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 EntheogenicPeace Scholar   Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:11 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist   Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Quote: For this reason, i affirm that psychedelics, magic mushrooms in particular, are the key to slowing down further development of male-ego operated machines of hierarchal societies. Because essentially, this is the basic issue that connects to all the problems we are continually facing as a global species.; be it war, poverty, or the exponentially increasing pollution of the planet. We are facing these challenges because our exisiting social order is built according to a system that is carried on the back of millions (maybe even billions) of human beings, only to serve a selected few ruling groups who can pull the strings from above and alter the programming of the social structure to its own selfish and ego-driven needs. This is cleary a pyramid that is erected and shaped by male-dominance values. Terence Mckenna has covered this reality in full detail and even perscribed the cure, which he believed, to be the neurological and spiritual effects of entheogenic mushrooms. Examples of female values, such as compassion, generosity, kindness, understanding, conservation, etc. etc. etc. are needed to balance out the scale. Entheogens highlight exactly these ethics in the user, they decondition the merely cultural and bring about senses of renewal and acceptance for the natural workings of life, death, nature, higher and lower cosmic forces. A bemushroomed person will have respect for these workings and the self-regulating system they operate in. They provide glimpses of the unexplainable, endorse creativity, free thought, and the choice to live a life of deeper meaning. Paint this in the picture and it will not come by surprise to comprehend the agendas working against the "the right of every American citizen to lead the religious life of his own conviction, to worship, to experience, to commune with universal forces, to transcend his ego and dissolve the petty differences that divide men whom love should bind, to seek religious ecstasy, revelation and truth as men have done throughout the ages." (Leary) Quote: Quote:  
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:12 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:12 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Thanks for the recommendation. Sounds interesting and i will bookmark it.
 At the moment i am reading The Phenomenon of Man by Pierre Teilhard de Chardin (no matter how hard i try, i can never correctly pronounce his name). In it he covers his self-coined concepts of the "noosphere" and the "omega point" which i am almost positive you are familiar with, if not then definitely check it out!  This thread is getting me all warmed up so i'll continue. Quote: Utopia. I often feel this term is generally misunderstood. Most people tend to associate it with the "perfect society", "a place free of conflict and problems". I don't think that is the true meaning of the word. As you said loss of ego is the path to utopia, which i envision to be a personal state of acceptance for a world that will never be perfect, 100% trouble-free, and the way we always want it to be. Life is just too varied and multi-facetted to fit everyone's ideals. There will always be someone who disagrees, opposes, and attacks. Attacking only to defend their own insecurities about what they hold true. In the end, love, respect, understanding, and gratitude will prevail for these values cannot be killed by a gun, or bombs. No matter how hard the male will try to repress the female, the female will always slip through its grip, like water, like sand, like air. This is its self-balancing nature. This allows existence to unfold, step by step, without overflowing. The male drives, the female brakes, to save the male who will drive faster and faster until he eventually crashes. The female brakes, the male drives, to save the female who will go slower and slower until she eventually comes to a hold. Yin Yang, this and that, here and there, now and now. Whoops, i'm rambling again. I'm just coming down some cubies right now so visonary thought is in full gear.  The bottomline: We create our own utopias, we realize our own dreams, we program our own realities, so pick up the brush, get the colors, and start painting your life.  hope to hear more of your insights and am welcoming everyone else to join in!
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 leery11 I Tell You What!  Registered: 06/24/05 Posts: 5,998 Last seen: 9 years, 15 days |
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I have a huge bias against anything male......
This is a good thread to read. I value masculine traits but they must be heavily balanced with the feminine. It is great to see women who have masculinity because it means they have questioned the authority of the social roles they were prescribed and dared to attempt to express themselves more spiritually and wholly. It is equally great to see femnine men. But yes a balance is in order because I myself have become almost entirely too passive by embracing femininity and shunning the male way of the bomb, the rope, the gun, the knife, the conflict. The confrontation. The ego battle. What effect does dropping out have on the collective mind? What happens when say a few thousand people take acid..... how do their minds affect the flowing of Earth as compared to the minds of those million who tune into each episode of 24 every night? Who has more power? When you trip you realize you don't exist, you are just the summation of all parts of reality and are in a constant process of authoring yourself, either strenghtening the ego, attaching and identifying with what you encounter, or softening it and attempting to free yourself. Or perhaps both simultaneously. But Tim Leary is right that we are the products of authority. I think it is sad that society got so bad that LSD and rampant drug escapism had to emerge in order to counter our rigid stagnation. Then again, the curious thing is if humans had instant and easy access to nirvana, there wouldn't be any humans sticking around....... ideally all cultures would allow people conveniant acess to religious states, through whatever methods, but disciplined and constructive, but those societies seem to get RAVAGED by the "evil" side of humanity that thinks its all just savagery. Sitting around smoking the peace pipe, you are the trees, you are the pipe..... savagery. Genocide upon a native people and removing their autonomy to make way for the money machine.... noble? Hurrah for the noble savage. --------------------  ....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human...... Edited by leery11 (09/10/06 07:25 PM)
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apfrommsp Just a box ofrai  Registered: 07/17/06 Posts: 1,171 Last seen: 16 years, 4 months |
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im pissed that drugs mushrooms are illegal cuz since they are i have got a felony...assholes
-------------------- "It's a joke. Greed and the desire to take drugs are two separate things. If you want to separate the two, the thing you do is make drugs legal. Accept the reality that people do want to change their consciousness, and make an effort to make safer, healthier drugs."
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wortiesbo  Registered: 03/18/06 Posts: 866 Loc: new vegas Last seen: 6 years, 2 months |
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Quote: and this has anything to do with the current topic? -------------------- 
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apfrommsp Just a box ofrai Registered: 07/17/06 Posts: 1,171 Last seen: 16 years, 4 months |
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no...
-------------------- "It's a joke. Greed and the desire to take drugs are two separate things. If you want to separate the two, the thing you do is make drugs legal. Accept the reality that people do want to change their consciousness, and make an effort to make safer, healthier drugs."
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:13 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Whatever goes up must come down. Whoever rests on top will eventually fall to the bottom. So is creation and destruction, life and death, liberty and tyranny.
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AnthonyStoner Stoner  Registered: 09/18/06 Posts: 86 Loc: Beyond the realm Last seen: 14 years, 2 months |
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My main points of view on this issue are as follows: if magic mushrooms are a public health concern, then what the hell is alcohol and tobacco?
