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The_Red_Crayon
Exposer of Truth


Registered: 08/13/03
Posts: 13,673
Loc: Smokey Mtns. TN
Last seen: 7 years, 12 days
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Basilides]
#6109432 - 09/27/06 10:41 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Islam was never started in hatred of jews or christians, Christians were referred to as people of the book, and muslims also believed jesus christ was a important profit. Islam traces its religious routes directly at the time Abraham abandoned Hagar and her concubine son Ishmael when Rebecca concieved Issac, When they were cast into the desert this is where islam traces off of.
It wasnt till after Mohammad's death that Islam started becoming militant, Factional sects of Islam broke off, mostly determining on the succession of caliphates. When Islam occupied Jurasalem the jews and muslims got together very well finely, as well as Moor controlled Spain with jews. Muslims usually regarded jews as brothers if not cousins, This stems back from the ancient persians who under Cyrus the Great helped rebuild the Jewish temple and was regarded in the Torah as well Old Testament bible a very holy and revered man. Of course Persians were Zaraostrian at that time but they eventually converted into Islam.
When the crusaders reached Jerusalem and other towns they were completely sacked, and all the inhabitants (jews as well as arabs) had their heads hacked off, and it seemed this type of retaliation became frequent as arab armies conquered christian towns.
To me i dont think that Muslims in that era were anymore brutal or violent then western culture.
Islams militancy today is a ressurection of Wahabbis and Salafism, and if the trend keeps going of knocking out arab states and erecting puppet governments or encouraging more violence in the region, then moderate muslims start to lose their voice and the militants become more credible.
If this trend continues then it could be quite feasible, of monthly attacks on soft targets here in Europe or the States.
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Basilides
Servent ofWisdom


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 7,059
Loc: Crown and Heart
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: SirTripAlot]
#6110189 - 09/28/06 05:29 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
SirTripAlot said:
Quote:
Basilides said:
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SirTripAlot said: You ask me for a solution, I don't have one.
And you do? Your "tolerance and patience" routine? Meanwhile bombs will still go off, and simple cartoons cant be shown. Come on. Your solution holds about the same amount as mine!!!!!!!!!
My solution involves the non-isolation of Muslims, an isolation which your approach effectively generates. My solution involves driving a wedge between mainstream Islam and the radical diatribes of fundamentalist Islam. Your solution is to sit with one's thumb up their ass while one complains about how wicked and barbaric Islam is with the imbecilic hope that if you insult the religion enough, Muslims will magically and well intently enter the modern world. Your solution nudges more and more otherwise moderate Muslims towards radicalism, as it merely increases the prevailing notion among Muslims that there is a world wide conspiracy against Islam to supress it. Again, this is not the End Times - so there is no need for one to read like an apocalyptic doomsayer.
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    "Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."
Edited by Basilides (09/28/06 05:39 AM)
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Basilides
Servent ofWisdom


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 7,059
Loc: Crown and Heart
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Hank, FTW]
#6110195 - 09/28/06 05:35 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
alpharedecho said:
Quote:
Basilides said:
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alpharedecho said: Good point with the Buddhists and Hindus?
People often try to blame violent behaviour on economic status. While it does play a role, it is not nearly as significant as the general culture of the people.
To the person who responded to me earlier by saying "Yeah bomb the Muslims, and see if doesn't piss them off" or what ever was said, I did not say it wouldn't piss them off. It would let them know who's boss and to stop killink our people(Christians) over fucking cartoons.
What does "bomb the Muslims" even mean? Bomb the ones firing guns? They're already doing that. Are you suggesting that Muslim civilians should be bombed? Your suggestion is so black and right, it's a sworn enemy of rational thought. You even describe first worlders as "Christians" which is a density only Osama could top.
Okay, replace Christians with whites. Happy?
No, just bomb the countries where our embassies get over run, mainly the people trying to over run the embassies.
The developed world, my friend, is not "White" nor "Christian". It is cosmopolitan, especially in the 20th and 21st centuries.
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    "Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."
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quiver
freedrug


Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 8,047
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Basilides]
#6110292 - 09/28/06 06:37 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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if mohamed came back we'd kill him
/joke maybe maybe not i can say that
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,782
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 41 minutes, 32 seconds
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Basilides]
#6110300 - 09/28/06 06:50 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Basilides said:
Quote:
SirTripAlot said:
Quote:
Basilides said:
Quote:
SirTripAlot said: You ask me for a solution, I don't have one.
And you do? Your "tolerance and patience" routine? Meanwhile bombs will still go off, and simple cartoons cant be shown. Come on. Your solution holds about the same amount as mine!!!!!!!!!
My solution involves the non-isolation of Muslims, an isolation which your approach effectively generates. My solution involves driving a wedge between mainstream Islam and the radical diatribes of fundamentalist Islam. Your solution is to sit with one's thumb up their ass while one complains about how wicked and barbaric Islam is with the imbecilic hope that if you insult the religion enough, Muslims will magically and well intently enter the modern world. Your solution nudges more and more otherwise moderate Muslims towards radicalism, as it merely increases the prevailing notion among Muslims that there is a world wide conspiracy against Islam to supress it. Again, this is not the End Times - so there is no need for one to read like an apocalyptic doomsayer.
No, your solution involves the thumb up the ass (for a longer period of time), with you "compassion and patience". If you think that it is somehow my fault, that a group of Muslims will react violently to a cartoon, is pure lunacy.
Just so we are all clear here......what it this wedge you will be driving between the two sects? What is the process, and how do you plan to implement it?
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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quiver
freedrug


Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 8,047
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: SirTripAlot]
#6110363 - 09/28/06 07:33 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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compassion and patience no doubt
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Syle
Kenai Sigh


Registered: 10/16/05
Posts: 6,678
Loc: WA
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: quiver]
#6110559 - 09/28/06 08:57 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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You people are all idiots and you are complicating the issue.
Ask yourselves this question: what were parker and stone trying to say with their newer "rip on jesus" episode"?
They are merely stating that htere is a double standard. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less.
-------------------- https://kenaisigh.bandcamp.com/ <- Just completed the 2021 RPM challenge for February - An EP in one month (5 songs or 20 minutes). Check it out!
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Hank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Basilides]
#6110847 - 09/28/06 10:51 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Basilides said:
Quote:
alpharedecho said:
Quote:
Basilides said:
Quote:
alpharedecho said: Good point with the Buddhists and Hindus?
People often try to blame violent behaviour on economic status. While it does play a role, it is not nearly as significant as the general culture of the people.
To the person who responded to me earlier by saying "Yeah bomb the Muslims, and see if doesn't piss them off" or what ever was said, I did not say it wouldn't piss them off. It would let them know who's boss and to stop killink our people(Christians) over fucking cartoons.
What does "bomb the Muslims" even mean? Bomb the ones firing guns? They're already doing that. Are you suggesting that Muslim civilians should be bombed? Your suggestion is so black and right, it's a sworn enemy of rational thought. You even describe first worlders as "Christians" which is a density only Osama could top.
Okay, replace Christians with whites. Happy?
No, just bomb the countries where our embassies get over run, mainly the people trying to over run the embassies.
The developed world, my friend, is not "White" nor "Christian". It is cosmopolitan, especially in the 20th and 21st centuries.
Look at the G8, yeah quite the cosmopolitan, you have white, and Japanese.
Anyway, it's not about that. The fact is, when our embassies start getting over run, it's time to bust out the machine guns, not sit back while people get killed.
People have a right to self defense, using deadly means, if necessary.
-------------------- Capliberty: "I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,643
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Hank, FTW]
#6110923 - 09/28/06 11:14 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Look at the G8, yeah quite the cosmopolitan, you have white, and Japanese.
America, to name one, ISN'T WHITE. I don't have the statistics but I think its safe to say one in three or four peopled in the US isn't an anglosaxon, or whatever the criterium is.
Quote:
The fact is, when our embassies start getting over run, it's time to bust out the machine guns, not sit back while people get killed.
When an embassy is overrun you evacuate it. You're confusing it with a military base. An embassy of a nation is a *guest* in the host country, thats why most embassies are casual about property damage when theres a riot somewhere.
Please note how almost any storming of an embassy anywhere results mostly in property damage, not a bloodbath.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
Edited by Asante (09/28/06 11:15 AM)
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Hank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Asante]
#6110943 - 09/28/06 11:20 AM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yeah, and during that evacuation, you happen to lose a few.....fair enough!
1 death is too many, it doesn't have to be a bloodbath.
BTW up until about 30 years ago, America was 90% white, so take that melting pot shit somewhere else.
-------------------- Capliberty: "I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "
Edited by alpharedecho (09/28/06 11:21 AM)
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Basilides
Servent ofWisdom


