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 psilo25
The one stuck inthe middle ofthis hopelessmess.
Registered: 03/03/02
Posts: 244
Loc: over here
Last seen: 15 years, 8 months
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth  [Re: Sclorch]
#599953 - 04/05/02 06:44 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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To me, the idea of our lives simply being a part of the infinite flow of energy in the universe is absolute. It's not arguable in my opinion, but I also have no problem with others having different beliefs, since those beliefs are in themselves a part of this infinite flow we are part of.As for enjoying this life as much as possible, this may not be absolute. It is most likely a product of my upbringing in Western culture, since the American dream is basically doing whatever you want in any way you see fit, as long it's legal (or you don't get caught). I don't expect the people who are having bombs dropped on them to rejoice in life, they have little reason to do so. This is so very sad. Religion seems to be the cause of much of this warfare. It's a product of people not living according to the ideals that I presented in my previous post. (This is not to say that I AM RIGHT, and there is no other way, it's just what I believe in) These conflicts would never arrise if people could just realize what a rare, precious gift this life is, and stop making such a big deal over every little thing. That's humanity's major problem; we are just simply too willing to get anal over every little detail of our existence. It's just plain ridiculous if you ask me...If we continue to live like this, I really do hope that "mom's gonna fix it all soon". Am I now guilty of disobeying my own philosophies?
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Stand up for your freedoms, join the fight against the War on Drugs!
www.drcnet.org
www.drugpolicyalliance.org
www.drugsense.org
Edited by psilo25 (04/05/02 06:48 PM)
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frogsheath
Stranger
Registered: 02/18/02
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Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: psilo25]
#599991 - 04/05/02 07:30 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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You worry too much...
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frogsheath
Stranger
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Posts: 915
Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: psilo25]
#599993 - 04/05/02 07:31 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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...but so do i, so don't worry
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frogsheath
Stranger
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Posts: 915
Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: psilo25]
#600015 - 04/05/02 07:57 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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"Why worry about such petty things as money, jobs, cars, (material posessions in general), religion, etc. Why worry so much about every little obstacle you encounter in life? Just enjoy it, go with the flow, do whatever it is you need to enjoy this life (keeping respect for others in mind, of course), because this is your ONLY chance. ENJOY IT AND FULFILL IT ANYWAY YOU CAN."
I like the idea, but how do you apply it to "reality"?
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psilo25
The one stuck inthe middle ofthis hopelessmess.
Registered: 03/03/02
Posts: 244
Loc: over here
Last seen: 15 years, 8 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: frogsheath]
#600027 - 04/05/02 08:19 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Nowadays, it is virtually impossible to live without money, cars, etc. I use my car everyday to get to work so I can make money. It's part of my life, and I can accept that. So do most people. However, I refuse to let these factors control me. If my car brakes down, so what, I'll get it fixed, and in the meantime I'll find other means of transportation. If I lose my job, I'm not gonna cry over it, I'll go search for another one. I was recently robbed by heroin addicts for approximately $700 worth of change that I had been saving for over 3 years. It sucked. I worked hard for that money. But you know what? Within a few days, I had all but forgotten about it. I moved on. I felt no need to make a big deal out of this situation. Why should I? What good is it gonna do? Just move on and keep living life. It's only life, no big deal.
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Stand up for your freedoms, join the fight against the War on Drugs!
www.drcnet.org
www.drugpolicyalliance.org
www.drugsense.org
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frogsheath
Stranger
Registered: 02/18/02
Posts: 915
Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: psilo25]
#600052 - 04/05/02 09:05 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Be a hetero-absolutist and be right... well, rightER than everyone else.
That you are alive and conscious seems to be "true". That you "think" and "feel"
and "communicate" these "facts" with others seems to verify this. Is this not Absolute?
"I" , for one, am verifying this (I think). I have no idea who you are, yet I am trying to
"talk" to you (based on the words that I read on this screen). Am I Non-existant? Are
you Non-existant? I think not. Therefore, I THINK we exist. That is "Absolute". WHY we exist is not as clear. Therefore, the question should be HOW we exist.
You have it. YOU are a REAL person. WE are creating the world by our thoughts.
