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OfflineSherlockDrubu
enthusiast
Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 347
Last seen: 22 years, 27 days
What shrooms really are
    #602678 - 04/08/02 09:18 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I think shrooms might be the key to spirits. When you eat the shrooms, the spirits within them are allowed consciousness through you, and they show you the story of their life. If someone had a bad life or horrible death, then you might get a bad trip. Overcoming this is realizing that this life isn't what your life is, so the worry will go away. Ever wonder why its hard to remember or organize your thoughts while on mushrooms? It's because the spirits are unloading the information they learned while alive, in hopes of you learning more than they did, thus evolution and new technologies.

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OfflineOdd_Snail
old hand
 User Gallery

Registered: 07/16/01
Posts: 359
Loc: omotive
Last seen: 8 years, 1 month
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602682 - 04/08/02 09:22 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

wow! what an amazing hypothesis!!
maybe it is sooo right one could apply it to any other drug in the universe.


--------------------
Darlene: "Ted, I got you this new nose plug to stop you from snoring at night."
Ted: "Uh yeah, and I got you this paper bag to stop you from looking like James Brown in the Morning."
Darlene: "Oh come now, I don't look anything like James Brown."
Ted: "Hey kids, who does your mom look like in the morning?"
Kids... in unison: "James Brown!"
Darlene, "All right, thats enough... It's poison spaghetti for dinner tonight."

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602711 - 04/08/02 09:45 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

When you eat the shrooms, the spirits within them are allowed consciousness through you, and they show you the story of their life.

This sounds amazingly like the superstition found in the 15th century when people thought that disease was due to bad spirits not microorganisms. Somehow I thought that we had progressed.

If there was anything remotely valid about your statement, then artificially created psilocybin (it never lived) would give a qualitatively different trip than mushrooms. As this is not the case, your hypothesis has no substance whatsoever.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflinecHeMiCaLbLuE
member
Registered: 04/07/02
Posts: 158
Last seen: 22 years, 30 days
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602713 - 04/08/02 09:47 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I have a new hypothesis, mybe if i eat my body weight in shrooms i will dissapear from here or there or wherever i am.


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insanity with a plan, a plan to stop exercising truth as compared to breathing thin air, but to experience truth as all there is to experience, for what do i not already have that exsists? All i can do is enjoy the ride.

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OfflineSherlockDrubu
enthusiast
Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 347
Last seen: 22 years, 27 days
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Odd_Snail]
    #602718 - 04/08/02 09:50 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Lets try:

I smoke some weed. I hear no voices, no cloudy thoughts, just nice warm feelings all over and and nice big smile on my face. No intense experience, spiritual feelings, or enlightenment.

I drink some alcohol. I stumble around, laughing at how drunk I am. I feel a nice weird feeling in my legs and stomach. Again, no voices, insight, or spiritual connection.

I smoke some opium. I feel a nice feeling all over. AGAIN, no spirtual feelings or insight.


I eat some shrooms.

I get a nervous feeling all over. I start to yawn. Suddenly, everything appears different, as if new. Increased thoughts and I start to hear voices. Eventually, I feel like a totally different person, as if I am experiencing life through someone else's eyes. I feel peace and one with myself, the universe, and full of knowledge. I have found no drug that will induce this. Not even LSD. LSD isn't as spiritual, and I still feel like I'm me. While on shrooms, its as if someone else is inside with me, telling me how to live and the knowledge they have been given.

Of course, there are many different drugs out there and there are many different experiences, but there are also many unknown things that people will never know because it is beyond their reasoning.


Hey, it could happen.

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InvisibleFreewired
journeyman
Registered: 03/25/02
Posts: 55
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602830 - 04/08/02 11:40 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Terence McKenna said that the mushroom told him that it was not of this planet.
I haven't asked the mushroom yet, so I can't verify.

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Offlinebedetached
supercalifragolisticexpialidocious

Registered: 01/20/02
Posts: 74
Loc: your mind
Last seen: 20 years, 14 days
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Freewired]
    #602835 - 04/08/02 11:48 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

things are never what they seem....


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through our senses the world appears. through our reactions we create delusions. without reactions the world becomes clear.