Mushrooms grow naturally on this planet, as does weed. Therefore it should not be illegal. Very simple. To outlaw nature is an insane, paranoid and extremely arrogant thing, a fact which is obvious to anybody who's power of rational perception and reasoning is functioning correctly (ie hasnt been too badly polluted by propaganda and scare tactics). If you're going to declare war on drugs, why do you wanna exclude alcohol (which kills tons more people than shrooms or weed ever did) and tobacco (ditto)? Declare war on yourself instead. -------------------- If I medicined you, you'd think a brain tumor was a birthday present. Dave's not here! Edited by AnthonyStoner (09/18/06 08:23 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Quote: You are right, any rational mind should immediately see through this nonsense. It is absolutely ludicrous to make a plant illegal, or any other life form for that matter. Such a stance clearly derives from the popular arrogant mentality that ‘man is above nature’, above as in, having the power to make life and take life, a power that we must ironically surrender to ourselves due to our biology and obvious place in nature. We are not above nature, or below nature; we are nature. We are Life. So why does nobody get this? Because it’s spinned. Plants and mushrooms are illegal because they’re bad for you, but sure go ahead, drive down to the liquor store, buy a case of beer and a bottle of johnny, and while you’re there, grab a pack of cigs which we so heavily advertise.. Do people see this? No. Or maybe yes. Perhaps people do see this. Maybe people do realize this absurdity, but how can they speak out? What outlets do they have available? What institutions exist that allow people to make direct requests concerning the irrationality of some legislation? Your local township council? Sure thing, just drop a letter in their mailbox, they’ll read it, discuss it briefly at a meeting, dismiss it, and it will be a thing of the past, the voice of the troubled people will be forgotten, no change will be made, and the ridiculous laws remain in the books. The central problem is the design of our social system. You can say crime is an issue, abuse is an issue, or you can go as far as saying that oil is the issue and politics is the issue. Surely, these are all issues, but they are not the problem. The problem cannot be solved by clearing up the issues, the problem itself as a whole must be solved, then the issues will take care of themselves, since they are all part of the problem. And the problem is clearly the design of society. So what’s so wrong with the social system of today’s culture? The problem is that power is centralized, and not evenly distributed amongst the whole. This allows very few people on top to control the lives of millions. People on the bottom of the pyramid virtually have no power in the decision making of any laws, including drug laws, or laws concerning the environment, or laws of military nature, and not to mention they have no voice on matters of foreign relations. The individual member of society has no control over any of these aspects. Only the very few people who have centralized power, can pull the strings any way they want, and they are always pulled to meet their own needs, not the needs of the majority. Not the needs of you and me. Straight up, this is the consequence of a democratic society that has elected itself into a fascist society. Alcohol and tobacco are permitted because they serve the elite’s interests. Alcohol is known to be an ego-nurturing drug, it promotes violent territorial behavior, irrational foggy thinking, and plain irresponsibility. Tobacco, like caffeine, is a so-called industrial drug, it stimulates the central nervous system and is therefore an ideal catalyst for production. That’s why you find people drinking coffee everywhere at their jobs, it keeps you awake and working longer, it's the holy water of corporatism, it keeps the economy rolling, and that again is all in the ruling power’s interest, money, money, money. Mushrooms and Cannabis? Are you crazy? Drugs that promote free thought, creativity, peaceful behavior, and respect towards other human beings? Drugs that allow you to find God? They cannot have that. Our social structure would crumble if people were concerned about peace, love, and spirituality. And this shows exactly that there is something wrong with our society. Because if you have a society that will fall apart due to the values of peace, love, and free spirit, and can only be maintained by war, conflict, prohibition, control, and a mechanistic world view, well then, that clearly proves that the design is flawed. And that is exactly what people must recognize and become aware of. And i think we must also act on it, and not be afraid to start this thing from scratch again. So instead of dropping your complaint letter in the mailbox of the local court house, go out and hug a stranger, teach people truth and educate about matters that truly matter. This is the clear way to go, it’s the first step to improving society and our own lives, and the first step towards legalizing life again.   
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AnthonyStoner Stoner Registered: 09/18/06 Posts: 86 Loc: Beyond the realm Last seen: 14 years, 2 months |
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Quote: Very well said! 
-------------------- If I medicined you, you'd think a brain tumor was a birthday present. Dave's not here!
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:14 PM)
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Economist in training  Registered: 10/11/05 Posts: 1,285 Last seen: 16 years, 7 months |
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I really think this thread is the perfect example of why most psychedelics are not likely to be legalized any time in the near future.
I just do not understand how the "pro-drug" movement, which decries the values of being open-minded and all-allowing became so closed-minded and narrow-sighted in such a short period of time. For a group so dedicated to fostering understanding and friendship, they are the fastest to employ labels, stereotypes, and one-sided viewpoints. By reading the posts in this thread, I'm honestly saddened by how little so many out there seem to understand our world, and why capitalism has actually prevailed for so long. When I hear people talk about dreamers, the first names that come to my mind are Ray Kroc and Sam Walton. Walton did not go out and develop Walmart for the express purpose of "enslaving the world". He had an idea, a dream, that he could provide more goods to more people, and do it better, than anyone else in the world. And you know what? He was right. Or how about Ray Kroc? He thought that he could provide fast and inexpensive food to millions throughout the world. And you know what? He did it. He succeeded in his dreams. You can complain about ill-treated chickens, or hormone-induced beef, but that wasn't really his goal, it was just a means to an end. He was willing to do whatever it took to achieve his dreams, including ground breaking research into fields barely touched before. The world has never seen anything as prolific as McDonalds, it should be studied and celebrated, not reviled. You say we *are* nature, and then you refer to human actions as unnatural. How can this be? If we are nature, and we can learn how to make chickens grow faster, beef develop better for our needs, how can that be unnatural? The "global social order" doesn't exist for the purposes of oppression and belittlement, it exists because people with dreams weren't afraid to achieve them. Capitalism has endured for so long across so many cultures because it embodies the human spirit. Capitalism allows anyone with a dream to go out and achieve it, and our dreams have taken us farther than ever before. Look at current medical posibilities, the newly developed bionic limb, private spaceflight, the GM foods that can feed millions in Africa. We have all of these things because of the social order created by capitalism, and God willing, that will not go away any time soon. What happens when we try to implement the kinds of changes called for in this thread? When we really do spread complete power across all of the masses? We get the war in Iraq. Say what you want, but pre-invasion no matter what poll you looked at, a majority of Americans wanted it, and that's the truth. Or, you can get France, with massive unemployment, racial unrest, and religious intollerance. You get racially-biased laws, the anti-immigration acts, and you get a prohibition on alcohol. Now, I think that it's important that steps towards legalization are taken (or at the very least, decriminalization). But they cannot be held back by arguments about the "fundamental nature of society" that are inherently one-sided and employ broad labels or stereotypes. Look at how the Civil Rights movement was won. Who accomplished more, the Black Panthers, and their efforts to create a marxist society in America, or the NAACP who hired lawyers and won Brown v. Board of Ed.? If you want to end the regime of prohibition you have to do it constructively, not destructively. Gather statistics, prove points, take cases to court, this will get results in the end. Namecalling and nonsense speaking will lead you nowhere.
