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InvisibleDexter_Morgan
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Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia?
    #6008658 - 08/29/06 03:02 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well which one is the biggest threat?

Bush is seen with the Saud family all the time, and no one ever blames the Sauds.

Saud royal family was not elected like Iran's president.  They have not received the voters 'seal of approval'  and there are many 'political dissidents' in the kingdom.  It is only held together by the tight saudi rule.

Sauds made up the majority of the 9-11 hyjackers.

Wahhabism

Iran seems like an interally stable nation, that practices military operations (I wonder what satilite images of our 'boot camps' looks like :rolleyes:) and is trying to stand up to the US, who is carrying out wars on both Iran's eastern and western borders, and the persian gulf.
Bigger Threat to the World
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from (08/29/06 02:57 PM) to (No end specified)
View the results of this poll



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Uncleluke, getting his assbeat, then he tries to delete it
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6355469#Post6355469
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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: Dexter_Morgan]
    #6008711 - 08/29/06 03:16 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I wouldn't exactly call what goes on in Iran elections.


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #6008720 - 08/29/06 03:18 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Why not?

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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #6008738 - 08/29/06 03:24 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

MushmanTheManic said:
Why not?



Maybe they use Diebold machines. :smirk:


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InvisibleMushmanTheManic
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: Silversoul]
    #6008786 - 08/29/06 03:45 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Tehran looks like a city from the future, so I wouldn't be surprised.






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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: MushmanTheManic]
    #6008798 - 08/29/06 03:50 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Saudi Arabia. They are preaching bullshit Islam and should be taken care of. After we stop depending on oil from them they should be taken care of accordingly.


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InvisibleDexter_Morgan
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6009498 - 08/29/06 07:15 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I wouldn't exactly call what goes on in Iran elections.




What would you call them then?

Quote:

downforpot said:
Saudi Arabia. They are preaching bullshit Islam and should be taken care of. After we stop depending on oil from them they should be taken care of accordingly.





So they should be 'taken care of', but we should wait until we no longer need there resources first?

That's a pretty pathetic stance for such a powerful nation, wouldn't you agree?

...Just like GWB.  But why would he try to take care of them, he, and the Bush dynasty are making a killing on Oil!


Q. Hey, where does a blue blood from Connecticut pick up a southern accent?
A. Texas oil field :laugh:

Sometimes the truth is all to funny :grin:


--------------------
Uncleluke, getting his assbeat, then he tries to delete it
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6355469#Post6355469
Tomato-Faced Banez
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5933438#Post5933438
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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6009546 - 08/29/06 07:32 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

downforpot said:
Saudi Arabia. They are preaching bullshit Islam and should be taken care of. After we stop depending on oil from them they should be taken care of accordingly.




Maybe you can take "care" of them for us. You seem to have all the answers.

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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #6009558 - 08/29/06 07:36 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well wtf do you want to do? Not take of them? Run?


--------------------



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Then shot in his head
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Can't fuck with me again"

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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6009625 - 08/29/06 07:59 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

downforpot said:
Well wtf do you want to do? Not take of them? Run?




USA isnt the big brother in the neighborhood who needs to go after every other bully.

WAR COSTS MONEY. Lots of money, and when i see repeated videos of 80,000 rockets being shot at 2 petty insurgents with a mortar tube i start questioning the efficiency of our military industry. It seems to me that this would be no different from any other war.

Maybe you and our country will realize what happens when you "bite off more then you can chew."

The best way to defeat Saudia Arabia and all those islamofascists is to stop buying oil from them and develop our own renewable energy "after all we can stick a man on the moon but no renewable energy" With all the money being commited to these wars which will invariably result in more violence we should try developing renewable energy and take our mouths off the arabian oil teet.

I dont see anyone making sacrifices for this war. Its like little kids took over the way wars are waged in this country. No matter how much idealism you have for something will not make it anymore effective. No how much you say the war is justified will make it effective.

When i start seeing people donating resources for the war effort and stop driving and buying SUVs and conserving oil i may change my mind on how effective the war on "terrorism" will be. Frankly i dont see this happening.

Quote:

Total war is a 20th century term to describe a war in which countries or nations use all of their resources to destroy another organized country or nation's ability to engage in war. The practice of total war has been in use for centuries, but it was only in the middle to late nineteenth century that total war was recognized as a separate class of warfare.





This tactic would be the only viable action for disarming nation states like Iran or Saudia Arabia. Failure to comply with these actions could unleash devestating consequences. Alliances could lead us into world war 3 and you usually dont know how deep it is till your neck deep in it.

Does this answer your question?

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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #6009633 - 08/29/06 08:02 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The_Red_Crayon said:

The best way to defeat Saudia Arabia and all those islamofascists is to stop buying oil from them and develop our own renewable energy "after all we can stick a man on the moon but no renewable energy" With all the money being commited to these wars which will invariably result in more violence we should try developing renewable energy and take our mouths off the arabian oil teet.