Registered: 02/10/06
Posts: 7,059
Loc: Crown and Heart
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: SirTripAlot]
#6111204 - 09/28/06 12:22 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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The difference here is that I present a solution.
You do not. We already know there is a problem with the Muslim world. Muslims who wish to take up arms against the civilized world will always be killed for the security of others, but where your approach fails utterly is when you begin to broach Muslims who do not pick up guns. You have no diplomatic approach.
The world needs to give moderate Muslims a reason to reform. Right now, with Muslim countries being invaded/bombed left and right (literally) by Western powers, the majority of Muslims have no reason to reform - because as they see it, the "civilized world" is waging a war on their religion and culture.
And yes, patience (or compassion, however you wish to call it) is the only option short of destroying the Islamic religion as a whole. You seem to forget that Islam is here to stay. You do not insult what is now historically eternal if your goal is cosmopolitan, not political and cultural duality. Reform is the only viable option. There are no other options. Emberassing Muslims is not an option. Calling Islam inherently violent to the face of every man, woman and child is not an option. Bombing Muslim countries into submission is not an option. The only option is diplomacy, regardless how painfully long it takes. It is either diplomacy my friend, or a war of elimination and cultural dominance.
You have no solution. The rest of the world does, and that is why many for the most part are attempting to build bridges, not burn them down.
What is your solution? You have none. You're just sitting there (ass and thumb) shouting "Islam is bad". Again, either advocate the elimination of Islam, or contribute something that isn't completely benighted with apocalyptic dualism.
Personally, I think you're simply on a fence - with rational thought on one side, and your contempt for Islam and Muslims on the other. It shows in your willingness to avoid diplomacy while attempting to rationalize it at the same time. You're a smart guy, you should be intelligent enough to see that diplomacy is the only answer short of elimination. You say you will never advocate such an elimination, hence why you are drawing a blank when I ask what your solution is.
At any rate, I'm done here. I enjoyed the discussion.
--------------------
    "Have you found the beginning, then, that you are looking for the end? You see, the end will be where the beginning is. Congratulations to the one who stands at the beginning: that one will know the end and will not taste death."
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Asante
Omnicyclion prophet


Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,643
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Hank, FTW]
#6111285 - 09/28/06 12:39 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
1 death is too many, it doesn't have to be a bloodbath.
Why the machine guns then?
Quote:
The fact is, when our embassies start getting over run, it's time to bust out the machine guns, not sit back while people get killed.
Quote:
BTW up until about 30 years ago, America was 90% white, so take that melting pot shit somewhere else.
Melting pot shit? 
Even a 90% white country isn't a white country, and a 10% minority across millions of people is a HUGE minority.
So a 10% minority should be swept under the rug? I think not.
I don't believe in a melting pot, but in a salad bowl. A melting pot turns every different thing into one and the same. That's wrong.
A salad bowl however is interesting because of all the colors, shapes, textures and tastes. People should retain their diversity. If you throw a tasty salad in a blender, you end up with a bland dish.
This is the reason behind the campaigns to be welcoming of diversity: its best for all involved.
-------------------- Omnicyclion.org higher knowledge starts here
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Hank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Asante]
#6111331 - 09/28/06 12:50 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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You couldn't be more flawed. How does a people maintain their distinct culture when they integrate and intermarry on a massive scale. If that were to happen, in so many generations eventually we will all look the same, and believe the same thing. I don't want that, that is why I propose we keep some countries separate, for those who choose.
If massive immigration keeps happening, and people continue down this path, eventually all cultures and ethnicities will be merged into one. I know this will take a very long time, but the point is, it WILL happen eventually.
Also, your blood bath comment is very aggravating.
I hope you are in an embassy one day, and a cartoon causes the native population to over run it.
Then, when there are no arms in said embassy, you will think of me. Of course that is just wishful thinking.(no I do not wish any harm on you, just trying to show a point).
You try and downplay the act of violence when it is in retaliation to a cartoon, but you call it a blood bath when it is in self defense.
Sometimes I think people are too "evolved" for their own good.
I am a firm believer in survival of the fittest.
-------------------- Capliberty: "I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "
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Redstorm
Prince of Bugs



Registered: 10/08/02
Posts: 44,175
Last seen: 6 months, 28 days
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Hank, FTW]
#6112124 - 09/28/06 04:17 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
BTW up until about 30 years ago, America was 90% white, so take that melting pot shit somewhere else.
We don't live 30 years ago. We live now, in the present, where those statistics are not the truth.
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Hank, FTW
Looking for the Answer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 3,912
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Redstorm]
#6112139 - 09/28/06 04:23 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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I do, I have time machine!
-------------------- Capliberty: "I'll blow the hinges off your freakin doors with my trips, level 5 been there, I personally like x, bud, acid and shroom oj, altogether, do that combination, and you'll meet some morbid figures, lol Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "
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SirTripAlot
Semper Fidelis


Registered: 01/11/05
Posts: 7,782
Loc: Harmless (Mostly)
Last seen: 41 minutes, 32 seconds
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Re: Censor for the sake of the Muslims, (Fuck You Southpark!) [Re: Basilides]
#6112676 - 09/28/06 07:28 PM (17 years, 7 months ago) |
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We disagree, And I never stated that about Islam.
-------------------- “I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.”
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