisis of govern-ment(a), and alternatives will arise for our next step as a species.
In the meantime, realize that whenever you buy something you are supporting someone. Think about who that might be.
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plexus
holding thelight of athousand candles
Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 1,291
Loc: texas
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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 Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6351317 - 12/09/06 02:59 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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here here!
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that there, thats not me. 
i go where i please. 
im not here.
this isnt happening.
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 Disco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR
Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6351400 - 12/09/06 03:24 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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No, by not voting you are ensuring that the fanatics will have their choice of government, which is how you got Bush. The people who aren't voting are doing so because they don't approve of the choices. The people who vote DO. You're letting those who are like minded with scum rule the country. You are in effect destroying your country by not voting.
If all the non-voters decided to vote for one of the hopeless parties that hoplesless party would no longer be hopeless, and would probably be the new government.
If you don't like things then vote for who you'd most like to win, regardless of their chances, and then take further measures to shape the country. Not voting is guarranteeing that your country is going to be screwed.
So if you care for the world at all you'll do your best to make sure that you and everybody you know makes a serious vote for the most appealing 3rd party.
Who do you think taught your country this bullshit that voting for a 3rd party is throwing away your vote? I'll give you a hint - they recently fucked up a good portion of the entire world, with the help of non-voters.
Edited by Disco Cat (12/09/06 03:32 PM)
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Hypercube
80 SRM
Registered: 12/18/05
Posts: 814
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Disco Cat]
#6351435 - 12/09/06 03:33 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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My point is, though, that it doesn't really matter who gets into office. The country will be screwed either way as long as our current system is in place.
Do you honestly think that things would be soooo much different if the Democrats won? Things would be marginally different, but you would still have politicians being figureheads for the interests of big business.
Quote:
Disco Cat said:
If all the non-voters decided to vote for one of the hopeless parties that hoplesless party would no longer be hopeless, and would probably be the new government.
Which would end up changing what, essentially? The names of the people accepting bribes, maybe. But the current democratic political system DOESN'T WORK, and it doesn't matter WHO is on the throne. It will not work for us because it isn't designed to.
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Disco Cat
iS A PoiNdexteR
Registered: 09/15/00
Posts: 2,601
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6351461 - 12/09/06 03:38 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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Vote 3rd party, and yes, it makes a difference.
If the Dems had been in office there'd be an entirely different stance on issues affecting millions of people. That's not enough to bother? Are all the Middle-Eastern and American deaths enough to bother? What then makes it enough to bother over?
Perfection or nothing? 40% of perfection as opposed to 14% perfection? I'd take the 40% without hesitation.
Edited by Disco Cat (12/09/06 03:41 PM)
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Hanky
wiffle bat.
Registered: 08/30/03
Posts: 56,993
Loc: Great Southern Land.
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6351504 - 12/09/06 03:48 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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Remember, if you dont vote, dont complain.
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Coaster is an idiot...
[quote]Coaster said:
but i thnk everything thats pure is white?
[/quote]
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TheHateCamel
Research &Development -DBK
Registered: 01/31/03
Posts: 15,738
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hanky]
#6351519 - 12/09/06 03:53 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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You didn't understand his post?
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capliberty
Stranger
Registered: 04/23/06
Posts: 1,949
Last seen: 14 years, 7 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hanky]
#6351543 - 12/09/06 04:03 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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MY vote doesn't matter anyway, its all electoral, my state voted the way I wanted which was democrat, so there was no reason for me to vote. Besides didn't Al Gore win the election, and Bush had the Florida vote changed because of his brother. Goes to show even when we do vote the guy in he doesn't get elected. Electoral votes are stupid anyways, it should be the popular vote, so everyones vote counts.
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snoopaloop53
No BetterFriend. NoWorse Friend.
Registered: 01/20/05
Posts: 311
Last seen: 12 years, 8 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6351868 - 12/09/06 05:36 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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But if you don't vote and the same people stay in office have you gained anything? They'll figure you don't approve of them, but since you didn't do anything to put them out of office they won't give you much of a second thought. I doubt there will be any real crisis in government, more of a sigh of relief that the politicians get to stay in office with any real work on their part.
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LynxRufus
Stranger
Registered: 08/09/05
Posts: 99
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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The Bush elections (both florida in in 2000 and ohio in 2004) go to prove that a few votes do count. Had more anti-bush people voted, Bushs people would not have had the opportunity to change the election.
Ha ha to the Ohio republicans that were involved in that fiasco. Blackwell et al. You may have missed national media attention/shame back in 04, but your careers are over so you still lose.
The "My vote don't count" argument is an ignorant, tired and rerun spiel stated and restated by those who just don't get it and probably never will.
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Viveka
refutation bias
Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 4,061
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hypercube]
#6352617 - 12/09/06 10:25 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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1. We do not live in a democracy. We never have. Policy can't be trusted to the unbridled whim of the majority, it would run a country into the ground. If what was most popular was best, McDonalds would be the best place to get a meal, Nickelback would be the best music to listen to, and bud light would be the drug of choice. We live in a Constitutional Republic, wherein every element ideally has a check against it, including the voting majority.