Ah. I never said we should stop depending on them for oil? Ah, okay.


--------------------



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"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"

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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6009651 - 08/29/06 08:09 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Well attacking them didnt seem logical. After all Oil prices can be tied directly to the situation of Iraq. Look at prices before 2003 and after. Their is a big difference.

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Invisibledownforpot
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: The_Red_Crayon]
    #6009676 - 08/29/06 08:15 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The_Red_Crayon said:
Well attacking them didnt seem logical. After all Oil prices can be tied directly to the situation of Iraq. Look at prices before 2003 and after. Their is a big difference.




Are you talking attacking Iran or Iraq?

And oil prices have been going up before we invaded Iraq.


--------------------



http://www.myspace.com/4th25


"And I don't care if he was handcuffed
Then shot in his head
All I know is dead bodies
Can't fuck with me again"

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: Dexter_Morgan]
    #6011413 - 08/30/06 11:38 AM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

ShroomDr said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
I wouldn't exactly call what goes on in Iran elections.




What would you call them then?





Appointments.

"After a series of elections in the late 1990s in which Iranians expressed their desire for change, recent trends point to a deterioration in Iran’s political climate. In the June 2005 presidential elections, more than 1,000 aspiring candidates, including prominent dissidents and all of the female candidates, were disqualified from running by clerics. Candidates who campaigned on reformist platforms complained of massive election irregularities. In the run-off election, the conservative former Tehran mayor and former Revolutionary Guard officer, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, got 62 percent of the vote, nearly twice that of his opponent, Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani, former president of Iran. Conservative hardliners now control every elected and unelected government institution in Iran.

In February 2004, deeply flawed elections were held for the 290-seat Iranian Majlis legislative assembly. More than 1,800 prospective candidates, including more than 80 reformists who held Majlis seats, were disqualified, limiting the democratic alternatives available to voters. Ultimately, conservative candidates did not face a reformist opponent in 132 of 290 seats. The Guardian Council exclusion of reformist voices in Parliament was the culmination of a four-year campaign against the reformist press. "

and

""The recent Iranian presidential elections were a triumph for the principle of one man, one vote. And the man with the vote this time, as always, was the country’s Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei."

—The Times via Iran Press News"

Both from here
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/56548.htm

Also, from the above,

""The problem is that the underlying framework of the existing constitution of the Islamic Republic of Iran is structurally incompatible with achieving the goals the reformers have set – democracy, human rights and secular pluralism. In this constitution the leader is all-powerful. He can ratify everything and can veto anything – and the people are at his mercy. … No democracy can be made out of Iran’s constitutional law."

— Mohsen Sazegara, reformist newspaper publisher and founder of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps"

So, despise the Sauds all you want but don't for one second think they are any less a government of the people than Iran is.


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InvisibleDexter_Morgan
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6011527 - 08/30/06 12:06 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Fox New Said:
IRAN IRAN IRAN, IRAQ, UBL, IRAN IRAN Syria, IRAN, IRAN, Hezbollah, IRAN, IRAQ UBL, IRAN, Lebanon, IRAN, IRAN IRAN IRAN, IRAQ, UBL, IRAN IRAN Syria, IRAN, IRAN, Hezbollah IRAN, IRAQ UBL, IRAN IRAN




Not one mention of Wahhabism or Saudi Arabia.


Bin laden has a militant-Sunni-Wahhabi-based religion. He believe Wahhabism is not 'puritanical' (remember our 'Puritan Pilgrams') enough, and all Muslims should follow the 7th century defintion of Islam.
Salafism
Those in Al-Qaeda believe in his SUNNI beliefs.

IRAN is a Shia country, not Sunni. They are not Arabs, they are Persians. The 'Terrorism' they support is in the form of backing Palestinians and those who fight Israel oppression.

Iran, MAY funding Shia resistance to the US occupation. They may be helping to destabilize Iraq, but who gave them that opportunity?

Certainly not Saddam!

Shia's and Sunni's are, at this moment, heading for civil war. So why link Iran with Sunni puritans?

Would pointing out the differences blow holes in the 'terrorism net'?

Why would Iran support a Wahabism? Wahhabi's believe Shia is a corruption of Islam.

Is everyone a 'terrorist', or is Iran supporting resistance to an unjust 'regime', and Wahhabi's believe everyone should follow 7th century rules, and militant-Wahhabi's will kill or convert you!


--------------------
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6355469#Post6355469
Tomato-Faced Banez
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5933438#Post5933438
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InvisibleHank, FTW
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: Dexter_Morgan]
    #6011547 - 08/30/06 12:12 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Good post, I agree that at the present time, Iran is not to be feared. Who knows what the future will hold though.