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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You bring up many points at once so I took a day to reflect on your statements.
 It seems to me that you connect capitalism with the concept of psychedelic freedom which is what is being discussed in this thread. By doing so you are linking money and religious freedom with another. This proves to be an unreal link because survival and the drive to make meaning of life are on two completely different sides of the river. Money is not freedom. Surely, money can open up possibilities, but it will never be directly responsible for spiritual fulfillment and happiness. This responsibility solely lies in the human being himself and is beyond material dreams. Quote: What “pro-drug” movement are you speaking of? Don’t you realize that this is a label in itself, just another one-sided viewpoint. Look at the bigger picture. Quote:  I’m not sure if you glorify McDonalds in the sense that it has made a few people “winners in the game of capitalism” or that it values profits more than the quality of their food. At any rate McDonalds is a just what it is, a corporation. Quote: The corporation does not represent the people. Most certainly it is an entity created by human dreams, but once established it does not serve the interests of the people and neither does it value life; corporations don’t have a conscience or any sense of right and wrong. They’re only a means to an end, rightly so. Just because somebody has a dream of making the world a better place doesn’t mean that reality will represent the nature of his or her vision. In fact it is more likely the case that reality will turn out to be entirely different from the ideas originally dreamt of. Individual people may have great ideas but in order for them to come to fruition they must be processed through the “Global Social System” which I am arguing is flawed and as I said before does not take into account the preservation of life. What I am saying to you is that it does just the opposite, it destroys life. And this is the central problem that is at hand. This is the flaw. This is the kind of society we raise our children in. War is what they learn, war on drugs, war on terror, war on nature, even war on themselves. We tell them that war is wrong and that peace is good, but they are also brought up being told that there will always be war and that peace is nothing but a pipe dream, that war is the only way. The American people supported the war on Iraq because they were told that war is the only possible solution, and they believed it. To give you an example, if a newborn is raised inside a cave, isolated from everyone but one person, and is told by that person that there is no outside world, and is raised that way from the day he is born, it becomes the only reality he will ever know. The possibility of an outside world, or anything beyond his belief system, will simply be non-existent. Yet the outside world is there, independent of what he knows and believes. What this means is that we don’t know anything other than what we tell ourselves. When people only talk about war, there will only be war. One has to be open to possibilities, then only can changes be implemented in a fashion that can be consciously directed. Quote: I am not for the legalization of psychedelics. I want to alegalize them. Laws in my opinion should not have any rule over what plants can be eaten or smoked. What I take past the barrier of my skin into myself cannot be regulated by an outside power. Decisions that I make within my nervous system are my responsibility only. Would you like it if you were told what you can eat and drink or when you can go to sleep? Yeah, me either. To legalize something is still to assume that a law or an external regulation can rule upon my internal order. To go fight this in a court of law is to believe that neurological responsibility lies not in my own hands. This is beyond law, beyond economies, and beyond government. This is not a political issue, this is clearly a humanistic issue. Entheogenic freedom means that you and only you have the power to do what you wish in this lifetime as long as it does not harm a non-consenting other. There is more to this than just psychedelic plants, this is about states of awareness, being able to experience any level of consciousness, whether you reach these states through meditation, extreme sports, Sunday night football, sex, or consciousness-expanding drugs is entirely up to you. Noone can dictate to you how you get in touch with god; to every spirit his own way. Finally, Quote: the answer is neither. Individual freedom is not a structure to be erected or taken down. Freedom is an ever-changing process. It is the choices we make that are based upon what we think, feel, and dream. The human spirit is not static, it is fluid and dynamic. Structure only eliminates choice, and thus the case of prohibition is not something to be constructed or destructed, it is something to be transcended.
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Edited by AlteredAgain (09/23/06 01:49 AM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:16 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:16 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:17 PM)
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MushmanTheManic Stranger  Registered: 04/21/05 Posts: 4,587 |
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I really think this thread is the perfect example of why most psychedelics are not likely to be legalized any time in the near future.
I'm glad someone pointed this out. Why it is so hard for some people to discuss drug policy without associating it with auxiliary movements and philosophies is beyond my conception. It naturally limits the acceptance of the movement to those who also accept the same perspectives, which in this case is quite small. The anti-prohibition movement will never be taken seriously until it abandons its fringe, minority perspectives and begins to simply rationally discuss the harm prohibition causes within our society. Combining drug policy reform with new-age or Marxist ideas only damages our credibility. The organizations, such as MPP, that have caused legislative change have not done so by pushing a radical and sensationalized message. All they seem to need are facts and funds. Edited by MushmanTheManic (09/25/06 12:21 AM)
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MushmanTheManic Stranger Registered: 04/21/05 Posts: 4,587 |
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While inebriated (more like illuminated if you ask me) on psychedelics, one has a child-like awe for life in all its forms and complexities. They are also enlightened to their relations with family & friends, and feel compassion towards them. This compassion, in turn, extends to other people and other living things. They make you want to learn and understand, not hate and destroy.
I've had plenty of experiences, and could cite the experiences of others, that falsify this claim. The Manson family comes to mind...
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:20 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:21 PM)
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Economist in training Registered: 10/11/05 Posts: 1,285 Last seen: 16 years, 7 months |
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I also tried to spend some time meditating on your response, so I could find the best way to word this. I find that the big disconnect about capitalism exists because they believe that the end goal of everyone in a capitalist society is the accumulation of money.
