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OfflineCubeculture
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Lophophora decipiens legality
    #6324512 - 12/01/06 02:14 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

A certain European based Cactus site is willing to ship me "Lophophora decipiens". Anyone have any idea on the legality?


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Knock the world right off its feet and straight onto its head.

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Offlinemoho456
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6324525 - 12/01/06 02:17 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Arguably a variation of Diffusa, more like that than williamsii(peyote). Should be okay.


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OfflineBrewmaster
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality *DELETED* [Re: moho456]
    #6324535 - 12/01/06 02:22 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by Brewmaster

Reason for deletion: .


Edited by blinkidiot (12/02/06 08:03 PM)

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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Brewmaster]
    #6324539 - 12/01/06 02:23 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

only williamsii is scheduled.

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OfflineCubeculture
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: CptnGarden]
    #6324749 - 12/01/06 03:28 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for the info and the link.


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OfflineCubeculture
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: CptnGarden]
    #6324750 - 12/01/06 03:28 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for the info and the link.


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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6324987 - 12/01/06 04:42 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

illegal in california btw

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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Mitchnast]
    #6325249 - 12/01/06 06:23 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

???mitch???

links??

i am aware of only williamsii being illegal in the entire US, and im about to sprout some other loph seeds, any info i should know?

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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: CptnGarden]
    #6325328 - 12/01/06 06:54 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

yeah, only that in the state of california, ALL members of the genus lophophora are treated as peyote.

yikes, i thought that was well known around here :P

careful there friend. :smile:

"
California #
California law states that "every person who plants, cultivates, harvests, dries, or processes any plant of the genus Lophophora, also known as peyote, or any part thereof shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a period of not more than one year or the state prison." (Health & Safety Code:Ch.6,Art.3,Sec.11363) This is notable because the wording includes the entire Lophophora genus, not just Lophophora williamsii."

-erowid

Edited by Mitchnast (12/01/06 07:02 PM)

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6325346 - 12/01/06 07:02 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

hey, is this only for you? cuz im looking for a cactus that looks exactly like peyote, i could care less about alkaloidical content, i just like the look of peyote lol.

ive been lookin for diffusa myself and have only come up with seeds shipping here to the US. id like to get a live plant.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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OfflineCubeculture
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6325777 - 12/01/06 09:43 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Sponsor or not, don't spam a source!

L. decipiens, L. diffusa, L. fricii, L. jourdaniana. They're a shroomery sponsor ;-)


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Knock the world right off its feet and straight onto its head.

Edited by blinkidiot (12/02/06 08:03 PM)

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InvisibleBlueDruid
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6327609 - 12/02/06 03:04 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

While it may not be scheduled in the U.S.A. (which I don´t believe) I wouldn´t rely on that fact to prevent the cops siezing it & holding it long enough for it to die (if they don´t just kill it).
I had thought that all lophophora are banned throughout the U.S.A.

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6327681 - 12/02/06 03:35 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

yes but they dont ship to the US.

i need some place that will ship here to the US.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

Edited by highdroponics (12/02/06 03:36 PM)

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328406 - 12/02/06 08:14 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

People sometimes act like they fail to realize that this is a public forum. Not only that, it's a ridiculously popular one. Hell, the garden doesn't even require membership to view (last I checked).

You have sources? Great. You want them to continue to be sources? Then wise up about the way in which you distribute them. It isn't a matter of, "It's not like the government doesn't already know about place x or site y." It's a simple matter of using common sense to avoid a situation where one or two sources becomes the main one publicly discussed for a specific product. For instance, dry cactus matter or root bark. When there is a primary source that is recommended, it's like providing a cross-hair that isn't necessary. In some situations people get unwanted attention. A few examples come to mind...

I'm not advocating source hording. But I also don't advocate source spamming, as blink put it. If someone wants to find a particular product sold on the net, they *will* be able to find it if they try.

And, of course, whether you agree or disagree with the reasons that I feel, there's the obvious fact that it's breaking the rules of the site. Lophophora williamsii seeds are illegal in the US. The same rules which apply for pot seeds or research chemicals apply for these. Even bulk poppy seed sources get removed.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Koala Koolio]
    #6328499 - 12/02/06 08:53 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

im not trying to buy this plant for use, i want it for my garden because i like the look of peyote, with all seriousness. all im looking for is the look here, i could care less about alkaloaidacal content or anything of that sort, i just want a kick ass looking garden. if i wanna use mescaline ill stick to other cacti. i would never touch williamsii because of its rareness.

im not particularly looking for williamsii, it can be any type of cactus that looks exactly or almost like williamsii. if anyone can direct me to a company that sells something that i might be looking for that sends to the US it would be very much appriciated.diffusa is the one i like most, for its similarities to williamsii, but it doesnt matter which type as long as it looks almost exactly like it.

i have been searching for ages trying to find something similar to the looks of williamsii, anything, it doesnt matter what genus as long as it grows and looks just like williamsii. ONLY SOMETHING LEGAL WILL I PURCHASE, so keep that in mind.