--------------------
Capliberty:

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Hell yeah I push the limits and hell yeah thats fucking cool, dope, bad ass and all that, I'm not changing shit, I'm cutting to to the chase and giving u shroom experience report. Real trippers aren't afraid to go beyond there comfort zone "

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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #6011602 - 08/30/06 12:29 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:

Appointments.

"After a series of elections in the late 1990s in which Iranians expressed their desire for change, recent trends point to a deterioration in Iran’s political climate. In the June 2005 presidential elections, more than 1,000 aspiring candidates, including prominent dissidents and all of the female candidates, were disqualified from running by clerics. Candidates who campaigned on reformist platforms complained of massive election irregularities. In the run-off election, the conservative former Tehran mayor and former Revolutionary Guard officer, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, got 62 percent of the vote, nearly twice that of his opponent, Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani, former president of Iran. Conservative hardliners now control every elected and unelected government institution in Iran.

In February 2004, deeply flawed elections were held for the 290-seat Iranian Majlis legislative assembly. More than 1,800 prospective candidates, including more than 80 reformists who held Majlis seats, were disqualified, limiting the democratic alternatives available to voters. Ultimately, conservative candidates did not face a reformist opponent in 132 of 290 seats. The Guardian Council exclusion of reformist voices in Parliament was the culmination of a four-year campaign against the reformist press. "

and

""The recent Iranian presidential elections were a triumph for the principle of one man, one vote. And the man with the vote this time, as always, was the country’s Supreme Leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei."

    —The Times via Iran Press News"

Both from here
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/56548.htm

Also, from the above,

""The problem is that the underlying framework of the existing constitution of the Islamic Republic of Iran is structurally incompatible with achieving the goals the reformers have set – democracy, human rights and secular pluralism. In this constitution the leader is all-powerful. He can ratify everything and can veto anything – and the people are at his mercy. … No democracy can be made out of Iran’s constitutional law."

    — Mohsen Sazegara, reformist newspaper publisher and founder of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps"

So, despise the Sauds all you want but don't for one second think they are any less a government of the people than Iran is.




Nice US GOVERMENT LINK :rolleyes:

.gov  for a link, I almost laughed

You make good points...
but I can link Flordia and Ohio election irregularies. 
Supreme court judges, apointed by a planitiffs father, ruling for the Son as President. 
UN officals not allowed to oversee our 2004 elections. 
Both Political Parties here, try to supess any third party canidate(Lieberman is an exception) not allowing 3 or more party debates. 
I could counter-quote you with a  Pat Robertson quote. 
And I can point out how the electoral college (and giving ALL the votes to a canidate who wins 51%) is not exactly democratic.



Any links to Saudi election fairness?  I would say they would need polling places within walking distance, since women are not allowed drive, but that would not be nessissary, since women can not vote.

"hey baby, nice ankles" :crazy2:
"Did you see the ankles on that one! :cool:"


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Uncleluke, getting his assbeat, then he tries to delete it
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6355469#Post6355469
Tomato-Faced Banez
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5933438#Post5933438
Dexter's Thesaurus
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InvisibleDexter_Morgan
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: downforpot]
    #6011614 - 08/30/06 12:34 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

downforpot said:
Saudi Arabia. They are preaching bullshit Islam and should be taken care of. After we stop depending on oil from them they should be taken care of accordingly.



Quote:

downforpot said:

Ah. I never said we should stop depending on them for oil? Ah, okay.




--------------------
Uncleluke, getting his assbeat, then he tries to delete it
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/6355469#Post6355469
Tomato-Faced Banez
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5933438#Post5933438
Dexter's Thesaurus
beer = guinness
smoke = vaporize
pubers = reasons to be pro-choice

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: Dexter_Morgan]
    #6011648 - 08/30/06 12:49 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

I made one assertion here and one assertion only, which was that the notion of free and fair elections in Iran is false. I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of the facts as stated in the state dept piece . If you do, please show me.

I made no assertion that the Saudis had free and fair elections. Nor do any of your other distractions in regard to US elections have anything to do with this discussion of the electoral processes in Iran and Saudi Arabia. And there is almost no set of circumstances in which I can imagine myself giving a flying fuck what the arch-retard Pat Robertson has to say except to use as an example of religious idiocy (a redundant phrase, I know).

To get back on topic, I am not aware of any Saudi nuclear program, nor do I have any reason to believe that they have an army worthy of the name


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OfflineThe_Red_Crayon
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Re: Bigger Threat to the World : Iran or Saudi Arabia? [Re: zappaisgod]
    #6011675 - 08/30/06 01:01 PM (17 years, 8 months ago)

Saudia Arabia is imploding from its own frankenstien. It has supported militant islam and in turn militant islam has turned against Saudia Arabia. No one in the arab world believes in Saudi legitimancy.

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