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Offlinethe_END
Mr. E
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cold shocking, who does it?
    #6066820 - 09/16/06 01:19 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

as far as ive been reading some do and some dont.
i tried it once and it did initiate pinning.

but that will all happen either way once you put it in the fruiting chamber.

so is cold shocking an idea that was put in there sometime, realised it did initiate pinning so somebody decided to use it, i mean its not like it speeds anything up right?

so yea, im kind of confused i have a cake thats 100% right now i caan shock it or fruit it. any suggestions?

edit: ... or wait for 2 more cakes o become 100% and try my luck with a casing?

Edited by the_END (09/16/06 01:24 AM)

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OfflineHippieChick
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: the_END]
    #6066834 - 09/16/06 01:31 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

I didn't when I did cakes . Dunk and roll or DEC this cake and try a little casing with the other 2 .

Peace,Love,Happiness and Harmony
:heart: Hippie Chick  :mushroom2:


--------------------
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OfflineWestnile
Disease yo!

Registered: 08/23/06
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: HippieChick]
    #6067060 - 09/16/06 08:03 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Some people dunk and put their cakes in the fridge. If you want to experiment with cold shocking to see how it works for you this is a good way. Like say your already taking the time to dunk, why not throw it in the fridge? You know?

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Invisibleesdfsfd
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6067363 - 09/16/06 10:35 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

i dunked my cause they were really dry and blue, got some monster fruits off them though...2 shrooms were each 1/8th ounce dry

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Invisiblemonstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work

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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: esdfsfd]
    #6067390 - 09/16/06 10:44 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

no person with any experience or knowledge would even consider
cold-shocking a cubensis species.


we dunk in the fridge to ward of bacteria, that is the only reason.


--------------------


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OfflineWestnile
Disease yo!

Registered: 08/23/06
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: monstermitch]
    #6067567 - 09/16/06 11:58 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Hmm, funny. I have both experence and knowledge. I have dunked in the fridge and its worked really well. A drop in temp helps initiate pinning. No rocket science here.

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Invisiblecreamcorn
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6067632 - 09/16/06 12:30 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

what mitch said.

cakes belong in the fridge for one of two reasons: you're dunking and don't want them to become contaminated with bacteria (which can happen in a matter of hours otherwise at room temp), or two, you're purposely stalling it to save it for later, to delay birthing

cubensis is not a cold weather species. it does not need low temperatures to signal fruiting. the "temperature drop" as a pinning trigger happens automatically - a colonizing cake or substrate produces some of its own heat; when it gets to 100% it stops heating itself - and the combination of introducing that to fresh air so there's circulation around it is all the slight temp drop you need.

if you've cold shocked something, and saw it pin shortly after - well guess what, it was going to pin all the same. you didn't make it happen with the cold shock and if anything you delayed it slightly.

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OfflineCantiSama

Registered: 10/21/04
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6067678 - 09/16/06 12:54 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Westnile said:
Hmm, funny. I have both experence and knowledge. I have dunked in the fridge and its worked really well. A drop in temp helps initiate pinning. No rocket science here.




the fallacy of association as causation - just because it was in the fridge doesn't mean it that is why it pinned.

i have a magic tennis ball that keeps me alive. i am alive, so the tennis ball must be magic. right? no.


--------------------
Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
Man got to sit and wonder 'why, why, why?'
Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
Man got to tell himself he understand.

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Offline2FiNiTe
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: CantiSama]
    #6068367 - 09/16/06 05:13 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

CantiSama said:
Quote:

Westnile said:

i have a magic tennis ball that keeps me alive. i am alive, so the tennis ball must be magic. right? no.




A fact too many times overlooked, the damn magic tennis ball.


--------------------
"Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants. We know more about war that we know about peace, more about killing that we know about living."

General Omar N. Bradley

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OfflineWestnile
Disease yo!

Registered: 08/23/06
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: CantiSama]
    #6068420 - 09/16/06 05:33 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks guys I can really feel the love.

Its been noted on several forums for years now that cold shocking as a means for encouraging pinning is a viable practice.

Heres a page in the shroomery FAQ pointing out some of the benefits and uses of cold shocking.
Cold shocking

Also according to Stamets: The Mushroom Cultivator, a 10 degree drop in temperature to 74-78 degrees Fahrenheit is generally enough to initiate the pinning process.

While it is true that in many cases the 10 degree drop has worked fine, as I'm sure you have experienced, there are cases where it doesn't work fine or a pin set could be greatly improved with a cold shock.

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Invisiblemonstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work

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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6068463 - 09/16/06 05:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)



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OfflineWestnile
Disease yo!

Registered: 08/23/06
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: monstermitch]
    #6068510 - 09/16/06 06:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Soooo, from these posts provided by monstermitch, we can see that

a)There has been alot of debate about cold shocking in the past.
b)Experenced culivators have different takes on cold shocking.
c) cold shocking has successfully been used for stopping vegitative growth. Which means that it is used for more then warding of bacteria.

Are we cool yet?