That is not what capitalism is truly about. Capitalism is about getting what you want and being greedy for "it" regardless of what "it" is. Members of the capitalist community whose only goal is dollars in the bank are akin to mushroom-eaters whose only goal is to "trip balls", they have almost entirely missed the point. The greatest capitalists in our society have never had end goals of "money in the bank". The Rockefellers, Morgans, and Carnegies (as well as our Gates, Buffets, and Bransons today) all risked (or gave away) their assets even after they were "rich" because they wanted to build, explore, and discover. Capitalism is also about true freedom, something that transcends even religion. For, if you could buy and sell *anything*, what freedom do you not have? An idea is as much a commodity as an orange. Capitalism is about being able to sell your book and your speach as it as about being able to sell your car. There's no room for censorship, slavery, or discrimination if you are free to sell your ideas, labor, and patronage. Capitalism is also not about war. Successful corporations (contrary to popular belief) do not declare war. Take a look at the Forbes 500 sometime. Walmart, Microsoft, Pfizer, Procter & Gamble, Citigroup, JP Morgan Chase, these are all in the top 20, and none of them benefit from death or destruction. Companies pull out when a war takes place, investment drops off, and consumers stop spending. As with the individuals who want to "trip balls" or simply accumulate large sums of money, so too are the few (for they truly are a minority of companies) businesses that want to see wars take place a misguided group. More often than not, these businesses are the result of nepotism, not capitalism. Were the market for Pentagon contracts truly free, and not a wink-and-nod between current and former Pentagon officials holding positions at Halliburton or Brown & Root, things would most likely be different. But that is a flaw in the democracy side of the equation, the failure to guarantee open bidding, over classification of documents, and giving bureaucrats, not elected officials, the capacity to award contracts. Capitalism has nothing to do with any of these problems. On the issue of the corporation, I think that the corporation is misunderstood somehow. The corporation is the culmination of human existance. It is the vehicle by which the many working together can truly become more tahn they ever would have been seperately. Any corporation which the market does not break up truly is worth more than the sum of its parts (for otherwise it would be broken up and sold off). That's possibly the most amazing idea the human race has ever stumbled upon. True, quantification that the whole is worth more than the parts. Millions of individuals working together consentually, across the globe, towards one goal. I can think of few wonders of nature that even begin to rival this. As for freedom and transcending, I agree that decisions individuals make about what they do to their bodies should be their own, and not the governments. I do, however, believe that the ends justify the means (I've always felt that way, I'm a capitalist ) and so if we need to gather lawyers and statistics in order to overcome the current regime, then so be it.The ends of legalization (or depenalization) more than outway the possible values tread upon to achieve them. The legal reasoning will become less important later, evolving as it did from the beginning of prohibition to now: a regime of legal use could easily be used to justify greater freedom down the road. @EntheogenicPeace You made several points, many of which I hope were answered above. To the specific claim of why are psychedelics illegal, I offer the following answer: To claim that it has anything to do with industry or the economy is to rewrite history, and for some reason quite a bit of that seems to have been going on recently. The fact of the matter is that when psychedelics were outlawed the Soviet Union was a far more pressing threat than anything we face today. They had enough weapons to kill humanity twice over, they were violent, they were unpredictable, and they hated us. To truly understand how dangerous the Soviet Union was, you have to look at Afghanistan. They tried to ANNEX Afghanistan during the 1980s. No one in the world was going out to conquer territory anymore, that was something left on the other side of WWII. And yet, there the Soviets were, attacking for litterally no other reason than to gain territory (unless there's some massive resource in Afghanistan that has never been discovered since). The Soviet Union told us they would crush us beneath their heels, they gave weapons to our enemies, and they routinely offered to launch their nuclear weapons. What's worse, we didn't know if we could respond. Consider: You're the President of the US and you just learned that the Soviets have ordered a complete full-scale nuclear attack. You now have 2 options. 1) Launch back and end human existance. 2) Don't launch and die unavenged, but secure in the knowledge that humanity might have a chance. Which would you choose? The reality was that the US would have most likely chosen the 2nd, and everyone knew it. So you don't even have a recourse in the "doctrine" of mutually assured destruction/ Now, you find yourself locked in a conflict on the other side of the world. You are fighting with the Soviets (they armed, trained, and funded the Viet Cong), and the battle is getting desperate. Most of the local population support you (remember how many scrambled to leave Saigon when the Americans did?) but your opponents are not about terrorism, killing innocents, killing family members, and torture. Litterally billions of lives may depend on the outcome of this conflict (there was no way to predict an anti-Soviet post-war Vietnam in the 1960s/1970s). Now, picture this, you're the US government and you have to deal with this every second or every minute of every day. By the time you're the Nixon administration, you didn't even start the war, the Democrats did. There is no recourse for you, you are the first last and only line of defense for the American people against an enemy that was willing to kill millions of their own citizens, let alone the rest of humanity. And now, now you hear that a few hundred thousand American youths who engage in psychedelic use are disrupting your ability to protect 200 million lives. So you make a choice. It's a bad one, it limits freedom and will end up costing more money than the current conflict, but you were the only one who could make the choice, and so you made it. Again, I'm not saying it's the right choice, but I also can't fault them. I'm often shocked that people are afraid of terrorists the way they are, when you consider the truly base fear that was the Soviet Union. Terrorists may kill thousands, but the Soviets threatened billions of lives every day for decades, and they were an enemy that could not be captured, arrested, or put on trial.
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:23 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:24 PM)
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Economist in training Registered: 10/11/05 Posts: 1,285 Last seen: 16 years, 7 months |
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So...this thread was about mushrooms, and you brought up Cannabis...
Also, I really tend not to trust sources that begin by calling themselves a "manifesto"...
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:24 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:24 PM)
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spacemonster i've evaporated  Registered: 04/07/04 Posts: 268 Loc: the comfy chair |
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Quote: Would you like it if some jackass who ate a bunch of "alegal" plants and chemicals drove down an imaginary rainbow highway through the side of your house? The fact is, people are irresponsible and they do irrational things. That's why we have laws, and if psychedelics are ever legalized they will most certainly still be regulated quite heavily. -------------------- I eat Rubik's Cubes.