2. If you are frustrated by the current illusion of opposing party structures, there's a much better alternative than simply not voting:
VOTE THIRD PARTY
You think doing nothing sends a message better than casting a vote in defiance of the status quo? It does not matter if 3rd party cannot possibly win this time around, or the next, or even the time after that. The only way you would be "throwing your vote away" is if you:
a. Cast your vote not for someone you would truly like to see in office, but as a "strategy" to get the "lesser of two evils" elected.
or
b. Not vote at all.
It could be said that government will always involve the lesser of evils, but I would much rather cast my vote for a break in the current party gridlock, than to do nothing. DO you know who gets people elected in this country? The elderly. Why? Because they're voting for whoever is promising them cheap prescription drugs, while the youth sits around and cooks up lame-brained schemes like "Hey, let's just stop voting, that will really get our intentions across!"
If in 2004, this generation would have pushed toward voting third party instead of the idiotic sentiment I saw at rock shows and throughout pop culture where "Rock the Vote!" really meant "Vote Democrat", we might already be on a path toward a refreshing, albeit unpredictable change in the way US governemnt conducts business. But no, people either value their precious little vote too much to "waste" it on a third party candidate or they think not voting at all is a brilliant act of protest.
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Colonelpoop
Poopyhead
Registered: 11/30/06
Posts: 412
Loc: On the ground, rollin' ar...
Last seen: 17 years, 4 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Viveka]
#6352805 - 12/09/06 11:31 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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Whether it's throwing my vote away or not, after witnessing 3/4 of the Bush presidency, as long as there is a Republican running I'm voting Democrat.
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LynxRufus
Stranger
Registered: 08/09/05
Posts: 99
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Please don't get me wrong, I would love to see some stronger 3rd parties. Especially a nice strong American green party.
But right now the most effective means of changing the American political scene is by infiltrating and changing what is already there.
If all these '3rd Party' peeps would stop talking about it and start getting involved with the parties that are presently in power, change can occur. Why waste all that money reinventing the wheel? Why sit around bitching about how your voice is not heard, your views are not accounted for or how your vote doesn't count. Get off the couch and GET INVOLVED.
That said, the ONLY wasted vote is the one not cast.
Colonelpoop, you got good ideas.
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LynxRufus
Stranger
Registered: 08/09/05
Posts: 99
Last seen: 17 years, 1 month
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: LynxRufus]
#6353026 - 12/10/06 12:58 AM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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And before anyone comes back and yells at me for what I just said...
Think about it. Think about how much money is spent on alternative candidates. The air time, the advertisements, the man power, etc. If that cash and power and momentum and those ideas were put into an already running machine instead of 'fighting the power'...................................
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Colonelpoop
Poopyhead
Registered: 11/30/06
Posts: 412
Loc: On the ground, rollin' ar...
Last seen: 17 years, 4 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: LynxRufus]
#6353931 - 12/10/06 12:25 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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Which is exactly what Bush did.
You won't ever see an Illuminati puppet running on a 3rd party ticket either, they know the way to power is by simply infiltrating and then hijacking an established political party. In this case, it was the Republican party.
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole
Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 10 months
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What's an Illuminati?
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Colonelpoop
Poopyhead
Registered: 11/30/06
Posts: 412
Loc: On the ground, rollin' ar...
Last seen: 17 years, 4 months
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A secret society that most people know very little about because they're secret. It's those New World Order punks. You can spot them by their agenda.
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Economist
in training
Registered: 10/11/05
Posts: 1,285
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
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Really, and what would their agenda be?
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plexus
holding thelight of athousand candles
Registered: 04/24/03
Posts: 1,291
Loc: texas
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Economist]
#6357686 - 12/11/06 01:07 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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I agree with what hypercube said about the idea that it doesnt matter whos in office. things wouldnt be different. and if they are, its because the people in charge want them different. and i dont mean the president. the democratic or republican bullshit is just to give the masses the illusion of choice. and 3rd party candidates are to give the illusion that the system is free and that anyone can be president... even you little timmy. bullshit.
no ones ever gonna vote in an independant party president.
listen you "my vote doesnt count is ignorant" people, i live in texas... you think if i voted for that kerry fuck that texas would be that much closer to turning blue? the state that he is from. the state that he was govenor of? the state with literally hunderds of thousands of old geriatric republican single minded war-supporting christan embittered stupid fucks who do vote? the state that is pretty much the only state that DEFINATLY will be red? we didnt even get rid of rick perry! thats sad.
my vote would NOT have counted.
it doesnt matter anyway, cause Kerry would not have been "better" in anyway.
its all a lie anyway.
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that there, thats not me.
i go where i please.
im not here.
this isnt happening.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: DO NOT VOTE [Re: Hanky]
#6358465 - 12/11/06 05:14 PM (17 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Hanky said:
Remember, if you dont vote, dont complain.
You got that backwards; the only ones with the right to complain about those fools in office are the ones that don't play that game.
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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