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frogsheath
Stranger
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Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: psilo25]
#600095 - 04/05/02 09:51 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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But YES! You are RIGHT by not taking it too seriously. You are forging a reality that
will have many good offspring. I love you for that! You are totally cool in my book.
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 Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: frogsheath]
#600274 - 04/06/02 01:24 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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The method of doubt runs strong through your veins. Don't ever let that go to waste. Everything can be doubted... even experience itself (i.e. "this is all a dream"). The pragmatic viewpoint is the only philosophy that both embraces the process of thinking and true freedom without borders. Metaprogramming... realize your own thought process. This is tricky, I don't think it is possible to directly teach a person how to do this. You can only guide them. As trendy as it is... from the Matrix: "I can only show you the door, you must open it." or something like that. A step further than the red pill vs. blue pill choice- Choose to be shown the door, then choose to go through it. Both choices have to made by the individual, they cannot be forced upon them... I don't care how much acid they take.
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Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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WeirdShroomer
journeyman
Registered: 04/01/02
Posts: 78
Loc: Sebia
Last seen: 22 years, 4 months
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Sclorch]
#600364 - 04/06/02 05:48 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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First, sorry for poor English ( I have a lot of trouble to express my self in foreign language but I will try )
Who I'm I? Im I just meat who think that is something more than meat.
I believe I lived many times before ( I saw that ) but that can be delusion that my brain created to make me feel that I have/had some purpose in life.
I don't believe in "God" as some long bearded old dude who like to stick his nose in dirty underwear so he can punish us for our mistakes, ( most things I learned in my life is through mistakes ) I believe in Earth as living organism ( which is by the way dying slowly and painfully ) ......but who Im I to believe. Shit...... I feel things but find that is so hard to say what I feel. And ultimate truth ? I don't know......somebody said that life is never ending learning and I agree. Looking everything from bright side is something I found necessary to stay sane in an insane world.
I wonder..... when I say to people how money is trivial and cant make you happy ( for one short moment can....but after? ) they look at me with THAT look( like I killed they family and pets too) and say " Don't bullshit ".
maybe this is somewhat off topic
( SofaJesus get off that sofa and spread the word.....no, wait, they could nail you for that )
Have a happy day and open mind and don't worry.
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----weird-----
Smoking dynamite can seriously blow your mind
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Tannis
ZoneTrooper
Registered: 12/13/01
Posts: 508
Loc: MD.USA
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Revelation]
#600407 - 04/06/02 08:04 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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There is no "good" news.
There is no "bad" news.
There is only news..........
We are the deciding factor........it's only perception.......not reality......
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Revelation
ॐ
Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,135
Loc: heart cave
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Tannis]
#600432 - 04/06/02 09:00 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Yeah, I agree with that. But couldn't god be considered the one true thing? Isn't god the ultimate truth?
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Tannis
ZoneTrooper
Registered: 12/13/01
Posts: 508
Loc: MD.USA
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Revelation]
#600436 - 04/06/02 09:08 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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I hear you and I agree......
I think that once we get past all the different ways of perceiving things.......what is left is lasting.....and my personal opinion is that ------ that is God......
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Revelation
ॐ
Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,135
Loc: heart cave
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Tannis]
#600439 - 04/06/02 09:15 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Right on man.
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skaMariaPastora
Utopiate
Registered: 03/14/01
Posts: 443
Loc: MA
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Tannis]
#600471 - 04/06/02 10:05 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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But do you think we can achieve this transcendence of individual perception in life? Or does one need to exit this physical world through death? Or perhaps do psychedelics take you a couple steps in that direction, showing you how things could be perceived? I know when I smoked 5-MeO-DMT I felt like I was experiencing the universe as it truly is, and I definitely felt a oneness with and realization of God (or all that is). But yes, this only shows you the door. To feel this way in everyday life is much more difficult.
We are all mirrors of God, and we each reflect it in a slightly different way. Perhaps if we trace our perception all the way to the source, you will find truth (if it is possible in this life).