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InvisibleLallafa
p_g monocle
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602840 - 04/08/02 11:52 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

maybe you are hallucinating


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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #602852 - 04/09/02 12:07 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

No, you don't get hallucinations on mushrooms. I certainly never have. A hallucination is a false perception of reality. When i am on mushrooms I am always perfectly aware what reality is.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #602853 - 04/09/02 12:07 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Lets try:

I smoke some weed. I hear no voices, no cloudy thoughts, just nice warm feelings all over and and nice big smile on my face. No intense experience, spiritual feelings, or enlightenment.

I drink some alcohol. I stumble around, laughing at how drunk I am. I feel a nice weird feeling in my legs and stomach. Again, no voices, insight, or spiritual connection.

I smoke some opium. I feel a nice feeling all over. AGAIN, no spirtual feelings or insight.



I eat some shrooms. I have a total psychotic breakdown. I swim in broken glass and walk naked into traffic after punching out my best friend and saying hurtful things that destroy a precious relationship (all from actual trip reports).

Now what does that signify?



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleLallafa
p_g monocle
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Xlea321]
    #602901 - 04/09/02 01:15 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

please tell me you are joking.


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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson

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Invisiblemr crisper
.

Registered: 07/24/00
Posts: 928
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Swami]
    #603144 - 04/09/02 09:14 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

that swimming in broken glass report is about the wildest ive read, you mean the guy who smashed his fishtank into the bathtub, stripped off and got in?

sherlock - i'm glad you are getting something from shrooms, may i be so bold as to suggest you read some more about it, lots of great books and websites out there.
here and there you will find sentences, comments or maybe pictures that will click for you and help you understand more about who you are and what you experience.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #603158 - 04/09/02 09:37 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Hang on Lal, is it a hallucination if you're aware it's a hallucination?

I've never thought something was there that wasn't, i've always been aware it was the effects on my brain of psilocybin. It's something all the native americans always say about Peyote - that they never have hallucinations.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleLallafa
p_g monocle
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Xlea321]
    #603179 - 04/09/02 10:07 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

"is it a hallucination if you're aware it's a hallucination?"

take some time to think about that statement


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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #603261 - 04/09/02 11:30 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

I already had thought about it Lal. I'm still waiting for you to contradict it.

When you watch a film and see Arnie flying through space do you think it's really happening? Is that a hallucination? Or do you just think "I'm watching a film"? When you see things on mushrooms do you think "this is really happening"?


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

Edited by Alex123 (04/09/02 11:32 AM)

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InvisibleLallafa
p_g monocle
 User Gallery

Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Xlea321]
    #603289 - 04/09/02 12:08 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

lol.
i dont have to contradict it, you did that for me

"is it a hallucination if you're aware it's a hallucination?"

if you are aware that its a hallucination, then you have just identified it as one.
how could it not be a hallucination after becoming aware that it is one?!
lol


--------------------
my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #603301 - 04/09/02 12:22 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

This discussion is way too Zen for me.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflinecHeMiCaLbLuE
member
Registered: 04/07/02
Posts: 158
Last seen: 22 years, 30 days
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #603452 - 04/09/02 03:24 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

very amusing, i think taking shrooms is very similar to a dream ( astral projection ) in the sense of their opposing similarities, a dream ( astral projection ) seems very long when in fact it is very short in the physical demension, while a mushrooms trip in the physical demension can seem like an eternity when in fact only a few hours have passed in the physical demension, wait, a mushrooms trip is some weird astral projection.


--------------------
insanity with a plan, a plan to stop exercising truth as compared to breathing thin air, but to experience truth as all there is to experience, for what do i not already have that exsists? All i can do is enjoy the ride.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Lallafa]
    #603485 - 04/09/02 03:51 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Nah, i was only using your terminology "hallucination" because you seemed unable to understand the point.

As i said in the earlier post, A hallucination is a false perception of reality. Seeing as i am aware that i am seeing these things because my brain is under the influence of psilocybin, then it isn't a hallucination. My perception of reality is perfectly accurate. Do you understand?


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Invisiblesunconscious
newbie
Registered: 01/17/02
Posts: 42
Loc: Calgary
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: SherlockDrubu]
    #603636 - 04/09/02 07:10 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

The mushroom lives and dies in your mind.

Is your mind a heaven or a hell?