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Quote: I would like to delve deeper into the nature of this statement. I think it is a solid claim and I am also glad that it has surfaced in this thought-provoking intelligent discussion. I myself am a person with radical ideas, that’s who I am, my thought is visionary and I am not afraid of sharing it. Yet anything in its extreme can be counter-productive and so logic is too a very essential form of thought which I try to balance myself out with. This whole drug-legalization movement that is happening right now is not really a movement more than it is a collective of split factions who all have their own basic ideas of freedom and own methods about how they would like to implement desired change in society. You have groups who want full legalization of all substances, groups only wanting cannabis to be freely available, others want no government regulation of drugs, there are also the medical marijuana groups, some who wish to only see cannabis being used as medicine, etc. You see, all these movements are pushing their own goals and agendas, they do not work together as an integrated whole, they are only parts of a puzzle which have no clearly defined picture. And this discussion isn’t even about cannabis in particular, we’re talking mushrooms here.. Anyone here who has had one good ego-shaking mushroom experience knows just how radical and counter-cultural these innocent looking fungi can be. Psilocybin causes some rather intense cultural boundary dissolution in the human mind, a bemushroomed person will laugh at police, question authority, de-recognize social institutions such as schools, courts, and burger kings. He will buffoon the red and blue, the right and left, the reps and the dems. Terrestrial politics and “economic hamster-wheeling” will all just seem ridiculous in the mind of someone who has his culturally imposed limitations melting away before his very eyes. Living off the land, respecting mother earth, preserving life will in contrast be more appealing and reasonable to one who has transcended his post-modern limitations. These are radical ideas which we are afraid to embrace because we are so obsessed with material security and having a supermarket right around the corner. We step away from neo-lithic non-competitive ways of life because we feel that doing so will devolve us so to speak, which is contrary to our popular belief that human beings are “meant” to advance into the future [what future]. We just simply cannot imagine a society other than our own. We were all brought up in the 20th centrury, raised by television and radio, we frankly don't know what a partnership society would be like, so we dismiss the possibility.. I believe that a logical method towards integrating psychedelic plants back into our culture is possible and it sure sounds like a rational way of going about it. But to organize a movement and roll it through the process of “courts, laws, and bills” will simply not happen in my humble opinion. A mechanistic society that works from nine to five, has no real connection to its planet anymore, and considers election year to be the only significant time to get involved and participate will never allow a “radical consciousness expanding drug” such as mushrooms to become freely accessible to its consumer units. This is why I don’t believe in its legalization and thus proclaim that this is a matter beyond law. I also think that this matter will be resolved eventually on its own once the machine of corporate globalization will operate itself out of control and eventually break down under its own weight. I see this coming sometime within the coming years, all the rants about the advent of armageddon are not illusionary, there is something going on underneath the surface of our collective psyche. What exactly is happening is something which can be discussed further in another topic, but the bottom line is if we really want to try to legalize mushrooms, it must be done “radicalogically” as I like to call it, we must form a synthesis of quick immediate action and precise planned out action. One or the other alone will never work, a radical approach will instantly be shut out by media and courtrooms, and a logical approach will never get past the multitude of laws which are now so engrained within the fabric of society. So yes i agree with you, I do not think that psychedelics will be legalized in the near future, but i disagree that it will be because of threads like this one.
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Edited by AlteredAgain (09/28/06 10:30 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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Quote: No i wouldn't be too fond of that happening and so i am glad that we have laws in place that punish people for actions that harm non-consenting others. Yes, people are extremely irresponsible nowadays. After all we have to get permission from the government for nearly everything we do. Ridiculous isn't it? Like we can't make our own choices anymore. So should we now criminalize alcohol because people get violent, or how about we just ban cars altogether because there are too many drunk drivers out on the road.. 
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musender13 Stranger Registered: 06/05/06 Posts: 5 Last seen: 15 years, 3 months |
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Okay, I really like everything you have said up to this point.
I agree that society is flawed, and we are stuck in a cycle that we basically created. But, I don't understand the alternative. How would a world that is full of love and peace work. I think it will always regress to the stage it is in now. There is hate and anger in the world and it escalates into the shit hole it is today. What needs to be done in order to create/maintain a "perfect" society. I realize that this is a heavy question, but it is something I have always wondered about and wanna hear other peoples ideas.
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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A heavy question indeed. The real question is, does it have an answer?
I think you hit the spot so I will try my best to give you my own personal idea on what is going on here. Please note that I will sidestep the thread title and delve deeper into the matter in favor of your momentous inquiry. Quote: It is important to first get a wide, all-including perspective of our world as it is today. Take a look around. What clearly stands out the most is what we call technological civilization. Our planet is tapestried with buildings, roads, railways, towers, factories, and skyscrapers, all which are soldered and cemented down to the earth, rooted by underground water pipes, electrical cables, and phone lines. Within these massive structures you have billions of smaller sized configurations such as cars, trucks, trains, planes, and ships, which transport material data (aka resources) and ideas all simultaneously, across nearly every geographical location on the planet. Then, you have even smaller technological objects which numbers jump into the trillions. Computers, Tvs, telephones, radios, home furnishing, public furnishing, books, movies, toys, clothes, bathroom soap, conventional 'made in china' possessions, basically any man-made item will fall into this vast category. All this stuff. We create it. Are we stuck with it? You bet. Are we stuck in a cycle of creating it? It appears so. What I see happening is an exponential increase of complexity, information transfer, and change within our societies. Everything is happening more frequently, more events unfold day by day, the wheel of life is spinning faster and faster and it seems that all we can do is match its speed so we don't get left behind. So what alternative is there really? Do we truly have any choice in what direction we want to head in? And if we do, what do we want anyway? What's the goal of our civilization? To advance and progress? Progress towards what? Peace, Love, Unity, and Understanding? By what means? War, Seperation, Denial, and Indifference? And come to think of it, who is to say what we are heading towards anyway? Does the individual truly represent the path of society and does the society actually represent the goals of the individual? Could it be that the individual is striving to become more simple, peaceful, orderly, and loving whereas the entire fabric of society is becoming more and more chaotic, complex, deranged, uncontrolled, and unstable? Could it be that what is really going is that the destinies of individual human beings are colliding with the destinies of our creations? What occurs at the collision? I ask all these questions to help you find your own answer. Because the way I feel about this is that everyone must come to their own insights and answers to life. All experience is subjective, what objectivity is there that can definitely say how our dreams can be fulfilled? Gather the knowledge you need, trust your heart, your intuition, and your inner voice, and always expect the unexpected. I feel that the unknown is exactly that which keeps us going. Love the mystery and you shall find your peace. Much Love   
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musender13 Stranger Registered: 06/05/06 Posts: 5 Last seen: 15 years, 3 months |
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I was thinking about what you said and it makes alot of sense. The whole idea that society and the individual are moving in a different directions seems quite valid to me. The answer that I personally came up with that explains why society is, and probably always will be flawed is "Indifference and Apathy" created by politics and the media.