MAKE SURE TO READ THIS CAREFULLY BEFORE REPLYING


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

Edited by highdroponics (12/02/06 08:58 PM)

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InvisibleVirgilKane
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328603 - 12/02/06 09:50 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Some Astrophytum (especially asterias) come pretty close....

http://www.cactus-art.biz/schede/ASTROPHYTUM/photo_gallery_astrophytum.htm


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Absense of evidence is not evidence of absense...

"Religion is a defense against a religious experience"
              Carl G. Jung

 
"So really, ordinary reality is a kind of chemical habit, sanctioned by culture, which says it's okay to use certain drugs, eat certain foods, and have certain sexual behaviors. However, when you transcend all this pre-conditioning by returning to the original wisdom of the animal body, then you discover this immense dimension of opportunity. For some people, it is a frightening risk. To me, that's the psychedelic experience."
Terence McKenna

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: VirgilKane]
    #6328669 - 12/02/06 10:14 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

wow, i really like these, if someone has a link message me privately so i can find something like this.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

Edited by highdroponics (12/02/06 10:15 PM)

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328685 - 12/02/06 10:20 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

nevermind BBB seems to have them, can anyone confirm if the cacti they have look exactly what they have in the picture and possibly the size i should expect?

also i have 2 cacti right now which resemble williamsii but have spines that lay on top of the skin.(hardly noticable) this cactus is also much larger than williamsii and is more of a green color...id like to determine what it is exactly. is there a link i could use to determine all species of cacti? i know it will take long to sort out what is and what isnt what i have but im willing to take the time.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

Edited by highdroponics (12/02/06 10:26 PM)

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328726 - 12/02/06 10:30 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

ok nevermind it seems this site has everything i need.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328729 - 12/02/06 10:31 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

You perhaps have gymnocalycium right now?

BBB orders can vary, but they do have a policy with cacti that if you're not satisfied you can return them.

highdroponics, my post really wasn't meant for you. I have no beef with growing williamsii! :smile: I have no beef with importing the seeds either, just about the way sources are treated on the forum. Hell, I wouldn't care if you were growing a patch of peyote for your own personal consumption. If that's what you wanted them for, you damn well would be putting enough effort/heart break into your grow that you deserve your decision.

Legality is a good reason to be careful. But don't avoid williamsii for the reason of rarity! Seeds purchased from europe, for example, are *not* being stolen from the wild. It is legal to grow there, and people sell large amounts of seeds. You'd be doing the species a service, and certainly not harm, by honoring it with your care.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6328839 - 12/02/06 11:00 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

yeah but its damn near impossible to find or even trust a company to send to the US lol. and besides im looking for a live plant, i dont wanna wait 5-10 years to get to where i want it to be right now lol. i may consider ordering seeds when i move outta here, but for right now i dont wanna put my grandparents at risk by owning something illegal.(yes im living with my family, they need my support, my grandfather isnt doing so well, but enough of my personal life)

and its all good i understand i just saw that you replied to me and thought it was directed at me, lol.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

Edited by highdroponics (12/02/06 11:10 PM)

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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6329028 - 12/03/06 12:04 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

if i were you i would look inside the US. you dont want to deal with customs, believe me.

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Invisiblepoboy
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality *DELETED* [Re: highdroponics]
    #6329795 - 12/03/06 09:34 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by poboy

Reason for deletion: d



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OfflineInFest
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: poboy]
    #6329876 - 12/03/06 10:25 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

For the life of me I cannot get my loph seeds to germ!
Can anyone give me a few tips?


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One Day at a Time

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: InFest]
    #6329886 - 12/03/06 10:30 AM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Just press them into the surface. They shouldn't be sitting on top of the soil, but they should absolutely not be covered.

Keep it misted, in humidity. Practice with trich seeds if you want, the process is pretty much identical.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: CptnGarden]
    #6330264 - 12/03/06 01:51 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

yeah i cant find a place inside the US that sells diffusa or any Loph species for that matter.

im prolly gonna go with the sand dollar cactus, actually looks slightly kooler than peyote :P

although eventually i would like to get peyote for my garden, id like to have a special garden for only rare cacti species.

oh and what i meant in one of my recent posts about not touching peyote because its rare i meant that i would never actually use it to trip, i have no problem with having it lol.(just to clear that up)


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Koala Koolio]
    #6330290 - 12/03/06 02:02 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Koala Koolio said:
You perhaps have gymnocalycium right now?