--------------------
=|) minds are growing

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OfflineEvilGir
Im the on coming storm

Registered: 11/26/01
Posts: 1,301
Loc: Planet Irk
Last seen: 7 years, 11 months
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: sunconscious]
    #604082 - 04/10/02 07:13 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

An hallucination is seeing something that is not there and not recognising its not there sorta like a dactura delerium, where you would be talking to a plant thinking its you best mate.


--------------------
Fighting the man the best way I can.

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OfflineTeonanacatl fan
journeyman
Registered: 06/28/00
Posts: 38
Last seen: 22 years, 1 month
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: EvilGir]
    #604131 - 04/10/02 08:57 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Back to topic...
spirits or not, I KNOW that each shroom (or shrooms attached in families) has it's own "personality".

I believed (or at least respected) that "witch" and vase story, I'm I supposed to believe that my thoughts on these have no validation swami?

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Teonanacatl fan]
    #604184 - 04/10/02 10:23 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

My witch and vase stories are true, but just stories. I draw no conclusions whatsoever; they are like a zen koan - open-ended riddles. The label of "witch" was to enhance the telling of the tale and not representative of my beliefs. I shared them to tell all that I too have encounters with the mysterious on occasion.

So you say I'll "respect" you and you "respect" me. I proposed nothing other than a good yarn. You propose something different.

This is not about belief and perspective.

If a chemical in a lab has the same signature as the fungus, then what you are experiencing while tripping CANNOT be the spirit of the organism no matter how quaint and soothing the idea is. There is no wiggle room here. (see my signature quote)


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Swami]
    #604275 - 04/10/02 12:29 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Unless psilocybin is the spirit of the mushroom.

Not really anything to do with chemicals is it - you can create a human being in a few test tubes, does that mean it won't have a spirit?


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Xlea321]
    #604425 - 04/10/02 02:31 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

Unless psilocybin is the spirit of the mushroom.
But psilocybin in the lab cannot say that "I am older than thought in your species" or any other McKennian phrase. It has not lived on other planets, nor does it have a history. The chemical has not witnessed the birth of stars, etc. So where does the "spirit" part come in?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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OfflinecHeMiCaLbLuE
member
Registered: 04/07/02
Posts: 158
Last seen: 22 years, 30 days
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Swami]
    #604454 - 04/10/02 03:02 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

it seems quite ridiculous that a mushroom contains a spirit rather it may bring out the spirit in you, the spirit of all time and ages and reincarnations from past lives.


--------------------
insanity with a plan, a plan to stop exercising truth as compared to breathing thin air, but to experience truth as all there is to experience, for what do i not already have that exsists? All i can do is enjoy the ride.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Swami]
    #604476 - 04/10/02 03:27 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

But psilocybin in the lab cannot say that "I am older than thought in your species"

Why not? The molecular structure itself is the same. If we can create DNA in the lab does this mean it won't share the 3 billion year history of DNA in human beings? Does it somehow negate the history of DNA when you can copy it's structure in the lab?

A single mushroom isn't older than thought in our species either - it dies after a few months. The psilocybin molecular structure is the ancient part, not necessarily the particular container it's in. Fungi are producing this stuff for a reason. And like most botanists I don't think the answer relates to that hoary old story about "these alkaloids are simply poison for protection". That's garbage.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Xlea321]
    #604577 - 04/10/02 05:20 PM (22 years, 1 month ago)

A single mushroom isn't older than thought in our species either - it dies after a few months.
The mycelium and spores do have a continuity that goes back to the beginning. Some part of the original still exists.

And like most botanists I don't think the answer relates to that hoary old story about "these alkaloids are simply poison for protection". That's garbage.
That explanation may not fly, but there is even less support for the "They manufacturer it to have a symbiotic relationship with high order mammals." hypothesis.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: What shrooms really are [Re: Swami]
    #604913 - 04/11/02 12:36 AM (22 years, 1 month ago)

"The mycelium and spores do have a continuity that goes back to the beginning. Some part of the original still exists."

Yeah but there's no psilocybin in the mycelium.

"That explanation may not fly, but there is even less support for the "They manufacturer it to have a symbiotic relationship with high order mammals." hypothesis."

Agreed. The answer is unknown at the moment.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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