People are becoming more indifferent and becoming less individualistic because the world is becoming a more global atmosphere. When a president makes a decision in one major country, the rest of the world sees what is happening and it some how persuades how they act/react. This creates a whole set of standards that people are set to adhere to. People naturally go along with what society tells them because it is wiped in their face every single last day of their life. Society determines what is cool, what is current, and what is the right or wrong belief on an issue. Because we are becoming a global community, there is a smaller number of people defining what society is. Our society is becoming more defined and every individual is expected to live by it or look abnormal, or possibly even get punished. When people are forced to live and believe a certain why, their thinking is taken away from them. People are losing touch with themselves and become indulged in society's message. If people forget everything non-extinctional that has been imprinted on them since the minute they were born and begin thinking for themselves the world would quickly become a better place. To bring it all back to the original title of the thread, "illegality of magic mushrooms" , society tells us that they are illegal. Man, if it was up to people who like to do mushrooms, it most certainly would not be illegal and they would be allowed to be individualistic and make their own choices. The same applies for anything in this world. This might just be something someone who is high as hell thought about.  Damn, now that I think about it, I still haven't created an answer, but merely another question, Still no progress... Now the question becomes  ""How can that cycle be changed???""...what the hell....
Edited by musender13 (11/06/06 10:27 PM)
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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   No, you're absolutely right on about that. Society has in a way become the epicenter of all concern, the prima cura of all human interaction and involvement. No mushrooms for individuals because society says so. But it's not really the society that says what it accepts/integrates and rejects/prosecutes, as you mentioned it's the inlets and outlets we accept as politics and media which dictate our global consensual realities for the most part. The interesting thing about these mediums is that even though individuals and groups consciously form and shape them, print the newspapers, broadcast the nine-o-clock news, make decisions to fire missiles, and start shit with cultures on the other side of the planet, they all act as one entity, a collective mind, an inter-connected "organism" composed of many many little cells [individual realities.] This goes not only for artificial constructs such as government, technological inputs and outputs, cities, roadways, and other forms of linguistic ideas manifested into a social fabric, but also for the six something billion sentient human beings living, eating, and growing on this tiny green orb floating in the midst of ice-cold alien space. Because of this, I see a diminishing of personal interiority happening to all of us here. As each day passes by, we are confronted ever more often by the realization that we are so intrinsically entwined with the social fabric, technology, governing systems, laws, and opinions, that it is hardly possible to separate the individual's needs from the needs of this "social electronic technological organism" we see taking over so rapidly. A Noosphere. Quote: In accord with the above the answer would be that yes, we can, as free-willed conscious individuals, choose to make the world a better place through our little daily interactions. However, a change of the world on a global level would require the decision of a collective mind. This is where it becomes paradoxical because we find it rather absurd to think of a "planetary consciousness" that can actually combine the thoughts of all people on Earth into one sentient mind. But what if, and this is entirely rhetorical.. What if a few years from now (2012?) the exponential rate of change in our world will have become so frequent and rapid that we won't have any sense of time anymore? Like the wings of a hummingbird, they move so fast, the image appears to be still. What if eventually, all time will become now? What if there will ever be a moment when the only moment is the present? How would this affect us? Consider the possibility. What is the mind state of a person who is in deep meditation? There are no worries about the future, and no regrets about the past. His awareness is in the now. Try to envision seven billion people in a meditative, enlightened, in-the-moment state of mind. How would this affect the "global social fabric?" Would the collective mind then act as one single thinking being? If all individual minds on the planet are tuned to one channel, wouldn't they all become one functioning mind? I know these are all philosophical questions, but I want to ask them anyway. Could humanity become conscious? Awaken as a self-reflecting being, act as the pilot of one planet, communicate with other pilots of other planets, communities of solar systems, governments of galaxies? Almost as if, the planet has become the individual.. Once again only questions, but perhaps, the answer to all our questions is a question? Who knows?  Great post, enlightening discussion.
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Edited by AlteredAgain (11/07/06 10:05 AM)
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Myc0s Stranger Registered: 12/09/06 Posts: 7 Last seen: 17 years, 1 month |
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I think you give to much credit to government and LEOs for the reasoning that goes into the Prohibition. I feel that it simply reflects the conservative mindset, one that by definition is opposed to change and/or new ideas or untraditional ways. Drugs legalization is certainly a new way of doing things, whereas the repeal of Alcohol Prohibition meant going back to the way things were, with "back in the good ol' days" being a conservative mantra.