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Revelation
ॐ
Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,135
Loc: heart cave
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: skaMariaPastora]
#600494 - 04/06/02 11:02 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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I know you weren't asking me but I just feel like throwing in my opinion... I would say that it's impossible to reach the truth in this life, however I do think that the purpose of life is to get closer and closer to it, and this goes for past lives and lives-to-be aswell. The reason I would say it's impossible is because when you have reached that state you will know nothing else or be aware of anything else. You will exist as and in a state of pure....something (love would be my best guess). In this life you are always pretty much aware of the world around you and of your own ego.... when you reach the truth details like this won't exist.
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SofaJesus
journeyman
Registered: 03/04/02
Posts: 69
Last seen: 21 years, 5 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: skaMariaPastora]
#600507 - 04/06/02 11:22 AM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Some people call it morbid, but life is all about death......
You don't have to take that completely at face value... If i sat around just waiting for death and never doing anything then I wouldn't learn anything.... You'll never know yourself till you die
.... I just think people should think about it before they claim to know themselves, because you'll never experience everything in life. You can't live your life as a man and a women and a cancer victim and as the happiest person on the planet...
You only get a glimce of what you might be the whole time your alive and then the shit hits the fan when you crash your car and impale yourself on a girder and bleed to death ..... Sometimes I really worry about pain and i don't really wanna get my arms chopped off or get beat to death, but you never know whats gonna come your way
Drugs like Shrooms and DMT allow you to think in different ways
Drugs like E just make you happy beyond what you should be --- I really like E, but I also realize that its just pushing away all the negitive thought and whats life without the sadness or the boring parts......
I dunno.... we just don't really know whats going on in the first place or where we will end up, but i know people are wrong when they drop bomb on each other and live their lifes for the fruits of money....
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"...and to the left where up is down now stand a zebra made of shapes of me and silver and the sun so bring no guilt with you up above the flatline let's just hit the sky exploding into one." [ HUM ]
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Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: SofaJesus]
#600575 - 04/06/02 01:31 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Drugs like Shrooms and DMT allow you to think in different ways
Drugs like E just make you happy beyond what you should be --- I really like E, but I also realize that its just pushing away all the negitive thought and whats life without the sadness or the boring parts......
Rarely will someone admit this. Most people who take E do it to escape... to live only for now. As long as you realize what it does (possibly too happy) and admit it, the chance of you living that aesthetic-sucker life is slim.
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Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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skaMariaPastora
Utopiate
Registered: 03/14/01
Posts: 443
Loc: MA
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: Revelation]
#600605 - 04/06/02 02:28 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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OK, I buy that. But do you think everybody will understand this universal truth/love/whatever it is at death? Or do you have to reach a certain point of understanding in this life? I imagine Buddha or Gandhi would, but what about people who live life caught up in the power struggles or wealth-driven mindsets that dominate our culture? In other words, are we all the same in the end or are people at different levels of spiritual awareness?
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skaMariaPastora
Utopiate
Registered: 03/14/01
Posts: 443
Loc: MA
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: SofaJesus]
#600613 - 04/06/02 02:42 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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Life is the soul's way to know itself experientially.
-paraphrase from Conversations with God
Hmm...after looking through CWG I think I have an answer to my own question. The soul knows everything, it always has. This life is the opportunity for it to give form and experience to that which it knows.
"The soul is after the feeling. Not the knowledge, but the feeling. It already has the knowledge, but knowledge is conceptual. Feeling is experiential. The soul wants to feel itself, and thus to know itself in its own experience."
I think the life process is kind of like learning a new language. Deep down you know the knowledge but you are trying to learn how to translate this knowledge into action, into experience. Some people are better than others, because they've had more practice (in other lives perhaps). So I think that everyone knows the truth deep down, but living in this world of physicality obstructs that truth.
So yeah. Revelation, I think I very much agree with you.
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frogsheath
Stranger
Registered: 02/18/02
Posts: 915
Loc: Chicago, Illinois U.S.A.
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
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 Re: There is no Universal, Absolute Truth [Re: SofaJesus]
#600747 - 04/06/02 06:00 PM (22 years, 5 months ago) |
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You only get a glimce of what you might be the whole time your alive and then the shit hits the fan when you crash your car and impale yourself on a girder and bleed to death ..... Sometimes I really worry about pain and i don't really wanna get my arms chopped off or get beat to death, but you never know whats gonna come your way
How 'bout it SofaJesus! That awakens the consciousness from complacency: knowing death is around the corner.
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