BBB orders can vary, but they do have a policy with cacti that if you're not satisfied you can return them.

highdroponics, my post really wasn't meant for you. I have no beef with growing williamsii! :smile: I have no beef with importing the seeds either, just about the way sources are treated on the forum. Hell, I wouldn't care if you were growing a patch of peyote for your own personal consumption. If that's what you wanted them for, you damn well would be putting enough effort/heart break into your grow that you deserve your decision.

Legality is a good reason to be careful. But don't avoid williamsii for the reason of rarity! Seeds purchased from europe, for example, are *not* being stolen from the wild. It is legal to grow there, and people sell large amounts of seeds. You'd be doing the species a service, and certainly not harm, by honoring it with your care.




http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/7966/cac1052trx9.jpg

http://img159.imageshack.us/img159/5417/gymnoc4fc6.jpg

did a google image search on what you talked about and these are the ones that most closely resemble what i have, although mine are a much brighter green.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: highdroponics]
    #6330332 - 12/03/06 02:24 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

http://img239.imageshack.us/img239/493/007ve6.jpg

http://img127.imageshack.us/img127/1962/010om2.jpg

here are the actual pictures, they arent all that great, ive got a cheap camera.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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Invisiblepoboy
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality *DELETED* [Re: highdroponics]
    #6330644 - 12/03/06 04:31 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by poboy

Reason for deletion: d



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Burn the land and boil the sea but you can't take the sky from me.

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: poboy]
    #6330715 - 12/03/06 04:53 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

just send me a link in private...i dont think there any rules about that.


--------------------
Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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OfflineCptnGarden
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: poboy]
    #6330719 - 12/03/06 04:54 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Don't you just love censorship




no but in certain cases its important.

how did overgrow get shut down? SEEDS!
this server operates on US law, if they are illegal, you shouldnt post sources, for the sources safety and safety of the board. the mods do have the right to defend their site if the possibility comes along that it could get shut down.

i hope you dont take this as offensive poboy, i mean no harm :grin: :peace:

saying "pm me for a source" is a different scenario, then you are taking the responsibility.

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: poboy]
    #6331080 - 12/03/06 07:03 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

poboy said:
Don't you just love censorship




Almost as much as I love being irresponsible on a widely used public forum, (in a part viewable by even nonregistered people) regarding the sources of things that I find important.

What on earth is the problem with keeping things to PM?

And, unless they also carried williamsii, it probably should've been allowed. I think mjb once had live diffusa. It doesn't seem they do, or any live cacti at all now.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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Invisiblepoboy
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality *DELETED* *DELETED* *DELETED* [Re: Koala Koolio]
    #6331561 - 12/03/06 10:02 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Post deleted by poboy

Reason for deletion: d



--------------------
Burn the land and boil the sea but you can't take the sky from me.

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: poboy]
    #6331591 - 12/03/06 10:10 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Yeah... not speaking on your case individually. I just think censorship isn't really the best way to think of it. If it really was salvia, kratom, and diffusa (with no other)... it shouldn't have been a problem I would guess?

But then there are things like mimosa or torch. In those situations, a question, "Where do you recommend for mimosa?" would be fine. Starting a 2 page thread about extraction methods, and then asking for a source is irresponsible. Or, even mentioning yields for that matter.

The salvia thing makes me curious though. Weird.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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OfflineCubeculture
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Registered: 11/16/06
Posts: 47
Last seen: 17 years, 3 months
Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Koala Koolio]
    #6333565 - 12/04/06 05:10 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

I probably shouldn't have posted the link. I assumed since they were a shroomery sponsor, and everything we were talking about is completely legal, it was ok. They do also sell williamsi, but they do not ship it to the USA on policy.

In the future I'll just keep it to PMs to be on the safe side.


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Knock the world right off its feet and straight onto its head.

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InvisibleKoala Koolio
TTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGGTTAGGG

Registered: 01/07/04
Posts: 7,752
Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6333749 - 12/04/06 05:59 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

Yours wouldn't have likely been a problem if it weren't under the context of the previous source, in which was specifically spammed for the purpose of illegally buying williamsii seeds.

Wasn't your fault.


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You're not like the others. You like the same things I do. Wax paper, boiled football leather... dog breath. We're not hitch-hiking anymore, we're riding!

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Offlinehighdroponics
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Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 5,574
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Re: Lophophora decipiens legality [Re: Cubeculture]
    #6333756 - 12/04/06 06:01 PM (17 years, 3 months ago)

i didnt think they shipped anything to the US, i checked out that site, said they only ship within europe.


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Dr :ronpaul: says to stop trying to treat the side-effects of big government and focus on the core issues. End the Federal Reserve/audit the gold reserves at Fort Knox, abolish the IRS, end all wars and occupancies, stop the building of an empire that will inevitably fail, and cut all unconstitutional federal programs. Put the power back in the peoples' hands by ending this nanny-state.

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