For conservatives to do drugs themselves is an extremely unsettling prospect because of the lack of predictability about what will happen to them and how others will react to it. People on drugs represent people who are unpredictable; even insane. It isn't by coincidence that conservatives form groups like the KKK who want control over people, likewise they are pro-military because the military means control, and control means predictability, i.e tradition, the good ol' days. People who dress differently aren't traditional; people who speak a different language could be trying to change their world to the way it is in their country, making the conservative the outcast in his own country.....or at least that's what they think everyone from a different religion, sexual orientation, etc. etc. is plotting to do. Their fear of impending (da-da-daDoom) CHANGE... even extends to education. Highly educated people often welcome the new or different experience. But now the conservative right is attacking universities for exposing their kids to "liberal" idea's like Marx's "Das Kapital", (not the Communist Manifesto, but because he wrote both, a seminal work on capitalist economic theory must somehow be communist too...idiots!) or implying that because men create different gods for different religions, then maybe the Christian god is just another one of those creations as well. And if thats true, then what happens to them after death is a big unknown again, and conservatives HATE the unpredictable, so much so that they are willing to use force on anyone who doesn't act in a way they can predict. If you think that's over-simplification, it is. I could go on for pages about what I really think is at the root of the right-wing "personality disorder". Cheers, Mycos
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pokermush Waterboardingmys  Registered: 09/17/06 Posts: 475 Loc: Utah Last seen: 16 years, 1 day |
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Quote: How would people know? Most have no idea that mushrooms are safe, and possibly beneficial. Don't mistake ignorance for deception. Also remember that it is near-impossible to do legitimate research on psilocybin mushrooms, so it will a long time before the medical community can scientifically demonstrate that shrooms are safe and a valuable treatment for some ailments. Quote: This is a logical fallacy, and you are making the mistake of interjecting (il)legality of mushrooms with several other (unpopular) activist causes, allowing your shroom cause to be dismissed just as easily as the rest. Growth hormone, aspartame, and ADHD have been scientifically demonstrated to be safe and effective within the boundaries set by the FDA (completely different from the DEA). Alcohol and tobacco are legal only because of their popularity, and many would ban them if they could. Also, pharmacists can't prescribe anything. The doctor prescribes and the pharmacists fills the order. Quote: You've almost nailed it here, in reverse. Mushrooms are illegal because they are part of a "drug" category, which is percieved to make people act in an irrational and anti-social way and cause brain damage. This statement of conspiracy and paranoia reinforce that perception. The people who keep shrooms illegal haven't experienced a shroom trip and they don't know how it really changes a person. They are going to base their judgement on observing users of shrooms, and unfortunately they'll see hippies saying things like "mushrooms are illegal because they are subversive to the social order". Quote: Ummm... how many people NOT TRIPPING ON LSD would say that? That behavior is so abhorrent that it is hard to comprehend, unless the person saying it is in a drug-altered state of mind. But I have to say, I've seen plenty of video of these so-called enlightened hippies spitting on soldiers, cheering for the destruction of America, and "peace" protests with very violent messaging. Is it the drugs? I don't know but every time the hippies march, we get farther from the legalization of shrooms. Based what drug users say, it wouldn't be hard for the average person to conclude that doing LSD and other drugs makes people hate their country and leads to anti-social behavior. Quote: Change that to: From the perspective of Mr and Mrs America, drugs were poisoning America's children. They noticed that the youth who were into the drug culture were dropping out of school, not working, hateful toward their country, and anti-social in general. And to them, kids in the 18 to 25 range should be dating, going to school, and planning the rest of their life. -- then you'd have something. Drugs are scary, and paranoid statements (like yours) from drug users reinforce to the average person that drugs (including shrooms) are harmful to the individual and society in general.
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AlteredAgain Visual Alchemist Registered: 04/27/06 Posts: 11,181 Loc: Solar Circuit |
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I see many commonly-held misconceptions and some contradictions in your post, but I will let EE tackle this one as it is directed towards him.
However what I would like to immediately make clear is regarding what you said right here: Quote: Just to let you know, Aspartame is what is called an exitotoxin, or neurotoxin. Smaller doses destroy the brain (DNA central processing unit) little by little, because the effects are cumulative. Depending on the tolerance level of the person, the effects can be severe like epileptic seizures, including grand mal, blindness, chest palpitations, blurred vision, bright flashes, tunnel vision, ringing or buzzing in ears, migraine headaches, dizziness and loss of equilibrium. Other psychological problems are caused by the phenylalanine in aspartame depleting levels of serotonin, a brain chemical and neurotransmitter that regulates, among other things, behavior and sleep patterns. Aspartame also contains methanol (wood alcohol basically), a poison that causes blindness and even death. Two teaspoons of pure methanol are considered lethal. I'm sorry, but to call that scientifically safe is ludicrous and a blatant lie, and is especially worrisome as this is within the boundaries of the FDA, an entity which claims a responsibility to determine what is good for us and what isn't. Shameful!  FYI you will find aspartame in instant breakfasts, breath mints, cereals, sugar-free chewing gum, cocoa mixes, frozen desserts, gelatine desserts, juices, laxatives, some multivitamins, milk drinks, pharmaceutical drugs and supplements, shake mixes, soft drinks, tabletop sweeteners, teas, instant coffees, topping mixes, wine coolers and yogurt. Just to name a few. Please do your research before claiming knowledge in the field of general health and well-being.
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Edited by AlteredAgain (01/08/07 08:38 PM)
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pokermush Waterboardingmys Registered: 09/17/06 Posts: 475 Loc: Utah Last seen: 16 years, 1 day |
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Personally, I avoid the stuff. I have heard much of what you are saying, but notice how I framed my statement. I stated that they had been demonstrated safe within the requirements of the FDA. The point is that the FDA has a procedure to evaluate the safety of these things, even though we might think those rules are too stringent or too lax.
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Cabinet_Sanchez Stranger  Registered: 02/14/07 Posts: 371 Last seen: 7 years, 8 months |
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This seems to be an important thread considering this is "the shroomery" so I'll add my .02, which I'm sure will be instantly rejected by the "open-minded" poster and cohort.
I do indeed believe that this thread is semi-representative of the reason why psylocybin and psylocin (I say deliberately because mushrooms themselves are now not especially illegal in Oregon or New Mexico), as well as many other "drugs" are illegal. More on that later. So far the main discussion has been about how "male" values are totally ungroovy and that only "feminine" values promote compassion or basically anything else "good." This is reverse-sexism just as much as affirmative action is reverse racism. Men and the concept of "male" in Western cultures are as they are because of our society's pressures just as much as women (and "feminine") are the way they are because of them. This would be a good reason to complain about our social structure: it inherently generates sexism. The problem is, feminism (or the opposite) hasn't got anything in particular to do with psylocybin. Also brought up is the religious concept of a universal consciousness and oneness which is likely an amalgam of Jung's ideas and theories about the Mayan calandar's ending in 2012 (which was specifically mentioned). That's a great idea, and I'm hoping the world as it is will end in 2012 too. HOWEVER: IT IS MOSTLY IRRELEVENT TO THE ISSUE OF WHY PSYLOCYBIN IS ILLEGAL. The point I mean to make with all that nonsense is that the discussion so far by the two main posters has not actually made much of a point on the legality of psylocybin and other drugs. The reason (or at least the biggest reason in my opinion) for the drug war being fought right now (mind you not when it began) is a lack of education. Right now for the majority of young people the government is almost the sole informant on "drugs." Sadly, most of this is misinformation. The reason psylocybin is illegal is that most people's education