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Invisiblemonstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work

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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6068596 - 09/16/06 06:41 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

yeah, whatever works.


that's all that matters anyway.

if you get better results cold shocking, then do it.

in the end, we all want the same thing:

correct information for all, and success for all.


--------------------


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Offlinehyphae
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: monstermitch]
    #6068644 - 09/16/06 07:01 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

monstermitch said:
no person with any experience or knowledge would even consider
cold-shocking a cubensis species.


we dunk in the fridge to ward of bacteria, that is the only reason.



I've always experienced positive results when fridge dunking cakes. I do not coldshock casings however but I do follow optimal parameters closely between incubating and fruiting. Cold shocking is also a valuable when working with very aggressive myc as well as coir based casing mixes but only the pros realize this and use it to their advantage. :wink: :thumbup:


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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Offlinehyphae
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Westnile]
    #6068661 - 09/16/06 07:09 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Westnile said:
Soooo, from these posts provided by monstermitch, we can see that

a)There has been alot of debate about cold shocking in the past.
b)Experenced culivators have different takes on cold shocking.
c) cold shocking has successfully been used for stopping vegitative growth. Which means that it is used for more then warding of bacteria.

Are we cool yet?



Well your a bright one! Welcome to the Shroomery bro you'll learn fast!  :thumbup: :thumbup:


--------------------
Getting the most out of your casings!, A pinning strategy.
Oyster Shell "Flour" $2 for 1lb. a hell of a deal :wink:
Not what is overlay but rather what overlay is
Gas Exchange vs. FAE

"We all have priorities. I used a closet once setup a nice little lab trouble was all the shit that was in there ended up in the bedroom that pissed off the GF then I ended up dumping her as she was getting in the way of my sterile culture technique! Ya I got priorities too!!!"

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Offlinethe_END
Mr. E
Male

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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: hyphae]
    #6068752 - 09/16/06 07:55 PM (17 years, 6 months ago)

well, jsut for your info.
i gave that cake i menioned an 8 hour dunk, not refridgerated.. and so far its just chillen, no pins or knots

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Offlinegringoman
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: esdfsfd]
    #6069895 - 09/17/06 03:32 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

esdfsfd said:
i dunked my cause they were really dry and blue, got some monster fruits off them though...2 shrooms were each 1/8th ounce dry



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InvisibleRoadkillM
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: hyphae]
    #6070179 - 09/17/06 09:29 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

hyphae said:

Quote:

monstermitch said:

no person with any experience or knowledge would even consider
cold-shocking a cubensis species.


we dunk in the fridge to ward of bacteria, that is the only reason.




I've always experienced positive results when fridge dunking cakes. I do not coldshock casings however but I do follow optimal parameters closely between incubating and fruiting. Cold shocking is also a valuable when working with very aggressive myc as well as coir based casing mixes but only the pros realize this and use it to their advantage. :wink: :thumbup:




:thumbup:


tc


--------------------
Laterz, Road

Who the hell you callin crazy?
You wouldn't know what crazy was if Charles Manson was eating froot loops on your front porch!


Brainiac said:
PM the names with on there names, that means they have mushrooms for sale.


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Invisiblemonstermitch
Growing in Bags Doesn't Work

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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Roadkill]
    #6070192 - 09/17/06 09:40 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

so I will officially change my position...


cold shocking has it's place with cubes, but those places are limited.


cold shocking should be used to halt overly aggressive mycelium,
to halt mycelium from colonizing a coir based casing,
or otherwise to stop vegetative growth.

because that's what the "cold shock" is doing, stopping the
vegetative growth.

for the above mentioned cases, this can help bring on a pinset
quicker than without a cold shock.
but be warned that it may increase the time between flushes,
therefore you may ultimately gain nothing in time.

Cold shocking should be used in moderation and only when it is needed.
It is not a practice that will benefit all those who wish for quicker pinning.
It will most likely slow down those people.

______________________________


as for cakes:

cakes are very, very dense.

they require much longer than a few hours to dunk.
they need more like 24 hours for the water to truly be absorbed.

therefore, sitting in that stagnant water for so long, the cakes
are for sure inviting contamination.

bacteria can bloom in hours if these dunking cakes are left at
room temperature.

therefore, putting the cakes in the fridge for the dunk protects them.
the low temperature will stop the bacteria from blooming and keep
your cakes protected.

this is the only reason the fridge is used for dunking cakes,
unless you're trying to stop the growth of the mycelium.


--------------------


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: cold shocking, who does it? [Re: Roadkill]
    #6070206 - 09/17/06 09:47 AM (17 years, 6 months ago)

"Cold shocking" takes several days. You must indicate to temperature sensitive mycelium that a change in seasons has occured.

Dunking in the refrigerator is good practice because it keeps bacterial blooms under control while the organic material of the cake is under water.

However, it must be undestood that dunking for 24 hours in the refrigerator is NOT cold shocking.

Cold shocking is for edibles such as agaricus, shiitake, p nameko, shaggy manes, etc.

Tropical species do not benefit from a cold shock.
RR


--------------------
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