on the chemical states that it is basically the same as LSD, cocaine, crack, and heroin. If the majority of Americans knew the truth about psychadellics (that they are non-addictive, and have positive effects), I doubt this prohibition would last. Americans think they are prohibiting a harmful toxin that ruins your brain, that's why they're willing to spend billions. You can test this yourself; go tell someone (preferably a "clean" sort of person, who only knows what the government has said), that shrooms have no harmful effects and will give a new perspective on reality. That person will probably not believe you. Ask a new friend who doesn't "do drugs" to try shrooms with you. They will probably say that they don't want to abuse something that hard or do something that dangerous. It seems that most people so far have been equating the use of drugs with a grand, all-encompassing consciousness revolution (aka 2012 and the like). The fact of the matter is that if psychadellics and cannabis were made legal, everyone would not simply reject the existing "order" of how things are, sit around trees and pass each other bongs, discussing the meaning of life. They will not meditate on the new perspective gained. The fact is that many, if not most people who smoke pot frequently right now are unsavory characters who just want to get stoned all the time and ignore the so called "greater good" altogether. They're the people who come on here looking for the next thing on which they can "trip balls" and fuck themselves up. Even your average everyman and politician can see the fact from the philosophical rhetoric, and that's why this sort of transcendental waxing hurts legalization's cause rather than helping it. The guy who calls in to talk to Dennis McKenna on a radio show about how the government is refusing to let us have drugs because of the mystical information they contain, just like they refuse to tell us the truth about the extra-terrestrial crashes at Area 51 is the biggest enemy to our cause. This mystical woo-woo and grand philosophizing about the apparently undefinable and conspiratorial "social order" is a healthy way to get outside the box, but cannot help the real cause of freedom. Sadly or not, we are going to have to deal with a world in which large governments set boundaries and rules for even larger groups of people. Trying to suddenly topple and reform the government is not going to work; a flaming annarchy symbol and the arcadian dream that without government everyone will survive by smoking pot, doing shrooms, and discussing their "feminine values" and compassion in instantaneous universally unconscious ways is totally impractical. In my (and I have to at least think most reasonable people's) opinion the fight against this war has to be done within the system in some way or another. This is what I think "on the illegality of magic mushrooms." The war on drugs (including psylocybin) in itself is unconstitutional. Remember the alcohol prohibition? There was an amendment for that wasn't there. That's because the power to prohibit a person from ingesting a substance is not granted by the constitution. Congress never once asked the American public if it wanted to ban all drugs and plants which could alter out mindset. It just did it. The reasons for that no longer matter; the primary issue is how to change it now. Personally I would look to such landmark decisions as Roe vs. Wade, which states that people have the choice to remove anything from their body if so desired (I don't care what your position on abortion is, it's only important because right now, it's legal). Would it not follow that people have a right to put into their bodies whatever they wish? It is not the government's place to tell a person what he or she can ingest unless it interferes with the rights of another person, which at least in the case of shrooms is unlikely. A person on shrooms, after all, has little desire for violence, and in light of legal substances such as alcohol which regularly cause extreme domestic violence, I don't see how shrooms can be banned in such a way. Challenge these laws in the courts if you believe them unconstitutional, as I do. Another avenue would be to call the DEA's bluff and educate the young. Hell educate everybody. This is something that will have to take place if psychadellics are ever made legal anyway. Education about the real risks and benefits of drugs are commonplace, except when it comes to that set of "drugs" ie crack, meth, et cetera. If this were to change, I bet drugs would become more popular, less "deviant," and eventually would be voted legal. Another poster presented the idea that capitalism allows people to reach their dreams by working through the system. If your dream is to legalize psylocybin, capitalism can help you, believe it or not. If you work within the system and win big, you might have enough money to tell the government what's legal and what isn't. It's happened before. Unfortunately it will take time no matter what is done, because the entire stigma of anyone using a psychadellic being a "drug addict" needs to be dissolved. That is currently the main cause of the continued prohibition. Whatever the initial cause, be it the man stomping down on free thinking or pharmaceutical companies paying the government or some other economic issue, the present cause is simply ignorance of the facts about most drugs. Working against the system on this issue will unfortunately not achieve the goals set by those who wish to do so. It is impractical and harmful to the cause of those who wish to have the right to have relationships with plants. It is indeed analagous to the situation of the Black Panthers' radical idealism vs. the NAACP's lawyers. The Black Panthers hurt the civil rights cause by spouting the equivalent of current mystical woo woo existentialism and alienating the people who will and must depend upon the system. The "drugs make people subversive to the system" theory is tempting and tasty in its promise that everyone using drugs will form a wondrous community of peace-loving and that right now the evil empire is crushing it, but it's just not realistic. I think that people right now have a want to end the war on drugs and its massive toll on our economy and judicial system, they just need a why. Fortunately, that why is the truth.
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar  Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:26 PM)
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:29 PM)
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enlightened seed Utopia is a state of mind  Registered: 05/04/07 Posts: 2,117 Loc: amongst civiliza |
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First off I would like to say that this is a great post! I believe that the our government for the people (yeah right) are just the puppets in a much larger and ever growing dis-information, propaganda driven, mind controlling, confusion of the modern day slave population. In order to maintain their ego driven alternatives to understanding their own insecurities that they are somehow above and beyond the so called "level" of average human beings because of their wealth and their inability to possess empathy for anyone of social status that is not of their own! If we as the human population to succeed in changing the path which we are being guided we turn off our television PROGRAMMING and tune into each other. It is my opinion that as generations before mine and after will become more aware of ourselves and learn to distinguish illusion from reality, truth from LIES. The children are the future and will become the leaders of tomorrow and must have positive and responsible role models to help shape their world view, not the corporations or puppet masters who are fulfilling their own desires at the cost of the ENTIRE human population! Then again maybe I'm wrong? Just my .02 cents!!!!!!!
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enlightened seed Utopia is a state of mind Registered: 05/04/07 Posts: 2,117 Loc: amongst civiliza |
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as i was reading the post i became somewhat dis oriented and after posting I realized that the original topic was "Re: On the Illegality of Magic Mushrooms" and am sorry for posting somewhat off topic?!?! Which leads me back to the subject above and could go on and on and on and on.....! I don't believe "Magic Mushrooms" will ever become "legal" in my lifetime, while the man made drugs will become made ever so easier to get. That my friends boils down to one thing.... Yup you guessed it MONEY. Some of the largest pharmaceutical company's which have annual profits in the hundreds of billions of dollars played a major role in the synthesis of the DRUGS in which are still produced and criminalized to this vary day!! Mushrooms are more natural than 99.99% of the food put in their body's every single day and are scheduled in the same class as heroin and pcp! There is only one word that can describe the insanity that this natural occurring fungi could have you stripped of your freedom and locked in a cage because another human being said thats the way it is and will be is "Unimaginable". Like I said in my last post...The children are OUR future. Each one teach one and our fate will be in their hands!
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EntheogenicPeace Scholar Registered: 10/04/05 Posts: 3,926 |
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Edited by EntheogenicPeace (06/05/16 08:30 PM)
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